Female Pastors

[jiggyfly]

Wow!! I also wear a head covering to Church. A few of the women in my Church also wear a veil. We call the head covering a veil.


A woman can be an assistant in Church. She serves the Church by helping out just as Phoebe did.

Romans 16:1-2 I commend to you Phoebe our sister, who is a servant of the church in Cenchrea, that you may receive her in the Lord in a manner worthy of the saints, and assist her in whatever business she has need of you; for indeed she has been a helper of many and of myself also.



None of those scriptures you quoted showed that God chose a female priest or pastor. All the priests of the Old Testament were men. God only chose the sons of Araon and Levi to be priests. He did not choose their daughters.

Exodus 31:10 And the cloths of service, and the holy garments for Aaron the priest, and the garments of his sons, to minister in the priest's office,

Numbers 3:3 These [are] the names of the sons of Aaron, the priests which were anointed, whom he consecrated to minister in the priest's office.

The priest's office belonged only to men.

But in the new covenant aren't we all priests?

 

[KingJ]

You said:
I also wear a head covering to Church. A few of the women in my Church also wear a veil. We call the head covering a veil.

JB:

Now, everything is making sense. Praise the Lord! My heart rejoices in God my Savior.

SHALOM, Beloved of the LORD!

The Lord bless thee, and keep thee:The Lord make his face shine upon thee, and be gracious unto thee: The Lord lift up his countenance upon thee, and give thee peace.

x 2

 

[JB_Reformed Baptist]

x 2

Shalom, Brother.

But in the new covenant aren't we all priests?

No, we are of a royal priesthood. What did I say? I said now we all have direct access to God and can offer up spiritual sacrifices, hopefully acceptable to him.

1Pe 2:9-10 But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light: Which in time past were not a people, but are now the people of God: which had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy.



The Israelites were a chosen or elected race, to be a special people unto the Lord their God, above all people that were upon the face of the earth, Deu_7:6. They were also a royal priesthood, or what Moses calls a kingdom of priests, Exo_19:6. For all were called to sacrifice to God; and he is represented to be the King of that people, and Father of those of whom he was king; therefore they were all royal. CLARKE

 

[101G]

Greeting to all in the Name of the Lord Jesus the Christ.
Wow!! I wear a head covering (veil) too. A few of the women in my Church also wear a veil.

OK now you want to go to the veil, LOL, LOL, alright.
2 Corinthians 3:12 "Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech: 13 And not as Moses, which put a vail over his face, that the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished: 14 But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ. 15 But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart. 16 Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away. 17 Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. 18 But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord".

ONE NEED TO RE-READ THOSE VERSES AGAIN. the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. Liberty is freedom, and freedom is SALVATION. but we see that you're not free, or have SALVATION. wearing your little veils to church, why not wear two or three . following the tradition of MEN.

GET THAT VAIL OFF YOUR HEART!, Matthew 15:1 "Then came to Jesus scribes and Pharisees, which were of Jerusalem, saying, 2 Why do thy disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? for they wash not their hands when they eat bread. 3 But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition? 4 For God commanded, saying, Honour thy father and mother: and, He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death. 5 But ye say, Whosoever shall say to his father or his mother, It is a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; 6 And honour not his father or his mother, he shall be free. Thus have ye made the commandment of God of none effect by your tradition. 7 Ye hypocrites, well did Esaias prophesy of you, saying, 8 This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me. 9 But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men". that's a serious indictment. tradition, and vain worship.
YES, your religious services, the teaching for the doctrines, and commandments of men. TRYING TO MAKE YOURSELF RIGHTEOUS. YES,self righteous, the only righteousness is in the Lord Christ Jesus. Listen, 16 Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away. 17 Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty". YES, you old testament priest, atoning for sin, year after year, and never removing sin. just going through the motions. just like some of you today, going to church. just going through the motions. but the apostle is correct, 2 Timothy 3:7 "Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth". stuck in tradition, blinded by religion. LISTEN, Acts 17:22 "Then Paul stood in the midst of Mars' hill, and said, Ye men of Athens, I perceive that in all things ye are too superstitious. 23 For as I passed by, and beheld your devotions, I found an altar with this inscription, TO THE UNKNOWN GOD. Whom therefore ye ignorantly worship, him declare I unto you".

