And there is the place where He says we are sealed by the Holy Spirit unto the day of redemption. That's God's seal of ownership. He knows what He purchased, and He didn't do that to back out later.
Much love!
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Heart Talks on Holiness
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And there is the place where He says we are sealed by the Holy Spirit unto the day of redemption. That's God's seal of ownership. He knows what He purchased, and He didn't do that to back out later.
Much love!
All I know is His intention is to grow us and mature us up....His word is working for that purpose, and part of that has to do with the fear of the Lord, which is the beginning of wisdom. Running the race so as to win it, because not everyone will win the prize......maybe that has to do with rewards later, or maybe that prize is the maturing of our faith itself, or both. I just have to believe it's for our good to take His word and parables to heart even if we don't necessarily fully understand everything yet.
Hi Lizbeth, no I haven't lost interest....I'm just a busy woman that is not able to spend all sorts of time here, I have other responsibilities. However, I did catch up last night....(bedtime reading), which inspired me to do more researching, which I intend to share on Monday....maybe tomorrow if time permits. Until then, peace!! A blessed weekend everyone!
still seeking
So, this is another book by Brengle that I picked up yesterday. It is available on the net as a pdf file if you are interested.
I think and hope we can all agree with the first page of chapter One that I will add here. (I added some bold to it.)
"Helps to Holiness by S. L. Brengle
Chapter 1
Holiness—What Is It?
“Not every one that saith unto Me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven ; but he that doeth the will of My Father, which is in heaven.” (Matt. vii. 21.)
NOW, “This is the will of God, even your sanctification. . . . For God hath not called us
unto uncleanness, but unto holiness,” and “Without holiness, no man can see the Lord.” Therefore, “ Be ye holy ! ”
Anyone who reads his Bible in sincerity, “not handling the Word of God deceitfully,” will see that it plainly teaches that God expects His people to be holy, and that we must be holy to be happy and useful here and to enter the Kingdom of Heaven hereafter.
When once a true man is convinced that the Bible teaches these facts, and that this is God’s will, he will next inquire, “ What is this holiness, when can I get it, and how ? ’’
There is much difference of opinion on all these points, although the Bible is simple and plain on each one to every honest seeker after truth."
I think and hope we can all agree with the first page of chapter One that I will add here. (I added some bold to it.)
"Helps to Holiness by S. L. Brengle
Chapter 1
Holiness—What Is It?
“Not every one that saith unto Me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven ; but he that doeth the will of My Father, which is in heaven.” (Matt. vii. 21.)
NOW, “This is the will of God, even your sanctification. . . . For God hath not called us
unto uncleanness, but unto holiness,” and “Without holiness, no man can see the Lord.” Therefore, “ Be ye holy ! ”
Anyone who reads his Bible in sincerity, “not handling the Word of God deceitfully,” will see that it plainly teaches that God expects His people to be holy, and that we must be holy to be happy and useful here and to enter the Kingdom of Heaven hereafter.
When once a true man is convinced that the Bible teaches these facts, and that this is God’s will, he will next inquire, “ What is this holiness, when can I get it, and how ? ’’
There is much difference of opinion on all these points, although the Bible is simple and plain on each one to every honest seeker after truth."
We are crucified in Christ, raised with Him, and go on to be transformed by the renewing of our minds. We pay attention to ourselves, denying what is ungodly, and doing what we know to be His will. We offer ourselves to God, and let Him transform us. Personally I find these discussions more profitable to use Scripture itself.
"that God expects . . .", are you remembering that God has all knowledge of our lives, so His "expectations" are simply His foreknowledge of what will happen, right? Writing this way, as it seems to me, is asserting a 2 step entrance into eternal life, the first step the gift of God through Christ, and the second step earned by yourself, that is, if you make the cut.
I think we do better to stay with the Bible itself. What other writers seem to complicate, God simplifies.
Much love!
Well, amen to the bible. Speaking of which, look into the concept of bondslaves in scripture. I believe it speaks to the topic of this thread. :)
I guess this is where we differ. I don't find Brengle's writing complicated at all...petty straight forward actually.
