Drinking Alcohol, should a Christian do it?

[Grailhunter]

That's what I've been doing, learning from God's Word which teaches we are to not be like the world.

We are supposed to put on the New Man and walk in Newness of Life. Surprised you don't know this!

Christians are called, and ordained by God to put off the old man and to walk in newness of life. To be a child of obedience, not a child of disobedience. The wrath of God comes upon the children of disobedience. (Colossians 3:5,6)

Here’s a few scriptural truths to consider that the OSAS peoples either don’t want to talk about, try to explain away, or will come up with some excuse to claim these scriptures aren’t for Christians today.

Ephesians 2:10
For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

It's not a matter of trying to earn salvation thru good works... It's a matter of being obedient verses being disobedient!

Those that accept the calling of the Lord and become new creatures in Christ Jesus abiding in Him doing good works by the power of the Holy Spirit within as the Lord leads... these are true children of God.

Those claiming to be saved not walking in obedience have rejected the ordination and calling of the Lord and are the children of disobedience who refuse to put on the new man and walk in newness of life to stop being servants of sin...

Colossians 3:5-9
Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry:
For which things' sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:
In the which ye also walked some time, when ye lived in them.
But now ye also put off all these; anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth.
Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds;
And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:

Ephesians 4:24
And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

Romans 13:14
But put ye on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make not provision for the flesh, to fulfil the lusts thereof.

Hebrews 9:14
How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?

Romans 6:4-6
Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.

Colossians 3:5,6
Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry: For which things' sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:

As these scripture references indicate, those not accepting the calling of the Lord to be led by the Holy Ghost into walking after the new man are in disobedience... which will NOT end well for them unless they repent of their sin and get with the Lord's game plan!

You can copy and paste the whole Bible into the forum but you will never find a verse that says that drinking is a sin or that you should judge people for drinking….the Bible says just the opposite…
Therefore let no one act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day—Colossians 2:16

As I have said there is not even a scripture that says they mixed water with wine.
This culture was a drinking culture and it was not “of the world” the Jews and Christians drank. So much of the wine and vineyards was used by Christ to symbolize Christianity that what your doing is demeaning Christ to edify yourself and that is the heart and intent of man-made sins.

 

[Wrangler]

UN-fermented wine (NON-alcoholic beverage)

A contradiction in terms.

 

[Dan Clarkston]

….the Bible says just the opposite…

No, no scripture verses saying "and you shall drink the booze"

As I have said there is not even a scripture that says they mixed water with wine.

There's actual historic documents about this and it's actually true.

But those that have a bent towards drinking the booze just got to have their booze and so they'll booze it up.

A contradiction in terms.

When they first make wine, it is not fermented and it has no alcohol in it.

I get it, you're an advocate for drinking the booze so bottoms up!

 

[O'Darby]

When they first make wine, it is not fermented and it has no alcohol in it.

A simple Google search will reveal umpteen academic and popular-level articles about the importance of wine in ancient Israel and in biblical times. A look at Wine and Viticulture in Jesus' Era. On virtually every thread on which you appear, you seem to adopt some extreme position and cling to it no matter how silly you end up looking.

 

[Wrangler]

No, no scripture verses saying "and you shall drink the booze"

Yes, there is. And I’ve cited them numerous times.

Keep on thinking you are a first rate Christian for what you don’t do. See how that ego works out for you.

 

[Grailhunter]

There's actual historic documents about this and it's actually true.

But those that have a bent towards drinking the booze just got to have their booze and so they'll booze it up.

That is a fact....I am talking Bible only….
Once you start taking history into account then you know that Judaism and Christianity are drinking religions as I have already pointed out. They mixed wine with water 70/30 and drank it at meals. But that does not mean that they did not drink it straight.

Again
You could almost call Judaism and Christianity drinking religions. When a drinking culture tells you not to be drunk or be a drunkard, it means something different than what most people understand as intoxication.

Go, eat your bread with joy and drink your wine with a merry heart, because it is now that God favors your works. Ecclesiastes 9:7

And wine which makes man’s heart glad, So that he may make his face glisten with oil, And food which sustains man’s heart. Psalm 104:15

Christ drank and drank with others.
Drinking wine was part of a very important Christian ritual.
One of Christ miracles was changing water into wine.
Christ used vineyards in his parables.
Paul told Timothy to drink wine on his travels for a very good reason…As you traveled back then each well had it own flora animal decaying in it….bird dropping….bugs….etc. Mixing water with wine helped neutralize the contaminates in the water.
Christianity built several symbologies from the wine, the grapes, the grapevines etc.
The belief that people back then were drinking grape juice is in error, unless they were drinking it from the press….and all presses were called winepresses and grape juice does not last in the summer….Try it....let grape juice sit in the heat for a couple days and drink it....and see what it does to you....it will remove all doubt that grape juice was a common drink. No refrigeration AHHH!