KNOW WHAT THAT WORD SUPERSTITIOUS MEANS?. "more religious than others". LOL, your rules and regulation, MAN MANDE. listen to our Lord and SAVIOUR, "Thus have ye made the commandment of God of none effect by your tradition". that's what to much religion will do for you.
NOW, your O.T priest. All the priests of the Old Testament were men

2 Corinthians 5:16 "Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh: yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh, yet now henceforth know we him no more. 17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new. 18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation". OLD THINGS, OLD WAY ARE PASSED AWAY.
change is hard. 16 Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away. 17 Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. NO FREEDOM, NO LIBERTY,

you will never be free until your mind is free.

John 8:36 "If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed".

we know the following scriptures by heart, but have no understanding of them, John 3:16 "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. 17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. 18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. 19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. 20 For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. 21 But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God".

another crutch made useless.

 

[Polt]

Greeting to all in the Name of the Lord Jesus the Christ.
Wow!! I wear a head covering (veil) too. A few of the women in my Church also wear a veil.

Isn't it hypocritical for you to wear a head covering? The Bible says the head covering is a symbol of a man's authority over the woman - which you preach against.

Then, after your claim to wearing a head covering, you return to your mockery of scripture by devoting a number of paragraphs to irrelevant Bible quotes.

 

[101G]

Polt, greeting

Sorry, I preach Jesus Christ and Him crucified,

Isn't it hypocritical for you to wear a head covering? Then, after your claim to wearing a head covering
either you have me mixed up with someone else, your mind, or your eyes are going bad.
you must didn't read my post, nor understand it. well that a toss up. anyway, "But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men". Matthew 7:5 "Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye"

again I say prove the scriptures I gave is wrong. if you can't, then do as the apostle said, "learn in silents".

P S if you don't have anything constructive to say, you will be ignored.

 

[jiggyfly]

Shalom, Brother.



No, we are of a royal priesthood. What did I say? I said now we all have direct access to God and can offer up spiritual sacrifices, hopefully acceptable to him.

1Pe 2:9-10 But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light: Which in time past were not a people, but are now the people of God: which had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy.



The Israelites were a chosen or elected race, to be a special people unto the Lord their God, above all people that were upon the face of the earth, Deu_7:6. They were also a royal priesthood, or what Moses calls a kingdom of priests, Exo_19:6. For all were called to sacrifice to God; and he is represented to be the King of that people, and Father of those of whom he was king; therefore they were all royal. CLARKE

Ok define the difference if there is any.

 

[mjrhealth]

There is a reason why there is an old and new testament, I wonder if anyone can figure it out???

In all His Love

Mat_9:16 No man putteth a piece of new cloth unto an old garment, for that which is put in to fill it up taketh from the garment, and the rent is made worse.
Mat_9:17 Neither do men put new wine into old bottles: else the bottles break, and the wine runneth out, and the bottles perish: but they put new wine into new bottles, and both are preserved.

 

[101G]

correct mjrhealth, and greeting in the name of the Lord Jesus.

if any MAN,(Male or Female) be in Christ is a new creature, OLD things have passed away, behold all THINGS are new. that old priesthood is done away with, Hebrews 7:11 "If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?" that's a done deal. Moses was the mediator of the OLD COVENANT. our Lord, Jesus the Christ is the Mediator of the NEW COVENANT. for Moses himself said, "HEAR YE HIM, (JESUS)". the law came by Moses, for Moses as mediator, not God gave the Law to the people. Grace and Mercy came by the new Mediator, God himself, our Lord. for our sins was COVERED, with his blood forever.
trying to put that old priesthood into the new order, will rend it, and the rent is made worse, just as mjrhealth brought out by scripture. for those who want to cover, or veil themselves, you rend the HOLY FABRIC THAT OUR LORD HAVE WOVEN FOR US.
and that old spirit, (wine), the mind, will not be put in NEW VESSEL (bottles) new or renewed minds are fit for new vessel.

Let this mind be in you that was in Christ Jesus. RENEW your mines, get that junk out of your trunk.

