Is it OK to blaspheme the Trinity?

[amadeus]

you are 100% WRONG! this is HERESY! as no person can be a true Christian with these beliefs!

"Then the high priest rent his clothes, saying, He hath spoken blasphemy; what further need have we of witnesses? behold, now ye have heard his blasphemy.
What think ye? They answered and said, He is guilty of death.
Then did they spit in his face, and buffeted him; and others smote him with the palms of their hands," Matt 26:65-67

"From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.
Then said Jesus unto the twelve, Will ye also go away?" John 6:66-67

 

[Brakelite]

"Then the high priest rent his clothes, saying, He hath spoken blasphemy; what further need have we of witnesses? behold, now ye have heard his blasphemy.
What think ye? They answered and said, He is guilty of death.
Then did they spit in his face, and buffeted him; and others smote him with the palms of their hands," Matt 26:65-67

"From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.
Then said Jesus unto the twelve, Will ye also go away?" John 6:66-67

The more I read of certain denominational thinking of many forum members here of late the more convinced I am of a future in which any Christian practicing his/her faith according to his conscientious beliefs that may not be in harmony with traditional Catholic dogma, will be on the receiving end of some attitude adjustment at the hands of Vatican sponsored state enforcers reminiscent of the darkest ages of medieval Europe. Prophecy warns that such will be on a global scale. I fear for those who are choosing to align with Rome in these last days. Their end will not go well.

 

[ByGraceThroughFaith]

"Then the high priest rent his clothes, saying, He hath spoken blasphemy; what further need have we of witnesses? behold, now ye have heard his blasphemy.
What think ye? They answered and said, He is guilty of death.
Then did they spit in his face, and buffeted him; and others smote him with the palms of their hands," Matt 26:65-67

"From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.
Then said Jesus unto the twelve, Will ye also go away?" John 6:66-67

meaing exactly what?

 

[amadeus]

The more I read of certain denominational thinking of many forum members here of late the more convinced I am of a future in which any Christian practicing his/her faith according to his conscientious beliefs that may not be in harmony with traditional Catholic dogma, will be on the receiving end of some attitude adjustment at the hands of Vatican sponsored state enforcers reminiscent of the darkest ages of medieval Europe. Prophecy warns that such will be on a global scale. I fear for those who are choosing to align with Rome in these last days. Their end will not go well.

The similarities between the labeled "Christian" community of today and the organization of the Jews when Jesus walked planet Earth 2,000 years ago are to me and probably a few others blatant. But... there are apparently a whole lot of blind people in Christendom today. They are so busy with their "I'm right and you're wrong" scenarios or in their giving their first attentions to things like "that doctrine will send you to a devil's hell" that their eyes and ears are closed to what Jesus said and is saying. They are like those many who walked with him no more as they with the Pharisees of old are looking to the tithing of mint and rue and all manner of herbs... and so forth:

"But woe unto you, Pharisees! for ye tithe mint and rue and all manner of herbs, and pass over judgment and the love of God: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone." Luke 11:42

Someone will probably now attempt explain what that tithing is as the carnal mind reads it and for love they will describe the "tough love" which they teach and preach and practice while they leave undone what Jesus really was and is. Does anyone really understand why Jesus wept? Did he not clarify it here for those with ears to hear?

"But Jesus turning unto them said, Daughters of Jerusalem, weep not for me, but weep for yourselves, and for your children." Luke 23:28

But... so many will continue with their tithing of all of those things, still giving only a tenth or less of what they do give to God instead of understanding and striving to apply what Paul explained here:

"I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith." Rom 12:1-3

 

[Brakelite]

The similarities between the labeled "Christian" community of today and the organization of the Jews when Jesus walked planet Earth 2,000 years ago are to me and probably a few others blatant. But... there are apparently a whole lot of blind people in Christendom today. They are so busy with their "I'm right and you're wrong" scenarios or in their giving their first attentions to things like "that doctrine will send you to a devil's hell" that their eyes and ears are closed to what Jesus said and is saying. They are like those many who walked with him no more as they with the Pharisees of old are looking to the tithing of mint and rue and all manner of herbs... and so forth:

"But woe unto you, Pharisees! for ye tithe mint and rue and all manner of herbs, and pass over judgment and the love of God: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone." Luke 11:42

Someone will probably now attempt explain what that tithing is as the carnal mind reads it and for love they will describe the "tough love" which they teach and preach and practice while they leave undone what Jesus really was and is. Does anyone really understand why Jesus wept? Did he not clarify it here for those with ears to hear?

"But Jesus turning unto them said, Daughters of Jerusalem, weep not for me, but weep for yourselves, and for your children." Luke 23:28

But... so many will continue with their tithing of all of those things, still giving only a tenth or less of what they do give to God instead of understanding and striving to apply what Paul explained here:

"I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith." Rom 12:1-3

KJV Matthew 23:23
23 .... weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith...
I wonder how the anti law folk, those who would do away with the law, deal with the above scripture you quoted?

