If atheists get accused of taking verses out of context, how do we know fundamentalists making those accusations aren’t doing the same as well?

[I.O.U]

Are you not admittedly not sure (agnostic)? Why then do you act as if you know what you are talking about?

I actually happen to know that "accepting" is not what salvation is based on, that it is rather a matter of belief or knowing. And I answered the Original Post question.

So, what, you're just lashing out?

I know (I just wanted attention) sorry.

 

[Romanov2488]

Yes, but only because most would assume that "accept" means "consent to receive (a thing offered)." Which definition does not define the salvation equation, as it assumes that one does not already have the thing "accepted." That's not how it works.

On the contrary, salvation is rather a matter of allowing one to define themselves by revealing just what it is they are made up of; meaning, if they are already "of God" or not. The biblical scriptures described this, as, "the man of sin is revealed", as manifesting in the flesh the things that are otherwise unseen and in the spirit.

In other words, it is as if we are born into this world to publicly empty or pockets to see if we have an entry token to the magic kingdom of eternal life. We either do or we don't. The "good news" however, is that even if we don't have what it takes--it's free for the asking. Thus, if one hears the first hand testimony that exists down throughout all of history from those who gave (and still give) their witness to what they have heard or seen of the truth of God, and believe it enough to see where it will take them, it's enough, and the doors will be opened to us.

It's not a challenge issue, but the doors of the heavens do not open to those who do not believe. In which case it all remains brilliantly out of sight and out of reach. Either way, whether only natural or spiritual, life is a gift. The one is simply and ultimately just smaller than the other.

Why would I care about what comes later? The future doesn’t exist, it’s merely a projection. This moment alone is all there is.

I legitimately don’t feel like I need saving nor do I feel fallen. Christians want me to feel like I’m a sinner, like I’m guilty and in need of forgiveness. I simply just don’t feel that way.

 

[Wrangler]

Yes, it’s a paradox. Even Socrates said that wisdom is knowing that you know nothing.

Most people struggle with paradoxes.

Paradoxes - like contradictions - do not exist in reality.

 

[I.O.U]

Paradoxes - like contradictions - do not exist in reality.

I think you just might be right. Or at least onto something.

 

[Romanov2488]

Paradoxes - like contradictions - do not exist in reality.

They sure do exist. It’s only the simplistic mind that can’t handle them. You think truth is on one side only-it’s not. Sides are “imagined”. Truth is more in the middle than anything. You seem to struggle with nuance.

Eastern philosophy is miles above Abrahamic religion because nonduality is at its core. Evil is not the opposite of good, it’s the opposite of nonduality-that there is actually a duality of good and evil. As such, “evil” is really an illusion that people buy into. Eastern philosophy is also not God forsaken. All is God, albeit impersonal. And God is more of a verb than anything, not a noun. Nouns are dead, they don’t grow. Abrahamic religions don’t unite, they divide all while missing the underlying oneness of reality.

Jesus was really just a man like you and I who realized his divine nature. It’s accessible to everyone. When he said “I am the way and the truth”, he was referring to the I which we all share: awareness.

Duality is ultimately an illusion with the reality of that illusion being nonduality. It is the formless playing as form.

 

[Wrangler]

Truth is more in the middle than anything.

Truth is more in the middle of what? According to you, in the middle of what does not exist.

Of course truth is only on one side. Many like to play word games to pretend otherwise.

 

[Romanov2488]

Truth is more in the middle of what? According to you, in the middle of what does not exist.

Of course truth is only on one side. Many like to play word games to pretend otherwise.

Truth is not only one side. Truth is free and doesn’t belong to any “sides”.

Truth doesn’t mind being questioned. Lies hate being challenged. In your religion, truth is not to be questioned. Makes you wonder if what you believe is even the truth after all.

 

[Wrangler]

Truth is not only one side. Truth is free and doesn’t belong to any “sides”.

Oy vey! Are you confused. One side is what is true.

It’s like you conceive of sides independent of the truth. What a riot.

 

[ScottA]

Why would I care about what comes later? The future doesn’t exist, it’s merely a projection. This moment alone is all there is.

I legitimately don’t feel like I need saving nor do I feel fallen. Christians want me to feel like I’m a sinner, like I’m guilty and in need of forgiveness. I simply just don’t feel that way.

Understandable, but limited. The thing about this world, is that it (and we) are not perfect...which is simply defined as caused by sin. Sorry if that news has come to you in the way of accusations. In reality, those who have seen around the next bend, simply know it to be worth sharing, and if known about one would not want to miss out on it.

But since you made claims about the future, let me ask you: How is it that you know this, or do you not actually know?

 

[Romanov2488]

Oy vey! Are you confused. One side is what is true.

It’s like you conceive of sides independent of the truth. What a riot.

Nope. Both sides of any situation claim to be right. Everyone thinks they are the good ones and the others are evil and vice versa. You keep chasing your tail like a dog.

