Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
Honestly, for me it's reading the word that helps me the most in distinguishing evil from good. But certainly prayer in conjunction with the word is the formula for distinguishing evil from good.
False Prophets
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Brother, those things screamed in my head since at least age 8 or 9. I would see images and flashes of torture in fire. (This is another place where I believed something that wasn't true.) I saw myself in flames, screaming, satan jeering as I felt the heat of the flames ...and "God" watching over.
But contrasting to that, at age 10, I began to hear the Lord Jesus calling me by name, calling me to follow Him, telling me that He loved me and that He had a new life for me. In those times, He taught my heart about Himself in ways that penetrated past what I was taught by those traumas. He called and spoke to me for 3 years. When I was 13, I finally surrendered my heart to Him. He didn't end my abuse ....but He kept me through it. I have tasted and seen His goodness. I have experienced many horrific and horrible things, but I would be a fool to walk away from the only hope I have in this world and in eternity to come.
Now, my experience wasn't a lie ...but my interpretation of it was. All those years, I believed it was me in the fire, screaming, etc. In reality, it was my twin/double who they (my programmers) burned in the fire. We were allowed to bond and play together. Then when we were age 5, she was killed in front of me, in the most horrific way.
I internalized her ....not literally, but my mind shattered and I created an alter personality with her name as a way to survive that loss. My programmers knew that my mind would respond the way it did, and they took that alter and programmed more systems (of alters) from that split, especially what they call "delta" alters. Basically, they wanted alter personalities they could use specific ways.
God has brought healing ....and that's why I can talk about these things.
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
Not being Catholic or Greek Orthodox gives a person a valuable unbiased position from which to discern the doctrines of those churches. And you can say that is certainly true about Catholics in regard to Protestant theology. And I agree. I have learned much about Protestant beliefs, right and wrong, because I have honestly considered the criticisms leveled against those beliefs by Catholics. I try to be honest, so when a Catholic is right about something, then they're right about something. I would wish that Catholics would give us the same respect. I think one of the best ways to fact check your own beliefs, and adjust them if necessary, is to listen to what your opponent has to say about them.
Try to understand.....just because people have done it this way for hundreds of years does not make it Gospel. Only the Word of God is the truth, not man or what man has told us, or what men have done in a church for hundreds of years.
Brother, those things screamed in my head since at least age 8 or 9. I would see images and flashes of torture in fire. (This is another place where I believed something that wasn't true.) I saw myself in flames, screaming, satan jeering as I felt the heat of the flames ...and "God" watching over.
But contrasting to that, at age 10, I began to hear the Lord Jesus calling me by name, calling me to follow Him, telling me that He loved me and that He had a new life for me. In those times, He taught my heart about Himself in ways that penetrated past what I was taught by those traumas. He called and spoke to me for 3 years. When I was 13, I finally surrendered my heart to Him. He didn't end my abuse ....but He kept me through it. I have tasted and seen His goodness. I have experienced many horrific and horrible things, but I would be a fool to walk away from the only hope I have in this world and in eternity to come.
Now, my experience wasn't a lie ...but my interpretation of it was. All those years, I believed it was me in the fire, screaming, etc. In reality, it was my twin/double who they (my programmers) burned in the fire. We were allowed to bond and play together. Then when we were age 5, she was killed in front of me, in the most horrific way.
My programmers knew that my mind would respond the way it did, and they took that alter and programmed more systems (of alters) from that split, especially what they call "delta" alters. Basically, they wanted alter personalities they could use specific ways.
God has brought healing ....and that's why I can talk about these things.
Okay, there’s a lot to unpack here and I’m not going to ask any further about your personal life (which is why I mentioned to discuss things in private if you prefer) but maybe you can tell me how you distinguish good from evil. If ‘personal experience’ is the answer than we should leave it at that and case closed. :)
But they’re quoting scripture too. I explained the position of Virgin Mary in the Orthodox Church.
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
The fact that the Catholic church is so time honored and respected by the world tells me loads about it. The world is too agreeable with it for me to think it's foundations are of God. I'm talking about the church itself, not the people in it. I've met beautiful Catholic believers. I do not instantly write off a person as an unbeliever just because they are Catholic. Just as I would expect a Catholic to not instantly write off a Protestant as an unbeliever just because they're Protestant, but sadly, official Catholic teaching says we are.
