6And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time. 7For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. 8And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: 2 thessalonians 6-8now I know that the pre tribulation says that the he who is going to be taken away is the holy spirit.But for us who know that the pre trib theory isn't true who has to be taken away before the antichrist is revealed???your brother in christryan fitz
he who is going to have to be taken out of the way
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Michael he is the holding Satan back as rev.12 tells us Rev 12:7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels, Michael has always had to deal with SatanJud 1:9 Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.
Jon-Marc
New Member
(Letsgofishing;31354)
now I know that the pre tribulation says that the he who is going to be taken away is the holy spirit.But for us who know that the pre trib theory isn't true who has to be taken away before the antichrist is revealed???your brother in christryan fitz
You don't KNOW any such thing--any more than I KNOW that there IS a pre-trib calling away of the saints of God. It's what you or I believe, and neither of us can prove either belief to the other.
now I know that the pre tribulation says that the he who is going to be taken away is the holy spirit.But for us who know that the pre trib theory isn't true who has to be taken away before the antichrist is revealed???your brother in christryan fitz
You don't KNOW any such thing--any more than I KNOW that there IS a pre-trib calling away of the saints of God. It's what you or I believe, and neither of us can prove either belief to the other.
(Jon-Marc;31425)
You don't KNOW any such thing--any more than I KNOW that there IS a pre-trib calling away of the saints of God. It's what you or I believe, and neither of us can prove either belief to the other.
There is a reason why there is no Pre-Tribulation Rapture is because Christ Himself said that we will have Tribulation. (John 16:33, Matthew 24:29-30) Have you not read that He foretold us all things? (Mark 13:23)JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
You don't KNOW any such thing--any more than I KNOW that there IS a pre-trib calling away of the saints of God. It's what you or I believe, and neither of us can prove either belief to the other.
There is a reason why there is no Pre-Tribulation Rapture is because Christ Himself said that we will have Tribulation. (John 16:33, Matthew 24:29-30) Have you not read that He foretold us all things? (Mark 13:23)JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
(dawngordon;31466)
read ALL words!!! that ONE or TWO words means ALL the difference29Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened,
Yes, reading the words with understanding does make ALL the difference.Dawn, there is a tribulation of Satan. It is one of deception. He will be pretending to be Christ. Then...Immediately after the tribulation of those days.... our Saviour arrives.We will all be here. Please do not fall for satan's deception and believe he is Christ coming to fly you away.Ezekiel 13:20 Wherefore thus saith the Lord God; 'Behold, I am against your pillows, wherewith ye there hunt the souls to make them fly, and I will tear them from your arms, and will let the souls go, even the souls that ye hunt to make them fly........Whirlwind
read ALL words!!! that ONE or TWO words means ALL the difference29Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened,
Yes, reading the words with understanding does make ALL the difference.Dawn, there is a tribulation of Satan. It is one of deception. He will be pretending to be Christ. Then...Immediately after the tribulation of those days.... our Saviour arrives.We will all be here. Please do not fall for satan's deception and believe he is Christ coming to fly you away.Ezekiel 13:20 Wherefore thus saith the Lord God; 'Behold, I am against your pillows, wherewith ye there hunt the souls to make them fly, and I will tear them from your arms, and will let the souls go, even the souls that ye hunt to make them fly........Whirlwind
Jon-Marc
New Member
The rest of you believe what you want. I believe the tribulation is meant for the lost and not for the bride of Christ--the church. Yes, we will have tribulation if we live for the Lord, but that does not mean we will be here for THE Tribulation. Jesus will come for His saints BEFORE the Tribulation. THEN the lost ONLY will go into the Tribulation. After the Tribulation, Jesus will return in power and glory, seal satan in the bottomless pit, and set up His 1,000 year reign on earth after removing all opposition and casting unbelievers into hell. At the end of the 1,000 years satan will be released for a short period of time, and he will try one last time to defeat Christ and fail. He and all his followers, along with death and hell, will be cast into the Lake of Fire for eternity.
(Jon-Marc;31624)
The rest of you believe what you want. I believe the tribulation is meant for the lost and not for the bride of Christ--the church. Yes, we will have tribulation if we live for the Lord, but that does not mean we will be here for THE Tribulation. Jesus will come for His saints BEFORE the Tribulation. THEN the lost ONLY will go into the Tribulation. After the Tribulation, Jesus will return in power and glory, seal satan in the bottomless pit, and set up His 1,000 year reign on earth after removing all opposition and casting unbelievers into hell. At the end of the 1,000 years satan will be released for a short period of time, and he will try one last time to defeat Christ and fail. He and all his followers, along with death and hell, will be cast into the Lake of Fire for eternity.