Greeting to all the SAINTS, in the name of the Lord Jesus the Christ.

Hebrews 7:12 "For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law. 13 For he of whom these things are spoken pertaineth to another tribe, of which no man gave attendance at the altar". say what?, of which no man gave attendance at the altar

Romans 16:1 " I commend unto you Phebe our sister, which is a servant of the church which is at Cenchrea"

Phebe our sister, the "OVERSEER" or Bishop to the Church in Rome.​

​

I know this will wake up the DEAD
​

Romans 16:2 "That ye receive her in the Lord, as becometh saints, and that ye assist her in whatsoever business she hath need of you: for she hath been a succourer of many, and of myself also".
there are two word we will, and must look at closely. I have underlined and bold them
business, and succourer
lets examine the first word "business. according to Mickelson's Enhanced Strong's Greek and Hebrew Dictionaries
G4229 πρᾶγμα pragma (prag`-mah) n.
1. a deed
2. (by implication) an affair
3. (by extension) an object (material)
[from G4238]
KJV: business, matter, thing, work
Root(s): G4238
a deed is a WORK, so our sister Phebe had work to do in Rome. now the root of this word G4229 Business, or DEED/WORK πρᾶγμα pragma (prag`-mah) n. is
G4238 πράσσω prasso (pras'-so) v.
1. to practice, i.e. perform repeatedly or habitually
2. (by implication) to execute, accomplish, etc.
3. (specially) to collect (dues), fare (personally)
{differing from G4160, which properly refers to a single act}
[a primary verb]
KJV: commit, deeds, do, exact, keep, require, use arts
Compare: G4160
Note definition #1. to practice, i.e. perform repeatedly or habitually. so whatever Phebe our sister was doing, her business, work, or deed. was a repeated thing. lets see what she was doing. the key word here is in the first definition, 1. to practice, i.e. perform repeatedly or habitually. and that work, or deed she repeatedly did was the work of a succourer. what is the definition of a succourer
G4368 προστάτις prostatis (pros-tat'-is) n.
1. a patroness, i.e. assistant
[feminine of a derivative of G4291]
KJV: succourer
Root(s): G4291
G4291 is the Male version of those who rule over, preside, or "oversee" the flock of God.

G4291 προΐστημι proistemi (pro-is"'-tay-mee) v.
1. to stand before
2. (in rank) to preside
3. (by implication) to practise
[from G4253 and G2476]
KJV: maintain, be over, rule
Outline of Biblical Usage
1. to set or place before
a. to set over
b. to be over, to superintend, preside over
c. to be a protector or guardian
1. to give aid
d. to care for, give attention to
1. profess honest occupations
so G4368 προστάτις prostatis (pros-tat'-is) n. is the feminine of a derivative of G4291. Phebe our sister was an "OVERSEER", OR "BISHOP".
now go to the blue letter bible and see the definition of "Bishop". http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/Lexicon.cfm?strongs=G1984
and see where in the bible it is used.
now, lets see the revelation.
Bishop, Part(s) of speech, Noun Masculine, G1985 ἐπίσκοπος episkopos (ep-is'-kop-os) n.
1. an overseer
2. (in genitive case) one of the co-superintendents entrusted with the well-being of a local assembly or of assemblies within a city or location
{literally or figuratively}
[from G1909 and G4649 (in the sense of G1983)]
KJV: bishop, overseer
Root(s): G1909, G4649
See also: G1983
Outline of Biblical Usage
1) an overseer
a) a man charged with the duty of seeing that things to be done by others are done rightly, any curator, guardian or superintendent
b) the superintendent, elder, or overseer of a Christian church


Bishop, Part(s) of speech: Noun Feminine, G1984 ἐπισκοπή episkope (ep-is-kop-ay') n.
1. inspection (for relief)
2. (by implication) superintendence
3.
[from G1980]
KJV: the office of a "bishop", bishoprick, visitation
Root(s): G1980
Outline of Biblical Usage
1) investigation, inspection, visitation
a) that act by which God looks into and searches out the ways, deeds character, of men, in order to adjudge them their lot accordingly, whether joyous or sad
b) oversight
1) overseership, office, charge, the office of an elder
2) the overseer or presiding officers of a Christian church

now this should wake up those OLD "DEAD" TESTAMENT spirits in here.

the Leg work is done for you, check it out and see if the research is true or not.

the key is in the office and the office holder :blink: .