‘This is actually a better position which is where I’d like to think I am. Because I don’t dismiss others as absolutely wrong and I’m 100% right.
GOD is good...and GOD is love. :)
I wouldn't know it by what my abusers told me since they taught me that good was evil and evil was good. They taught me that God likes when we suffer because He hates us. They taught me that love is pain and pain is love. None of those things were true. I know the truth by the Word of God. When you meet Him ....and yes, experience Him (relationship) ...you know that you know, and there's no going back. To know Him is to love Him. And you begin to have a love and an appetite for His Word. No one told me when I came to Christ that I had to read the Word, but boy did I have an appetite for it!! I would spend hours and hours in my room with my KJV Bible, highlighters, a pen, and a notebook.... running references and writing them in notebooks. I filled several notebooks with Scripture. And that was the truth my heart and mind needed to arm against all the lies and evil I was exposed to.
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I want to acknowledge that I reread this and now, I can see what you were saying. I apologize for misunderstanding. It looks like a few of us read it the same way. lol
Be careful about omitting commas. lol (j/k) :)
But now, it makes more sense. Thank you for not holding it against me for misunderstanding. :)
I certainly respect your position and your personal experience. My relationship with the Lord is also something which I would describe as frequent. I pray twice a day and get involved with the church and the liturgy at least twice a week. There are many personal experiences that I’ve heard in churches over the years which I personally don’t dismiss as Satanic. For example what happened to me, also happened to one of the churches caretakers I go to. This guy is basically cleaning the church on a weekly basis and he says that he’s seen Angels or Spirits in a white light.
This makes him more devoted to God and more humble while devoting his free time to take care of the church. I don’t see this as a bad thing when these signs affect people and draw them closer to God.
So I can’t speak for him but for me this seemed like a spirit that passed in front of my eyes and many orbs lit the room while flying in different directions. My wife and I interpreted this as a “sign” for the prayers we had said for relief of sickness in one of our family members.
I don’t know what this sign means other than a response to my personal prayers.
There’s one mediator between man and God, not two. Jesus is our mediatir.
Jesus is also our intercessor, not Mary, Hebrews 7:25. .
Jesus refused to part a crowd when He was teaching, when told His mother was there, instead saying everyone who does the will of God is His mother. Jesus did not venerate Mary and told us not to by His response..
Mary is not God. Mary can’t hear and answer millions of people continually praying to her 24/7 in all the worlds languages and time zones, but Catholics and Orthodox never realize that.
Only God is omnipotent and omniscient, not Mary.
Jesus told us to pray directly to the father in His name, that leaves Mary out.
Jesus promised to do whatever we ask the Father in His name, John 14:13, why would I waste time asking Mary for anything?
Venerating Mary is a form of worship.
Making Mary the focus of prayer instead of God is idolatry.
Maranatha
‘These things are understood by many orthodox believers but for reasons which I explained earlier, we do honor and respect her but we don’t worship her. It sounds to me you’re taking a very hard line to this and don’t even want to acknowledge her existence.
If you're bowing and praying to an image of her, that is worship.
It would be advised that you go straight to God's Word for the truth rather than "church fathers" and their practices.
@Curtis has based his understanding 100% on the Word of God which is the only source of doctrinal truth. The reason you feel we do not like Mary is because we mainly focus on the false teachings of the Catholic church of who Mary is. But if we go to Scripture, we can plainly see that she was a woman born of fallen parents like us all, and she was not God, nor immaculately conceived. She needed the Savior just like us all. But she was and is blessed in that she was chosen among women to bear the Christ child. That's as far as it goes.
It's a wonderful thing that God chose her for. But she isn't God, nor does the Bible even title her as "the mother of God." God is without beginning and end.... eternal. He has no mother or creator. Mary was a vessel submitted to God for the purpose of fulfilling prophesy of the Messiah. He had to be born into a flesh body.... "for God so loved the World that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life." We aren't told to "believe in Mary" ...anywhere in Scripture. We don't need faith in Mary. Faith in Christ is what leads to salvation.
Mary (and all other saints) is a fellow servant and "of the brethren" (a sister/sibling in Christ).
Revelation 19:10
[10]And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.
