EASTER?

[sniper762]

, the gospels say that jesus was crucified "the day of
preparation, the day before the sabboth"
joseph requested the body so it could be buried before the fast
approaching sabboth (which begins at sunset of the seventh day (saturday) of
the week. (that would be friday), i add,
the end of friday, so you cant count friday as one of the days.

mary magdaline discovered him to be already risen very early
in the morning of the the first day of the week, "the day after the sabboth" (that
would be sunday), which the night has transpired but not yet the day (therefore
you cannot count sunday as a full day)

so, do the math,,,,,,,,,,from friday evening before the
sabboth until sunday morning after the sabboth= 2 nights(the night of the sabboth
and the night after the sabboth) and one
day (the day of the sabboth). Total time
in the grave= 1 day and 2 nghts.

MOST CHRISTIANS BELIEVE THAT JESUS WAS IN THE TOMB FOR 3 DAYS AND 3 NIGHTS

PLEASE EXPLAIN

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

He died on the day of Preparation 3 hours before the next day started. He remained dead all of the day of Passover (night/day), all of the next day (night/day) which was the start of unleavened bread, and then raised on the morning of first fruits, which was 12 hours (assuming 6AM) into the 3rd day depending on what hour he arose. So I guess technically it wasn't 72 hours, but it does appear he was dead for 63+ hours (3+ 24 + 24 + 12), which is three days more than its two days.

 

[Dan57]

I personally believe Christ was crucified on Wednesday and place in the tomb before sunset. Its a little confusing, but there were 2 Sabbaths, the regular weekly (Saturday) Sabbath and the High Sabbath. Christ rose early Sunday, but it was before 6:00 AM, making it still the Hebrew Sabbath Day. http://www.centuryone.com/crucifixion.html

 

[ericrun]

Sniper762, in the bible, when days are counted, the count includes the first and last day. For instance, when a Jewish baby is circumcised on the 8th day as Abraham was directed, that means you count the day the baby was born and the day they are circumcised. So if a baby is born on Sunday, they are circumcised on the next Sunday. Counting Sunday, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday and Sunday as 8 days, even if the baby is born late on Sunday and is circumcised early on Sunday for 156 hours or 6.5 days.

Likewise on the 3 days in the tomb, noon to sundown on Friday=1st day, all day Saturday=2nd day, sundown Saturday to whenever Jesus rose=3rd day.

In John 20:26, Jesus's second appearance when Thomas was present happened after 8 days. The text doesn't say this is the first day of the week, but most likely, Jesus was making a point about the Lord's Day, by making his first two appearances in the upper room on the first day.

 

[Groundzero]

It's also important to remember that the Jewish day started at evening.

 

[williemac]

I personally believe Christ was crucified on Wednesday and place in the tomb before sunset. Its a little confusing, but there were 2 Sabbaths, the regular weekly (Saturday) Sabbath and the High Sabbath. Christ rose early Sunday, but it was before 6:00 AM, making it still the Hebrew Sabbath Day. http://www.centuryone.com/crucifixion.html

This is the most likely scenario. Not too many people know about the two sabbaths, the first one being called the high sabbath. The only thing I will say differently is that He likely rose saturday evening. The correction is that the seventh day sabbath begins fri. at 6:00 pm. and ends sat. at six pm. Thereofe any time after six on saturday is technically the 1st day of the week. If He rose sunday morning this would make it four nights (wed.,thurs.,fri.,sat.) So, sat. evening is the probability. He was already gone when they arrived at the tomb sunday morning.

 

[Axehead]

I wonder what Sniper762 thinks of all of your answers?

 

[JB_Reformed Baptist]

I wonder what Sniper762 thinks of all of your answers?

What could you possibly mean by that.

 

[sniper762]

i think that it is NOT scripture


MARK 15

42 ¶ And now when the even was come, because it was the day of preparation,
[b]that is, the day before the sabbath.

43 Joseph of Arimathaea, an honourable acounsellor, which also waited for the
kingdom of God, came, and went in boldly unto Pilate, and bcraved the body of
Jesus.

44 And Pilate marvelled if he were already dead: and calling unto him the
centurion, he asked him whether he had been any while dead.

45 And when he knew it of the centurion, he gave the body to Joseph.



MATHEW 28

1 In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the
week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre. IN DEALING
WITH THE CRUCIFIXION AND THE RESURECTION THE BIBLE SPEAKS OF THE SABBOTH, NOT
THE PASSSOVER

0

 

[Axehead]

What could you possibly mean by that.

