Not according to Scripture. Sunday could be the first or eight day of the week, never last.
God changed Seventh Day Sabbath Worship to First Day of the Week
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Not according to Scripture. Sunday could be the first or eight day of the week, never last.
BarneyFife
Well-Known Member
Bob Estey
Well-Known Member
Genesis 1, 2 and 3 ... IF YOU BELIEVE THE CREATION IS GOD'S.
Mark, Matthew, John, Luke ... IF YOU BELIEVE SALVATION IS OF THE LORD.
... unless you believe everyone including God is crazy.
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Paul showed the <parallel>, Sarah and Hagar, IS ONE <covenant> OF ALL PEOPLES IN BONDAGE UNDER SIN.
Rather keep silent, it will save you face and much egg on it. The Erasmus conglomeration or whatever you want to call it from which Tyndale translated what became 90% or so of the 1611 KJAV, was put together by Erasmus from four or five manuscripts available to him at the time.
But far more important is the fact all manuscripts old and recently incorporated in the apparatus (4K to 6K overall I have seen alleged) do not have any variants of significance as far as Colossians 2 is concerned – none whatsoever.
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Exemplar of Sunday ingenious
And they claim it is Christ's Gospel --- lunacy!
Re: <<In writing to Jews, the author of Hebrews would not consider it necessary to prove to them that Sabbathkeeping “remaineth.”>>
The Letter is not written <<to Jews>>, but “God hath in these last days spoken unto us (Christians, believers by grace only) by his Son, Whom He hath appointed Heir of all things, by Whom also He made the worlds” or all humankind looking back as well as looking forward; but first of humankind, Christians believing in the RAISED from the dead Son of God. Which in this Letter is not to Jews BC, but to Christians AD.
Therefore, <<In writing to Jews, the author of Hebrews would not consider it necessary to prove to them that Sabbathkeeping “remaineth.”>> Of course not, Jews would be well acquainted with the status quo. It could not be different! Sure!
Why then does the author nevertheless emphatically stress, “THERE THEREFORE REMAINETH KEEPING of the Sabbath Day FOR THE PEPLE of God”?
Because of the Reason the author immediately before, gives, WHY “there therefore remains keeping of the Sabbath Day for the PEOPLE of God”, namely, “IF JESUS GAVE THEM REST, THEN, THEREFORE, there remains for certain and forever, a Sabbath Day-of-rest for the PEOPLE of God”! “The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath”, by the Lord of the Sabbath, by Jesus! Without Jesus, without Christ RAISED from the dead, God never rested, never could have rested, never would have rested. Nor finished. Nor blessed. Nor hallowed. Nor RESTING REVIVED nor REVIVING RESTED.
What makes the difference between any keeping of the Sabbath in the past and for the present, IS JESUS’ LORDSHIP OF THE SABBATH OBTAINED THROUGH RESURRECTION FROM THE DEAD. In writing to CHRISTIANS, the author of Hebrews considered it necessary to prove to them “the REASON WHY Sabbath-keeping remains valid, necessary and mandatory : FOR THE PEOPLE OF GOD”. It’s BECAUSE JESUS THROUGH RESURRECTION FROM THE DEAD IS BECOME THEIR LORD AS HE IS BECOME LORD OF THE SABBATH DAY THROUGH RESURRECTION FROM THE DEAD, AND HAD GIVEN THEM REST”—“The Rest Of God”—HIMSELF.
Brakelite
Well-Known Member
There are parallels, and there are types and antitypes. There is nothing new under the sun. But many do tend to get carried away, taking passages into extremes, calling it 'spiritual', but in effect devaluing the texts themselves until their real meaning is lost.
Ziggy
Well-Known Member
I also believe a lot of people only like to eat the icing on the cake.
They're not interested in the ingredients that go into making the cake, and the labor involved.
And the recipe doesn't always come out perfect. Sometimes it's better and sometimes it's worse.
But at least an effort was made.
I enjoy cooking. And there is always that.. something's missing.
Maybe it's a dash of oregano or a splash of lemon juice.. and you go searching for the missing ingredients.
Sometimes you have to substitute and the substitute is better than the original version.
A little more enhanced, more flavorable.
I read the bible like I cook.
I know there is always something I've missed. Or something I could find to understand better.
Not everyone likes my cooking.
That's why everyone who has a bible owns their own pantry and cook for themselves.
There's plenty of ingredients in there to feed the whole world.
But you have to make an effort.
You might even get burned from time to time because the pan is too hot, or you may overcook it, or under cook it.
It might not even taste the way you thought it would.
There is always room for improvement.
:)
HUGS
Man, man cannot find rest in a day or in anything for that matter created like himself despite man fell in sin but nothing else did. Man finds rest only in God's Eternal Purpose for having made the Sabbath a blessing, a completion, a holy thing, and a "keeping of rest-day, for the People of God", and that is GOD Giving them REST BY THE SON IN THESE LAST DAYS ... like never before, forever.
