Drugs And Religion?

[Kaz]

I don't care how many times a person reads the bible or how many passages a member posts here in rebuttal to an opinion, there are still countless things that we will never know about God and how He works. A little open mindedness please.

 

[michaelvpardo]

Alright. We don't know each other very well, but I didn't join this forum to be judged.

Just because I use "Buddy Christ" as my avatar, does NOT mean that I mean ANY disrespect towards Him. You don't know me. You don't know what's in my heart. Jesus does, and that's all that matters to me. I've been through a lot of hard crap in my life like everyone else, and have never lost my faith, so if you don't like my avatar, fine but keep your comments to yourself.

I thought dogma was one of the funniest movies that I've ever seen despite the carnal and somewhat immoral humor. If I didn't see the Lord as my best friend, I'd have never done some of the most difficult things He asked of me and God definitely has a sense of humor.
The wicked plots against the just, And gnashes at him with his teeth. The Lord laughs at him, For He sees that his day is coming. Psalm 37:12-13
And "a log in your eye?" You know His disciples had to be giggling and trying to hold back their laughter out of respect. I get it. An avatar is a representation of the user and if you see yourself as buddy Jesus, being renewed in His image, well that's just impressive. Some folks have thin skin and don't get the humor, but I laughed when I first saw one of your posts. I'm going to apologize for a brother that I don't even know because some of us express our zeal for Christ in ways offensive to others. Been there, done that, hope I didn't do too much damage.
I have found the church to be a much greater exercise in forgiveness than anything I've experienced in the world, so God bless you with mercy and love to forgive as He's forgiven (I have to tell myself that every time I involve myself in any controversy on this forum.) In Christianity "let love rule" actually means something, so don't let the young lions get on your nerves. You can always look at someone's profile and click on ignore. I been doing that a lot in the last few years as there's no good reason to let people steal your peace.

 

[quietthinker]

Truman the Levite's thread about Christians smoking marijuana got me to thinking. From past personal experiences with several different drugs, hallucinogens and others, I noticed that on many occasions they would bring about a desire to be closer to and learn more about God. I wasn't just me, I've seen many others do the same.

Is there perhaps something about some drugs that may actually be used in positive way? If a drug makes you desire to learn and want to be closer to God, is this necessarily a bad thing?

Drugs and Religion have always been closely associated in various cultures worldwide. It is a dangerous combination for several reasons; it alters the space of how one sees impairing good judgement. It is in fact a window used by the evil one to distort. The 'good' experience one has is not a reason to justify it, for example, an adulterous relationship has all the hallmarks of excitement and justification but does this actually justify it?....it does in fact create breakdown, the opposite of what one initially imagines.

 

[FHII]

In the majority of cases I don't approve of drug use. I have to explain that opening statement before I can even move on! In short, I have a friend with a very painful and nauseating disease. Marijuana may alleviate her pain. I don't have knowledge that she has tried it. But this disease is going to take her if the Lord doesn't intervene, and yes... We have been in prayer for tears about it. Well, she is still around, so maybe the prayers have worked! But if this drug (which is an herb) can alleviate her pain, I am not going to judge her for using it. Is it any different when the Bible says to give strong drink to those that are perishing?

Now if you are going to talk about drugs, alcohol must be included. Its allowed in the Bible, but not to the point of drunkenness. So can you take a tote of weed or snort a short line? Just as long as it doesn't get you high?

Truthfully, I say no. But it is an interesting and difficult question if alcohol is ok. And frankly, its not ok to get drunk. Yeah, sometimes I do... But it isn't ok.

The Bible says many times to be sober minded. That can mean absence of drugs, but it is not limited to it. You can be stone cold sober of drugs and alcohol and still be drunk on power, a philosophy or simply emotions. Heck... In Acts 2 folks were thought drunk because they had the holy spirit!

But if you get high or drunk and find yourself talking to God and he actually talks back, who am I to say don't listen? Who can say that God isn't using that low point to say, "are you ready to get out of this"?

But if "God" is giving you devine knowledge while high or drunk... I think you should question the spirits to see what sort they are from.

 

[Curtis]

Although there is no Scriptural verse prohibiting drug use, I am guided by my Bible Study leaders common refrain, “It’s all about God’s glory.”

How does doing drugs bring glory to God?

Since getting drunk is a sin, getting high has to be one, also.

 

[Curtis]

I don't care how many times a person reads the bible or how many passages a member posts here in rebuttal to an opinion, there are still countless things that we will never know about God and how He works. A little open mindedness please.

