Greenland is melting

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ChristianJuggarnaut

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Here's the real beauty of this thread. Climate change deniers are anti-science because of right wing politics.

......yet global warming will only hurt the poor, women, and puppies. No political agenda there. It's actually comical.
 

aspen

“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
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Haha- bout time some reason was posted...
 

pom2014

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aspen said:
It is not normal at all. Glaciers that have not melted for hundreds of thousands of years are melting.

By the way POM - Greenland was called green because of the coastlands where the Danes settled. Never in the history of modern mankind has Greenland been free of ice.
Never said it was free of ice. Said that Erik called green to entice settlement.

And it is slowly returning to that state where people lived, farmed, hunted and thrived.

Humans adapting and taking advantage of their world no matter the climate.
 

BlackManINC

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aspen said:
Really?!

So we are simply supposed to sit back, eat some poisonous microwave popcorn and watch Greenland and Antartica melt? We are also probably too late to fight for rights to exploit the new ocean at the North Pole too, right? Meanwhile, California and Oregon are consumed by wildfire and all costal cites are submerged in the ocean.....nice

How ironic that eschatology is so popular among certain Christians and yet, they ignore the Earth falling down around them. We have it all backwards and the world can see it
If God wants the world to "warm" or "cool", then it will happen regardless of what we do. If God wants the world to fall, then its going to happen whether we want it to or not. You know what these climate cult tree huggers are all about when it comes down to it? They are all about salvation by works, as is the case with the evolutionists as I pointed out before. These people are basically telling you that its our job to "save the planet" when God already redeemed his creation when he sacrificed his only begotten son Jesus Christ on the cross. His sacrifice and resurrection wasn't just about humanity, the redemption applies to the whole of creation referred to from the very beginning of his book, to everything within our realm of time space and matter. Without Jesus Christs resurrection, the new heaven and new earth promised to us cannot happen, because its through Jesus Christ that everything was made new, and its through him that all things consist, not by our works like this vile anti-Christ world would like us to believe. I ain't got a damn thing backwards, because my worldview is based on salvation by grace through faith in Jesus Christ and him alone.
 

aspen

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BlackManINC said:
If God wants the world to "warm" or "cool", then it will happen regardless of what we do. If God wants the world to fall, then its going to happen whether we want it to or not. You know what these climate cult tree huggers are all about when it comes down to it? They are all about salvation by works, as is the case with the evolutionists as I pointed out before. These people are basically telling you that its our job to "save the planet" when God already redeemed his creation when he sacrificed his only begotten son Jesus Christ on the cross. His sacrifice and resurrection wasn't just about humanity, the redemption applies to the whole of creation referred to from the very beginning of his book, to everything within our realm of time space and matter. Without Jesus Christs resurrection, the new heaven and new earth promised to us cannot happen, because its through Jesus Christ that everything was made new, and its through him that all things consist, not by our works like this vile anti-Christ world would like us to believe. I ain't got a damn thing backwards, because my worldview is based on salvation by grace through faith in Jesus Christ and him alone.

Wow.....just, wow
 

River Jordan

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ChristianJuggarnaut said:
Here's the real beauty of this thread. Climate change deniers are anti-science because of right wing politics.
Can't think of any other reason why fundamentalist Christians would so uniformly deny the clear science behind global warming, even though (like with evolution) they know almost nothing about it. At least with evolution their raging opposition to it is understandable (contradicts their interpretation of Genesis). But global warming? That's explained once you listen to a bit of right-wing talk radio. Then the overlap between fundamentalist Christianity and Republican politics is made crystal clear.

......yet global warming will only hurt the poor, women, and puppies.
Who said that?

No political agenda there. It's actually comical.
What? Your issues with reading comprehension? I don't think those sorts of things are funny. :p
 

pom2014

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Here's the issue I have, both the doomsayers of the Christian and Global Climate Change camps are the same beastie with just different coloured fur.

The issue with the global climate change people is they, like Thomas Robert Malthus have made a critical error in thought and then hold fast to it to become hypocrites.

Yes the sea level will rise and coastal cities will flood.

WHY? Because they should never have placed cities there. Castles made of sand? Cmon people. No one in the RIGHT mind (in this case they were blinded by greed) would build on a sand
where a good flood would occur. Did the ancient Egyptians build their cities RIGHT on the Nile? No. They left that to farms and built just away from it. WHY? They KNEW it would flood.

I will never understand why people build on flood plains, sandbars, barrier islands, mudslide, volcanic areas, fault lines or any place where they know every so often there will be disaster.
Willfully ignorant people that are playing the odds. And it also part of the inane human belief "nothing bad ever happens to me".

The solution? Abandon these cities, look at archaeological sites and you will find hundreds of resettlement periods. The whole of the Mayans left their cities when they became nonviable.
Pack up and MOVE. Nothing says you HAVE to be there for thousands of years just because your great great great great grandfather was there.

