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You see, as all other people like you do, you have to ignore what you are shown. You think I haven't discussed this before? Your rational mind is leading you, in effect to try and rationalise that if a person stands on the plain words of Christ when he walked this earth, they will be condemned to hell. BTW your question was previously answered. Now answer a question of mine
God states he is Christ's God(Heb1:9) Jesus, four times in Rev3:12 refers to God as ''my God''. Peter and Paul both refer to God as THE God of Christ. So, God, Christ Paul and Peter all believe God is the God of Christ. So, if Christ is the one true God, who is the God of the one true omnipotent God? Scriptural support would be appreciated
If God isn't your Savior you've been DUPED by Satan. There's ONLY one Savior.
Hosea 13
4 You shall know no God but Me; For there is no Savior besides Me.
Jesus is God, the ONLY Savior!
You see, you cannot answer anything put before you can you. You just robotically repeat the same things. If the Holy Spirit was leading you to contradict the words of Christ as to the requirement of belief needed according to the title of Christ to be saved, in trinitarian terms, God would be contradicting God. Anyone can randomly quote the letter of scripture, it does not mean they understand the message
You can't even answer the most important question you've ever been asked in your life?
"Is Jesus THE Savior or not?"
You've had that previously answered, as you are aware, its just pure deflection as you cannot answer anything put before you. You may think you know much, but the opposite is true Im afraid
post 151
My son and I are walking along a river bank. I see a child in the river. I say to my son ''Go and rescue the child'' He does. I am the saviour of the child, by asking my son to rescue him. My son is also the saviour of the child, for he went and got him out of the water
However, deflection from an inability to address any question put before someone is vital
My son and I are walking along a river bank. I see a child in the river. I say to my son ''Go and rescue the child'' He does. I am the saviour of the child, by asking my son to rescue him. My son is also the saviour of the child, for he went and got him out of the water
However, deflection from an inability to address any question put before someone is vital
And you my friend have simply shown you are unable to answer any question put to you. And you have shown your belief that if a person stands on the plain words of Christ when he walked this earth they will be condemned to hell. Thank goodness I've never come accross such nonsense in any church I've ever been to
What do I need? Kingdom Hall brainwashing? No thanks. I don't want to burn in Hell "forever and ever". Jesus is THE Savior. He is God.
Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
Not sure who you want a response from...but here goes....
You stated that "both Father and son have divine authority over history"? Well if you mean that they are aware of the prophesies that are being fulfilled as history unfolds, then yes, both have that divine authority...yet only Yahweh has always had divine authority, and passes it on to his son.
Before his return to heaven...."Jesus approached and spoke to them, saying: “All authority has been given me in heaven and on the earth."
If Jesus was God why would he need his Father to "give" him "ALL authority"? (Matthew 28:18)
Revelation 12:7-11 also brings out this same point...
"And war broke out in heaven: Miʹcha·el and his angels battled with the dragon, and the dragon and its angels battled 8 but they did not prevail, nor was a place found for them any longer in heaven. 9 So down the great dragon was hurled, the original serpent, the one called Devil and Satan, who is misleading the entire inhabited earth; he was hurled down to the earth, and his angels were hurled down with him. 10 I heard a loud voice in heaven say:
“Now have come to pass the salvation and the power and the Kingdom of our God and the authority of his Christ, because the accuser of our brothers has been hurled down, who accuses them day and night before our God! 11 And they conquered him because of the blood of the Lamb and because of the word of their witnessing, and they did not love their souls even in the face of death."
Satan and his hordes were evicted from heaven and only then was Christ given his authority to conquer his enemies, who are all now on this earth. (Acts 7:48-49) It was what he had been waiting for, as prophesied by King David....
"Yahweh says to my Lord, “Sit at my right hand,
until I make your enemies your footstool for your feet.”
2 Yahweh will send out the rod of your strength out of Zion.
Rule among your enemies." (Psalm 110:1-2)
David's "Lord" (Messiah) was to sit at God's right hand and wait till his enemies were place under his feet....on his footstool...then he would rule among his enemies until the time for the final judgment arrived. He is, as we speak, separating the "sheep from the goats".....do you know what the sheep are doing that the goats are not?
