For those who deny the Most Holy Trinity!

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theefaith

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They agree on the Jewish non trinity "one". There is no trinity in judaism.
Again,when a Jew says one, he means a non trinity one.
Do you know what judaism is?

and the high priest used the same reasoning and verse to kill Christ
 

jaybird

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Ancient/modern-day Jews, Baptists, and Catholics agree there is one God (Is. 45:21, Mk. 12:29).

i want to go back to this statement, what does this have to do with Jewish people believing or not believing in the trinity?

the science is called astrology.

Any form of censorship Newton may have received at the time does not lend validity to his theories, nor does it prevent modern-day people from knowing what his theories were, and discerning if there is truth to them.

so censorship is ok? we can just go through the bible with a big black marker, blackout everything we dont like, and tell everyone there was nothing to see there anyway.

However, it is not that the only way to achieve causing others to accept the Trinity was to burn them. Many still do accept it every day without the need to burn anyone. You are conflating what people in the Church had done, sinfully, a long time ago, with the doctrine that the Church has followed since long before anybody was burned by Christians, but instead, Christians were burned for believing it. These things are not tied. One is not the result of the other. It is not necessary to kill to believe in the Trinity.

so they burned people alive to make them believe something, and this does not bother you? it sends chills through my body that anyone could be so evil.
 
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theefaith

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i want to go back to this statement, what does this have to do with Jewish people believing or not believing in the trinity?

the science is called astrology.



so censorship is ok? we can just go through the bible with a big black marker, blackout everything we dont like, and tell everyone there was nothing to see there anyway.



so they burned people alive to make them believe something, and this does not bother you? it sends chills through my body that anyone could be so evil.

science and Jews are not authorities
Christ and his church are

Jn 1:16 And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace.

17 For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.
 

theefaith

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Simple questions

Is Jesus God?
Is Mary the mother of God?

no hurry
 

jaybird

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It has to do with how these religions agree there is one God, which is important to show that the doctrine of the Trinity remains aligned with monotheism. The Trinity itself is based on the truth there is one God. You simply do not understand the complexity of God's triune and singular nature, because you mistakingly believe the Trinity is the belief in three completely separate gods.
it sounds like filibuster distraction to me. because the reality is it has nothing to do with anything. Jews dont believe in a trinity. they believe in "one" and you know when they say "one" they mean different than when a trin says "one"
this is what your doing - Christian, greek mythology, viking pagans are all the same because they all have a creator.
do you see how stupid that sounds?


Despite what individual Jews or certain Jewish sects believe regarding the Trinity, the one God does refer to Himself in the plural form multiple times in the Old Testament:

hold on now, the individuals in question are Jesus and the scribe and their agreement on the non trinity Most High.
 
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jaybird

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Here is another fact that debunks the trinity. The lack of controversy. The trinity is the most controversy subject ever, yet there is no controversy in the bible. Why? The Jews have always maintained there is one Most High and the Most High was never three persons, had they been told this was wrong and they had to believe something different, it would have been mentioned. This is bigger than circumcision and eating food, yet those subjects caused a controversy and this which is so much bigger did not? Im not buying that.
 

jaybird

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Your referencing pagan gods confirms my argument you mistake the distinct persons that make up and are the one God with the completely separate individual gods that make up pantheons of pagans.
Nevermind I guess you don't see how stupid it sounds.


Again, Jesus and the scribe agreed one God exists, as in multiple completely separate gods do not exist. If there is any disagreement between Jews and Christians, it is not over whether or not there is one God, because these religions agree there is, but rather whether the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit make up and are that one God.
When a Jew says one do they mean trinity?
Yes or no. Don't go off dodging
 
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jaybird

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What sounds stupid is your claim I am saying, "Christian, greek mythology, viking pagans are all the same because they all have a creator." Refer back to post #585 for why.
Exactly my point, so why do you use the argument if it's nonsense?

Refer back to post #585.
You didn't answer there either, it's a yes or no response.
Why would anyone believe you when you can't answer simple questions.
 

jaybird

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Again, you mistakingly believe I am saying, "Christian, greek mythology, viking pagans are all the same because they all have a creator." Refer back to post #585 for why.
It's the exact same logic.


Refer back to post #585.
There is no answer to the question there. No one is is asking if Jews belief in one Most High. The question is when they say "one" do they mean a trinity? Did you have an answer to that?
 

jaybird

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Incorrect. Refer back to post #584.

Refer back to post #584.

Yes, its the same thing, your finding one common denominator and claiming they are the same. When someone asks if Jews believe in a trinity and you respond with they believe in one Most High, thats not an answer because its not what was asked. It has nothing to do with anything. This is either a deflection because you know it blows up your argument, or you do not know what Judaism is.

and this is exactly why the church had to burn people alive to make them believe, because these teachings in addition to not holding up against scripture, make no sense at all.
 

jaybird

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And here is another bible text that disproves the trinity:

John 17:3
Now this is eternal life: that they know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.

This passage is disastrous to the trinity as it identifies G-D as the only true G-D to the exclusion of Jesus who the passage says was sent.

Passages like this were contrary to what the trins were teaching and it got so bad they actually went so far as to edit the scripture. This is what Augustine of Hippo wrote in his Homilies on John:

“This is eternal life, that they may know Thee and Jesus Christ, whom Thou hast sent, as the only true God.”


and thats how you make the trinity work, you just edit the scriptures until it fits. Pitiful.
 

jaybird

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The Trinity as you understand it? No. The Trinity as I understand it? No, but there are verses in the Old Testament that show it is rooted in ancient Judaism [the one] God is a plurality in a unity. Therefore, if the scribe in Mk. 12:32 did not understand that when he said, "Well, Master, thou hast said in truth, that there is one God," it would mean he was either partially blind to the nature of God, or a poorly informed Jew. If he did understand that, did he come to recognize Jesus was the one God incarnate, and that the Father, the Son [Jesus], and the Holy Spirit are the one God? I hope.

I have three questions for you now.

(i) Do you agree water (singular) exists in the following forms: liquid, solid, and vapor (plural)?

(ii) Do you agree the one God refers to Himself in the singular and plural in the Old and New Testament?

(iii) Do you see the Church burning people alive today to force belief in the Trinity?

when Jews dont believe in a trinity, and Jesus agrees with it, i am going to follow Jesus.
 

jaybird

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another scripture that disproves the trinity:
John 14 28 Jesus says the Father is greater than Him. thats not a trinity.
 

jaybird

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That does not address my answer to your question, nor does it answer any of my questions.

my mistake, i will answer the way you answer my questions.

Exodus 20 16
16“You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.

the Jews taught not to bear false witness therefore the trinity must be false.
 

jaybird

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and more passages that disprove the trinity

John 20:17
Jesus said, “Do not hold on to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father. Go instead to my brothers and tell them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’”

G-D does not have a G-D.