Yes the ice will melt and there will be less surface water for people, farms and livestock.

So you find more sources of water, desalinate it or MAKE it. Yes Yes Yes it is expensive NOW to desalinate it. WHY? Because there is already cheap fresh surface water. No demand, no streamlined processing.
You get a demand and you will find new ways to cheaply do it. And you can make water as well. Again pricey because there is no streamlining.

Yes there will be disastrous weather.

Ask someone that lived through the dust bowl what that was like.
Ask someone that lived through a major earthquake what that was like.
Ask someone from Fukushima or Tschernobyl what that was like.

Now ask what did they do?

Why either rebuilt or picked up and left. And they had some stories of course to pass down to future generations that usually start like this:
"when I was your age, I had to walk x distance to y place uphill in z amount of precipitation, mud, ash, bodies, etc."

Humanity has seen MANY disasters and now we have much better systems in place to reduce the numbers of death and to assist the survivors than before.

Droughts will reduce our amount of food.

We now, if you stay away from the organic cultists, create foods that use less land and in harsher climates than ever before. Drought tolerant and less arable land crops.
Before long we will have lab created animal protein (shutting the vegans up) and within the span that the doomsayers proclaim monumental disaster, molecular printers
so we can make you a steak atom by atom to your exact specifications. How you cook it is still up to you.

We have SO many technologies in place or in the near future that we can survive this. It is NOT the end of the world. Only the end of HOW we know it NOW.

And just like Malthus, these people are ONLY seeing the world as it stands NOW not how much it will change due to the need to survive.

Humanity is a stubborn lot when it comes to survival. Technology, like it has been in the past, will give us new tools to keep going on.

And I hope I live to see the day I can talk to my kitchen and say I would like a thinly sliced, well marbled, sirloin steak sandwich, with truffle butter spread on toasted brioche and a micro green salad with hazelnut and 15 year old balsamic vinaigrette; and it just makes it for me molecule by molecule. It will be glorious!
 

pom2014

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ChristianJuggarnaut said:
Which Noah/NOAA can be trusted?

That's the question.

Think of it.

Or not.
Well as one is dead and the other is manned with living people dedicated to meteorology. I might take the living people.

Anyway its better to trust God over both of them.
 

pom2014

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They fudge no more than any one else, including the denominations of christendom.

I'm not overly concerned by something that in ten thousand years no one will remember.

In fact all that we post here will have as much bearing on history as the gossips by workers at the pyramids did.

Do we know any of that? No.

I'm not going sweat entries in a database.
 

ChristianJuggarnaut

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Feb 20, 2012
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My reading comprehension skills are probably more advanced than yours are. But you digress.
I am sorry that you cannot get sarcasm. Although you are rather skilled at delivering it.

Anyway Captain Obvious, any natural occurring extreme weather cycles will indeed harm those of lower economic situation. This is true of any calamity whether (weather) man made or natural.

More to come.
 

ChristianJuggarnaut

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River Jordan said:
However, the earth will still be here and will be habitable, just not in the way we're used to
Yes, and anything that involves me (river) having to view anything out of my own myopic vision must be bad and not understood by fundamentalists.
 

River Jordan

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ChristianJuggarnaut said:
Yes, and anything that involves me (river) having to view anything out of my own myopic vision must be bad and not understood by fundamentalists.
I know what you're trying to say, but the way you've written it doesn't make sense. Of course, I guess that makes it even funnier! :p
 

aspen

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Ok, I think there are reasons on both sides, Conservative Christians and scientists (personally I do not see the dichotomy), which keeps us polarized.

Conservative Christians:

1. Must reject everything that seemingly contradicts the literal interpretation of the Bible including, global warming, old Earth, evolution, denial of a literal flood or creation.
2, All people who consider any ideas outside the literal interpretation of the Bible are not just wrong, they have evil intentions or are blinded by Satan. Therefore, they must not simply be dismissed, they must be fought against.
3. Different interpretations of scripture, beyond the literal interpretation should not even be entertained because they might lead to the slippery slope. It is playing with fire to think about anything but the most narrow viewpoint because believing ideas about the bible and God and Truth is the same thing as faith.

Scientists

1. View old and current ideas as stagnant unless they are constantly challenged.
2. View securing the Truth (rather than exploring it and challenging it) as remaining in ignorance
3. Welcome evidence that support or challenge the current understanding of truth.

Conflict:

1. CC reject scientific ideas that challenge their interpretation of scripture regardless of logic, facts, evidence because it would be arrogant not to. Absolute truth must be preserved at all costs. Thoughts about the Bible and God are they same as a relationship with God.
2. Scientists challenge all ideas that are decided, as stagnant, and fear that thinking will be oppressed.
 

aspen

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