 

[amadeus]

meaing exactly what?

You are the one who said,

you are 100% WRONG! this is HERESY! as no person can be a true Christian with these beliefs!

With that kind of knowledge do you not understand what the cited verses mean?

"Then the high priest rent his clothes, saying, He hath spoken blasphemy; what further need have we of witnesses? behold, now ye have heard his blasphemy.
What think ye? They answered and said, He is guilty of death.
Then did they spit in his face, and buffeted him; and others smote him with the palms of their hands," Matt 26:65-67

"From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.
Then said Jesus unto the twelve, Will ye also go away?" John 6:66-67[/QUOTE]

What do you understand of what Apostle Paul meant when he wrote the following words for in understanding them you may understand what the high priest was doing and why Jesus asked the question he did of the twelve:

"And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness." II Thess 2:10-12

 

[amadeus]

KJV Matthew 23:23
23 .... weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith...
I wonder how the anti law folk, those who would do away with the law, deal with the above scripture you quoted?

I guess they have an answer. Most everyone has an answer. Me too! Are they God's answers or their/our own?

According to some, it would seem, we are have put our confidence in the wrong place, but do they even understand what place we are in... when they concern themselves still with things which are not their business and too often appear as meaningless nonsense like those Pharisees of old? I may miss my way with God at times, but who is ultimately to be my judge on these things? Anyone on this forum? Some act as if it were so!

 

[James the Rabbit]

The statement addresses disagreements and various levels of Christian maturity, I understand all that. But the statement does not address arrogant blasphemy, which should not be tolerated in a supposedly trinitarian forum. Blasphemy is not mere disagreement, it is not discussion, it is blasphemy and should not be tolerated. Period. Jesus and St. Paul would have DNB banned.

It's not just DNB blaspheming the Trinity, the goading and harassing by the SDA cult members is endless, and reports go ignored. Appeals to have the thread closed go ignored. SDA is an anti-trinitarian hate cult, and they should not be exempt from the rules, but obviously they are. The responsibility for allowing anti-Christian hate speech (which further contributes to the decline of civilization) rests with you.

I am a Trinitarian Christian, but I really don't see people who reject the doctrine of the Trinity, blaspheming against God. They are rejecting a construct that we use to understand a basic truth about God's nature. Blasphemy against a doctrine, whether true or not, isn't blasphemy against God, I think

 

[APAK]

The more I read of certain denominational thinking of many forum members here of late the more convinced I am of a future in which any Christian practicing his/her faith according to his conscientious beliefs that may not be in harmony with traditional Catholic dogma, will be on the receiving end of some attitude adjustment at the hands of Vatican sponsored state enforcers reminiscent of the darkest ages of medieval Europe. Prophecy warns that such will be on a global scale. I fear for those who are choosing to align with Rome in these last days. Their end will not go well.

Still today, the essential part of Protestantism all lead back to pagan Roman Trinitarianism, a concept conceived and forced on many people by their compromising Roman Catholic Mother. Go figure, they shed the light and most visible stuff, the sacraments, the Mass, the idols including the superior reverence of Mary, and kept the core mental construct of Gods of three different roles and personalities as being the same mysterious non-descript Triune God - all lumped together! And then many wonder why scripture does not always, and usually not, fit their paradigm, and they are forced to ignore or at least down-play the significance of some scripture in their supporting arguments. And it blows their Bible Study sessions and lofty mental constructs of a 3 headed God to smithereens..............

All because of their Trinity well-engrained lens that should not and never be attempted to be associated with scripture. One is holy and the other, definitively not.

APAK

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Post #389 here. Invincible ignorance is what keeps the poster from committing the unpardonable sin.

Would someone please explain to me why diabolical content like this is allowed (reports go ignored for 3 days)?
Or is it only allowed when Catholics are relentlessly attacked by anti-trinitarians who disregard the rules?
I await a relativistic excuse.

Well that is not a blasphemy. It is not okay to speak against god. but this is ignorance borne of unbelief. The only sin that is unforgivable now is to die without having trusted in the death and resurrection of Jesus for your sin.

 

[ByGraceThroughFaith]

I am a Trinitarian Christian, but I really don't see people who reject the doctrine of the Trinity, blaspheming against God. They are rejecting a construct that we use to understand a basic truth about God's nature. Blasphemy against a doctrine, whether true or not, isn't blasphemy against God, I think

then you think wrong

 

[Brakelite]

then you think wrong

How is it that your avatar speaks of the grace of God toward you, but you have difficulty extending that same to others?