Simple, JB. Don't read anything into it. Since Sniper started the OP, and there were about 6 or so answers, I was wondering what he thought. I see that he has shared his point of view. Thanks Sniper.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

I was wrong about Christ being in the grave the whole day of Passover. He was crucified on Passover, the day of preparation. Therefore, Christ was only dead 3 hours on the day of Passover, 24 hours on the first day of unleavened bread, and raised the following morning before sunrise, which was the festival of firstfruits. Therefore he was raised on the third day, but not in the grave for 3 full days.

I think the confusion regarding the Sabbath is because the Greek word sabbaton is used in the above mentioned verses, which is a plural word referring, not to the weekly sabbath, but to the one or more of the 7 weeks of weeks between passover and pentecost. Here is something on this subject that might help - http://www.translatum.gr/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=53ceee133d3120390c2b1cd09f0532ba&topic=6592.0

Update:

Now I'm starting to doubt this. The reason being Matthew 12:40:

For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth. Matthew 12:40

In light of this verse, Jesus resurrected on the day following the start of unleavened bread doesn't work because that would only be 2 nights.

One thing we know beyond a shadow of a doubt is that Jesus died on Passover, was buried at the start of the first day of unleavened bread, and rose on the morning of firstfruits. Firstfruits is described in Leviticus 23:11:

And he shall wave the sheaf before the LORD, to be accepted for you: on the morrow after the sabbath the priest shall wave it. Leviticus 23:11

I was taught that the day after the first day of unleavened bread was always firstfruits. But I'm starting to think that may not be correct.The above verse says firstfruits was to be the day following the sabbath. The first and seventh days of unleavened bread were days of rest, but I don't think they were called sabbaths. So I am starting to think that the above verse is referring to the weekly sabbath. That would mean that firstfruits would always occur on a Sunday, but not necessarily the day after the first day of unleavened bread. In other words, firstfruits would float in relation to unleavened bread.

That seems to eliminate any difficulties, and allows the following scenario:

• Christ was crucified on Wednesday (Passover)
• Spent Thursday night and day in the grave (1st day of unleavened bread)
• Spent Friday night and day in the grave (2nd day of unleavened bread)
• Spent Saturday night and day in the grave (3rd day of unleavened bread)
• Was resurrected at the beginning of Sunday (firstfruits, the day following the sabbath)

Mark 15:42 says that Joseph asked Pilate for Christ's body the day before the Sabbath, which seems to say that Christ died on Friday. The Greek word used there though is sabbaton, which is plural; so it is likely not referring to the weekly sabbath, but possibly the day of rest on the first day of unleavened bread.

Also, the day of preparation mentioned in Mark 15:42 may not be referring to the weekly sabbath, but to the preparation for unleavened bread during which a family searched and cleaned their house to remove all leaven. That day was also a day of rest, so there had to be some preparation for it.

Update 2:
I poked around the Internet to see if the above has merit and came across this well-researched, well-reasoned piece that indicates it does. - http://www.nailedtocross.com/articles/shavuot_timing.htm

I'm convinced.

 

[Webers_Home]

.
Jesus underwent crucifixion, death, and burial prior to the night that the
Jews dined upon their Passover lambs. (John 18:28)

Jesus was done eating his own Passover lamb twenty-four hours ahead of
the Jews' lambs. (John 13:1-2)

So then, by comparing the synoptic gospels with John's gospel, it becomes
readily apparent that there were two Passover dinners eaten that year a day
apart: Jesus' dinner and the Jews' dinner.

When people neglect to factor that seemingly insignificant detail into their
thinking, they inevitably fall prey to erroneous chronologies.

Buen Camino
/

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

.
Jesus underwent crucifixion, death, and burial prior to the night that the
Jews dined upon their Passover lambs. (John 18:28)

Jesus was done eating his own Passover lamb twenty-four hours ahead of
the Jews' lambs. (John 13:1-2)

So then, by comparing the synoptic gospels with John's gospel, it becomes
readily apparent that there were two Passover dinners eaten that year a day
apart: Jesus' dinner and the Jews' dinner.

When people neglect to factor that seemingly insignificant detail into their
thinking, they inevitably fall prey to erroneous chronologies.

