False converted, than apostate

[Lambano]

Sorry but as I said, unfortunately I've never been His son. So I'm not the Prodigal Son.

But you know what it's like to be lost. What is Jesus saying about the heart of the Father?

 

[Lizbeth]

How does repentance work ? Because I want to repent of my sins to God, but I feel like I'm not drawn by the Holy Spirit but only by myself. I don't feel this conviction that God wants me. I just know that I have to repent, but I don't think this is true conviction... Can I still ask God for forgiveness and believe that I am forgiven, even if I don't feel anything ?

I would say if your conscience is bothering you that is conviction enough to start with and is a good sign that your heart isn't hardened and your conscience isn't seared. Don't go by whether you are "feeling" God's presence, but just accept what the word of God says. Wherever we make our bed He is there in one sense even if we don't feel Him. (Ps 139:8) He knows you and knows and sees all that is going on with you.

But sin has consequences so it may be you will be feeling tormented for a while.....possibly for as long as you were sinning, though that is certainly not carved in stone, it will be for as long as you need. The Israelites were under judgment for the same length of time as all the "sabbaths" they didn't keep...it was like the Lord withdrawing His presence because they grieved the Holy Spirit. This is for someone's good, that they learn to fear God and not fall into sin again. During whatever length of time it takes, you have opportunity to show the Lord how sincere you are with wanting Him and wanting to learn obedience. See, even Jesus set an example of learning obedience by the things He suffered. The Lord chastises and disciplines who He LOVES as sons.

You need to make the determination and have a mindset that you will wait on the Lord and suffer through this for however long it takes, even if it were to take the rest of your life. Humble yourself under His mighty hand, and in due time He will lift you up. When we yield and submit to His discipline, it really and truly works to change us. If you have sinned in ways where you can make reparation, then you need to make things right with whoever you wronged. Just remember that the pleasures and gain from sin is the devil's measly bait for a trap that is not worth losing eternal life for This life is short...eternity is a very long time.

I suggest reading the Psalms for encouragement to hang on to hope....David sinned grievously and we read of what he went through and how he prayed and sought the Lord.

Also this:

Eze 33:13-16

If I tell a righteous person that they will surely live, but then they trust in their righteousness and do evil, none of the righteous things that person has done will be remembered; they will die for the evil they have done.

And if I say to a wicked person, ‘You will surely die,’ but they then turn away from their sin and do what is just and right—

f they give back what they took in pledge for a loan, return what they have stolen, follow the decrees that give life, and do no evil—that person will surely live; they will not die.

None of the sins that person has committed will be remembered against them. They have done what is just and right; they will surely live.

We certainly are in a battle for our soul.....but the word says be still and know that I am God, the battle is the Lord's. We need to learn to be at rest in Him, at rest from committing sins as well as self effort, but lean into the Spirit, yield to Him. It's not by might, not by power but by my spirit says the Lord. Read the word and meditate on the goodness and righteousness and holiness of Jesus and take eyes off oneself, but keep looking to Him.

He has promised, “Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you." Matthew 7:7 So encourage you to never give up asking, seeking and knocking for the strength and anything and everything you need.

 

[amigo de christo]

But even when I think that I'm forgiven, I don't have those feelings of joy and love in my heart. I can acknowledge the greatness of His sacrifice for me and thank Him for that, but it's not heartfelt like others believers who are in tears of thankfulness when they think about what Jesus did for them. Even when I manage to get myself believing I'm forgiven, I don't feel anything. Everything is in the mind, not the heart.

Man shall not live on emotions , but rather by the WORD and words of GOD .
stop letting fear drive you to a place wherein there simply is no hope .
You looking at man that was far worse than the lot of you all combinded .
GOD PULLED ME OUT and i DONT LOOK back . Now go and do likewise . Dont look back
and dont allow emotions to scare you half to death . TRUST Simply in GOD and in HIS CHRIST .
IF GOD was in the business of saving upright men , I HAD BEEN without HOPE . .
I came to call not the righteous but sinners to repentance . HEED THAT and LIVE FOR CHRIST as a new man

 

[poorlostapostate]

Thank you all for your answers. I didn't expect to get as much support for such a heavy case as mine. I might reply something else about what you wrote, but for now I'll leave it like that and I'll just think about it.

