1 Tim. 3:14 ...continue in what you have learned..." That is a brief definition of Tradition. Since you have your own private definition, you can't accept the biblical one. "...and have firmly believed, knowing from whom you learned it." That is a brief definition of Magisterium. To the Jews, it was called "The Seat of Moses." The teaching authority of the Jews was transferred to Peter, initially with him receiving the Keys of the Kingdom. Magisterium simply means "teaching authority". what do you mean..There is no such thing as a written ordinance.
scripture is the basis of all doctrine....if it is not in scripture ...it is not given by inspiration of God...therefore not profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
2 Timothy 3:16
All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
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"Profitable" does not mean exclusive, which is how you read it. 2 Tim 3:16 does not say all doctrine must be explicitly found in scripture. Scripture is a primary source, but not the only source.
2 Tim 3:
[14] But as for you, continue in what you have learned (TRADITION) and have firmly believed, knowing from whom you learned it (MAGISTERIUM)
[15] and how from childhood you have been acquainted with the sacred writings (SCRIPTURE) which are able to instruct you for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus.
[16] All scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness,
[17] that the man of God may be complete, equipped for every good work.
Sola scripturists ignore verse 14 and 15 because it demolishes their position.
The Bible on St. Paul's list comes in third, not first. He actually gives here the traditional Catholic teaching on the three sources of sound teaching.
In verse 16 he goes into an excursus on the Bible. This brief excursus emphasizes the value of the Bible and recommends a fourfold method of exegesis. This verse was used as a proof text for the Quadriga which was the standard Catholic approach to the Bible, long before the so called reformation, and it is still used today. The Quadriga method used the following four categories:
Literal/Literary (teaching) - the text as it is written
Analogical (reproof) - matters of faith
Anagogical (correction) - matters of hope/prophecy
Moral (training in righteousness) - matters of charity
The so called reformers rejected all this and instead adopted a more literal approach to biblical exegesis, and Martin Luther was rejected by his contemporaries for ignoring 2 Timothy 3:16.
Far from distinguishing tradition from the gospel, as evangelicals often contend, the Bible equates tradition with the gospel and other terms such as "word of God," "doctrine," "holy commandment," "faith," and "things believed among us." All are "delivered" and "received":
1) Traditions "delivered" (1 Cor 11:2), "taught by word or epistle" (2 Thes 2:15), and "received" (2 Thes 3:6).
2) The Gospel "preached" and "received" (1 Cor 15:1-2, Gal 1:9,12, 1 Thes 2:9).
3) Word of God "heard" and "received" (Acts 8:14, 1 Thes 2:13).
4) Doctrine "delivered" (Rom 6:17; cf. Acts 2:42).
5) Holy Commandment "delivered" (2 Pet 2:21; cf. Mt 15:3-9, Mk 7:8-13).
6) The Faith "delivered" (Jude 3).
7) "Things believed among us" "delivered" (Lk 1:1-2).
Clearly, all these concepts are synonymous in Scripture, and all are predominantly oral. In St. Paul's writing alone we find four of these expressions used interchangeably. And in just the two Thessalonian epistles, "gospel," "word of God," and "tradition" are regarded as referring to the same thing. Thus, we must unavoidably conclude that "tradition" is not a dirty word in the Bible. Or, if one insists on maintaining that it is, then "gospel" and "word of God" are also bad words! Scripture allows no other conclusion - the exegetical evidence is simply too plain.
Thus, the Bible cannot be separated and isolated from tradition and a developmental process. Christianity does not take the view of Islam, whose written Revelation, the Q'uran, simply came down from heaven from Allah to Mohammad, without involving human participation in the least. Some extreme, fundamentalist forms of "Sola Scriptura" have a very similar outlook, but these fail the test of Scripture itself, like all the other manifestations of the "Bible Alone" mentality. As we have seen, Scripture does not nullify or anathematize Christian Tradition, which is larger and more all-encompassing than itself - quite the contrary.
In Catholicism, Scripture and Tradition are intrinsically interwoven. They have been described as "twin fonts of the one divine well-spring" (i.e., Revelation), and cannot be separated, any more than can two wings of a bird. A theology which attempts to sunder this organic bond is ultimately logically self-defeating, unbiblical, and divorced from the actual course of early Christian history.
I could write a book about 2 Tim. 3:16 and how severely it is abused, and demolish sola scriptura in the process.