Buen Camino
/

Why don't you demonstrate through scripture that there were two passover dinners.

 

[Webers_Home]

.
ChristRoseFromTheDead, on 30 Mar 2013 - 09:21, said: Why don't you
demonstrate through scripture that there were two passover dinners.

See post #12

Buen Camino
/

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

.
ChristRoseFromTheDead, on 30 Mar 2013 - 09:21, said: Why don't you
demonstrate through scripture that there were two passover dinners.

See post #12

Buen Camino
/

no, I mean why don't you instruct those who don't see. I don't see.

 

[tim_from_pa]

, the gospels say that jesus was crucified "the day of
preparation, the day before the sabboth"
joseph requested the body so it could be buried before the fast
approaching sabboth (which begins at sunset of the seventh day (saturday) of
the week. (that would be friday), i add,
the end of friday, so you cant count friday as one of the days.

mary magdaline discovered him to be already risen very early
in the morning of the the first day of the week, "the day after the sabboth" (that
would be sunday), which the night has transpired but not yet the day (therefore
you cannot count sunday as a full day)

so, do the math,,,,,,,,,,from friday evening before the
sabboth until sunday morning after the sabboth= 2 nights(the night of the sabboth
and the night after the sabboth) and one
day (the day of the sabboth). Total time
in the grave= 1 day and 2 nghts.

MOST CHRISTIANS BELIEVE THAT JESUS WAS IN THE TOMB FOR 3 DAYS AND 3 NIGHTS

PLEASE EXPLAIN

This sounds similar to a thread on another Christian forum I answered. I'm not sure if I already answered you or not, but this 3 days and 3 nights issue comes up every Easter, and if people are honestly perceptive, it proves that Friday evening until pre-dawn Sunday morning is not 3 days and 3 nights otherwise it would not be brought up ad-nauseum. Because you are right, that time span is not 3 days and 3 nights otherwise Messiah would have been a liar.

At the expense of sounding like a broken record, I find only one mathematically and prophetically sound way to interpret this.

Yeshua (Jesus) died late in Nisan 14 to fulfil Passover.
He was interred late 14th/early 15th to fulfil Unleavened bread, i.e. all of Nisan 15 was the first full night and day in the tomb.

Yeshua made it clear he'd be in the tomb 72 hours (Matthew 12:40), so that's 3 calendar days later he'd rise. We all know how to add 3 without debating this, don't we? 14th/15th + 3 = 17th/18th. That is to say he arose Saturday evening at sundown as the 18th dawned for the priest to wave the wave sheaf for Firstfruits feast. The resurrection fulfilled Firstfruits.

What else do we know? Firstfruits was the "morrow after the (weekly) Sabbath" in Passover week. That's Sunday.

Now.... if Sunday falls on the 18th of any calendar, what day of the week is the 14th? That's the day he was crucified. I'll let everyone here figure out the actual day he was crucified --- simple enough.

Enough proof stated, anything else is either nonsense or placing 10 pounds of fudge in a 5 pound bag.

 

[Mungo]

.
Jesus underwent crucifixion, death, and burial prior to the night that the
Jews dined upon their Passover lambs. (John 18:28)

Jesus was done eating his own Passover lamb twenty-four hours ahead of
the Jews' lambs. (John 13:1-2)

So then, by comparing the synoptic gospels with John's gospel, it becomes
readily apparent that there were two Passover dinners eaten that year a day
apart: Jesus' dinner and the Jews' dinner.

When people neglect to factor that seemingly insignificant detail into their
thinking, they inevitably fall prey to erroneous chronologies.

Buen Camino
/

I've read a suggestion that Jesus celebrated his Passover according to the Esssene calendar

The Temple kept a lunar calendar of (basically) 354 days.However Judaism in Jesus time wasn’t a unified religion and there was a large group called the Essenes. When the dead sea scrolls were found it was discovered that the Essenes kept a solar calendar of 364 days, and on that calendar the Passover fell on a Tuesday every year. Moreover recent excavations have shown that the Essenes lived not only by the dead sea, but also lived in a part of Jerusalem.

The suggestion is that Jesus, knowing he would be dead by the time of the Temple Passover, celebrated Passover according to the Essene calendar on the Tuesday evening. That would also resolve the discrepancy between Matthew/Mark and John regarding how mnay days Jesus was in Bethany before the Passover.

