Israel has been attacking Gaza for decades

[Jack]

We need to understand this as an allegory (type/shadow) for the gospel being given to Israel. The promised land is the kingdom of God. Prophecies of Israel being gathered to the land was alluding to and looking ahead to when Israel would be gathered like a flock of sheep by and to her Shepherd, the Messiah and His gospel....already fulfilled when Jesus walked the earth....to all of Israel who were willing to receive it.

The OT prophecies foretelling Jersusalem's judgment were fulfilled as well, in 70 AD.

Israel is still walking and living in types/shadows....even now with respect to battling the Palestinians, the world and devil will only tolerate token efforts and battles but will not allow Israel to go all in and win the war and is trying to stop her from all-out victory......this is like churches I have experienced. Think we need to look at this on a personal level as well.

Should we believe you or God? Israel is home to stay in the Land of the Bible, Israel!

Amos 9:14-15
14 I will bring back the captives of My people Israel; They shall build the waste cities and inhabit them; They shall plant vineyards and drink wine from them; They shall also make gardens and eat fruit from them.
15 I will plant them in their land, And no longer shall they be pulled up From the land I have given them," Says the LORD your God.

 

[Lizbeth]

The Bible doesn't say the land is a free gift to Israel.

Deuteronomy outlines it as a conditional covenant. If Israel obeys God, then He will give them blessings, and if they don't, instead they get curses. They were expected to subdue the Canaanites... part of the blessings was God's help in doing so.

And that covenant is no longer. And unfortunately Israel rejected the new covenant and multiplied her sins leading to her demise as a nation and being ousted out of the land in 70AD sadly, and scattered to all parts of the globe, by God.

I wish Israel and Jewish people well wherever they are, and above all that they may be saved, but I think there might be something that can be deceptive to believers about her coming back to the physical land as a nation apart from the Messiah/Christ and the new covenant.

 

[Lizbeth]

Should we believe you or God? Israel is home to stay in the Land of the Bible, Israel!

Amos 9:14-15
14 I will bring back the captives of My people Israel; They shall build the waste cities and inhabit them; They shall plant vineyards and drink wine from them; They shall also make gardens and eat fruit from them.
15 I will plant them in their land, And no longer shall they be pulled up From the land I have given them," Says the LORD your God.

This was fulfilled in the natural sense regarding "Israel after the flesh" when the Jews returned from their captivity in Babylon.

From what I see, in the spiritual sense that prophecy, and others like it, are speaking to those who are Jews inwardly, and belong to the "Israel of God", and is fulfilled in the new covenant. Our promised land as believers (whether Jew or Gentile) is the kingdom of God......the gospel being the "gospel of the kingdom".

 

[Lizbeth]

Jack I think most Christians in the modern day have accepted that Christians are the new testament Israel. When Paul was brought to the Romans he taught them and they believed Jesus was the Messiah. Therefore the Kingdom was given to the Romans. That is recorded in the New Testament.

What does the bible say about the tree grafting. Jack you need to go back and study the New Testament so you can understand correctly what is going on and who the Scriptural Nation of Israel related to God is now. Read this: Romans 11:11-24 ESV;NKJV - Gentiles Grafted In - So I ask, did - Bible Gateway

Gentiles Grafted In​

11 So I ask, did they stumble in order that they might fall? By no means! Rather, through their trespass salvation has come to the Gentiles, so as to make Israel jealous. 12 Now if their trespass means riches for the world, and if their failure means riches for the Gentiles, how much more will their full inclusion mean!


13 Now I am speaking to you Gentiles. Inasmuch then as I am an apostle to the Gentiles, I magnify my ministry 14 in order somehow to make my fellow Jews jealous, and thus save some of them. 15 For if their rejection means the reconciliation of the world, what will their acceptance mean but life from the dead? 16 If the dough offered as firstfruits is holy, so is the whole lump, and if the root is holy, so are the branches.


17 But if some of the branches were broken off, and you, although a wild olive shoot, were grafted in among the others and now share in the nourishing root of the olive tree, 18 do not be arrogant toward the branches. If you are, remember it is not you who support the root, but the root that supports you. 19 Then you will say, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.” 20 That is true. They were broken off because of their unbelief, but you stand fast through faith. So do not become proud, but fear. 21 For if God did not spare the natural branches, neither will he spare you. 22 Note then the kindness and the severity of God: severity toward those who have fallen, but God's kindness to you, provided you continue in his kindness. Otherwise you too will be cut off. 23 And even they, if they do not continue in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God has the power to graft them in again. 24 For if you were cut from what is by nature a wild olive tree, and grafted, contrary to nature, into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these, the natural branches, be grafted back into their own olive tree.