Except scripture reveals all things pertaining to righteousness, we don’t have to guess in that area.

 

[Kaz]

Except scripture reveals all things pertaining to righteousness, we don’t have to guess in that area.

The Lord also works in mysterious ways. There's no way you can tell me that when He created marijuana and shrooms that He didn't know we were going to get high off 'em. There's a reason these drugs have this specific effect. Are you trying to tell me that the bible explains everything that God is thinking and exactly why He created every natural growing plant and fungi?

 

[Kaz]

Also, nice to meet you Curtis.

 

[Wrangler]

The Lord also works in mysterious ways. There's no way you can tell me that when He created marijuana and shrooms that He didn't know we were going to get high off 'em. There's a reason these drugs have this specific effect. Are you trying to tell me that the bible explains everything that God is thinking and exactly why He created every natural growing plant and fungi?

Appeal to Nirvana. It seems you are setting an expectation designed to fail God's Word. We don't need to know EVERYTHING about God to know ...

Scripture reveals all things pertaining to righteousness, we don’t have to guess in that area.

Repeating the mantra 'The Lord also works in mysterious ways' undermines Curtis' valid point; that Scripture reveals all things pertaining to righteousness, we don’t have to guess in that area. I asked the question How does doing drugs bring glory to God? This question 'flips the script' on the implicit claim that the absence of Biblical prohibition means we can do a thing.

FHII points out 'The Bible says many times to be sober minded.' What do you have to say about that? All glory to God (none to drug use for recreational purposes). Better to be high on God's love, grace and mercy.

 

[Yan]

Don't use those drugs only to get such an experience with God existence, as those drugs was used as a sword to your own soul (Luke 2:35) as the sword here defined as devil temptation using herbs (ancient) or lsd (modern) before they attack with necromancy/black magic (Matthew 13:24-30), if you'd got a black magic attack the devil will whisper your heart or mind to other people surround you to make them hate you for a purpose; that's why devil was called as a spirit of schism, divide, and adultery (Hosea 4:12-14; Hosea 5:1-4; Acts of the apostles 16:16), those sorcerer always seeks people with Holy Spirit as their burnt offerings sacrifice for their gods because they got money from their divination/necromancy, as since beginning the serpent always against God (Acts of the apostles 19:13-20).
It all become make sense, why did Jesus lead by Holy Spirit in the wilderness (Luke 4:1-13) ?
Jesus was also have had attacked by sorcerer (Hebrews 4:14-16) and that's why he had 40 days fasting to overcome that temptation (Matthew 17:14-21). As since ancient babylonian sorcerer always tempted believers using fungus or mushrooms to put onto believer's food or drink to make them hallucinate and under their spells.
So, God deliver us and protect us from this temptation only by Grace because of our unknowning or not aware of being poisoned. So don't ever tried to used those hallucinogen for a purpose, if your heart or mind is weak then you might gone crazy and you can't distinct of reality and fantasy, those hallucinogen can bring your consciousness into mental disorder (Anxiety disorder, Guilty disorder, Disassociative disorder, etc).

 

[Truman]

When I first got the high that Holy Spirit gives, I realized what a cheap counterfeit everything else is in comparison.

 

[soul man]

I thought dogma was one of the funniest movies that I've ever seen despite the carnal and somewhat immoral humor. If I didn't see the Lord as my best friend, I'd have never done some of the most difficult things He asked of me and God definitely has a sense of humor.
The wicked plots against the just, And gnashes at him with his teeth. The Lord laughs at him, For He sees that his day is coming. Psalm 37:12-13
And "a log in your eye?" You know His disciples had to be giggling and trying to hold back their laughter out of respect. I get it. An avatar is a representation of the user and if you see yourself as buddy Jesus, being renewed in His image, well that's just impressive. Some folks have thin skin and don't get the humor, but I laughed when I first saw one of your posts. I'm going to apologize for a brother that I don't even know because some of us express our zeal for Christ in ways offensive to others. Been there, done that, hope I didn't do too much damage.
I have found the church to be a much greater exercise in forgiveness than anything I've experienced in the world, so God bless you with mercy and love to forgive as He's forgiven (I have to tell myself that every time I involve myself in any controversy on this forum.) In Christianity "let love rule" actually means something, so don't let the young lions get on your nerves. You can always look at someone's profile and click on ignore. I been doing that a lot in the last few years as there's no good reason to let people steal your peace.

