Is This True?
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Yes. Philippians 3:20 tells of predestination to glory, which we cannot lose.
Eph. 1:5 - . There are two types of "predestination,"
1) to grace, which we can lose and
2) to glory, which we cannot lose.
In this verse, Paul is teaching about predestination to grace, which means becoming a Christian.
predestination to grace 1 Pet. 1:1-2
predestined to glory: 1 Cor. 15:49
predestined to grace Rev. 3:5
Therefore, predestination is either to grace (which we could lose) or to glory (which we cannot lose). As alluded to above, some confuse the definition of "predestination" (which means God knows what we will do before we do it) and "predetermination" (the erroneous belief that God determines what we will do). But God does not author evil. We choose evil by our own freewill.
Eph. 1:5; 1 Peter 1:2; Rom. 8:29-30; 1 Cor. 15:49 - therefore, predestination is either to grace (which we could lose) or to glory (which we cannot lose). Some confuse the definition of "predestination" (which means God knows what we will do before we do it) and "predetermination" (the erroneous belief that God determines what we will do). But God does not author evil. We choose evil by our own freewill.
Rom. 8:29-30 – Paul also writes that we are predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son. Now Paul is writing about predestination to glory, which means not only becoming a faithful Christian during our lives, but persevering to the end by conforming our will to Christ's will.
Acts 10:35 this text show that non-Christians can also be saved if they fear God, even though they haven't formally accepted Jesus as Savior at an altar call. They just do not have the fullness of the means of salvation.
Eph. 1:5 - . There are two types of "predestination,"
1) to grace, which we can lose and
2) to glory, which we cannot lose.
In this verse, Paul is teaching about predestination to grace, which means becoming a Christian.
predestination to grace 1 Pet. 1:1-2
predestined to glory: 1 Cor. 15:49
predestined to grace Rev. 3:5
Therefore, predestination is either to grace (which we could lose) or to glory (which we cannot lose). As alluded to above, some confuse the definition of "predestination" (which means God knows what we will do before we do it) and "predetermination" (the erroneous belief that God determines what we will do). But God does not author evil. We choose evil by our own freewill.
Eph. 1:5; 1 Peter 1:2; Rom. 8:29-30; 1 Cor. 15:49 - therefore, predestination is either to grace (which we could lose) or to glory (which we cannot lose). Some confuse the definition of "predestination" (which means God knows what we will do before we do it) and "predetermination" (the erroneous belief that God determines what we will do). But God does not author evil. We choose evil by our own freewill.
Rom. 8:29-30 – Paul also writes that we are predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son. Now Paul is writing about predestination to glory, which means not only becoming a faithful Christian during our lives, but persevering to the end by conforming our will to Christ's will.
Acts 10:35 this text show that non-Christians can also be saved if they fear God, even though they haven't formally accepted Jesus as Savior at an altar call. They just do not have the fullness of the means of salvation.
Therefore, predestination is either to grace (which we could lose)>>>> I have real problem with that! Grace and then loose ,does not make two apples and one pear in a basket , The bible and the blood of the cross does work like that.
Marcus O'Reillius
Active Member
What were to happen if you were to be a "foolish virgin" and take the 'mark of the beast' to buy something you thought you needed to "make it" until Christ came again - would you still be allowed into Heaven with all the years of fervent, sincere, heartfelt belief you've had?blessedhope said:
What does the Bible say will happen?
So while God extends Grace unto us, is that not dependent upon our willing acceptance of it, and then our obedience to His Commands for us? (And no, I'm not talking about OT Law; I'm talking about what Jesus has commanded us to do in the NT.)
kepha31 said:
None of the above verses negates the fact that you must repent, and follow God's commandments, NOTHING....God's grace will absolve you of your sins, if you repent, and sin no more....What is sin? 1st John says "sin is transgression of God's law"
In your misinterpretation of Acts 10.35 you totally ignore the fact of what Jesus said in John 14.6 "I am the way, the truth and the life, no man comes to the Father but by me"....so there is NO salvation without Jesus, according to His own statement...
Remember always, Salvation is through the Son of God, God's grace and commandments, and NOT the sungod/satan and his doctrines and days of sunday, dec 25th and easter, all of which are non Biblical and of pagan origin.