There is no such thing as a written ordinance.
dikaióma: an ordinance, a sentence of acquittal or condemnation, a righteous deed
Original Word: δικαίωμα, ατος, τό
Part of Speech: Noun, Neuter
Transliteration: dikaióma
Phonetic Spelling: (dik-ah'-yo-mah)
Short Definition: a thing pronounced to be just
Definition: a thing pronounced (by God) to be righteous (just, the right); or the restoration of a criminal, a fresh chance given him; a righteous deed, an instance of perfect righteousness.
It's kinda dumb for Paul to hand deliver scripture when he always prefers oral preaching. How do you write down a righteous deed?
God is a God of the living. He invites us to pray for each other, living on earth or living in heaven. You unbiblically divide the Body of Christ.
..You are evading the question. "Dead saint" is not in the bible, it is invented by prot cults that have only been around for a few decades, more or less. I see it all the time. The saints in heaven are more alive than you and I; its prot cults that deny life after death, especially when it comes to trying to explain intercession of the saints. It's like trying to explain the Trinity to a JW or a Muslim. The Pope doesn't make anyone a saint, he declares sainthood based on the sanctity of a persons life, they are already saints, which proves your ignorance. Yet you feel qualified to criticize Catholicism based on what you learn from a voyeuristic view obscured by stained glass.
Total rubbish is believing Jesus came to earth by space aliens, since you can't find Mary in scripture.
"...he was acquainted with scripture from a child..." which logically excludes the New Testament, so it can't mean scripture alone.
Just because pronouncements are written does not change the definition. Definitions from Strong's Concordance are accepted as authoritive, it shouldn't depend on who is using it.
Yes, but that is not what I said. I said he (Paul) preferred to be physically present over writing letters.
1 Thess. 3:10 - Paul wants to see the Thessalonians face to face and supply what is lacking. His letter is not enough.
2 Thess. 2:15 - the fullness of the Gospel is the apostolic tradition which includes either teaching by word of mouth or by letter. Scripture does not say "letter alone."
1 Tim. 3:14-15 - Paul prefers to speak and not write, and is writing only in the event that he is delayed and cannot be with Timothy.
Were the righteous deeds of Jesus not written down???
Yes, but not all of them. John 20:30; 21:25 - Jesus did many other things not written in the Scriptures. These have been preserved through the oral apostolic tradition and they are equally a part of the Deposit of Faith.
They don't need anything, they are with Christ. That's why they make better intercessors than we do. You need to see an actual prayer to a saint, they are not horrifying like you have been taught.
You are unaware of the long and complicated process. http://www.catholicapologetics.org/ap070400.htm
what of Rome ???it is not they alone who are called to be saints...
I was being sarcastic.
who said anything about excluded church???/
People who think the saints in heaven are deaf, dumb, and blind to our concerns. Some reward. It's not biblical and its not heaven. The Body of Christ includes those in heaven and those on earth. Those in heaven are not a separate body. We are ONE body in Christ. Those who refuse to understand intercession are left with creating 2 bodies of Christ. It's bad theology.
Intercession of the saints goes back to the very beginning of Christianity, but the doctrine and 7 books of the Bible was jettisoned by the reformers 1500 years later because it didn't fit their man made theories.
PRAYERS TO SAINTS:
St. Michael the Archangel
Holy Michael the Archangel, defend us in battle. Be our protection against the wickedness and snares of the devil. May God rebuke him, we humbly pray; and do Thou, O Prince of the heavenly hosts, by the power of God, thrust into hell Satan and all the other evil spirits who prowl through the world seeking the ruin of souls. Amen.
Prayer to St. Joseph, the Protector of the Church
Father, you entrusted our Savior to the care of Saint Joseph.
By the help of his prayers may your Church continue to serve its Lord,
Jesus Christ, who lives and reigns with you and the Holy Spirit,
one God, for ever and ever.
Amen.
ST. PEREGRINE
St. Peregrine, whom Holy Mother Church has declared Patron of those suffering from Cancer, I confidently turn to you for help in my present sickness. I beg your kind intercession. Ask God to relieve me of this sickness, if it be his Holy Will. Plead with the Blessed Virgin Mary, the Mother of Sorrows, whom you loved so tenderly and in union with whom you have suffered the pains of Cancer, that she may help me with her powerful prayers and loving consolation.
But if it should be God’s Holy Will that I bear this sickness, obtain for me courage and strength to accept these trails from the loving hand of God with patience and resignation, because he knows what is best for the salvation of my soul. St. Peregrine, be my friend and patron. Help me to imitate you in accepting suffering, and to unite myself with Jesus Crucified and the Mother of Sorrows, as you did. I offer my pains to God with all the love of my heart, for his glory and the salvation of souls, especially my own. Amen.