Yea the online duke out. We post with all sincerity and bip you have a slugfest. It is just an online deal and most know it and try to not be to mean. If we met in person it would be completely different without the dukes. The trolls that come in christian sites (not saying that is what is happening in this thread) are pretty easy to spot but cause fueds nonetheless. It is kind of entertaining if it doesn't get to brutal. In a chat-room everyone get's to talk, and that is what I like about online, you don't have to just sit in some boring Sunday school class listening not able to really lay out your heart and puts you to sleep. I think everyone should be able to speak and give their thoughts on spiritual matters. Online has pros and cons just as all life so to me it is a good thing and you can fellowship with people all over the world if you want. I started in mid-nineties doing christian rooms on AOL (does that even still exsist) and have loved it ever since - not all but 95% of my experience has been good.

 

[Renniks]

Truman the Levite's thread about Christians smoking marijuana got me to thinking. From past personal experiences with several different drugs, hallucinogens and others, I noticed that on many occasions they would bring about a desire to be closer to and learn more about God. I wasn't just me, I've seen many others do the same.

Is there perhaps something about some drugs that may actually be used in positive way? If a drug makes you desire to learn and want to be closer to God, is this necessarily a bad thing?

I have a relative into this and it scares me frankly. What is he opening his mind to? Sure, it's a key to the spiritual realm, but which one? When a person on drugs talks about spirituality, is it really the God of the Bible he's talking about or the one who disguises himself as an angel of light?

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Truman the Levite's thread about Christians smoking marijuana got me to thinking. From past personal experiences with several different drugs, hallucinogens and others, I noticed that on many occasions they would bring about a desire to be closer to and learn more about God. I wasn't just me, I've seen many others do the same.

Is there perhaps something about some drugs that may actually be used in positive way? If a drug makes you desire to learn and want to be closer to God, is this necessarily a bad thing?

Being closer to God is an awesome thing, but you won't get there with drugs. Under the care and guidance of physicians, psychotropics are a useful tool, but any other use is dangerous. Truman was right-- sorcery in the bible is pharamkea. Getting high, getting drunk produce an altered state of consciousness and that is a gateway for demons to oppress and even control an individual (not posees but put you back in bondage).

This getting closer to God with drugs is a trap from the devil. He may lure at first with all sorts of amazing lies that seem so right, then sooner or later he will lower the boom.

 

[friend of]

I used to be the same way Kaz. Once upon a time. But now I know that using hallucinogens is not the way God wants us to be in contact with Him. We shouldn't need catalysts like hallucinogens to come into His presence. Not to mention that when we dabble in hallucinogens we are dabbling in the spirit world and there are many spirits there who want to take our focus away from Christ and put it on a generic "God" that is not the God of Christianity.

 

[NayborBear]

It certainly is a can of worms when "cussing and discussing" drug/alcohol usage! Especially these days of scientifically refined drugs! Right?
Reminds me of a line from an old song (well?...now it is...) "in the year 3535, ain't gonna need to tell the truth, tell no lie." "Everything you think do and say....is in the pill you took today!"

Seems we gentiles are in this "tug of war connundrum" with:
Exodus 15:26
And said, If thou wilt diligently hearken to the voice of the Lord thy God, and wilt do that which is right in his sight, and wilt give ear to his commandments, and keep all his statutes, I will put none of these diseases upon thee, which I have brought upon the Egyptians: for I am the Lord that healeth thee.

And "Man!" (aka the "number" of the beast)
1 Corinthians 10:22


Do we provoke the Lord to jealousy? are we stronger than he?

And just how much "influence" has "man" made upon, and negated "those called by His name?"
Into the "relegating" of these mortal flesh bodies to be healed in continuing "nimrod's leagacy" in the "falsely called science" called "modern medicine?"

 

[friend of]

Also @Kaz i think "Buddy Christ" is hilarious.

 

[Guestman]

Truman the Levite's thread about Christians smoking marijuana got me to thinking. From past personal experiences with several different drugs, hallucinogens and others, I noticed that on many occasions they would bring about a desire to be closer to and learn more about God. I wasn't just me, I've seen many others do the same.

Is there perhaps something about some drugs that may actually be used in positive way? If a drug makes you desire to learn and want to be closer to God, is this necessarily a bad thing?

When Jesus was offered wine drugged with myrrh, what did he do with it ? The account says that "he would not take it."(Mark 15:23) And why ? Because he wanted to have complete control of his senses till his death, wanting to face this difficult situation squarely during this supreme test of his faith.