I DO NOT BELIEVE YOU CAN LOOSE YOUR SALVATION IN THE AGE OF GRACE! If you read once the church is raptured there are five crowns that you can get! The 5 types of crowns for believers in heaven
The 5 types of crowns are: –
1.Crown of righteousness
2.Incorruptible crown
3.Crown of life
4.Crown of glory
5.Crown of rejoicing
1. Crown of Righteousness
2 Tim 4:8: Henceforth there is laid up for me a crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous judge, shall give me at that day: and not to me only, but unto all them also that love his appearing.
This is a crown for every person who loves the appearing of Jesus Christ like Timothy. A crown for those ready and waiting for Jesus Christ coming.
Righteousness is only by faith.
Rom 3:24: Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus.
Gal 5:5: For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.
Php 3:9: And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith.
Crown of Righteousness is a crown for every righteous person through grace by faith.
Salvation is only through grace by faith and every person in Jesus Christ is justified and righteous, and waiting for the final salvation when Jesus appears.
The crown of righteousness is for every saved person.
2. Incorruptible crown
1 Cor 9:25: And every man that strives for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.
Incorruptible crown is a crown for people who brought their body unto subjection; disciplined their body; – had self-control.
1 Cor 9:24 – 25: Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receives the prize? So run, that ye may obtain. And every man that strives for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.
1 Cor 9:26 – 27: I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beats the air. But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.
Paul uses the word ‘temperate’ meaning self – control and he explains that it is through keeping the body into subjection that you receive an incorruptible crown.
3. Crown of life
Jas 1:12: Blessed is the man that endures temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him.
Rev 2:10: Fear none of those things which thou shall suffer: behold, the devil shall cast some of you into prison, that ye may be tried; and ye shall have tribulation ten days: be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life.
Crown of life is a crown for people who have patiently endured trials, testing and persecution. It is for the people who bravely confront persecution for Jesus Christ even to the point of death.
4. Crown of glory
1 Pet 5:2 – 4: Feed the flock of God which is among you, taking the oversight thereof, not by constraint, but willingly; not for filthy lucre, but of a ready mind. Neither as being lords over God’s heritage, but being ensamples to the flock. And when the chief Shepherd shall appear, ye shall receive a crown of glory that fades not away.
Crown of glory is a crown for every person who feeds the flock; – the pastors, apostles, prophets, evangelists, teachers, ministers and every person carrying out the great commission.
It is a crown for the Peters, Pauls, Johns and every God’s servant preaching the gospel to every creature. Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature Mk 16:15.
This is the crown I am fighting for, remaining strong in faith and preaching the gospel no matter what comes my way as I strongly guard my crown. My heart rejoices when I remember the great reward awaiting me in heaven; the crown of Glory.
5. Crown of Rejoicing
1 Th 2:19: For what is our hope, or joy, or crown of rejoicing? Are not even ye in the presence of our Lord Jesus Christ at his coming?
The Crown of rejoicing will be our crown where ‘God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away’ Rev 21:4.
It is a crown for every saint; every saved person. Salvation is only by grace through faith.
There are people who will have more than one type of crowns in heaven. Which is/are your crowns?
You have what you need now to make your choice. Make a good choice.
God blesseBut you can not loose your salvation once you are bought by the blood of the Lamb>that is heresy.
The 5 types of crowns are: –
1.Crown of righteousness
2.Incorruptible crown
3.Crown of life
4.Crown of glory
5.Crown of rejoicing
1. Crown of Righteousness
2 Tim 4:8: Henceforth there is laid up for me a crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous judge, shall give me at that day: and not to me only, but unto all them also that love his appearing.
This is a crown for every person who loves the appearing of Jesus Christ like Timothy. A crown for those ready and waiting for Jesus Christ coming.
Righteousness is only by faith.
Rom 3:24: Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus.
Gal 5:5: For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.
Php 3:9: And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith.
Crown of Righteousness is a crown for every righteous person through grace by faith.
Salvation is only through grace by faith and every person in Jesus Christ is justified and righteous, and waiting for the final salvation when Jesus appears.
The crown of righteousness is for every saved person.
2. Incorruptible crown
1 Cor 9:25: And every man that strives for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.
Incorruptible crown is a crown for people who brought their body unto subjection; disciplined their body; – had self-control.
1 Cor 9:24 – 25: Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receives the prize? So run, that ye may obtain. And every man that strives for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.
1 Cor 9:26 – 27: I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beats the air. But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.
Paul uses the word ‘temperate’ meaning self – control and he explains that it is through keeping the body into subjection that you receive an incorruptible crown.