But here's another reasoning that I have : what tells me that I won't fall away again ? Because I did it once and I learned that I absolutely can't trust myself. And what if I'm not an elect ? Because if there's someone who absolutely doesn't deserve His mercy, it's me. I grew up in a loving christian family. From my birth to today, God gave me absolutely EVERYTHING that I needed to lead an abundant and godly life. I've had all the light that I needed. Even in my darkest time when I totally abandoned Him, when I was bathed deep in sins, God put christian people in my life to bring me back to Him. And still I ignored it.

What did I do with all those blessings that he gave me throughout my life ? Absolutely nothing. I've never really been grateful to Him, I've never really acknowledged the fortune that I had. I've never really had this desire to know God, or almost never. Instead, I've almost always ignored Him, always been attracted to sins. I had everything I needed to become a Godly man. But I chose sin. Why ? I have absolutely no idea. And by chosing sin, I became a very wicked person inside. I won't detail all the bads of me because it would be too long, but my biggest problem is my pride. And this pride led me to do very bad things, to have lusts. Why did I become this proud person ? I have absolutely no idea. I wish I had an explanation, but I don't.

I am a proud person and a vile sinner, and I have no excuse for that. It's not as if I had a hard childhood like, or went through a hard trial or something. No ! I'm just naturally wicked, twisted inside.

So why would God have mercy on me ? Why would I be part of the elect ? 31 years old, always known about God, always been blessed, but almost always ignored Him. And I would be an elect ?

 

[quietthinker]

Thank you all for your answers. I didn't expect to get as much support for such a heavy case as mine. I might reply something else about what you wrote, but for now I'll leave it like that and I'll just think about it.

But here's another reasoning that I have : what tells me that I won't fall away again ? Because I did it once and I learned that I absolutely can't trust myself. And what if I'm not an elect ? Because if there's someone who absolutely doesn't deserve His mercy, it's me. I grew up in a loving christian family. From my birth to today, God gave me absolutely EVERYTHING that I needed to lead an abundant and godly life. I've had all the light that I needed. Even in my darkest time when I totally abandoned Him, when I was bathed deep in sins, God put christian people in my life to bring me back to Him. And still I ignored it.

What did I do with all those blessings that he gave me throughout my life ? Absolutely nothing. I've never really been grateful to Him, I've never really acknowledged the fortune that I had. I've never really had this desire to know God, or almost never. Instead, I've almost always ignored Him, always been attracted to sins. I had everything I needed to become a Godly man. But I chose sin. Why ? I have absolutely no idea. And by chosing sin, I became a very wicked person inside. I won't detail all the bads of me because it would be too long, but my biggest problem is my pride. And this pride led me to do very bad things, to have lusts. Why did I become this proud person ? I have absolutely no idea. I wish I had an explanation, but I don't.

I am a proud person and a vile sinner, and I have no excuse for that. It's not as if I had a hard childhood like, or went through a hard trial or something. No ! I'm just naturally wicked, twisted inside.

So why would God have mercy on me ? Why would I be part of the elect ? 31 years old, always known about God, always been blessed, but almost always ignored Him. And I would be an elect ?

A gift has been given you; that makes you an elect. What you do with it is up to you. You can make any excuse you want just like those invited to the wedding banquet. Their excuses seemed plausible to them so the bottom line was, they didn't get to go to the banquet.

 

[Lambano]

But here's another reasoning that I have : what tells me that I won't fall away again ? Because I did it once and I learned that I absolutely can't trust myself.

Just as you're going to have to trust God to take you back, you're also going to have to trust God to keep you.

Really, if you can't trust you, what other choice do you have than to trust Him?

 

[sheariah07]

Thank you all for your answers. I didn't expect to get as much support for such a heavy case as mine. I might reply something else about what you wrote, but for now I'll leave it like that and I'll just think about it.