 

[Brakelite]

Still today, the essential part of Protestantism all lead back to pagan Roman Trinitarianism, a concept conceived and forced on many people by their compromising Roman Catholic Mother. Go figure, they shed the light and most visible stuff, the sacraments, the Mass, the idols including the superior reverence of Mary, and kept the core mental construct of Gods of three different roles and personalities as being the same mysterious non-descript Triune God - all lumped together! And then many wonder why scripture does not always, and usually not, fit their paradigm, and they are forced to ignore or at least down-play the significance of some scripture in their supporting arguments. And it blows their Bible Study sessions and lofty mental constructs of a 3 headed God to smithereens..............

All because of their Trinity well-engrained lens that should not and never be attempted to be associated with scripture. One is holy and the other, definitively not.

APAK

I agree that Protestantism never fully extricated itself from Mother. The Catholic church boasts of the trinity as the central doctrine of her faith, and all other doctrines emanating from it. But let us not throw everything aside in order to prove we are free from the papacy. You will never find a counterfeit $8 note. Or a counterfeit $99 note. Counterfeiters aren't stupid. The devil has in creating the Papal system established an ingenious counterfeit, which without scriptures, can be readily accepted as true Christianity. So while the Nicaean creed and the ones following were counterfeits of the reality of the Godhead, those creeds weren't so far out into left field to be obviously and dramatically wrong. I think we need to take great care in criticizing the trinity, as we are discussing the infinite and eternal nature of God, so we are stepping onto holy ground. We need to take care when we start drawing lines in the sand...on both sides...and condemning others for their view. God has revealed Himself to mankind throughout human history. In so much as He has revealed Himself, that we can take as Truth. But we get into trouble when we take that Truth, and attempt to embellish it in ways that have not been revealed. We make assumptions. And those assumptions become dogma. Then as can be seen on this thread, those who disagree with those assumptions come dogma, are condemned.
The Truth is no -one knows how or in what manner God is materially comprised. We do know that there are three personalities involved. We know that the Messiah, Jesus, is the Son of God. We know that He had a hand in creating all things, and was begotten of God way back in eternity before anything else was made or created. Begotten we know does not mean created. Brought forth in a manner that isn't explained, at a time which to us seems forever, must and can only mean of the same nature as His Father...just as in all Father/Son relationships. At least to me, in my own very limited human and distressed understanding, that makes the Son every much a part of divinity as the Father. Yet also very separate. The Son is an individual. A distinct person in His own right. And that, right there, is where I part from orthodox Christianity. I simply cannot see any rhyme or reason for inventing an idea that makes the Father and Son into one consubstantial being. You don't need such a belief in order to accept Christ's divinity. His Sonship ought to be sufficient for that alone. That, the consubstantial theory, at east to my mind, takes the understanding or teaching of the Godhead a step too far. It is an assumption born of political necessity to create an orthodox formula to bring unity to a divided empire. And the means by which this formula was promulgated and enforced upon all Christianity ought to make modern trinitarians embarrassed. And I sense that same ungracious spirit of intolerance and persecution being demonstrated in this thread. All based on an assumption. Sad.

 

[Heart2Soul]

This board hangs in the balance - will it go the way of THEOLOGY FORUMS - which says flat out that they are a Theology board rather than a "Christian" board?

theologyforums.com - "Heresy Hotel" - worldwide web headquarters of the non-trinnies and the Not-Godders who deny that Christ is God

will this board become like it?

How very judgmental of you....and how would you, if you owned a Christian Forum, operate it so that all denominations are welcome to join....and keep it fair and balanced?
Non-trinitarians only? Trinitarians only?
What would Jesus do?
How do people who are seeking fellowship and answers get to join if they aren't even saved?
What if it was someone about to commit suicide and was looking for help on the internet and it led them to the forum and someone reaches out to them with words of hope?

What you fail to understand is this is not a place to esteem one doctrine of faith over another....it is a place to come and fellowship.
If only members would learn to do that in a humble manner.

 

[Heart2Soul]

Anyone who deines the Teaching of the Holy Trinity, CANNOT EVER get to heaven, but will surely be punished eternally, as it is a teaching from the devil himself!

I don't dare say who is or isn't going to heaven....you're crossing the line when you make such a statement....

 

[Hemlock]

So in answer to the OP - Yes.

 

[Taodeching]

you are 100% WRONG! this is HERESY! as no person can be a true Christian with these beliefs!

Exactly

 

[ByGraceThroughFaith]

I don't dare say who is or isn't going to heaven....you're crossing the line when you make such a statement....

I dare nothing, this is what the Bible says.

 

[ByGraceThroughFaith]

How is it that your avatar speaks of the grace of God toward you, but you have difficulty extending that same to others?

ask the God of the Bible, Who so loves the world, that He made hell for those who reject Him!

 

[Brakelite]

ask the God of the Bible, Who so loves the world, that He made hell for those who reject Him!

No. I know God better than I know you. I'm asking you... It's you I don't understand.