Israel’s Rejection Not Final​

11 I say then, have they stumbled that they should fall? Certainly not! But through their fall, to provoke them to jealousy, salvation has come to the Gentiles. 12 Now if their fall is riches for the world, and their failure riches for the Gentiles, how much more their fullness!


13 For I speak to you Gentiles; inasmuch as I am an apostle to the Gentiles, I magnify my ministry, 14 if by any means I may provoke to jealousy those who are my flesh and save some of them. 15 For if their being cast away is the reconciling of the world, what will their acceptance be but life from the dead?


16 For if the firstfruit is holy, the lump is also holy; and if the root is holy, so are the branches. 17 And if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive tree, were grafted in among them, and with them became a partaker of the root and [c]fatness of the olive tree, 18 do not boast against the branches. But if you do boast, remember that you do not support the root, but the root supports you.


19 You will say then, “Branches were broken off that I might be grafted in.” 20 Well said. Because of unbelief they were broken off, and you stand by faith. Do not be haughty, but fear. 21 For if God did not spare the natural branches, He may not spare you either. 22 Therefore consider the goodness and severity of God: on those who fell, severity; but toward you, goodness, if you continue in His goodness. Otherwise you also will be cut off. 23 And they also, if they do not continue in unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again. 24 For if you were cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and were grafted contrary to nature into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these, who are natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree?

I think specifically we could say the new covenant was taken from "Israel after the flesh" and given to the "nation" called "the Israel of God".....which began in Israel with Jewish believers and spread to include believers from the Gentile nations as well. Salvation is of the Jews.

Israel "conquering" the Gentile heathen nations around her is a type/shadow of the gospel going from Israel to the nations. Conquering in the spiritual sense.

 

[Lizbeth]

Israel is back to stay! Praise Jesus, the God of Israel!

Amos 9
14 I will bring back the captives of My people Israel; They shall build the waste cities and inhabit them; They shall plant vineyards and drink wine from them; They shall also make gardens and eat fruit from them.
15 I will plant them in their land, And no longer shall they be pulled up From the land I have given them," Says the LORD your God.

Amen Jesus, God of Israel!

Isn't He also God of the nations of the whole world too....?

 

[Lizbeth]

Yes I deny Christian Zionism that you promote, the Church is the Israel of God, children of the promised seed

(Israel/Jews) are no more God's people than Mexicans, Chinese, Americans, Indians, Africans, you name it

Jesus Is The Lord

Bible says God raises and lowers kings and kingdoms of this world as He sees fit, and such worldly concerns are not really our business as the church. It's a snare to get caught up in such things......soldiers serving their commanding officer wanting to please Him are not to get caught up in civil affairs.

But I think the Jews/Israel occupy a bit of a unique position....Paul said they are loved on account of the patriarchs. and that means something. Still sons in a sense, but prodigal sons. I think of them like I do my natural unsaved family members...happy for them when they do well, disappointed for them when they do wrong......and desiring their salvation above all.......and overall still love them no matter what.

 

[Lizbeth]

That choice is beyond my pay grade, but God did speak about it.

25 And thou, profane wicked prince of Israel, whose day is come, when iniquity shall have an end,

27 I will overturn, overturn, overturn, it: and it shall be no more, until he come whose right it is; and I will give it him.

29 Whiles they see vanity unto thee, whiles they divine a lie unto thee, to bring thee upon the necks of them that are slain, of the wicked, whose day is come, when their iniquity shall have an end.

30 Shall I cause it to return into his sheath? I will judge thee in the place where thou wast created, in the land of thy nativity.

31 And I will pour out mine indignation upon thee, I will blow against thee in the fire of my wrath, and deliver thee into the hand of brutish men, and skilful to destroy.

32 Thou shalt be for fuel to the fire; thy blood shall be in the midst of the land; thou shalt be no more remembered: for I the LORD have spoken it.
-

God judges and punishes who He will, when He will. What do you think is happening now with the Palestinians sadly? He punished Israel on Oct. 7 for idolatry and sin and now He is punishing those who punished her. That too is in the OT bible. I'm sad for the Palestinians too though...they are being oppressed by Hamas.....and being deceived, and it all results in them shooting themselves in the foot. As the bible says there is none righteous, no not one. Neither side is righteous, and both need to receive the forgiveness and cleansing from sin that comes only through God's Son.