But here's another reasoning that I have : what tells me that I won't fall away again ? Because I did it once and I learned that I absolutely can't trust myself. And what if I'm not an elect ? Because if there's someone who absolutely doesn't deserve His mercy, it's me. I grew up in a loving christian family. From my birth to today, God gave me absolutely EVERYTHING that I needed to lead an abundant and godly life. I've had all the light that I needed. Even in my darkest time when I totally abandoned Him, when I was bathed deep in sins, God put christian people in my life to bring me back to Him. And still I ignored it.

What did I do with all those blessings that he gave me throughout my life ? Absolutely nothing. I've never really been grateful to Him, I've never really acknowledged the fortune that I had. I've never really had this desire to know God, or almost never. Instead, I've almost always ignored Him, always been attracted to sins. I had everything I needed to become a Godly man. But I chose sin. Why ? I have absolutely no idea. And by chosing sin, I became a very wicked person inside. I won't detail all the bads of me because it would be too long, but my biggest problem is my pride. And this pride led me to do very bad things, to have lusts. Why did I become this proud person ? I have absolutely no idea. I wish I had an explanation, but I don't.

I am a proud person and a vile sinner, and I have no excuse for that. It's not as if I had a hard childhood like, or went through a hard trial or something. No ! I'm just naturally wicked, twisted inside.

So why would God have mercy on me ? Why would I be part of the elect ? 31 years old, always known about God, always been blessed, but almost always ignored Him. And I would be an elect ?

Those who are born again cannot fall away again. God's seed will remain in you that you cannot sin anymore and the wicked one touches you not. All your trials is for your purification and you are not given a trial above what you can bear but there is always provided an escape.

1 John 3:9 KJV
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

1 Corinthians 10:13 KJV
There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.

That means, once you are born again, you are secured, sealed, protected by God.

Psalm 37:23-24 KJV
The steps of a good man are ordered by the Lord : and he delighteth in his way. [24] Though he fall, he shall not be utterly cast down: for the Lord upholdeth him with his hand.

Isaiah 46:4 KJV
And even to your old age I am he; and even to hoar hairs will I carry you : I have made, and I will bear; even I will carry, and will deliver you.

"So why would God have mercy on me ?"

Even Pharoah was shown mercy by God when he showed him all his wonders in Egypt. But he refused to humble his heart that's why his heart was hardened everytime he was shown mercy.

Exodus 10:3 KJV
And Moses and Aaron came in unto Pharaoh, and said unto him, Thus saith the Lord God of the Hebrews, How long wilt thou refuse to humble thyself before me? let my people go, that they may serve me.

You have to know that sinning over and over again is an indicator that you have not yet been born again.

A born again person is a new creature who does not struggle with sin anymore. Do you know that that's what's inside the new covenant of God?

Ezekiel 36:25-27,29 KJV
Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.
[26] A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
[27] And I will put my spirit within you, and CAUSE you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.
[29] I will also save you from all your uncleannesses: and I will call for the corn, and will increase it, and lay no famine upon you.

It is a covenant, a promise, he will "CAUSE" you to obey him, he will make you obey him, none of your efforts needed but only God's power at work here (by grace you have been saved and not by your own works)

How is it possible to ever stop from sinning? And here's God's promise and answer about your fear of returning from sinning and your old way of life.

Jeremiah 32:40 KJV
And I will make an everlasting covenant with them, that I will not turn away from them, to do them good; but I will put my fear in their hearts, that they shall not depart from me.

He will put His FEAR in your heart so that you will never ever depart from him (as you fear happening to you because you know how vile you are and you don't trust yourself)

Psalm 111:10 KJV
The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom: a good understanding have all they that do his commandments : his praise endureth for ever.

Proverbs 16:6 KJV
By mercy and truth iniquity is purged: and by the fear of the Lord men depart from evil.

Now what should you do?

Hebrews 3:15 KJV
While it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts, as in the provocation.