 

[justaname]

correct mjrhealth, and greeting in the name of the Lord Jesus.
if any MAN,(Male or Female) be in Christ is a new creature, OLD things have passed away, behold all THINGS are new. that old priesthood is done away with, Hebrews 7:11 "If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?" that's a done deal. Moses was the mediator of the OLD COVENANT. our Lord, Jesus the Christ is the Mediator of the NEW COVENANT. for Moses himself said, "HEAR YE HIM, (JESUS)". the law came by Moses, for Moses as mediator, not God gave the Law to the people. Grace and Mercy came by the new Mediator, God himself, our Lord. for our sins was COVERED, with his blood forever.
trying to put that old priesthood into the new order, will rend it, and the rent is made worse, just as mjrhealth brought out by scripture. for those who want to cover, or veil themselves, you rend the HOLY FABRIC THAT OUR LORD HAVE WOVEN FOR US.
and that old spirit, (wine), the mind, will not be put in NEW VESSEL (bottles) new or renewed minds are fit for new vessel.

Let this mind be in you that was in Christ Jesus. RENEW your mines, get that junk out of your trunk.

Greeting to all the SAINTS, in the name of the Lord Jesus the Christ.
Hebrews 7:12 "For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law. 13 For he of whom these things are spoken pertaineth to another tribe, of which no man gave attendance at the altar". say what?, of which no man gave attendance at the altar

Romans 16:1 " I commend unto you Phebe our sister, which is a servant of the church which is at Cenchrea"

Phebe our sister, the "OVERSEER" or Bishop to the Church in Rome.​

​

I know this will wake up the DEAD
​

Romans 16:2 "That ye receive her in the Lord, as becometh saints, and that ye assist her in whatsoever business she hath need of you: for she hath been a succourer of many, and of myself also".
there are two word we will, and must look at closely. I have underlined and bold them
business, and succourer
lets examine the first word "business. according to Mickelson's Enhanced Strong's Greek and Hebrew Dictionaries
G4229 πρᾶγμα pragma (prag`-mah) n.
1. a deed
2. (by implication) an affair
3. (by extension) an object (material)
[from G4238]
KJV: business, matter, thing, work
Root(s): G4238
a deed is a WORK, so our sister Phebe had work to do in Rome. now the root of this word G4229 Business, or DEED/WORK πρᾶγμα pragma (prag`-mah) n. is
G4238 πράσσω prasso (pras'-so) v.
1. to practice, i.e. perform repeatedly or habitually
2. (by implication) to execute, accomplish, etc.
3. (specially) to collect (dues), fare (personally)
{differing from G4160, which properly refers to a single act}
[a primary verb]
KJV: commit, deeds, do, exact, keep, require, use arts
Compare: G4160
Note definition #1. to practice, i.e. perform repeatedly or habitually. so whatever Phebe our sister was doing, her business, work, or deed. was a repeated thing. lets see what she was doing. the key word here is in the first definition, 1. to practice, i.e. perform repeatedly or habitually. and that work, or deed she repeatedly did was the work of a succourer. what is the definition of a succourer
G4368 προστάτις prostatis (pros-tat'-is) n.
1. a patroness, i.e. assistant
[feminine of a derivative of G4291]
KJV: succourer
Root(s): G4291
G4291 is the Male version of those who rule over, preside, or "oversee" the flock of God.