3. Crown of life
Jas 1:12: Blessed is the man that endures temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him.
Rev 2:10: Fear none of those things which thou shall suffer: behold, the devil shall cast some of you into prison, that ye may be tried; and ye shall have tribulation ten days: be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life.
Crown of life is a crown for people who have patiently endured trials, testing and persecution. It is for the people who bravely confront persecution for Jesus Christ even to the point of death.
4. Crown of glory
1 Pet 5:2 – 4: Feed the flock of God which is among you, taking the oversight thereof, not by constraint, but willingly; not for filthy lucre, but of a ready mind. Neither as being lords over God’s heritage, but being ensamples to the flock. And when the chief Shepherd shall appear, ye shall receive a crown of glory that fades not away.
Crown of glory is a crown for every person who feeds the flock; – the pastors, apostles, prophets, evangelists, teachers, ministers and every person carrying out the great commission.
It is a crown for the Peters, Pauls, Johns and every God’s servant preaching the gospel to every creature. Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature Mk 16:15.
This is the crown I am fighting for, remaining strong in faith and preaching the gospel no matter what comes my way as I strongly guard my crown. My heart rejoices when I remember the great reward awaiting me in heaven; the crown of Glory.
5. Crown of Rejoicing
1 Th 2:19: For what is our hope, or joy, or crown of rejoicing? Are not even ye in the presence of our Lord Jesus Christ at his coming?
The Crown of rejoicing will be our crown where ‘God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away’ Rev 21:4.
It is a crown for every saint; every saved person. Salvation is only by grace through faith.
There are people who will have more than one type of crowns in heaven. Which is/are your crowns?
You have what you need now to make your choice. Make a good choice.
God blesseBut you can not loose your salvation once you are bought by the blood of the Lamb>that is heresy.
The salvation in Christ is not temporary, it is eternal.
In John 10:28-30, Jesus says: “I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one can snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all; no one can snatch them out of my Father's hand. I and the Father are one." The forgiveness of God through Christ is sufficient to cover all of our sins -- past, present, and future. There is nothing a person can do that God cannot forgive. This doctrine is supported by Romans 8:38-39, Ephesians 4:30, and Jude 24; among others.
The idea of losing our salvation is not only unscriptural, but it creates monumental problems with other doctrines, including salvation by faith, the sin nature of man, and the purpose of Christ’s sacrifice.
The Bible teaches that man is inherently sinful -- that a sinful nature is a part of all of us (Romans 3:10). This means that even after being saved, every single believer is going to sin from time to time. Thinking that we can live a perfect, sinless life after our salvation is not only unscriptural, but arrogant (James 2:10). If we are not eternally secure, this sinning will cause us to lose our salvation, but how much sin is too much? There is no scriptural “yardstick” given to tell us how many or what kind of sins are enough to void our salvation. Without eternal security, the Bible would describe a situation where Christianity is a perpetual game of Russian Roulette; a life in which condemnation and salvation alternate every time we sin and confess, and we never know if we’re saved or not.
In John 10:28-30, Jesus says: “I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one can snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all; no one can snatch them out of my Father's hand. I and the Father are one." The forgiveness of God through Christ is sufficient to cover all of our sins -- past, present, and future. There is nothing a person can do that God cannot forgive. This doctrine is supported by Romans 8:38-39, Ephesians 4:30, and Jude 24; among others.
The idea of losing our salvation is not only unscriptural, but it creates monumental problems with other doctrines, including salvation by faith, the sin nature of man, and the purpose of Christ’s sacrifice.
The Bible teaches that man is inherently sinful -- that a sinful nature is a part of all of us (Romans 3:10). This means that even after being saved, every single believer is going to sin from time to time. Thinking that we can live a perfect, sinless life after our salvation is not only unscriptural, but arrogant (James 2:10). If we are not eternally secure, this sinning will cause us to lose our salvation, but how much sin is too much? There is no scriptural “yardstick” given to tell us how many or what kind of sins are enough to void our salvation. Without eternal security, the Bible would describe a situation where Christianity is a perpetual game of Russian Roulette; a life in which condemnation and salvation alternate every time we sin and confess, and we never know if we’re saved or not.
Most religions focus on the external actions, but Christ took the concept of sin and holiness to a much deeper level. For example, most religions are satisfied to condemn the physical act of adultery, but Christ said “Whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart” (Matthew 5:28).