Whether Israel has a right to be there or not is a moot point....we might as well ask if white North Americans have a right to be here. We're here and that's that until God deems otherwise. Same with Israel......it would be better for all concerned to accept it and try to get on with building a life for themselves instead of wasting and destroying their own lives with hatred, bitterness and living in the past and trying to turn back the clock and tide of history that has occurred under the sovereignty of God.

 

[Lizbeth]

Israel’s true history

Palestinian territory – encompassing the Gaza Strip and West Bank, including East Jerusalem – has been illegally occupied by Israel since 1967. Since then, the Israeli government has established a two-tiered legal and political system that provides comprehensive rights for Jewish Israeli settlers while imposing military rule and control on Palestinians without any basic protections or rights under international law. The Israeli government has also engaged in a regular practice of inhumane acts, as well as extrajudicial killings, torture, denial of fundamental human rights, arbitrary detention and collective punishment. The UN

According to a March 2022 report by the UN Special Rapporteur on the situation of human rights in the OPT, Israel’s political system of entrenched rule in the OPT satisfies the prevailing evidentiary standard for the crime of apartheid. The Special Rapporteur determined in July 2021 that Israel’s occupation since 1967 has been characterized by settlement expansion that aims to permanently alter the ethnic demographics of East Jerusalem and amounts to a war crime. The UN Security Council (UNSC) previously adopted a resolution in December 2016 reaffirming that Israeli settlements in the OPT violate international law. The CoI reached similar conclusions in September 2022, reporting that the Israeli government’s policies and actions have led to the permanent occupation and de facto annexation of Palestinian territory, likely constituting crimes under international law, including war crimes. Both the CoI and Special Rapporteur have reported that this ongoing coercive environment has prevented Palestinians from fulfilling their right to self-determination and other fundamental human rights. In December 2022 the UN General Assembly requested the International Court of Justice to give an advisory opinion on the legal consequences of Israel’s ongoing occupation.

Palestinians are regularly subjected to violence by Israeli settlers, including physical attacks, shooting with live ammunition, torching of fields and livestock, theft and vandalization of property. Israeli security forces also perpetrate widespread attacks against Palestinians, particularly in occupied territory, which often lead to deadly escalations, including regular aerial bombardments of the Gaza Strip. According to the UN Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs (OCHA) and the Office of the High Commissioner for Human Rights (OHCHR), 2022 was the deadliest year for Palestinians residing in the Occupied West Bank, including East Jerusalem, since 2005, with over 150 Palestinians, including 26 children, killed by Israeli security forces.

Meanwhile, Israel’s air, sea and land blockade of Gaza has been in place since 2007

The CoI concluded that the Israeli government has restricted civic space through a strategy of delegitimizing and silencing civil society, which is linked to its goal of maintaining permanent occupation at the expense of the rights of the Palestinian people.
Israel and the Occupied Palestinian Territory - Global Centre for the Responsibility to Protect

The Truth Will Set You Free
-​

Stop hating and being resentful of Israel and all this horrific strife will stop. Israel isn't bent on conquest for the sake of conquest....they just want to be at peace and live but are being forced to go to war and defend themselves. So let her be at peace, and the Palestinians will bless themselves in the process.

 

[MA2444]

And that covenant is no longer. And unfortunately Israel rejected the new covenant and multiplied her sins leading to her demise as a nation and being ousted out of the land in 70AD sadly, and scattered to all parts of the globe, by God.

I wish Israel and Jewish people well wherever they are, and above all that they may be saved, but I think there might be something that can be deceptive to believers about her coming back to the physical land as a nation apart from the Messiah/Christ and the new covenant.

Sister, you seem to be mistaken how covenants work. A covenant is a contract. A contract can either be BiPartisan or Partisan. A bipartisan covenant (or agreement/contract) is where both sides of the covenant have duties to fulfill their part of the contract. A Partisan agreement is when only one party has any responsibility.

Now an addendum to a contract is a point which is introduced to the original contract and modifies the agreement in some way. It does not cancel the contract or any portion of it beyond what is spelled out in the addendum.

It's the same way with the Lord God. All throughout the OT, the deal was clear. ..."If" my people will turn from their wicked ways etc., I will heal their land. So if we dont turn from our wicked ways all promises are null and void within the contract.

We are very much still under the old covenant. If the original covenant is "no more" like you say, then what's that mean? That we dont have to obey the 10 commandments any more?! That is not so, Sister.