Jesus was not like many who turn to drugs to either escape life's pressures or anxieties or even to feel like a "winner", to get "high", to feel that he can be "king of the mountain". Rather, Jesus wanted full control of his faculties at all times, even when feeling the intense pain of being nailed to the stake, for obedient mankind's everlasting future depended upon him, and he was to be the perfect example for true Christians.(1 Pet 2:21)

It was only later when he was thirsty that he accepted undrugged wine.(John 19:28-30; see Ps 22:15) Being the perfect example to follow, "as we look intently at the Chief Agent and Perfecter of our faith, Jesus" (Heb 12:2), instead of using mind-altering drugs (or alcohol) to cope with problems, pressures and uncomfortable situations, a person who faces them head, though stressful, on will fare much better, helping them to be responsible like Jesus.

At Isaiah 50, of Jesus, it says: "The Sovereign Lord Jehovah has given me the tongue of those taught, so that I may know how to answer the tired one with the right word. He awakens me morning by morning; He awakens my ear to listen like the taught ones. The Sovereign Lord Jehovah has opened my ear, and I was not rebellious. I did not turn in the opposite direction."(Isa 50:4, 5)

Jesus allowed himself to be taught by Jehovah God, not turning to mind-altering drugs when things "got tight", so that he "was not rebellious" and "turn in the opposite direction" away from Jehovah.

Of marijuana, according to Webmd, the signs of marijuana use are:

(1) rapid heart rate,
(2) increased blood pressure,
(3) increased rate of breathing,
(4) red eyes,
(5) dry mouth,
(6) increased appetite,
(7) slowed reaction time.

Marijuana stays within a person's system for as long as a month, with that person being possibly impaired from several days to perhaps several weeks after the high wears off. What could happen to someone who drives or operates machinery while in this state ? Many put personal pleasure ahead of the safety of others, even of themselves. Would Jesus do that ?(see John 15:13)

 

[Grailhunter]

I think that you're spot on with this post, but I know from my personal experience as a longtime "abuser" of cannabis that besides just enjoying euphoria, I was self medicating because of long term anxiety issues and emotional trauma caused by parental abuse, disciplinary abuses of catholic nuns, abuse from peers who loved intimidating a big kid with a timid personality, abuse from University educators for not accepting theory as fact, abuse from officers in the military threatened by intellect and skill, abuse from supervisors intimidated by my skills and fearful of my intentions, and over 20 years of abuse on line from both professing Christians and nonbelievers for disagreeing with them.
I've had one physician give prescriptions for anxiety meds which had serious side effects, and on the occasion that led to my separation and ultimately to my divorce, I was put on powerful "stabilizers" in a hospital ward to restore my brain chemistry to normal after 12 days of partial fasting and sleep deprivation during the feast of tabernacles which coincided with my birthday back in 2017. Those meds were so powerful that my physician had to ween me off them slowly after I was evaluated as "not crazy" (in the words of the resident psychiatrist on the ward) and released. I fainted in my brother's bathroom under the effect of one of those meds and a step in one direction could've opened my skull.
While I know that we should avoid breaking the laws and should "be of a sound mind", I've always thought it odd that the Lord often provided cannabis providentially for my times of great distress and anxiety (I received unexpected "gifts", I found lost bags and joints where I walked or sat on campus, I was befriended by students who "dealt" on campus and smoked with me regularly glad for my company.) God's grace is inexplicable and He clearly created natural plant remedies for many disorders. As far as I know He called them all good (weed is a misnomer for cannabis which can be found growing wild where it was once cultivated but doesn't have thorns, nor grows as thistles or brambles, and has been cultivated for religious uses for millennia.)
The scripture prohibits the use of sorcery under the law, and sorcery in the original language involves the use of drugs for the reasons you've already given, but also because these ancient mystical pharmacists gathered poisons for performing abortions and other murders. Strictly speaking, prescription pharmaceuticals are no different from naturally occurring drug substances. Like most natural things potentially harmful in our experience, God made them good, but we pervert His intentions through our abuse.

Well, thank you Lord for making me a big Ox and evil has the good sense to run from me. Amen

 

[DuckieLady]

I don't care how many times a person reads the bible or how many passages a member posts here in rebuttal to an opinion, there are still countless things that we will never know about God and how He works. A little open mindedness please.

Jesus said the way is narrow and some people are so open minded that their brain has fallen out.

The physical effects on the body are not changing the spirit. The Bible tells us to be sober of mind.

" But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law..."

But getting high will not please God. What will please the Lord is a heart that seeks him in obedience.

And the Lord rewards those who seek Him.