2 Chronicles 7:14 KJV
If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.

Humility is the opposite of pride. Humble yourself before God and ask him for mercy and to grant you true repentance, to open your eyes to what you don't see so that you might obey him. Ask him to humble you and put an end of yourself, to empty you, and then fill you with his Spirit.

Ask him to teach you how to deny yourself, to carry your cross daily, to lose your life on earth. Ask, seek, knock, and the door will be opened.

Any negative thoughts you have on God, ask him to remove it from you and to lead you to the right path.

If you want to also chat, let me know, I'd be happy to talk.

 

[Lambano]

Why would I be part of the elect ?

"Elect" means taking on the responsibilities of being part of God's people. It's not about privilege.

Please forgive me for this digression: I remember Rabbi Abraham Heschel in his book God in Search of Man writing something to the effect of when a Jewish child comes of age, he (or she) accepts the responsibilities of being part of God's chosen people. "Thus, we are not only a chosen people, we are also a choosing people."

My dog chewed up that book and I never did get to finish it. I wish I still had it. But I think I remembered the quote correctly.

I wrote that as much as a reminder to myself about the responsibilities I accepted as being part of Jesus's people. It needed to be said.

 

[Lambano]

So why would God have mercy on me ? ... 31 years old, always known about God, always been blessed, but almost always ignored Him.

I don't know why God loves us. It doesn't make sense to me either, but the Bible tells us so. I don't understand it, but I trust that He does.

 

[GRACE ambassador]

1) why God let me be deceived like that ? Why didn't he told me that I was deceived and didn't actually 2) commited fully my life to Him ?

I will pray for you:

1) He Didn't; He Is The God Of Truth, Not deceit.

2) that is NOT The Gospel Of The Grace Of God.

Jesus died on the cross to deliver people from sin.

That is Only Half Of The Gospel Of The Grace Of God; +

"Christ Rose From The Dead, According To The Scriptures":

"Who Was Delivered for our offences, and was
Raised Again for our Justification." (Romans 4:25)

Believest thou this? Why not?

When we believe This with ALL our heart God's Great News Of Salvation, and HE Saves us.
We can Never "fully commit to Him," in order to Save ourSELVES. After He Does The Saving,
Then we have:

Grace, Peace, And JOY! Amen? And, Also These Truths (Not deceit as some think):

God's OPERATION On All HIS New-born babes In CHRIST
+
God's Eternal Assurance

After Salvation, God Then Proceeds To "Conform us To The Image Of His SON"
(Romans 8:29), faster for some, who make Him LORD, humbly submitting Daily,
others are slower, and some, not at all, still Saved, But "losing rewards" At
Judgment (1 Corinthians 3:8-15), But ALL of us Will Be Conformed! Amen?

IF you have believed God, have you decided Which group (third?) you will be in? And:

Please Be Very RICHLY Encouraged, Enlightened, Exhorted, And Edified In
The LORD JESUS CHRIST, And In His Word Of Truth, Rightly
Divided! (+ I and II!) ← Saturation With Scriptures = a LOT LESS sin! Amen?
+
"...we live By faith, Not by sight..." ( feelings, emotions, experiences, self-pity, etc. )

Believe God, or not, your choice, eh? I will pray for you...

 

[poorlostapostate]

I will pray for you:

1) He Didn't; He Is The God Of Truth, Not deceit.

2) that is NOT The Gospel Of The Grace Of God.

Don't want to put the blame on God, I just want to understand... Because I was so close to giving my life to Him. And I really thought I did. I loved Him and wanted to make His will... Or at least I thought I did. When I would pray, I really thought I was praying according to His will. I kept asking Him to use me for the advancement of His kingdom, to make me look like Jesus more and more... I really wanted to please Him and to change.

But in spite of all that, I wasn't a true converted because I wasn't basing my salvation on His work on Jesus and on His work on the cross for me. I was intellectually aware of it, and I would even praise Him for that... but I hadn't actually received Jesus-Christ with faith in my heart as my Saviour and my Lord. Instead, I was basing my salvation on MY works, and my inner changes. I realised it only a few months ago, 12 years later, because of the predicament I'm currently in. I just can't believe it.