There was major changes to the original covenant because of Jesus and His work on the cross. It practically changed the whole game! But not completely. The old covenant did not go away.

 

[MA2444]

I think specifically we could say the new covenant was taken from "Israel after the flesh" and given to the "nation" called "the Israel of God".....which began in Israel with Jewish believers and spread to include believers from the Gentile nations as well. Salvation is of the Jews.

Israel "conquering" the Gentile heathen nations around her is a type/shadow of the gospel going from Israel to the nations. Conquering in the spiritual sense.

Israel was not ready for Jesus to come so did not recognize Him. And back in Daniel 9 God put 70 weeks upon Israel that they then owed God for their transgression of not knowing the day that He would come. One week of the 70 weeks is the tribulation (Great Trib). Israels 69 weeks that they owed God, were fulfilled and finished on...(wait for it)...

May 14 1948. The very day that Israel became a nation again.

That's types & shadows of a warning to us Gentiles. We etter be looking for the rapture, for Jesus to come and take His Bride. We cant know the day but we know the season and are instructed to know the seasons and be always ready and watching for Him...

 

[Lizbeth]

Sister, you seem to be mistaken how covenants work. A covenant is a contract. A contract can either be BiPartisan or Partisan. A bipartisan covenant (or agreement/contract) is where both sides of the covenant have duties to fulfill their part of the contract. A Partisan agreement is when only one party has any responsibility.

Now an addendum to a contract is a point which is introduced to the original contract and modifies the agreement in some way. It does not cancel the contract or any portion of it beyond what is spelled out in the addendum.

It's the same way with the Lord God. All throughout the OT, the deal was clear. ..."If" my people will turn from their wicked ways etc., I will heal their land. So if we dont turn from our wicked ways all promises are null and void within the contract.

We are very much still under the old covenant. If the original covenant is "no more" like you say, then what's that mean? That we dont have to obey the 10 commandments any more?! That is not so, Sister.

There was major changes to the original covenant because of Jesus and His work on the cross. It practically changed the whole game! But not completely. The old covenant did not go away.

As the apostle wrote, the ordinances were nailed to the cross....they are no longer in effect. What was old and obsolete was fading away at the time of those NT writings....a transitional time.....Israel's valley of decision......then in 70 AD the old covenant was over and done with. However that doesnt' mean God's moral/ethical laws were made null and void...no indeed..... however we do serve in the new way of the spirit now, not in the old way of the letter. But this doesn't mean we can't learn from the written Law and ordinances of temple worship etc.....since they all speak to the Jew and Gentile church ("Israel of God") in types/shadows very much worth being instructed by....as we are told to compare spiritual with spiritual.

 

[Lizbeth]

Israel was not ready for Jesus to come so did not recognize Him. And back in Daniel 9 God put 70 weeks upon Israel that they then owed God for their transgression of not knowing the day that He would come. One week of the 70 weeks is the tribulation (Great Trib). Israels 69 weeks that they owed God, were fulfilled and finished on...(wait for it)...

May 14 1948. The very day that Israel became a nation again.

That's types & shadows of a warning to us Gentiles. We etter be looking for the rapture, for Jesus to come and take His Bride. We cant know the day but we know the season and are instructed to know the seasons and be always ready and watching for Him...

I've forgotten all the math from Daniel...but to my understanding it all added up to when Jesus came in the first century....? Already fulfilled.

But I think we need to consider whether there is a way in which "what has been will be again".....it was all to the Jew FIRST, but THEN to the Gentile....the gospel, but also "tribulation and anguish upon every soul that does evil, to the Jew first then the Gentile". So yes, I agree the church need to take warning from Israel's example and be ready for the second coming of Christ!

 

[Wick Stick]

And [Moses] covenant is no longer. And unfortunately Israel rejected the new covenant and multiplied her sins leading to her demise as a nation and being ousted out of the land in 70AD sadly, and scattered to all parts of the globe, by God.

I wish Israel and Jewish people well wherever they are, and above all that they may be saved, but I think there might be something that can be deceptive to believers about her coming back to the physical land as a nation apart from the Messiah/Christ and the new covenant.

Right - the Levitical covenant no longer applies.

But what about Abraham's covenant? Abraham was also promised this land, albeit with different terms and conditions.

 

[Jack]

Isn't He also God of the nations of the whole world too....?

Israel is SPECIAL to God.

Luke 1:68
68 "Blessed is the Lord God of Israel, For He has visited and redeemed His people,

 

[Lizbeth]

Israel is SPECIAL to God.