One further bit of information. The traditionalb site of the upper room where Jesus celebrated the Passover is actually in the Essene part of Jerusalem.

This sounds similar to a thread on another Christian forum I answered. I'm not sure if I already answered you or not, but this 3 days and 3 nights issue comes up every Easter, and if people are honestly perceptive, it proves that Friday evening until pre-dawn Sunday morning is not 3 days and 3 nights otherwise it would not be brought up ad-nauseum. Because you are right, that time span is not 3 days and 3 nights otherwise Messiah would have been a liar.

At the expense of sounding like a broken record, I find only one mathematically and prophetically sound way to interpret this.

Yeshua (Jesus) died late in Nisan 14 to fulfil Passover.
He was interred late 14th/early 15th to fulfil Unleavened bread, i.e. all of Nisan 15 was the first full night and day in the tomb.

Yeshua made it clear he'd be in the tomb 72 hours (Matthew 12:40), so that's 3 calendar days later he'd rise. We all know how to add 3 without debating this, don't we? 14th/15th + 3 = 17th/18th. That is to say he arose Saturday evening at sundown as the 18th dawned for the priest to wave the wave sheaf for Firstfruits feast. The resurrection fulfilled Firstfruits.

What else do we know? Firstfruits was the "morrow after the (weekly) Sabbath" in Passover week. That's Sunday.

Now.... if Sunday falls on the 18th of any calendar, what day of the week is the 14th? That's the day he was crucified. I'll let everyone here figure out the actual day he was crucified --- simple enough.

Enough proof stated, anything else is either nonsense or placing 10 pounds of fudge in a 5 pound bag.

3 days and 3 nights was a Jewish idiom (actually wider than just Judaism). It doesn't mean literally 72 hours

Jesus never mentioned 72 hours..

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

I've read a suggestion that Jesus celebrated his Passover according to the Esssene calendar
The Temple kept a lunar calendar of (basically) 354 days.However Judaism in Jesus time wasn’t a unified religion and there was a large group called the Essenes. When the dead sea scrolls were found it was discovered that the Essenes kept a solar calendar of 364 days, and on that calendar the Passover fell on a Tuesday every year. Moreover recent excavations have shown that the Essenes lived not only by the dead sea, but also lived in a part of Jerusalem.
The suggestion is that Jesus, knowing he would be dead by the time of the Temple Passover, celebrated Passover according to the Essene calendar on the Tuesday evening. That would also resolve the discrepancy between Matthew/Mark and John regarding how mnay days Jesus was in Bethany before the Passover.
One further bit of information. The traditionalb site of the upper room where Jesus celebrated the Passover is actually in the Essene part of Jerusalem.
3 days and 3 nights was a Jewish idiom (actually wider than just Judaism). It doesn't mean literally 72 hours
Jesus never mentioned 72 hours..

The problem I see with this interpretation is that the Essenes were a fringe sect. Jesus was commanded by the law to observe Passover on the evening of 14 Nisan. To have done otherwise would have put him in violation of the law, which would have been sin.

The pharisees sat in the seat of Moses, and Jesus told everyone to do what they said. When the high priest commanded Jesus to solemnly swear under oath if he was the messiah, Jesus obeyed. So their observance of passover was the law, not the essenes'.

Also, I think any speculation about the upper room is just that - speculation. No one knows where it was.

 

[mjrhealth]

And all this bickering is going to do what for your spiritual growth. Oh how clever is the devil, deceives man through His pride.

In All His Love

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Why don't you demonstrate through scripture that there were two passover dinners.

Ooh, I see it now. I didn't read the verses you listed (that is always helpful).

I don't think John 13:1 supports your view because all it really says is that Jesus having known beforehand that he would be crucified, loved his disciples unto the end.

HOWEVER, John 18:28 is very interesting. That indeed does say that Jesus ate the passover the night before 14 Nisan. So it does appear that you are right.

That would have to mean that he died on a Thursday, 14 Nisan, towards the end of the day; and was then in the tomb, 14 Nisan, 15 Nisan, 16 Nisan (the weekly sabbath), and then raised on 17 Nisan (Sunday).

Very good.

And all this bickering is going to do what for your spiritual growth. Oh how clever is the devil, deceives man through His pride.

The devil loves to cast doubt on Christian doctrine. We are merely trying to understand the apparent discrepancy in order to ward off his atttacks via skeptics, and remove doubt. Go back to sleep.