Why didn't God tell me ? Why didn't he gently told me in "David, you have to receive me with faith as your personal Lord and Saviour. You haven't done it yet. " Why didn't he do that ? Why didn't he open my eyes with all the time I would spend with Him ? He was seeing me everyday praying and reading my bible with enthusiasm, even singing christians songs, and he didn't see fit to tell me I was deceived ? He didn't want to save me ?

 

[quietthinker]

Don't want to put the blame on God, I just want to understand... Because I was so close to giving my life to Him. And I really thought I did. I loved Him and wanted to make His will... Or at least I thought I did. When I would pray, I really thought I was praying according to His will. I kept asking Him to use me for the advancement of His kingdom, to make me look like Jesus more and more... I really wanted to please Him and to change.

But in spite of all that, I wasn't a true converted because I wasn't basing my salvation on His work on Jesus and on His work on the cross for me. I was intellectually aware of it, and I would even praise Him for that... but I hadn't actually received Jesus-Christ with faith in my heart as my Saviour and my Lord. Instead, I was basing my salvation on MY works, and my inner changes. I realised it only a few months ago, 12 years later, because of the predicament I'm currently in. I just can't believe it.

Why didn't God tell me ? Why didn't he gently told me in "David, you have to receive me with faith as your personal Lord and Saviour. You haven't done it yet. " Why didn't he do that ? Why didn't he open my eyes with all the time I would spend with Him ? He was seeing me everyday praying and reading my bible with enthusiasm, even singing christians songs, and he didn't see fit to tell me I was deceived ? He didn't want to save me ?

Hello poorlostapostate......I trust this presentation will answer your hurt.

What it Means to Believe in Jesus

White Rock Seventh-day Adventist Church

www.rediscoveringgod.ca

 

[Lambano]

Why didn't he do that ?

"It didn't look like what I thought it would look like" could be the theme of my Christian journey. ;)

 

[amigo de christo]

Dance a jig of praise unto the glorious Lord my peoples . ITS LORD praising time .

 

[Jn1.Chris]

Don't want to put the blame on God, I just want to understand... Because I was so close to giving my life to Him. And I really thought I did. I loved Him and wanted to make His will... Or at least I thought I did. When I would pray, I really thought I was praying according to His will. I kept asking Him to use me for the advancement of His kingdom, to make me look like Jesus more and more... I really wanted to please Him and to change.

But in spite of all that, I wasn't a true converted because I wasn't basing my salvation on His work on Jesus and on His work on the cross for me. I was intellectually aware of it, and I would even praise Him for that... but I hadn't actually received Jesus-Christ with faith in my heart as my Saviour and my Lord. Instead, I was basing my salvation on MY works, and my inner changes. I realised it only a few months ago, 12 years later, because of the predicament I'm currently in. I just can't believe it.

Why didn't God tell me ? Why didn't he gently told me in "David, you have to receive me with faith as your personal Lord and Saviour. You haven't done it yet. " Why didn't he do that ? Why didn't he open my eyes with all the time I would spend with Him ? He was seeing me everyday praying and reading my bible with enthusiasm, even singing christians songs, and he didn't see fit to tell me I was deceived ? He didn't want to save me ?

So...if you realize these things now, then what does it matter that 'He didn't tell you'? I mean...obviously you know now. Questioning the Creator of all things probably is |edit| not |edit| going to go well. Are you mad at Him for saving you? Are you not saved? Then repent and believe!

Forget about the past and live for NOW.

 

[GRACE ambassador]

Forget about the past and live for NOW.

Amen - the past was "no Christ in us," NOW = "Christ In us, The Hope Of Glory!" Amen?
+
Precious friend, A Very Warm Welcome to the Board.