G4291 προΐστημι proistemi (pro-is"'-tay-mee) v.
1. to stand before
2. (in rank) to preside
3. (by implication) to practise
[from G4253 and G2476]
KJV: maintain, be over, rule
Outline of Biblical Usage
1. to set or place before
a. to set over
b. to be over, to superintend, preside over
c. to be a protector or guardian
1. to give aid
d. to care for, give attention to
1. profess honest occupations
so G4368 προστάτις prostatis (pros-tat'-is) n. is the feminine of a derivative of G4291. Phebe our sister was an "OVERSEER", OR "BISHOP".
now go to the blue letter bible and see the definition of "Bishop". http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/Lexicon.cfm?strongs=G1984
and see where in the bible it is used.
now, lets see the revelation.
Bishop, Part(s) of speech, Noun Masculine, G1985 ἐπίσκοπος episkopos (ep-is'-kop-os) n.
1. an overseer
2. (in genitive case) one of the co-superintendents entrusted with the well-being of a local assembly or of assemblies within a city or location
{literally or figuratively}
[from G1909 and G4649 (in the sense of G1983)]
KJV: bishop, overseer
Root(s): G1909, G4649
See also: G1983
Outline of Biblical Usage
1) an overseer
a) a man charged with the duty of seeing that things to be done by others are done rightly, any curator, guardian or superintendent
B) the superintendent, elder, or overseer of a Christian church


Bishop, Part(s) of speech: Noun Feminine, G1984 ἐπισκοπή episkope (ep-is-kop-ay') n.
1. inspection (for relief)
2. (by implication) superintendence
3.
[from G1980]
KJV: the office of a "bishop", bishoprick, visitation
Root(s): G1980
Outline of Biblical Usage
1) investigation, inspection, visitation
a) that act by which God looks into and searches out the ways, deeds character, of men, in order to adjudge them their lot accordingly, whether joyous or sad
B) oversight
1) overseership, office, charge, the office of an elder
2) the overseer or presiding officers of a Christian church
now this should wake up those OLD "DEAD" TESTAMENT spirits in here.

the Leg work is done for you, check it out and see if the research is true or not.

the key is in the office and the office holder :blink: .

So according to your misinterpretation of the Romans passage Phebe is a bishop above Paul the apostle? :wacko: I make this observation because of the ending of the verse "and of myself also" Interesting the lengths people will go to to attempt to eisegete their pet doctrines.

 

[101G]

2 justaname, Greeting in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ.
So according to your misinterpretation of the Romans passage Phebe is a bishop above Paul the apostle? I make this observation because of the ending of the verse "and of myself also" Interesting the lengths people will go to to attempt to eisegete their pet doctrines.

Once more, what is Doctrine: dok'-trin: Latin doctrina, from doceo, "to teach," denotes both the act of teaching and that which is
taught; now used exclusively in the latter sense.

Old Testament:
Isaiah 28:9 Whom shall he teach knowledge? and whom shall he make to understand doctrine? them that are weaned
from the milk, and drawn from the breasts".

Isaiah 29:24 They also that erred in spirit shall come to understanding, and they that murmured shall learn doctrine.

New Testament:
John 7:16 Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me.
John 7:17 If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself.
John 7:18 He that speaketh of himself seeketh his own glory: but he that seeketh his glory that sent him, the same is true,
and no unrighteousness is in him.

well you got half of it right, when you said "my" misinterpretation, LOL, I, I, I, have nothing to do with this. your signature say Love the Lord with all your Heart, and your neighbor. am I not your neighbor?. I guess not from your response. I greet you, why not greet me?. where is this LOVE?. Oh well.

now down to business. just like our sister Phebe, lets get to work.

#1. I see you're caught up on titles, listen to yourself. "Phebe is a bishop above Paul the apostle". that's what the doctrine of men do for you. WHO'S IN CHARGE. or WHO'S OVER YOU. well lets put this ignorance to rest, Psalms 23:1 "A Psalm of David. The LORD is my shepherd; I shall not want".
so now we know who's in Charge. next, our Lord and Saviour is the Governor of the Church, he set the rules and regulation of HIS CHURCH. yes he the Governor. scripture, Matthew 2:6 "And thou Bethlehem, in the land of Juda, art not the least among the princes of Juda: for out of thee shall come a Governor, that shall rule my people Israel".