After the 4th century and actual Christian church buildings started to appear there were usually vineyards and winepresses on church property and clergy that were skilled in the art of Viticulture.

 

[Grailhunter]

When they first make wine, it is not fermented and it has no alcohol in it.

I get it, you're an advocate for drinking the booze so bottoms up!

What I am is an educated theologian, educated in 5 countries.

My ministry I call the Johnny Appleseed of Truth. My motto is Be good and do good. Truth is the focus of my ministry and debunking false beliefs. Believing that Christian deserve to be told the Truth ….whether they believe it or not is between them and God ….Casting seeds as Christ did.

And it would not matter if I drank or not….truth is truth. But I do drink and do so with a clear Christian conscience….all things in moderation….I do smoke, usually twice a year, I smoke cigars during deer and turkey season….LOL….Usually with preachers that are part of the hunting group.

Not too much on lotto but I am not going to say I have not bought a scratch off or two and I play raffles at church and the VFW.

 

[Dan Clarkston]

A simple Google search will reveal umpteen academic and popular-level articles about the importance of wine in ancient Israel and in biblical times. A look at Wine and Viticulture in Jesus' Era.

I actually take a supplement called "red wine grape seed extract" that enables me to get the beneficial nutrients that come from the fruit of the vine without ingesting alcohol, since science also shows alcohol is damaging to the body.

On virtually every thread on which you appear, you seem to adopt some extreme position and cling to it no matter how silly you end up looking.

God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty (1 Corinthians 1:27)

The vast majority of teaching in today's churches contains a lot of false doctrine based on the wisdom of carnal minded men so of course the Truth from God's Word makes one look foolish and silly which is no concern to me whatsoever.

My relationship with the Lord, based on His Word, always comes first before ALL other things including people whether they be friends, family, other Christians, or the man on the street, Concerning myself about what others think is something the Lord has delivered my from a long time ago.

Peer pressure, group think, and hive mentality are all tactics the devil uses to push people in to conforming to what others tell them to think. I don't get along with the devil, so I don't accept his doctrines.

 

[Wrangler]

science also shows alcohol is damaging to the body.

Science also shows the beneficial effects of moderate alcohol consumption.

Is drinking in moderation good for your heart?

A new study offers an explanation for why light to moderate alcohol consumption may be associated with lower risk of heart disease.

news.harvard.edu

epidemiological studies have suggested that light to moderate alcohol consumption (one drink per day for women and one to two drinks per day for men) is associated with a lower risk of cardiovascular disease.

 

[Dan Clarkston]

Science also shows the beneficial effects of moderate alcohol consumption.

The damaging effects out weigh any claimed benefits.

Not to mention it's sinful for Christians to be on the booze.

Studies claiming drinking booze if good for you are funded by the booze companies.

 

[bluedragon]

The damaging effects out weigh any claimed benefits.

Not to mention it's sinful for Christians to be on the booze.

Studies claiming drinking booze if good for you are funded by the booze companies.

Not the true. Medical Journals will argue with your all day long concerning the benefits of one glass of red wine a day.

 

[Wrangler]

The damaging effects out weigh any claimed benefits.

Your opinion.

Given that the benefits deal with the #1 killer, heart disease, it’s worth the negative impact for disease that kills far fewer people.

Math is not you strength.

 

[O'Darby]

I actually take a supplement called "red wine grape seed extract" that enables me to get the beneficial nutrients that come from the fruit of the vine without ingesting alcohol, since science also shows alcohol is damaging to the body.

Good for you! You have chosen not to drink alcohol for health reasons. I happen to have been a dedicated fitness fanatic for many decades and am frequently mistaken for being 20+ years younger than I actually am. I do it because I actually do believe my body is a temple of the Holy Spirit and that spiritual fitness starts with physical fitness ("First, be a good animal," as the Greeks taught). There are health benefits to not drinking at all and to drinking in moderation, particularly red wine. I choose the latter course; you choose the former.

You then attempt to introduce into the equation that any alcohol consumption is sinful. This position simply can't be sustained, biblically or historically. If you think it's sinful per se or inevitably leads to greater sins, then this is just your perspective and you are welcome to it. But your perspective simply can't be sustained biblically or historically, which is what makes you look like a crank when you keep insisting it can.