That's my understanding also, John-Marc .God Bless,Thunder1
The rest of you believe what you want. I believe the tribulation is meant for the lost and not for the bride of Christ--the church. Yes, we will have tribulation if we live for the Lord, but that does not mean we will be here for THE Tribulation. Jesus will come for His saints BEFORE the Tribulation. THEN the lost ONLY will go into the Tribulation. After the Tribulation, Jesus will return in power and glory, seal satan in the bottomless pit, and set up His 1,000 year reign on earth after removing all opposition and casting unbelievers into hell. At the end of the 1,000 years satan will be released for a short period of time, and he will try one last time to defeat Christ and fail. He and all his followers, along with death and hell, will be cast into the Lake of Fire for eternity.
That's my understanding also, John-Marc .God Bless,Thunder1
SMILES, Jesus said one goes and one stays, I really think the ones who are thinking they are here for it, need to really pray because they have issues, something is wrong, GOD IS MERCY< LOVE< GRACE AND FRIENDSHIP, Glad to see some SEE the REAL LORD
(dawngordon;31664)
SMILES, Jesus said one goes and one stays, I really think the ones who are thinking they are here for it, need to really pray because they have issues, something is wrong, GOD IS MERCY< LOVE< GRACE AND FRIENDSHIP, Glad to see some SEE the REAL LORD
Matthew 24:40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.41.Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.The question is....who will do the taking? God is mercy, love and grace. He tells us, though His letter, that the one that comes first will take some, actually will take many. You don't want to be in the group that gets "taken" by the deceit of Satan. I do pray Dawn...for people like you that believe in the rapture. The "issues" I have are that those like you are helping to spread the deception of Satan. You are working for him whether you realize it or not. Be very careful. There is no doubt you love Christ but do you love Him enough to let go of what you have been taught and read, with understanding, His Word about who will be "taken?" Will you wait and "see the real Lord" or will you follow the fake?........Whirlwind
SMILES, Jesus said one goes and one stays, I really think the ones who are thinking they are here for it, need to really pray because they have issues, something is wrong, GOD IS MERCY< LOVE< GRACE AND FRIENDSHIP, Glad to see some SEE the REAL LORD
Matthew 24:40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.41.Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.The question is....who will do the taking? God is mercy, love and grace. He tells us, though His letter, that the one that comes first will take some, actually will take many. You don't want to be in the group that gets "taken" by the deceit of Satan. I do pray Dawn...for people like you that believe in the rapture. The "issues" I have are that those like you are helping to spread the deception of Satan. You are working for him whether you realize it or not. Be very careful. There is no doubt you love Christ but do you love Him enough to let go of what you have been taught and read, with understanding, His Word about who will be "taken?" Will you wait and "see the real Lord" or will you follow the fake?........Whirlwind
I believe it is Michael the archangel as well. I believe the time his restraining power over Israel is removed is the same point in time spoken of by Daniel the prophet in Daniel 12:1 at which time afterwards Israel will go through a time of trouble like never before. Zech chap 13 describes this time when 2/3 of the inhabitants of Israel die. That's what will happen when the antichrist gets control of Jerusalem which will happen once Michael lifts his restraints. Paul says Jesus won't come until the antichrist is revealed. The antichrist won't be revealed until the restraining power is removed. What the antichrist will do is divide up Jerusalem. That's one way we will know who he is. That is also why it is so scary that Bush is trying to get the division of Jerusalem done before he leaves office. I'm not saying Bush is the antichrist, but he sure is acting like one. Personally I believe the antichrist is not Bush but will be the next Caliph of Islam who will be the Mahdi.Dan 12:1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which stands for the children of your people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time:Zec 13:8 And it shall come to pass, that in all the land, says the LORD, two parts in it shall be cut off and die; but the third shall be left in it.2Th 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come the falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; Joe 3:1 For, behold, in those days, and in that time, when I shall bring back the captives of Judah and Jerusalem,Joe 3:2 I will also gather all nations, and will bring them down into the valley of Jehoshaphat, and will enter into judgment with them there for my people and for my heritage Israel, whom they have scattered among the nations, and have divided up my land.