#2. TITLES, vs FUNCTIONS. not all Preacher are pastor, and not all pastor are preachers. the function of an office is to provide a service, not to receive it. we're servants who have work to do, in the NAME OF THE LORD JESUS. 1 Corinthians 12:27 "Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular. 28 And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues. 29 Are all apostles? are all prophets? are all teachers? are all workers of miracles? 30 Have all the gifts of healing? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret? 31 But covet earnestly the best gifts: and yet shew I unto you a more excellent way".
Now listen real good. 1 Corinthians 12:14 " For the body is not one member, but many. 15 If the foot shall say, Because I am not the hand, I am not of the body; is it therefore not of the body? 16 And if the ear shall say, Because I am not the eye, I am not of the body; is it therefore not of the body? 17 If the whole body were an eye, where were the hearing? If the whole were hearing, where were the smelling? 18 But now hath God set the members every one of them in the body, as it hath pleased him. 19 And if they were all one member, where were the body? 20 But now are they many members, yet but one body. 21 And the eye cannot say unto the hand, I have no need of thee: nor again the head to the feet, I have no need of you. 22 Nay, much more those members of the body, which seem to be more feeble, are necessary: 23 And those members of the body, which we think to be less honourable, upon these we bestow more abundant honour; and our uncomely parts have more abundant comeliness 24 For our comely parts have no need: but God hath tempered the body together, having given more abundant honour to that part which lacked: 25 That there should be no schism in the body; but that the members should have the same care one for another".
I just reverse the order of scripture just for you to see. I suggest you read all of chapter 12. and see the pastoral GIFT.

#3. GENDER. The Lord sent a Jew, (Paul) to the Jews to let them know that the Gentiles was equally chosen as they was. and he was no respecter of Person. the Apostle Peter found that out also. read the 10th. chapter of the book of Acts. the churches as they was growing had a large gentile congergation, but with a Jewish Face in the pulpit. well the Lord change that up through his apostle, Paul. Paul train Timothy, who father was a Greek, Gentile. so now the face in the Leadership position, (which is to GUIDE) was changing. no longer a Jewish face up front. this was the same thing at the church of Rome. the Jews thought they had so kind of advantage over the gentiles, because of their heritage, not so. well the same was with GENDER. only males was in the leadership (GUIDE) position. ONE NEED TO REALLY UNDERSTAND "RULE" VS "RULE OVER", that's why the apostle Paul wrote a LETTER OF RECOMMENDATION to the church at Rome for our sister. no longer was there a MALE only face to be a GUIDE in Righteousness. as the apostle told them, Romans 3:1 "What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?", because of the LAW, yes, but under GRACE, none.. read the whole chapter, for it worthy of your read, but the whole book is better.
under GRACE, and not the LAW, all are the same. Romans 3:10 "As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: 11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. 12 They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one". that's the reason why it's so important to have the HOLY SPIRIT in you. so that you can be a guide to the blind. a HELPER. and the Spirit is for men and women, as I have pointed out in the topic. and is expressed again in the Spiritual gifts in 1 Corinthians chapter 12. please re-read chapter 12 for edification. with these Spiritual Gifts men and women was enable to teach preach, and GUIDE God's flock into perfection. listen. for it is GOD, by Spiritual GIFTS that was in these Men and Women. Ephesians 4:11 "And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; 12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: 13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ: 14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive; 15 But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ".
God is no respecter of Person. if one is in Christ, men and women are apostles, prophets, teachers, pastors for the PERFECTING OF THE SAINTS.
I hoped this helped.


PS. to help you see. 1 Corinthians 12:27 "Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular. 28 And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues".

God set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, so justaname, where is your pastor?. why is the word pastor missing in that scripture. lets see if you have spiritual eyes to see it.

 

[justaname]

If it is I have offended you, I am truly sorry. My love for you in the Lord is true, yet I cannot concede to what I perceive as false teaching.

Greetings in the name of our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ!

Teaching Scripture: 1Thess 5:12 "And we beseech you, brethren, to know them which labour among you, and are over you in the Lord, and admonish you"

lets walk through this verse with the wisdom of Christ".

