Eternal Security

[marks]

According to this passage . . .

Colossians 3:1-4 KJV
1) If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God.
2) Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.
3) For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.
4) When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.

Is there anyone who has been "raised with Christ", being "dead", who will NOT appear with Christ in glory?

Much love!

 

[marks]

1 John 3:1-3 KJV
1) Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not.
2) Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.
3) And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.

Can you know? Or is this disengenuous . . . that is . . . false?

Much love!

 

[Lambano]

According to this passage . . .

Colossians 3:1-4 KJV
1) If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God.
2) Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.
3) For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.
4) When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.

Is there anyone who has been "raised with Christ", being "dead", who will NOT appear with Christ in glory?

Much love!

So, going back to our discussion about election “in Christ”: I’ve latched on to this concept of double identification with Christ, and I can’t let go. Jesus identifies with us in our humanness and our sin and our our death; we identify with Him in… in what? The passage mentions His resurrection. And mindset. Discipleship counts as identification, I would think. Security would then be continuing to identify with or stay with (or “abiding in”, though that’s not part of my normal vocabulary) Him.

 

[Lambano]

1 John 3:1-3 KJV
1) Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not.
2) Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.
3) And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.

Can you know? Or is this disengenuous . . . that is . . . false?

Much love!

Technical question: Do read any difference between the “oido” in verse 2 (which I usually take as “perceiving” and the “ginosko” in verse 1, which I usually take as a more internalized knowledge?

 

[marks]

Technical question: Do read any difference between the “oido” in verse 2 (which I usually take as “perceiving” and the “ginosko” in verse 1, which I usually take as a more internalized knowledge?

Perceiving compared to knowing, I'd go with that.

Much love!

 

[marks]

we identify with Him in… in what?

Sonship. He shares our humanity, and we share His Sonship.

He became a man, so we can become sons of God.

Much love!

 

[Lambano]

Sonship. He shares our humanity, and we share His Sonship.

He became a man, so we can become sons of God.

Much love!

Excellent answer! How did I miss that one?

 

[marks]

Excellent answer! How did I miss that one?

Lot's of people miss that one. I did too for a long time. We truly share what Jesus has, we are in Him.

Michael Reeves may be good to listen to. I found these extremely useful.

Much love!

 

[amigo de christo]

ETERNAL SALVATION . FOUND ONLY IN JESUS . YEAH . Take that to the celestial bank .
BUT , we had better make sure its the BIBLICAL JESUS we are BELIEVING IN AND FOLLOWING .
Cause , as i am sure paul would say as well , another jesus cant save ya .
ETERNAL SALVATION . What must i do to be saved , BELIEVE IN JESUS CHRIST .

 

[amigo de christo]

For there is NO , as in NO , as in NONE , other NAME whereby one may be saved .
TAKE that to the celestial bank . ITS SOLID TRUTH my friends . Let none be swayed by the all inclusive lie .
No other god , no other religion , can save YA . ONLY FAITH IN JESUS . cash in on the reward RIGHT NOW . I say to one i say to all .
Even if one gave all their money to the poor , fed many , yet rejected Christ , I tell us all that man will not have eternal life ,but
only the wrath of GOD abides on them . YE MUST BELEIVE IN JESUS .

 

[Wynona]

Here we go!

Does this promise really apply to all who claim to be Christians? Are there not warnings in Scripture about being found in us a hardened heart of unbelief?

Most importantly, if I show Scripture that refutes Eternal Security, than will you consider that it is simply a popular man-made doctrine without the support of the entire Word of God?

 

[Wynona]

For the sake of argument, let's say we put all theologians, pastors, and speakers aside and were willing to bear with a bit of Scripture.

What does the Bible say?

2 Peter 2:20-22 KJV

20 For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.

21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.

22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.



But Wynona, you can't mean we can lose our salvation if we don't endure to the end!!

That's exactly what Scripture says.

Hebrews 3:6 KJV

6 But Christ as a son over his own house; whose house are we, if we hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm unto the end.



But Wynona, we can't fail on the grace of God...

But that's the thing

Hebrews 12:14-15 KJV

14 Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord:

15 Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you, and thereby many be defiled;

Are there enough Scripture warnings to make us heed that we can depart from the faith(1 Timothy 4:1) ?

How much Scripture is needed to show that we can believe and later have an evil heart of unbelief (Hebrews 3:12-15)?

Are there a lot of Scriptures warning that we can cast off our first faith (1 Timothy 5:11-15)? You better believe it!

Can we fall from grace (Galatians 5: 1-4)?

Yes!!

 

[Truman]

I died, You live and dwell inside of me
I am finally assured of eternity
You never left my side, not even when I died
You were with me in the dark, right by my side
Faithful is Your name tc
“Never will I leave you; never will I forsake you.” - Hebrews 13:5
"God don't make promises that He don't keep!" - Bob Dylan

 

[kcnalp]

Eternal security is Bible, unless we forsake God!

 

[marks]

Here we go!

Does this promise really apply to all who claim to be Christians? Are there not warnings in Scripture about being found in us a hardened heart of unbelief?

Most importantly, if I show Scripture that refutes Eternal Security, than will you consider that it is simply a popular man-made doctrine without the support of the entire Word of God?

And of those Scriptures I've shown?

I'm not wanting to "play Scripture against Scripture", instead, I believe they harmonize. Scriptures correctly understood will harmonize with all others.

Much love!

 

[Pythagorean12]

"I died to give them conditional impermanent revocable salvation." Jesus

If salvation is not permanent it isn't saving.

Imagine a beach lifeguard swimming out into the Pacific and rescuing a drowning person. And on the way back to shore the rescued swimmer says something that upsets the sensibilities of the lifeguard.
And the lifeguard in return let's the swimmer go, and the swimmer drowns.

Did the lifeguard fulfill his promise and save the swimmer?

 

[bbyrd009]

Can you know? Or is this disengenuous . . . that is . . . false?

id take we know there to be either pointing to deception, or verifying the truth of the proceeding statement; is there a witness, somewhere else in Scripture, to…we shall be like him?

 

[marks]

id take we know there to be either pointing to deception, or verifying the truth of the proceeding statement; is there a witness, somewhere else in Scripture, to…we shall be like him?

Til Christ be formed within you . . .

And the day star rise in your hearts . . .

To be conformed to the image of His Son . . .

I'd say yes.

Much love!

 

[bbyrd009]

Til Christ be formed within you . . .

And the day star rise in your hearts . . .

To be conformed to the image of His Son . . .

I'd say yes.

Much love!

i agree

seems like we are maybe a step closer to “John Doe, from Nowhere”

 

[marks]

i agree

seems like we are maybe a step closer to “John Doe, from Nowhere”

I think we are the John Does from nowhere, and we're coming home, to where Jesus has been all along.

Much love!