Luke 1:68
68 "Blessed is the Lord God of Israel, For He has visited and redeemed His people,

Yes He has, and the Jewish and Gentile church is Israel...the Israel of God. He is a Jew who is one inwardly. Now we know no man according to the flesh. In the kingdom of heaven there is neither Jew nor Gentile, male nor female.

However, the Jews/Israel are loved on account of their faithful forbears....the faithful patriarchs. But we better not go beyond what is written and start to idolize them, as many in the Jewish roots movement have been doing. Unbelieving Jews are lost souls and tend to do as lost souls tend to do. We mustn't lose sight of the fact that they need the gospel every bit as much as we all once did....without it they will perish and not be heirs to eternal life.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Right - the Levitical covenant no longer applies.

But what about Abraham's covenant? Abraham was also promised this land, albeit with different terms and conditions.

Amen

The abrahamic covenant is eternal and still stands..

 

[Lizbeth]

Right - the Levitical covenant no longer applies.

But what about Abraham's covenant? Abraham was also promised this land, albeit with different terms and conditions.

Sorry, I meant to come back to this. What covenant are you talking about specifically....do you mean the circumcision?

Rom 2:25-29

For circumcision verily profiteth, if thou keep the law: but if thou be a breaker of the law, thy circumcision is made uncircumcision.

Therefore if the uncircumcision keep the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumcision?

And shall not uncircumcision which is by nature, if it fulfil the law, judge thee, who by the letter and circumcision dost transgress the law?

For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:

But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

Romans 3:1

What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?

Romans 3:30

Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith.


Rom 4:9-12

Cometh this blessedness then upon the circumcision only, or upon the uncircumcision also? for we say that faith was reckoned to Abraham for righteousness.

How was it then reckoned? when he was in circumcision, or in uncircumcision? Not in circumcision, but in uncircumcision.

And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had yet being uncircumcised: that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be not circumcised; that righteousness might be imputed unto them also:

And the father of circumcision to them who are not of the circumcision only, but who also walk in the steps of that faith of our father Abraham, which he had being yet uncircumcised.


Or do you mean God's promises concerning the promised land?

The bible says Abraham sojourned as a stranger and pilgrim on earth and he wasn't seeking an earthly city but one whose foundations are in God.

Nevertheless He did give the land of the Canaanites to Abraham's seed........but unfortunately they forfeited it more than once.

According to 2 Peter 3.........the whole earth is going to burn up at the coming of Christ, so what will having land profit anyone then? (And all indications are that He is coming soon.) And what did it profit all those unbelieving Jews who have sadly been perishing without Christ/Messiah for millennia? What does all that say about where our focus as the church needs to be? Did Jesus delegate earthly concerns to us or did He give us another mandate?...to go and preach the gospel making disciples...

You know when Jesus walked the earth Israel was under Roman oppression and rule......there is not one single verse about Him taking up that cause or being worried about it. On the contrary, when the Jews took Him and tried to make Him an earthly King of Israel (with all that implies).......He fled them!

 

[Lizbeth]

Amen

The abrahamic covenant is eternal and still stands..

Brother, let's think a minute....is it really possible for any earthly covenant to be eternal, since this earth is temporal and waxing old and like a garment God will change it...? Those earlier covenants were prophetic types/shadows/allegories of the new covenant which is the only truly eternal covenant. He was speaking partly on an earthly level as concerns Abrahams physical descendants and also alluding to an eternal covenant at the same time...the gospel of the new covenant. Jesus being Abraham's seed...who would inherit an eternal kingdom, not an earthly one.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Sorry, I meant to come back to this. What covenant are you talking about specifically....do you mean the circumcision?

Rom 2:25-29

For circumcision verily profiteth, if thou keep the law: but if thou be a breaker of the law, thy circumcision is made uncircumcision.

Therefore if the uncircumcision keep the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumcision?

And shall not uncircumcision which is by nature, if it fulfil the law, judge thee, who by the letter and circumcision dost transgress the law?

For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:

But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

Romans 3:1

What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?

Romans 3:30

Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith.


Rom 4:9-12

Cometh this blessedness then upon the circumcision only, or upon the uncircumcision also? for we say that faith was reckoned to Abraham for righteousness.

How was it then reckoned? when he was in circumcision, or in uncircumcision? Not in circumcision, but in uncircumcision.

And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had yet being uncircumcised: that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be not circumcised; that righteousness might be imputed unto them also:

And the father of circumcision to them who are not of the circumcision only, but who also walk in the steps of that faith of our father Abraham, which he had being yet uncircumcised.