The Seventh Day Sabbath of the Lord God of the Old Testament era is become a Salvation factor like it NEVER had been BEFORE IN THE NEW TESTAMENT ERA.
And you will notice one thing for sure, that literal Sabbath Day of Rest for the People of God, is entered upon THROUGH FAITH BY GRACE ALONE AS ONLY A LOST SINNER MAY enter into GRACE BY FAITH ONLY. Never any different - the hypocrite has no idea what God's Sabbath-Rest is; he cannot.
Brakelite
Well-Known Member
Using any scripture whatsoever as defense for rejecting a Commandment of God, particularly when those scriptures are misused, misapplied, misunderstood, and in some cases deliberately so, is belittling yourselves. Don't blame those who point out your errors.
Ziggy
Well-Known Member
What exactly is a Christian?
Who coined the name?
Wasn't it King Agrippa?
And who was Paul talking about to King Agrippa?
Was he talking about the twelve tribes of Israel, was he talking about the Gentiles?
Who is a Christian?
Was Paul a Jew?
Who coined the name?
Wasn't it King Agrippa?
And who was Paul talking about to King Agrippa?
Was he talking about the twelve tribes of Israel, was he talking about the Gentiles?
Who is a Christian?
Was Paul a Jew?
It is God's sabbath. We are God's Jews. We are God's Christians. Everything is God's. I suggest we do things God's way.
If you want to to celebrate Sunday, celebrate Sunday. If you want to celebrate Saturday, celebrate Saturday.
Just don't make a law out of it, try to force it on others, and then say, "God says so," when He doesn't.
The sabbath predates Jews and Christians.
If you want to to celebrate Sunday, celebrate Sunday. If you want to celebrate Saturday, celebrate Saturday.
Just don't make a law out of it, try to force it on others, and then say, "God says so," when He doesn't.
The sabbath predates Jews and Christians.
SKEWED as a dogs legs thinking. No, dishonorably facing the truth of Scripture.
Not from or before <vs. 1, 6> is Joshua mentioned. If the author meant Joshua and not Jesus, why did he write, "Jesus" like 12 times elsewhere?
I'll tell you why!
Because Sunday-worshippers scholars deny God's "Sabbath-made-for-worship-of-Him the day the Seventh Day GOD thus spoke of : And GOD, the day The Seventh DAY - OF HIS MAKING - from all, his, works, rested." They will NOT ALLOW the People of God the Sabbath of their LORD, THEIR, GOD, THEIR SAVIOUR. So they make God LIE with his own Word the Holy Scriptures. THAT IS WHY!
It is Antichrist's oppression and persecution of God's children.
In 1930 Cruden’s Concordance was first published. I got myself a 1964 edition for R6.65 less than 10 cents American Dollar today, more than $14 at that time thanks to the gold standard.
In 1903 Wigram’s Greek Concordance was first published. I got myself a 1976 ‘Impression’ for 8 Pounds 95 pennies less than 16 pennies then, more than 160 Pounds today due to no more gold standard.
Now check up these 20th century oevre against 18th century and before Concordances and Lexicons – which I do not have but can guarantee disagree with Cruden’s and Wigram in that the older works of UNBIASED PREDISPOSITION will have ‘Jesus’ [Iehsous] in Hebrews 4:8 included with all the rest of its incidences, not separate under a FALSE listing under ‘Joshua’.
Try me.
And even if I’m wrong, it doesn’t make the scholars right. THEY MUST CHANGE the Scriptures even the very Name of Jesus for their Sunday idolatry.
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Whether I'm called a Christian, a Hebrew Christian, or a Messianic believer,
I am what I am, a child of the great, "I AM,"
By the blood of the Lamb, the Lamb who was slain.
I'm precious in His sight, the apple of His eye,
I am fearfully and wonderfully made.
Whether we are genetic descendants of the twelve tribes or not,
We are followers of Jesus/Yeshua. We are one.
Ziggy
Well-Known Member
Act 26:22 Having therefore obtained help of God, I continue unto this day, witnessing both to small and great, saying none other things than those which the prophets and Moses did say should come:
Act 26:23 That Christ should suffer, and that he should be the first that should rise from the dead, and should shew light unto the people, and to the Gentiles.
So saying none other things than those which the prophets and Moses did say should come....
Where does changing the sabbath fall into these things?
Do you see in the prophets or in Moses that there would be a change in the day?
To the law and to the testimony...
Why does the Lord keep having us look backwards for confirmation?
2Ti 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
2Ti 3:17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
Isa 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.
Testimony:
Exo 31:18 And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, H5715 tables of stone, written with the finger of God.
Exo 16:27 And it came to pass, that there went out some of the people on the seventh day for to gather, and they found none.
Exo 16:28 And the LORD said unto Moses, How long refuse ye to keep my commandments and my laws?
Exo 16:29 See, for that the LORD hath given you the sabbath, therefore he giveth you on the sixth day the bread of two days; abide ye every man in his place, let no man go out of his place on the seventh day.
