Does God want me if I'm just a 'common use' piece of clay?

[BarneyFife]

It’s a manmade tradition that suggest Jesus took the wrath of God. What did he do to deserve that? Sin? If you give me an answer to that question, perhaps I’ll change my position, but until then. The judgment was coming upon Israel, Jesus took upon the cup of suffering. Not wrath. All the best to you.

Where does the cup of suffering come from? Not a vacuum. By His stripes we are healed. Surely you don't think Jesus died from the physical suffering of a few hours as a penalty commensurate with the sin of the world. He felt like He might die even before He left Gethsemane.

What did we do to deserve the mercy of God? Works of righteousness?

He was treated as we deserve that we might be treated as He deserved.


.

 

[MatthewG]

Where does the cup of suffering come from? Not a vacuum. By His stripes we are healed. Surely you don't think Jesus died from the physical suffering of a few hours as a penalty commensurate with the sin of the world. He felt like He might die even before He left Gethsemane.

What did we do to deserve the mercy of God? Works of righteousness?

He was treated as we deserve that we might be treated as He deserved.


.

Just answer me. What did Jesus do… to deserve Gods wrath? If you don’t want to answer then, I’ll just walk away from the conversation, friend.

I don’t believe Jesus did anything to deserve Gods wrath… it was his own people that put him to death, which are promised to have wrath poured out on them, in the last and great and dreadful day of the LORD.

 

[MatthewG]

So, can I ask if you have accepted Jesus as Lord and Saviour? If not then that is the first think you need to do.

Once we have done that we are born again - that's what Jesus himself called it in the bible.

And if we are born again God has made us new and we are a part of his family.

Once we are part of his family he will then begin to shape us from a useless piece of clay into something useful and beautiful. But it take time.

But just as clay needs to be kept continually moist in order to be worked and shaped and re-shaped so to do we need to be kept ‘moist’ and malleable with the Living Water by allowing the Holy Spirit to refill us daily so that God can shape us into his plan for us.

Does not the potter have the right to make out of the same lump of clay some pottery for noble purposes and some for common use? - Romans 9:21

So I went down to the potter’s house, and I saw him working at the wheel. But the pot he was shaping from the clay was marred in his hands; so the potter formed it into another pot, shaping it as seemed best to him. Then the word of the LORD came to me: 6 “O house of Israel, can I not do with you as this potter does?” declares the LORD. “Like clay in the hand of the potter, so are you in my hand, O house of Israel. - Jeremiah 18:3-6 (NIV)

Good encouragement.

 

[Behold]

21 Does not the potter have the right to make out of the same lump of clay some pottery for special purposes and some for common use?​

@arkham

Everyone is offered the Cross of Christ.
Not everyone will come to the Cross and be saved, but Many will.

Everyone who is saved, is a part of the body of Christ... and the body has Many parts..

Are all the Ear?
Are all the Nose?
Are all the Hands?

Yet, all are ONE Body......of Christ.

Also..

Everyone who is a born again Christian, has a ministry.
All are called to share the love of God, but not all are called to be a Pastor, or an Apostle, or a Teacher, or a Evangelist.

Yet, all can teach. All can preach. All can evangelize..

Do you see how all are ONE Body of Christ, yet not all have the same part to play in the One Body of Christ?

 

[Traveler]

Can anybody explain this scripture to me? Because I'm desperately struggling with belief although I want to believe. This is confusing me and making me feel more hopeless than ever. (I'm new here and I hope this is the right place to ask.)

Does this mean that no matter if I seek God, I might just be unwanted and never saved? "Many are called but few are chosen..."? I'm struggling to come to Him, asking for help and strength despite my doubts and failure, I've prayed to know Him. Now I feel that maybe I'm just not one of the chosen.

Romans 9

14 What then shall we say? Is God unjust? Not at all!​

15 For he says to Moses,​

“I will have mercy on whom I have mercy,​

and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion.”​

16 It does not, therefore, depend on human desire or effort, but on God’s mercy.​

17 For Scripture says to Pharaoh: “I raised you up for this very purpose, that I might display my power in you and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth.”​

18 Therefore God has mercy on whom he wants to have mercy, and he hardens whom he wants to harden.​

19 One of you will say to me: “Then why does God still blame us? For who is able to resist his will?”​

20 But who are you, a human being, to talk back to God? “Shall what is formed say to the one who formed it, ‘Why did you make me like this?’”​

21 Does not the potter have the right to make out of the same lump of clay some pottery for special purposes and some for common use?​

The fact that you are even wanting to come to God shows that you have been called. Consider this passage;

Eph 2:6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:
Eph 2:7 That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.
Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

To actually have any belief in God at all is a gift from God, People are normally opposed to their own salvation, they are under the influence of the spirit of this world and reject any idea of there even being a God. For anybody to overcome that influence requires their first miracle, That being the small seed of faith to even believe. Most start off just where you are but their faith grows as they study Gods word and then start to experience the gifts of the spirit, It is a process, We get the change within to believe God and Jesus but then the growth requires some dedication to learn from our perspective,

In modern times that is hard and requires way more effort, In the old days the new Christian would be a disciple of the one that led them to Christ so they would have an example to learn from, Now days in modern times the church has taken over that responsibility but this has been compromised in many places by pastors that are really just Christ sellers for money rather than Apostles to teach the people.