Or do you mean God's promises concerning the promised land?

The bible says Abraham sojourned as a stranger and pilgrim on earth and he wasn't seeking an earthly city but one whose foundations are in God.

Nevertheless He did give the land of the Canaanites to Abraham's seed........but unfortunately they forfeited it more than once.

According to 2 Peter 3.........the whole earth is going to burn up at the coming of Christ, so what will having land profit anyone then? (And all indications are that He is coming soon.) And what did it profit all those unbelieving Jews who have sadly been perishing without Christ/Messiah for millennia? What does all that say about where our focus as the church needs to be? Did Jesus delegate earthly concerns to us or did He give us another mandate?...to go and preach the gospel making disciples...

You know when Jesus walked the earth Israel was under Roman oppression and rule......there is not one single verse about Him taking up that cause or being worried about it. On the contrary, when the Jews took Him and tried to make Him an earthly King of Israel (with all that implies).......He fled them!

Hope this helps.

Gen 12:
12 Now the Lord had said to Abram:

“Get out of your country,
From your family
And from your father’s house,
To a land that I will show you.
2 I will make you a great nation;
I will bless you
And make your name great;
And you shall be a blessing.
3 I will bless those who bless you,
And I will curse him who curses you;
And in you all the families of the earth shall be blessed.”

Gen 15:
6 And he believed in the Lord, and He accounted it to him for righteousness.
7 Then He said to him, “I am the Lord, who brought you out of Ur of the Chaldeans, to give you this land to inherit it.”
8 And he said, “Lord God, how shall I know that I will inherit it?”


9 So He said to him, “Bring Me a three-year-old heifer, a three-year-old female goat, a three-year-old ram, a turtledove, and a young pigeon.” 10 Then he brought all these to Him and cut them in two, down the middle, and placed each piece opposite the other; but he did not cut the birds in two. 11 And when the vultures came down on the carcasses, Abram drove them away.


12 Now when the sun was going down, a deep sleep fell upon Abram; and behold, horror and great darkness fell upon him. 13 Then He said to Abram: “Know certainly that your descendants will be strangers in a land that is not theirs, and will serve them, and they will afflict them four hundred years. 14 And also the nation whom they serve I will judge; afterward they shall come out with great possessions. 15 Now as for you, you shall [d]go to your fathers in peace; you shall be buried at a good old age. 16 But in the fourth generation they shall return here, for the iniquity of the Amorites is not yet complete.”


17 And it came to pass, when the sun went down and it was dark, that behold, there appeared a smoking oven and a burning torch that passed between those pieces. 18 On the same day the Lord made a covenant with Abram, saying:

“To your descendants I have given this land, from the river of Egypt to the great river, the River Euphrates— 19 the Kenites, the Kenezzites, the Kadmonites, 20 the Hittites, the Perizzites, the Rephaim, 21 the Amorites, the Canaanites, the Girgashites, and the Jebusites.”

Gen 17: 2 And I will make My covenant between Me and you, and will multiply you exceedingly.” 3 Then Abram fell on his face, and God talked with him, saying: 4 “As for Me, behold, My covenant is with you, and you shall be a father of many nations. 5 No longer shall your name be called Abram, but your name shall be Abraham; for I have made you a father of many nations. 6 I will make you exceedingly fruitful; and I will make nations of you, and kings shall come from you. 7 And I will establish My covenant between Me and you and your descendants after you in their generations, for an everlasting covenant, to be God to you and your descendants after you. 8 Also I give to you and your descendants after you the land in[f] which you are a stranger, all the land of Canaan, as an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.”

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Brother, let's think a minute....is it really possible for any earthly covenant to be eternal,

When God says he gives you something forever. I tend to take him seriously.

since this earth is temporal and waxing old and like a garment God will change it...? Those earlier covenants were prophetic types/shadows/allegories of the new covenant which is the only truly eternal covenant. He was speaking partly on an earthly level as concerns Abrahams physical descendants and also alluding to an eternal covenant at the same time...the gospel of the new covenant. Jesus being Abraham's seed...who would inherit an eternal kingdom, not an earthly one.

The abrahamic covenant was not a shadow. God Gave abraham and his descendants through Isaac and Jacob a gift. And said this gift was eternal.

It was unlike the mosaic covenant, which was a shadow. and a dual covenant. This was an I will covenant, even the way he gave is in Gen 15 shows it was bound on God himself..