 

[BlessedPeace]

You're the one trash talking about the Lord!

No. You are trash talking a members faith and questioning if they are saved. Stop.

You claim God loves everyone. God tells us in his word he does not.
Ergo, it is you who would be trash talking when you don't know what God says of himself.

You don't have to accept that Jesus turned water into wine. However, it is scripture that he did. It is also tradition in Jewish weddings that wine is used in the weddings. Wine, not grape juice.

You can continue to argue against scripture as you like. If you have a personal issue with alcohol that is your business. However, don't push prohibition ideology onto the word of God.

The Jews drank wine. This does not mean they were alcoholics.

 

[Dan Clarkston]

This position simply can't be sustained, biblically

Sure it can by those that take God's Word seriously:

1 Corinthians 6:9,10
Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

Biblical definition of "drunkards"

G3183 - methusos -- pronounced: meth'-oo-sos
from 3184; tipsy, i.e. (as noun) a sot: KJV -- drunkard.
See Greek No. 3184 <G3184>

G3184 - methuo -- pronounced: meth-oo'-o
from another form of 3178; to drink to intoxication, i.e. get drunk: KJV -- drink well, make (be) drunk(-en).
See Greek No. 3178 <G3178>

Those that drink alcohol are engaging in the appearance of evil even if not
getting drunk, and they are being friendly with the world as well as abusing
their body all of which are not biblical and is sinful behavior.

1 Thessalonians 5:21,22
Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.
Abstain from all appearance of evil.

James 4:4
Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the
friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever
therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God.

Plus, it's known medical fact that alcohol is harmful to your health and Christians
have been bought with a price they are not their own and are called to glorify
God in their bodies (1 Corinthians 6:19-20) so drinking alcohol is sinful behavior.

1 Corinthians 3:17
If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy;
for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

Christians have no right to abuse their body by ingesting alcohol.
Those that don't take their relationship with the Lord seriously
would be the ones drinking booze while claiming to be Christians.

 

[Dan Clarkston]

Not the true. Medical Journals will argue with your all day long concerning the benefits of one glass of red wine a day.

It is true as other Medical Journals will argue with your all day long concerning alcohol being harmful to the body

 

[Wrangler]

Sure it can by those that take God's Word seriously

Only people who agree with me take God’s Word seriously?! That’s your humble position, eh?

and they ate and drank before Yahweh on that day with great gladness.
1 Chr 29:22

Why do you suppose YHWH did not smite them for sinning before him by drinking? Could it be that drinking is not the sin you claim it to be?

 

[BlessedPeace]

Sure it can by those that take God's Word seriously:

1 Corinthians 6:9,10
Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

Biblical definition of "drunkards"

G3183 - methusos -- pronounced: meth'-oo-sos
from 3184; tipsy, i.e. (as noun) a sot: KJV -- drunkard.
See Greek No. 3184 <G3184>

G3184 - methuo -- pronounced: meth-oo'-o
from another form of 3178; to drink to intoxication, i.e. get drunk: KJV -- drink well, make (be) drunk(-en).
See Greek No. 3178 <G3178>

Those that drink alcohol are engaging in the appearance of evil even if not
getting drunk, and they are being friendly with the world as well as abusing
their body all of which are not biblical and is sinful behavior.

1 Thessalonians 5:21,22
Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.
Abstain from all appearance of evil.

James 4:4
Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the
friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever
therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God.

Plus, it's known medical fact that alcohol is harmful to your health and Christians
have been bought with a price they are not their own and are called to glorify
God in their bodies (1 Corinthians 6:19-20) so drinking alcohol is sinful behavior.

1 Corinthians 3:17
If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy;
for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

Christians have no right to abuse their body by ingesting alcohol.
Those that don't take their relationship with the Lord seriously
would be the ones drinking booze while claiming to be Christians.

As stated, your position cannot be sustained biblically.

Drunkards is not a reference to any who imbibe. It is a reference to alcoholics.


Colossians 2:16
Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day.

 

[Dan Clarkston]

Only people who agree with me take God’s Word seriously?! That’s your humble position, eh?

Your "humble position" is that only those that agree with you take God's Word seriously.

So you are doing the exact same thing you are accusing me of!

Why do you suppose YHWH did not smite them for sinning before him by drinking?

Try a different verse to support your argument as that one makes no mention of WHAT they were drinking.

As stated, your position cannot be sustained biblically.

Actually it is your position cannot be sustained biblically.

 

[BlessedPeace]

Actually it is your position cannot be sustained biblically.

You know that's false. Many here , second only to God's word, have proven your position is in error.