 

[BarneyFife]

Just answer me. What did Jesus do… to deserve Gods wrath? If you don’t want to answer then, I’ll just walk away from the conversation, friend.

I don’t believe Jesus did anything to deserve Gods wrath… it was his own people that put him to death, which are promised to have wrath poured out on them, in the last and great and dreadful day of the LORD.

He did absolutely nothing to deserve His Father's wrath.

What makes you think Jesus came to Earth to get what He deserves?

WE put Him to death.

If you don't want to discuss this, you can stop anytime you like, Matthew.

But don't start in on me with your threats to walk away, unless you're prepared to follow through on them.

.

 

[Behold]

. Now I feel that maybe I'm just not one of the chosen.

@arkham ...

Are you born?
Are you here?
Are you breathing?
Do you have a heartbeat?

Then COME TO God ..... by faith in Christ.

GOD wants everyone to come....

Will you?

"Now is THE DAY of Salvation", and thats every day.

See, God wont make you.. He does not force anyone.

What He does is... God says...>>See The Cross.?? See my Son Jesus on it dying for your sin. ???
Do you SEE ???
SEE how much i love you?
Trust in my Son and i will show you even more of my love, forever.

"ALL that believe in Jesus, shall be saved".

Jesus said... "If you believe in me... I give unto you Eternal Life, and you shall never go to Hell (perish)"..

@arkham...

I never had a real home.
And then i heard that God loved me and wanted me to come Home to Him.
I said to Jesus....>"I BELIEVE".. and God said to me... "welcome Home Son".

And He'll say the same to YOU or anyone, as God's love is always calling you home, and Jesus is The Only Way there.

A.) You take Jesus by Faith AS YOUR SAVIOR... and God takes you FOREVER AS HIS SON/DAUGHTER.

Its God's promise.

 

[MatthewG]

He did absolutely nothing to deserve His Father's wrath.

Okay. It was pleasing though for Jesus to give up his life, in order for his Father to crush him, and rise him up again. That had nothing to do with wrath. It was Jesus suffering on behalf of his Father and on behalf of the world for sin.

What makes you think Jesus came to Earth to get what He deserves?

He came to do his Fathers will, who taught him everything to say and do. He willingly laid down his life for the love of all human beings, and his Father in order to fulfill the covenant of old, and bring forward the new arrangement, by the second covenant. I really don’t understand your question exactly.

WE put Him to death.

Sure, by virtue of your sins. However in context of the narrative. Listen to what Peter says in Acts.

”Then Peter stood up with the other eleven apostles. He spoke loudly so that all the people could hear. He said, “My Jewish brothers and all of you who live in Jerusalem, listen to me. I will tell you something you need to know. Listen carefully. These men are not drunk as you think; it’s only nine o’clock in the morning. But Joel the prophet wrote about what you see happening here today. This is what he wrote: ‘God says: In the last days I will pour out my Spirit on all people. Your sons and daughters will prophesy. Your young men will see visions. Your old men will have special dreams. In those days I will pour out my Spirit on my servants, men and women, and they will prophesy. I will work wonders in the sky above. I will cause miraculous signs on the earth below. There will be blood, fire, and thick smoke. The sun will be changed into darkness, and the moon will be as red as blood. Then the great and glorious day of the Lord will come. And everyone who trusts in the Lord will be saved.’ Joel 2:28-32 “My fellow Israelites, listen to these words: Jesus from Nazareth was a very special man. God clearly showed this to you. He proved it by the miracles, wonders, and miraculous signs he did through Jesus. You all saw these things, so you know this is true. Jesus was handed over to you, and you killed him. With the help of evil men, you nailed him to a cross. But God knew all this would happen. It was his plan—a plan he made long ago. Jesus suffered the pain of death, but God made him free. He raised him from death. There was no way for death to hold him.“
‭‭Acts‬ ‭2‬:‭14‬-‭24‬ ‭ERV‬‬

If you don't want to discuss this, you can stop anytime you like, Matthew.

But don't start in on me with your threats to walk away, unless you're prepared to follow through on them.

Didn’t expect you to answer me.

 

[BarneyFife]

Didn’t expect you to answer me.

This is childish, passive-agressive nonsense.

Your question was:

Just answer me. What did Jesus do… to deserve Gods wrath? If you don’t want to answer then, I’ll just walk away from the conversation, friend.

To which I answered:

He did absolutely nothing to deserve His Father's wrath.

I don't know how to answer the question any more directly than that.

But since it doesn't meet with your approval well enough to even be considered an answer, I guess we're going to get to see if you'll make good on your threat to walk away from the conversation in a friendly manner, since you did, after all, call me "friend."

.

 

[MatthewG]

This is childish, passive-agressive nonsense.

Being honest in not expecting you to answer me is childish?

Man I barely trust my coworkers to come in on time, and I’ve told them that I don’t trust them. They shouldn’t never trust me.