Commentary: Which labour among you. There is no reason to suppose, as many have done, that the apostle here refers to different classes of ministers, he rather refers to different parts of the work which the same ministers perform. The first is, that they "labour"--that is, evidently, in preaching the gospel. where it occurs twice; 1Cor 15:10; 1Cor 16:16. The word is one which properly expresses wearisome toil, and implies that the office of preaching is one that demands constant industry. And are over you in the Lord. That is, by the appointment of the Lord, or under his direction. They are not absolute sovereigns, but are themselves subject to one who is over them--the Lord Jesus. On the word here rendered "are over you," (προισταμενους) Rom 12:8, where it is translated ruleth.

Now lets reinforce this with a second scripture: 1Cor 16:16 "That ye submit yourselves unto such, and to every one that helpeth with us, and laboureth".

Commentary: and laboureth; in the Lord's vineyard, in the word and doctrine, for the good of souls, and the glory of Christ: for such are worthy of double honour, and ought to be valued and esteemed for their works' sake, and submitted to in everything that is according to the rules of the Gospel. get that again.

This is where I see falseness in what what you attempt to convey. You see the Apostle Paul in the the 1 Thess 5:12 passage is not teaching that those who labor among you "Lord over you", but you are.
He is simply referring to those Thessalonians who do rule over the others in that day, and consequently they labor in the Lord also. Only those who labor in the Lord will have positions of authority, but that does not mean all who labor in the Lord have positions of authority. Not all are called to be bishops, but some are, and historically they were all men.

With this passage being your springboard for your teaching your entire premise is flawed.

We can all agree that women do have roles in the church. They are to teach such as other women, children, and those outside the church. They can evangelize, participate in service, and many other things. No doubt they are given the HolySpirit and gifts in the Lord.

What comes into question is the leadership roles and teaching positions where it is permanent and over men. This again is not to say a man cannot learn anything from women in the church. Women have much to offer and can have excellent, Spirit led ideas just as anyone else. This is not to say men are to make all decisions void of female input or advice, this would be foolish.

Also I have female professors, and I attend a Christian college. It is only in the establishment of the church were Paul uses his apostolic authority in teaching what I adhere to.

 

[101G]

2 jutaname,
first, there is no offense, second I highly disagree with you understanding. as such "No doubt they are given the HolySpirit and gifts in the Lord".

I ask you in the name of the Lord Jesus, is this gifts listed in 1 Corinthians 12:8 "For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit". is this a Pastoral gift Y/N only a yes or no will do thanking you in advance.

 

[justaname]

2 jutaname,
first, there is no offense, second I highly disagree with you understanding. as such "No doubt they are given the HolySpirit and gifts in the Lord".

I ask you in the name of the Lord Jesus, is this gifts listed in 1 Corinthians 12:8 "For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit". is this a Pastoral gift Y/N only a yes or no will do thanking you in advance.

Can you please clarify your second point. I am saying I believe women receive the HolySpirit and other gifts in the Lord.

We can only pray that pastors have wisdom and knowledge. We do know today that some who claim to be pastors do not have these gifts.

 

[101G]

2 jutaname,
Can you please clarify your second point. I am saying I believe women receive the HolySpirit and other gifts in the Lord.
We can only pray that pastors have wisdom and knowledge. We do know today that some who claim to be pastors do not have these gifts.


Here's my point, Jeremiah 3:15 "And I will give you pastors according to mine heart, which shall feed you with knowledge and understanding:".
the Spiritual gift of pastoring is made in 1 Corinthians 12:8 "For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit"
the point is, are women include in these GIFTS, yes or no?.

2 justaname,
this is not a hard question to answer, just read Joel 2:28 & 29. and if you would have read the topic body you would have this.

 

[justaname]

Sure women receive these gifts. ^_^

 

[101G]

Good, now do you deny that the gift listed in 1 Corinthians 12:8 "For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit". is also recieved of a woman Yes or No?.

 

[justaname]

I do not believe God to be partial to gender in bestowing any gifts.

 

[101G]

I do not believe God to be partial to gender in bestowing any gifts.
Good, that's the POINT, 1 Corinthians 12:8 is the Pastoral gift, and its for sons and daughters as the Lord wills, and he's no respecter of person. so women can Pastor, for the gift is for them also.

 

[Justin Mangonel]

Dear 1,

At the end of the day do you think that you will wrestle these people to your way of thinking by analytical argument?

Blessings,

Justin