Please Be Very RICHLY Encouraged, Enlightened, Exhorted, And Edified In
The LORD JESUS CHRIST, And In His Word Of Truth, Rightly
Divided! (+ I and II!) ← PG rated "Approved" *

Grace, Peace, And JOY!…

* PG = Perfect God / Parental Guidance:

 

[Keturah]

So...if you realize these things now, then what does it matter that 'He didn't tell you'? I mean...obviously you know now. Questioning the Creator of all things probably is going to go well. Are you mad at Him for saving you? Are you not saved? Then repent and believe!

Forget about the past and live for NOW.

Welcome to the forums here.
May you be blessed & be a blessing.

 

[Jn1.Chris]

Welcome to the forums here.
May you be blessed & be a blessing.

Thank you. I need to introduce myself.

 

[amigo de christo]

I would say if your conscience is bothering you that is conviction enough to start with and is a good sign that your heart isn't hardened and your conscience isn't seared. Don't go by whether you are "feeling" God's presence, but just accept what the word of God says. Wherever we make our bed He is there in one sense even if we don't feel Him. (Ps 139:8) He knows you and knows and sees all that is going on with you.

But sin has consequences so it may be you will be feeling tormented for a while.....possibly for as long as you were sinning, though that is certainly not carved in stone, it will be for as long as you need. The Israelites were under judgment for the same length of time as all the "sabbaths" they didn't keep...it was like the Lord withdrawing His presence because they grieved the Holy Spirit. This is for someone's good, that they learn to fear God and not fall into sin again. During whatever length of time it takes, you have opportunity to show the Lord how sincere you are with wanting Him and wanting to learn obedience. See, even Jesus set an example of learning obedience by the things He suffered. The Lord chastises and disciplines who He LOVES as sons.

You need to make the determination and have a mindset that you will wait on the Lord and suffer through this for however long it takes, even if it were to take the rest of your life. Humble yourself under His mighty hand, and in due time He will lift you up. When we yield and submit to His discipline, it really and truly works to change us. If you have sinned in ways where you can make reparation, then you need to make things right with whoever you wronged. Just remember that the pleasures and gain from sin is the devil's measly bait for a trap that is not worth losing eternal life for This life is short...eternity is a very long time.

I suggest reading the Psalms for encouragement to hang on to hope....David sinned grievously and we read of what he went through and how he prayed and sought the Lord.

Also this:

Eze 33:13-16

If I tell a righteous person that they will surely live, but then they trust in their righteousness and do evil, none of the righteous things that person has done will be remembered; they will die for the evil they have done.

And if I say to a wicked person, ‘You will surely die,’ but they then turn away from their sin and do what is just and right—

f they give back what they took in pledge for a loan, return what they have stolen, follow the decrees that give life, and do no evil—that person will surely live; they will not die.

None of the sins that person has committed will be remembered against them. They have done what is just and right; they will surely live.

We certainly are in a battle for our soul.....but the word says be still and know that I am God, the battle is the Lord's. We need to learn to be at rest in Him, at rest from committing sins as well as self effort, but lean into the Spirit, yield to Him. It's not by might, not by power but by my spirit says the Lord. Read the word and meditate on the goodness and righteousness and holiness of Jesus and take eyes off oneself, but keep looking to Him.

He has promised, “Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you." Matthew 7:7 So encourage you to never give up asking, seeking and knocking for the strength and anything and everything you need.

Hit the trenches sister . And let the glorious LORD be praised n thanked .

 

[amigo de christo]

Thank you. I need to introduce myself.

Let all that has breath praise the glorious LORD . JESUS CHRIST is our hope and our salvation .
Its all out war for the souls of men in these final days upon earth .
Just ponder on the beauty that one day , ONE DAY SOON , every lamb gonna be gathered
and praising and thanking GOD the Father of our LORD and savoir JESUS CHRIST .
HEAVENLY JERUSALEM will be our HOME .
Till then , armour up , cause things are gonna get much worse and very fast in this world .
But our HOPE aint in this world . WE look forward to the new heavens and the new earth
wherein dwelleth righteouness . POINT TO CHRIST JESUS , embracing all things HE did teach
embracing all the pure and lovely reminders in the bible . Lift those hands up and praise the glorious KING .