Exo 16:30 So the people rested on the seventh day.
Exo 16:31 And the house of Israel called the name thereof Manna: and it was like coriander seed, white; and the taste of it was like wafers made with honey.
Exo 16:32 And Moses said, This is the thing which the LORD commandeth, Fill an omer of it to be kept for your generations; that they may see the bread wherewith I have fed you in the wilderness, when I brought you forth from the land of Egypt.
Exo 16:33 And Moses said unto Aaron, Take a pot, and put an omer full of manna therein, and lay it up before the LORD, to be kept for your generations.
Exo 16:34 As the LORD commanded Moses, so Aaron laid it up before the Testimony, to be kept.
I guess my question would be, who are "your" generations?
Who is included in those generations?
The manna which God provided for 6 days for over 40 years was set before the two tables of testimony as a witness.
What was this supposed to make them remember?
I can think of a lot of things..
God's provision for his people. food and rest.
They had to work for it, they had to gather it. But at the end of gathering they were given rest.
that they may see the bread wherewith I have fed you in the wilderness...
Jhn 6:35 And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst.
Jhn 6:36 But I said unto you, That ye also have seen me, and believe not.
Jhn 6:37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
Jhn 6:38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
Jhn 6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
Jhn 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
Jhn 6:36 But I said unto you, That ye also have seen me, and believe not.
Exo 16:27 And it came to pass, that there went out some of the people on the seventh day for to gather, and they found none.
Exo 16:31 And the house of Israel called the name thereof Manna: and it was like coriander seed, white; and the taste of it was like wafers made with honey.
Deu 8:2 And thou shalt remember all the way which the LORD thy God led thee these forty years in the wilderness, to humble thee, and to prove thee, to know what was in thine heart, whether thou wouldest keep his commandments, or no.
Dan 11:35 And some of them of understanding shall fall, to try them, and to purge, and to make them white, even to the time of the end: because it is yet for a time appointed.
Rev 3:10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.
look at all these ingredients
:)
Hugs
Act 26:23 That Christ should suffer, and that he should be the first that should rise from the dead, and should shew light unto the people, and to the Gentiles.
So saying none other things than those which the prophets and Moses did say should come....
Where does changing the sabbath fall into these things?
Do you see in the prophets or in Moses that there would be a change in the day?
To the law and to the testimony...
Why does the Lord keep having us look backwards for confirmation?
2Ti 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
2Ti 3:17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
Isa 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.
Testimony:
Exo 31:18 And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, H5715 tables of stone, written with the finger of God.
Exo 16:27 And it came to pass, that there went out some of the people on the seventh day for to gather, and they found none.
Exo 16:28 And the LORD said unto Moses, How long refuse ye to keep my commandments and my laws?
Exo 16:29 See, for that the LORD hath given you the sabbath, therefore he giveth you on the sixth day the bread of two days; abide ye every man in his place, let no man go out of his place on the seventh day.
Exo 16:30 So the people rested on the seventh day.
Exo 16:31 And the house of Israel called the name thereof Manna: and it was like coriander seed, white; and the taste of it was like wafers made with honey.
Exo 16:32 And Moses said, This is the thing which the LORD commandeth, Fill an omer of it to be kept for your generations; that they may see the bread wherewith I have fed you in the wilderness, when I brought you forth from the land of Egypt.
Exo 16:33 And Moses said unto Aaron, Take a pot, and put an omer full of manna therein, and lay it up before the LORD, to be kept for your generations.
Exo 16:34 As the LORD commanded Moses, so Aaron laid it up before the Testimony, to be kept.
I guess my question would be, who are "your" generations?
Who is included in those generations?
The manna which God provided for 6 days for over 40 years was set before the two tables of testimony as a witness.
What was this supposed to make them remember?
I can think of a lot of things..
God's provision for his people. food and rest.
They had to work for it, they had to gather it. But at the end of gathering they were given rest.
that they may see the bread wherewith I have fed you in the wilderness...
Jhn 6:35 And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst.
Jhn 6:36 But I said unto you, That ye also have seen me, and believe not.
Jhn 6:37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
Jhn 6:38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
Jhn 6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
Jhn 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
Jhn 6:36 But I said unto you, That ye also have seen me, and believe not.
Exo 16:27 And it came to pass, that there went out some of the people on the seventh day for to gather, and they found none.
Exo 16:31 And the house of Israel called the name thereof Manna: and it was like coriander seed, white; and the taste of it was like wafers made with honey.
Deu 8:2 And thou shalt remember all the way which the LORD thy God led thee these forty years in the wilderness, to humble thee, and to prove thee, to know what was in thine heart, whether thou wouldest keep his commandments, or no.
Dan 11:35 And some of them of understanding shall fall, to try them, and to purge, and to make them white, even to the time of the end: because it is yet for a time appointed.
Rev 3:10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.
look at all these ingredients
:)
Hugs
It appears to me to be a choice between following God's word or man's tradition.
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