Actually it is the one seated on the throne who receives worship.
If you notice in verses 9-10...it says of Jesus...
"You are worthy to take the scroll
and to open its seals,
because you were slain,
and with your blood you purchased for God
persons from every tribe and language and people and nation.
10 You have made them to be a kingdom and priests to serve our God,
and they will reign on the earth.”
You seem to read right over what is very obvious, without actually seeing what is written....with his blood, Christ purchased people for God, who will serve in heaven as kings and priests, to serve whom? "our God"...who is clearly NOT Jesus. (Revelation 20:6)
Verses 12-14 read...
“Worthy is the Lamb, who was slain,
to receive power and wealth and wisdom and strength
and honor and glory and praise!”
But there is no mention of worship there.
"13 Then I heard every creature in heaven and on earth and under the earth and on the sea, and all that is in them, saying:
“To him who sits on the throne and to the Lamb
be praise and honor and glory and power,
for ever and ever!”
14 The four living creatures said, “Amen,” and the elders fell down and worshiped."
Worshiped whom?
Since worship in the Bible is reserved for Yahweh alone, (Luke 4:5-8) and sharing his Father's throne in what is called co-regency, that doesn't mean that Jesus is worshipped as if he were his Father's equal. The son is a "servant" of his Father who is also his God. (Acts 4:27; Revelation 3:12)
Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
You are talking to an Aussie mate....what the heck does that mean?
The person of Jesus is nothing without his teachings...that's what he was...a teacher, who is "the same yesterday, today and tomorrow". He does not alter and neither do his teachings.....your arguments are pretty shallow.
Last time I looked it was based on knowledge of the scriptures....all of it, not just cherry picked verses. .....I agree one of us is trying to appear 'confident' whilst having no response to a single scripture offered. That's the thing...you can't argue with scripture...
DanielConway
Member
I repeat.
6 Then I saw a Lamb, looking as if it had been slain, standing at the center of the throne, encircled by the four living creatures and the elders.
The FACT that Jesus is a co-habitor (I won't say he shares because it WOULD imply a co-regency, which is NOT the relationship of the father with the Son) of the throne and accepts every word of worshipful honor that the Father does clearly does demonstrate his divinity, at least in the eyes of the heavenly host if not yours. The wording strongly implies they simultaneously occupy the seat of divine authority, and while I am at it the reference to the seven horns and seven eyes of the lamb is a clear reference to the Holy Spirit which even your cult (in the formal sense) recognizes and he too occupies the Throne and accepts worship. Listen Up! And for Chrissake take your doctrinal blinders off and read your own quote:
“To him who sits on the throne and to the Lamb
be praise and honor and glory and power,
for ever and ever!”
14 The four living creatures said, “Amen,” and the elders fell down and worshiped."
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DanielConway
Member
You are talking to an Aussie mate....what the heck does that mean?
The person of Jesus is nothing without his teachings...that's what he was...a teacher, who is "the same yesterday, today and tomorrow". He does not alter and neither do his teachings.....your arguments are pretty shallow.
Last time I looked it was based on knowledge of the scriptures....all of it, not just cherry picked verses. .....I agree one of us is trying to appear 'confident' whilst having no response to a single scripture offered. That's the thing...you can't argue with scripture...
Ehh.. what? You missed the entire point of my post. Your rebuttal to my statement that "the same yesterday, today and tomorrow" was a clear reference to divinity was to try to map the article onto Jesus teachings instead of his person, which the Greek clearly indicates is an absurdity, as I indicated in my response. Are you drunk? try getting high for the next hitt.
Wrangler
Well-Known Member
Yes.
No. God didn't die on the cross. Jesus did. See how that is not the same?
Wrangler
Well-Known Member
You do realize the property OF DanielConway is not DanielConway, right?
Likewise, anything OF God is not God. The Lamb of God is not God.
DanielConway
Member
Hmm.. You seem to be saying that it is not possible for a servant to own himself, I suggest you check out the Dred Scott decision.
And you know what else? I think Enoch111 and Jack are stuffed shirts for the trinity deniers on this thread. There may be more, some of what Behold writes is pretty stiff and suspect, but I guess he's a long sleeved stuffed shirt.
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