(Letsgofishing;31354)
6And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time. 7For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. 8And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: 2 thessalonians 6-8
Now that is an excellent question. If you read my brothers words correctly that which holds back the mystery of iniquity is the very thing that restrains it even now. Now if it restrains it, it must follow that it restrains it till a time when what ever is holding back iniquity is taken out of the way. The restrainer is the delusion. Once the strong delusion is taking out of the way then the lie will be revealed for what it is and there will be no need for the lawless one to be held back. The wicked that will be revealed is the very delusion that captures all too many and once it is taken out of the way then the time of wrath is at hand.This, that is the delusion, is the very lie that many cling to in hope against hope. It not only encompasses the rapture cult but includes the participation of all too many unwittingly in the Harlot that rides the Beast. There is much to the Harlot that rides the Beast; she is the pseudo Bride, a facsimile of what our Christ intended, and its participants are not only found in the various flavors and denominational assemblies of believers, but also includes the political apparatus that facilitates them and those who love this system of the god of this world. That doesn't mean those who flow and operate within these manmade structures are doomed. The time will come when anyone who hears the words of the servants will recognize the call and will disassociate themselves respectively and find themselves as tribulation saints.
6And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time. 7For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. 8And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: 2 thessalonians 6-8
Now that is an excellent question. If you read my brothers words correctly that which holds back the mystery of iniquity is the very thing that restrains it even now. Now if it restrains it, it must follow that it restrains it till a time when what ever is holding back iniquity is taken out of the way. The restrainer is the delusion. Once the strong delusion is taking out of the way then the lie will be revealed for what it is and there will be no need for the lawless one to be held back. The wicked that will be revealed is the very delusion that captures all too many and once it is taken out of the way then the time of wrath is at hand.This, that is the delusion, is the very lie that many cling to in hope against hope. It not only encompasses the rapture cult but includes the participation of all too many unwittingly in the Harlot that rides the Beast. There is much to the Harlot that rides the Beast; she is the pseudo Bride, a facsimile of what our Christ intended, and its participants are not only found in the various flavors and denominational assemblies of believers, but also includes the political apparatus that facilitates them and those who love this system of the god of this world. That doesn't mean those who flow and operate within these manmade structures are doomed. The time will come when anyone who hears the words of the servants will recognize the call and will disassociate themselves respectively and find themselves as tribulation saints.
I have to go with servant here though I agree Islam is a big part of this harlotit is not just Saudi Arabia any more than it is just one church of any kind it is all false religion This (w)"hore" is identified as "Mystery, Babylon", as we look ahead to Rev 17:15 "And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the ***** sitteth are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues."He continues explaining the symbols. The "waters" are "the people, and nations of all languages of the earth" that the Antichrist will sit upon. Mystery Babylon will control the entire earth, and that means you, unless you have been sealed in your mind, prior to when the Antichrist arrives. We need to establish in our minds exactly what the "waters", or "seas", or "rivers" truly represents. These bodies of water are peoples, and nations, tongues and languages right here on earth. This harlot is not the Catholic church, or any other church now in operation, Nor one country but it is a deception that will so change your church, or any church, to accept the one world political and religious beasts. In the end, it will be the Antichrist's religious system.
You guys can stay here if you want, but when Jesus calls for me you can call me gone!I will not be decieved by any false christ!But if you guys really believe that we are currently in the Tribulation period. I guess we will see who's right or wrong in 7 years or less!Honestly I hope I'm right and your wrong!
There are 2 pre-requisites that must happen before the man of sin can be revealed.1 is the "falling away" (or "apostasia" in the original greek) If you have eyes to see you know that the apostasy of today is unprecendented. Thge churches in europe are empty or have been turned into nightclubs, gyms and mosques; and in the USA the Laodecian megachurches are teeming with unrepentant sinners. In the liberal-emergent church, homosexuals and women are offering prayers to Allah and Father/Mother God, etc.I say that the "falling away of 2 Thes 2 is fulfilled.
The "taken out of the way" was also fulfilled in Aug 05. After Israel pulled out of Gaza at the bequest of the Bush's roadmap to hell, Hurricane after hurricane struck the US.For the first time in history hurricanes were named using the greek alphabet going from alpha to Zeta (well, not to omega but close)That summer half of the US was burning with wildfires. The Amazon river simply dried up for no reason.On every late night tv show Christ and the church was being mocked. The writers of "south parl" were quoted as saying "It's open season of Jesus".several books written by athiests hit the best sellers list, blaspheming God.As Bush celebrated Ramadan in the white house, the dalai lama was receiving the congresses highest honor as a hindu/demon worshipper offered prayers before the senate.Every ridiculous lie of satan was trotted out, the gospel of judas, the Jesus tomb etc.the da vinci movie came out, as the children rushed to buy the newest book about a boy wizard.So I ask, did you sense this massive shift in the spiritual realm that began in Aug of 05?Let me add that in Aug of 05 my eyes and ears were opened and the name of the man of sin was revealed to me. I began to expose him and was immediately arrested on the lies of a false witness. Since then I've had 2 computers stolen and suffered many things.God delivered me from it all, so that I can continue my work.The man of sin is a European/American and his name means-I am the Triumph of Satan's willHe is 20 years old and lives in So CA.More to come soon-
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