Christ set the bar for holiness at a level all Christians are called to aspire to, but none can ever fully live up to, because of our sin nature. Just as the law of Moses was meant, in part, to demonstrate to Israel how impossible it was for mortal man to obtain the moral perfection of God, the standards of Christ also remind us of how shallow our best efforts at goodness really are. Thankfully, God has always provided a way for us to be forgiven for our shortcomings. Christ’s sacrifice on the cross served the same purpose for all mankind that the sacrificial lambs did for specific families before His ministry. Christ was a sinless, blameless substitute for our sins. The Bible clearly tells us what Christ’s moral expectations are for us. If we lost our salvation every time we fell short of those ideals, then none of us would be saved for more than a few minutes at a time. If that were true, what purpose was there in His death?
Also, according to the Bible, if we could lose our salvation, then it would be lost forever, because Christ only died once. Hebrews 6:4-6 is an often misunderstood passage, which strongly supports the doctrine of eternal security in two ways: it implies that Christ’s sacrifice must be sufficient for all sins, and states that if it were possible for a person to lose their salvation, it would be forever lost. According to this passage, if a person could do something that cost them their salvation (which they cannot), then it would be “impossible” for them to be re-redeemed.
Christ set the bar for holiness at a level all Christians are called to aspire to, but none can ever fully live up to, because of our sin nature. Just as the law of Moses was meant, in part, to demonstrate to Israel how impossible it was for mortal man to obtain the moral perfection of God, the standards of Christ also remind us of how shallow our best efforts at goodness really are. Thankfully, God has always provided a way for us to be forgiven for our shortcomings. Christ’s sacrifice on the cross served the same purpose for all mankind that the sacrificial lambs did for specific families before His ministry. Christ was a sinless, blameless substitute for our sins. The Bible clearly tells us what Christ’s moral expectations are for us. If we lost our salvation every time we fell short of those ideals, then none of us would be saved for more than a few minutes at a time. If that were true, what purpose was there in His death?
Also, according to the Bible, if we could lose our salvation, then it would be lost forever, because Christ only died once. Hebrews 6:4-6 is an often misunderstood passage, which strongly supports the doctrine of eternal security in two ways: it implies that Christ’s sacrifice must be sufficient for all sins, and states that if it were possible for a person to lose their salvation, it would be forever lost. According to this passage, if a person could do something that cost them their salvation (which they cannot), then it would be “impossible” for them to be re-redeemed.
Marcus O'Reillius
Active Member
Blessedhope: everything you say is true, but if you say you have Jesus in your heart and take the mark of the beast so as to save yourself - you will lose your life for all eternity.
Just remain steadfast in your faith in Jesus that you have now, and endure patiently should the Great Tribulation come to fruition in your lifetime, and be willing to lose your life for Christ and you will gain the Martyr's Crown as well.
Just remain steadfast in your faith in Jesus that you have now, and endure patiently should the Great Tribulation come to fruition in your lifetime, and be willing to lose your life for Christ and you will gain the Martyr's Crown as well.
Guaranteed salvation or eternal security or "once-saved-always-saved" (OSAS) is a 500 year old doctrine invented by John Calvin. There isn't a shred of evidence this teaching existed in Christianity before him. We can play scripture tennis and argue all day, but personally, I don't believe that many will lose their salvation anyway, so it doesn't have to be such a divisive issue. If you think that having Jesus in your heart is a license to dishonor your parents then I would voice my objections.
OSAS, as I understand it, is mostly a Baptist teaching, and yes, they do use it as a license to sin....mostly the sin of adultery, as in divorce and remarriage. I know a couple of them who have been married four or five different times...kepha31 said:
Oh, they know that God hates divorce...but since they are "saved", it doesn't matter how much they sin. After all, didn't Christ die for all their sins, past, present, and future?
At least, that's the way they see it...
Blessedhope: everything you say is true, but if you say you have Jesus in your heart and take the mark of the beast so as to save yourself - you will lose your life for all eternity.> O my, I take it you are bible prophecy good. but I see not so good!> Jacobs troubles is a whole other ball of WAX! The rapture happens , the church is gone and the age of grace is gone, but as I see it the mark will be more just a mark. I feel that this mark will change your DNA> Nephilim anyone?
I don't believe that many will lose their salvation anyway> I just luv this > so where is the yard stick to who is saved and who is not!! Just blows my mind how some people can be GOD!
Talk like that just makes me more into once saved ALLWAYS SAVED! Mans and womens thought who can be saved and not.
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