Revelation 22:8-9
[8]And I John saw these things, and heard them. And when I had heard and seen, I fell down to worship before the feet of the angel which shewed me these things.
[9]Then saith he unto me, See thou do it not: for I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren the prophets, and of them which keep the sayings of this book: worship God.
Revelation 19:10
[10]And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.
Revelation 22:8-9
[8]And I John saw these things, and heard them. And when I had heard and seen, I fell down to worship before the feet of the angel which shewed me these things.
[9]Then saith he unto me, See thou do it not: for I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren the prophets, and of them which keep the sayings of this book: worship God.
Are you praying to God the Father in the name of Jesus Christ? Or are you praying to Mary or some other saint? What does it mean to you when you say you pray?
@TLHKAJ and others, I can see where you draw the line. It’s basically icons and making the cross in your chests when you bow/pray.
As I explained earlier, the Orthodox Church understands very clearly that no one is higher than God but bases the veneration of Mary on scriptures too. I’m pretty sure every other orthodox Christian understands this distinction as well.
Icons as I mentioned are not to be worshipped either and almost all believers understand this.
This is also why you and others here might see this as Satanic or Demonic because some of these icons in different places around the world have performed some miracles including healing of the sick. We see this as a sign of God responding to our prayers or other mysteries which only God knows but we don’t confuse a literal painting with the almighty God.
Of course, I’m praying to God the father and the Trinity. Mary does have a place in the daily prayers but it’s very short. We basically thank her for being the vessel as you mentioned.
I’ve also seen some comments here on Trinity where some folks don’t agree with it? @Grailhunter and others what’s your take on this?
As I explained earlier, the Orthodox Church understands very clearly that no one is higher than God but bases the veneration of Mary on scriptures too. I’m pretty sure every other orthodox Christian understands this distinction as well.
Icons as I mentioned are not to be worshipped either and almost all believers understand this.
This is also why you and others here might see this as Satanic or Demonic because some of these icons in different places around the world have performed some miracles including healing of the sick. We see this as a sign of God responding to our prayers or other mysteries which only God knows but we don’t confuse a literal painting with the almighty God.
Of course, I’m praying to God the father and the Trinity. Mary does have a place in the daily prayers but it’s very short. We basically thank her for being the vessel as you mentioned.
I’ve also seen some comments here on Trinity where some folks don’t agree with it? @Grailhunter and others what’s your take on this?
Truth7t7
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Mary dosent intercede in heaven as "Mediatrix" between man and God, nor does she bring the gift of salvation as Roman Catholicism falsely teaches below
Mary in the Catechism of the Catholic Church
969 "This motherhood of Mary in the order of grace continues uninterruptedly from the consent which she loyally gave at the Annunciation and which she sustained without wavering beneath the cross, until the eternal fulfillment of all the elect. Taken up to heaven she did not lay aside this saving office but by her manifold intercession continues to bring us the gifts of eternal salvation … Therefore the Blessed Virgin is invoked in the Church under the titles of Advocate, Helper, Benefactress, and Mediatrix.
Mary didnt partake in the Bodily resurrection as Roman Catholicism teaches below, this is a future event unfulfilled
974 The Most Blessed Virgin Mary, when the course of her earthly life was completed, was taken up body and soul into the glory of heaven, where she already shares in the glory of her Son's Resurrection, anticipating the resurrection of all members of his Body.
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My husband was raised Catholic. From childhood, he questioned why they prayed to "saints" instead of praying to God. They always gave him some excuse but it never made sense or sat right with him. I have seen the shrines and also the literature (in my mother-in-law's home) that has been produced by the Catholic church about Mary, elevating her to "savior" status and taking the place of Jesus. I saw this with my own eyes.... literature and posters with Mary depicted as the one we should look to, standing on the earth with nails scars and a crown of thorns. Mary is not given by God the title of the queen of heaven. The pagans worship Ishtar, the "queen of heaven." Be careful who you bow and pray to.
My son passed away almost 2 years ago. He was the most amazing example of faith and servanthood I've ever known. But I don't pray to him. I have wept and ached, and asked God to tell him that I love and miss him. But praying to those who have gone on is not Biblical. I thank God for my son's witness. But as far as talking to him in prayer .....no. He ran his race, and God took him Home.
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