Christians think they are right. LGBT thinks it’s right. Muslims think they are right. Democrats think they are right. Republicans think they are right.

 

[Romanov2488]

Understandable, but limited. The thing about this world, is that it (and we) are not perfect...which is simply defined as caused by sin. Sorry if that news has come to you in the way of accusations. In reality, those who have seen around the next bend, simply know it to be worth sharing, and if known about one would not want to miss out on it.

But since you made claims about the future, let me ask you: How is it that you know this, or do you not actually know?

Me not being perfect is what makes me perfect. The imperfection is the perfection.

What claims did I make about the future?

 

[ScottA]

Me not being perfect is what makes me perfect. The imperfection is the perfection.

What claims did I make about the future?

You speak as if you never had anything to complain about, that life is always perfectly easy and without any times being tough, frustrating, difficult, or even never coming to and end. But that simply isn't true of this world or this life.

You mentioned that "The future doesn’t exist, it’s merely a projection. This moment alone is all there is." To which I asked, "How do you know this to be true, or do you actually know it (or not)?

 

[Wrangler]

Why would I care about what comes later? The future doesn’t exist, it’s merely a projection. This moment alone is all there is.

I legitimately don’t feel like I need saving nor do I feel fallen. Christians want me to feel like I’m a sinner, like I’m guilty and in need of forgiveness. I simply just don’t feel that way.

Feelings aren't facts and don't determine reality.

The future does not exist, in actuality, true enough. It's existence is a potential.

Nope. Both sides of any situation claim to be right. Everyone thinks they are the good ones and the others are evil and vice versa. You keep chasing your tail like a dog.

Christians think they are right. LGBT thinks it’s right. Muslims think they are right. Democrats think they are right. Republicans think they are right.

You are so lost! Your frame of reference is in the man-made "sides" rather than the metaphysical truth. Your starting point of analysis is supposed to be with what is true, not with what man-made sides there are.

 

[Gottservant]

It is about what other people are believing. Your belief was imported, it was someone else’s belief. Nobody is born knowing about Jesus or the Bible. Denominations are just religions of a particular interpretation of the Bible.

No, I don't believe that.

You can trust whatever you like, no one is forcing you.

 

[Romanov2488]

You speak as if you never had anything to complain about, that life is always perfectly easy and without any times being tough, frustrating, difficult, or even never coming to and end. But that simply isn't true of this world or this life.

You mentioned that "The future doesn’t exist, it’s merely a projection. This moment alone is all there is." To which I asked, "How do you know this to be true, or do you actually know it (or not)?

Because anything that has ever happened or will happen, takes place in the now.

I am just “here-now” always. Tomorrow will be now. Here and now is outside space-time. Space time is simply how the mind filters this moment.

The future always comes as right now. The past was always, right now.

 

[Romanov2488]

Feelings aren't facts and don't determine reality.

The future does not exist, in actuality, true enough. It's existence is a potential.


You are so lost! Your frame of reference is in the man-made "sides" rather than the metaphysical truth. Your starting point of analysis is supposed to be with what is true, not with what man-made sides there are.

Metaphysical truth is unknowable by the human mind. It’s too big to be encapsulated into a single thought. Thoughts are always -about-, not the actual truth.

 

[Gottservant]

Because anything that has ever happened or will happen, takes place in the now.

I am just “here-now” always. Tomorrow will be now. Here and now is outside space-time. Space time is simply how the mind filters this moment.

The future always comes as right now. The past was always, right now.

The thing is "you only have so much 'now' to act on" and if you use it up, you will get tired (maybe even pass out or die)

 

[Wrangler]

Metaphysical truth is unknowable by the human mind. It’s too big to be encapsulated into a single thought. Thoughts are always -about-, not the actual truth.

Appeal to Ignorance. Utter nonsense. We didn't get to the moon without knowing metaphysical truth. Truth is understood through epistemology.

Our thoughts about the truth are independent of the truth. And Jesus is the truth and you may know him IF you humble yourself enough to ask.

 

[ScottA]

Because anything that has ever happened or will happen, takes place in the now.

I am just “here-now” always. Tomorrow will be now. Here and now is outside space-time. Space time is simply how the mind filters this moment.

The future always comes as right now. The past was always, right now.

Two out of three (past, now, future) ain't bad, but one out of three (now), no.

Time is even scientifically an illusion, nonetheless it ticks by and comes to an end, and then it's over. You know this. You may as well put your head down and shut out everything but the ground beneath your feet. Indeed, what you are [now] doing has no future. I am trying to be kind but truthful...but psychologically "now" thinking is just an escape from reality, and from what the future actually does or does not hold. Life is more than meets the eye, and your mind--our minds--that "filter" only operate at a fraction of what it's capable of. Now is only the first grade, and all of time only the third grade. Not a good place to stay.

If you want to know what life was and is actually meant to be about, pick your head up, take the blinders off, ask.

 

[I.O.U]

You see why I want to be with you doll-face. No one on this planet can reach my emotional depth but you. It can only be you.