Would you like to continue to discuss what has been presented or is it not worth the time?

My only hope is that God uses me to get not only you but others see to that the wrath of God was never poured on Jesus, and that God gives people the increase @BarneyFife.

You can disagree if you would like. With your sharing on Does God want me if I'm just a 'common use' piece of clay?. My thoughts concluded that Gods wrath being poured on Jesus, is a manmade myth.

Okay. It was pleasing though for Jesus to give up his life, in order for his Father to crush him, and rise him up again. That had nothing to do with wrath. It was Jesus suffering on behalf of his Father and on behalf of the world for sin.

He came to do his Fathers will, who taught him everything to say and do. He willingly laid down his life for the love of all human beings, and his Father in order to fulfill the covenant of old, and bring forward the new arrangement, by the second covenant. I really don’t understand your question exactly.

Sure, by virtue of your sins. However in context of the narrative. Listen to what Peter says in Acts.

”Then Peter stood up with the other eleven apostles. He spoke loudly so that all the people could hear. He said, “My Jewish brothers and all of you who live in Jerusalem, listen to me. I will tell you something you need to know. Listen carefully. These men are not drunk as you think; it’s only nine o’clock in the morning. But Joel the prophet wrote about what you see happening here today. This is what he wrote: ‘God says: In the last days I will pour out my Spirit on all people. Your sons and daughters will prophesy. Your young men will see visions. Your old men will have special dreams. In those days I will pour out my Spirit on my servants, men and women, and they will prophesy. I will work wonders in the sky above. I will cause miraculous signs on the earth below. There will be blood, fire, and thick smoke. The sun will be changed into darkness, and the moon will be as red as blood. Then the great and glorious day of the Lord will come. And everyone who trusts in the Lord will be saved.’ Joel 2:28-32 “My fellow Israelites, listen to these words: Jesus from Nazareth was a very special man. God clearly showed this to you. He proved it by the miracles, wonders, and miraculous signs he did through Jesus. You all saw these things, so you know this is true. Jesus was handed over to you, and you killed him. With the help of evil men, you nailed him to a cross. But God knew all this would happen. It was his plan—a plan he made long ago. Jesus suffered the pain of death, but God made him free. He raised him from death. There was no way for death to hold him.“
‭‭Acts‬ ‭2‬:‭14‬-‭24‬ ‭ERV‬‬


Didn’t expect you to answer me.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

If sin is paid for for a gentile. What was the sin of the Jewish people who put up Gods Son to death? Putting Gods Son to death? That is deserving of wrath…

God changed his mind and how he worked through his love many times, working with his people, the twelve tribes of Israel.

Jesus was put to death by our sin. Jesus is the Lamb slain before the foundation of the world. It was the counsel of the godhead before creation that Jesus would come and die in our plaqce. the vessel used is not that relevant. You are looking at this from a human perspective.

It was Pilate who put Jesus to death- He alone had the authority to pardon or condemn Jesus , no matter how much the leadership connived to kill HIm.

God has never changed His mind. He has changed methods but not His mind. He knew what He would do long before man entered the picture.

 

[MatthewG]

It was Pilate who put Jesus to death- He alone had the authority to pardon or condemn Jesus , no matter how much the leadership connived to kill HIm.

Did you read what Peter said in Acts 2? When he tells the Israelites they put him to death with the help of evil people?

Listen to what Peter says in Acts.

”Then Peter stood up with the other eleven apostles. He spoke loudly so that all the people could hear. He said, “My Jewish brothers and all of you who live in Jerusalem, listen to me. I will tell you something you need to know. Listen carefully. These men are not drunk as you think; it’s only nine o’clock in the morning. But Joel the prophet wrote about what you see happening here today. This is what he wrote: ‘God says: In the last days I will pour out my Spirit on all people. Your sons and daughters will prophesy. Your young men will see visions. Your old men will have special dreams. In those days I will pour out my Spirit on my servants, men and women, and they will prophesy. I will work wonders in the sky above. I will cause miraculous signs on the earth below. There will be blood, fire, and thick smoke. The sun will be changed into darkness, and the moon will be as red as blood. Then the great and glorious day of the Lord will come. And everyone who trusts in the Lord will be saved.’ Joel 2:28-32 “My fellow Israelites, listen to these words: Jesus from Nazareth was a very special man. God clearly showed this to you. He proved it by the miracles, wonders, and miraculous signs he did through Jesus. You all saw these things, so you know this is true. Jesus was handed over to you, and you killed him. With the help of evil men, you nailed him to a cross. But God knew all this would happen. It was his plan—a plan he made long ago. Jesus suffered the pain of death, but God made him free. He raised him from death. There was no way for death to hold him.“
‭‭Acts‬ ‭2‬:‭14‬-‭24‬ ‭ERV‬‬

God has never changed His mind. He has changed methods but not His mind. He knew what He would do long before man entered the picture.

If you say so. I believe God changed in his love for his people constantly by changing…
-“—
I don’t believe everything you are saying to me. All people should test what people say, throw away the bad and hold on to the good.