And .....
“This is the will of God, even your sanctification. . . . For God hath not called us
unto uncleanness, but unto holiness,” and “Without holiness, no man can see the Lord.” Therefore, “ Be ye holy ! ”
Anyone who reads his Bible in sincerity, “not handling the Word of God deceitfully,”
.....these are scripture verses, so how is this not staying with the Bible??
Perhaps you don't like Brengle's writing style....
p.s. sorry for the bold....I tried to change it, but failed.
it's beyond my skill.....Well I was watching Mormon conference and it made me look up their views on the Holy Ghost and they say you have to be worthy to have the constant companionship of the Holy Ghost. I look up scripture to see if it says that, and it would appear that if you take the sacrament unworthily it is not well sinning against the body of Christ. So I wonder if the Holy Ghost is similar in workings. Duno but I'm guessing yes although I seem to have the Holy Ghost and am a sinner somewhat. But maybe I'm not with the Holy Ghost as much as I could be.
I respectfully disagree with you, as I have read many testimonies of people who experienced life-changing "second" blessings (maybe it's the name "second blessing" that you don't agree with, that it's all one BIGGGGGGG blessing). To agree with you would mean that these people didn't have the "second blessing" that they experienced and lived in....and to take it further, that they are lying about it!?!? I don't think that such a dogmatic stance is necessary. Perhaps for you, you don't want or need it, but it's on you to disprove that these people didn't have a second blessing when they said they did, and it completely changed their lives. Just quickly, Jessie Penn Lewis and Smith Wigglesworth as well as Brengle spoke, testified, and wrote (I read it) about it. So, who are you to say there is none??
Respectfully,
a seeker
ChristisGod
Well-Known Member
Testimony’s do not trump scripture . I’ll go with the Bible 100% of the time over subjective experiences from man.
Who said testimonies trump scripture?? When you line yourself up with scripture, God blesses you!! And this is testimony of lining up with God's word!!
ChristisGod
Well-Known Member
When one is lined up with the scriptures through His indwelling Spirit them one is filled with the spirit, walking in the spirit which results in the fruit of the spirit .
hope this helps !!!
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quietthinker
Well-Known Member
I agree that they don't......but they need to be tested by scripture and discerned to make sure they don't go against God's character or word. And see what kind of fruit comes from it too. But keep in mind also, that a person may not always necessarily understand their experiences fully either, or explain them accurately....and that wouldn't necessarily negate that they did experience something from the Lord.
To me, if there is a list of credible believers who have the same or similar testimony, it has weight.....since the word of God says to let everything be established by two or three witnesses. So it makes me sit up and take notice and try to weigh what they are saying....in the light of the word. If God has wrought a kind of paradigm-changing work in someone that is bearing good fruit, then that doesn't sound as though it is against anything of scripture or outside God's character, it seems in keeping with Him, in my opinion. Eg, it wasn't quite the same Moses that led the Israelites out of Egypt, that he used to be prior to his own time in the wilderness.
From what I have read (which is still limited), it doesn't sound as though what these others have experienced is a temporary, in and out, condition, like we have heard elsewhere on this forum, but it is something that remains.
ChristisGod
Well-Known Member
I know of many people who have the same testimony/experience where they roll on the floor in holy uncontrollable laughter, bark like dogs, speak in tongues, foam at the mouth, convulsions etc.......... its not from God as God is not a God of confusion.
But are these credible believers....are they mature or carnal.....and discern what kind of fruit is showing in their life from their 'experience', or is there any fruit at all? I doubt there is any fruit to be had from barking like a dog, and worse if they are seeking "manifestations" rather than seeking the Lord, it will turn to them for a snare.
Those who are testifying of experiencing what is being called a "second blessing" seem also to be testifying to a very changed life for the better...good fruit. And I just see lots of things in scripture that would seem to agree with the idea in principle, so far. So I'm not going to dismiss it out of hand.
ChristisGod
Well-Known Member
I was making a point that numbers and similar experience in churches do not make something biblically true.
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