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Jesus as co-Creator

Discussion in 'Bible Study Forum' started by Mighty Bear, Dec 8, 2007.

  1. EzrahEl21

    EzrahEl21 New Member

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    (DrBubbaLove;35764)
    Yes, we have to have Three Persons and One Nature in order to have a Trinity and One God. The question and understanding goes to what a nature and a person means.How it is possible or can we fully comprehend God in this life, we deny knowing. So no matter what one believes, in some sense God remains in many ways a mystery to us, something that we cannot "see" or "know" FULLY in this life.Having said that, there are things that He has revealed to us. Many Christians hold that the orthodox Trinity doctrine is one of these things. Now to your point about that doctrine.It is true the Father is both unbegotten and First. However, in what sense can we say He is "first" in time? The teaching is that Jesus is the Word of the Father. So is it possible to imagine the Father existing at any "time" without His Word? Is the Father speechless before begetting Jesus? Jesus is "Begotten not Made" means something. But what? Ok, Jesus is uncreated by the Father. So how did Jesus come to be? The tradition and orthodox answer is that both the Father and Jesus are and have always existed. You cannot have Father without His Word.Another way to look at it, is that we all have an idea in our minds of who we are. That idea may not agree with what others think of us and it may be an imperfect idea, but none the less, we have a picture in our mind of who we are. We can do that because we are rational beings, created that way. While science tells us we are not born with this image of ourselves, it is something that developes as we mature. And in the sense that we can picture it, the image of ourself is real, but of course we cannot touch it and it is not something that exists as it's own person. It is just my image of me. Like looking at myself in a mirror, it is my reflection, not another person.Now God the Father, Creator of All things is certainly a rational Being, no one would argue that. So like us, He too would have an Image of Himself that He could conceive, reflecting on Himself. But what kind of Image would that be? God the Father is Perfect in all ways. That is the meaning of fully Divine. So that Image would have to be Perfect, a Perfect Reflection of Himself. (God from God, True God from True God, Light from Light.) In fact a such Perfect and fully complete Image of God the Father, that Image would BE, would EXIST, which means that Reflection is a Person and is God. And as God the Father is never changing, is uncreated, has always "been"; the realization is then that such an Image of Himself must have also always never changed, is begotten from the Father's mind/Will and has always "been"/existed.So in this view of the Trinity, in saying that the Father is First, it is only True in the sense that in order for the Son to be, there has to be a Father. The Son "proceeds" from the Father. The Son is the Perfect EXPRESSION of the Mind of the Father, another way of saying His Word! It cannot really be said to be true in any sense we have of time. Just as we can say the Love of Father for His Image, Himself, His Son and the Son for His Father is so Real, we have the Holy Spirit; who is also never changing and always existing.
    Questions If I May Ok ? Then Maybe We Can Stay On The Subject . In Genesis 1; 26 , In Who Image And Likeness Was God Created ? :study:
     
  2. DrBubbaLove

    DrBubbaLove New Member

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    (EzrahEl21;35768)
    Questions If I May Ok ? Then Maybe We Can Stay On The Subject . In Genesis 1; 26 , In Who Image And Likeness Was God Created ? :study:
    Sure, it is the same Image. But unlike the Image we suggested in the orthodox Trinity view, which proceeds from the Father's mind of Himself and as such is a Perfect Likeness; man is understood by this verse to be created in some sense in that same Image. So while a "reflection" of the same Image there is nothing in the creation story to suggest man is a perfect reflection of that Image. And only Satan and perhaps the Mormons suggest that we can be. For that matter, and we would go off topic, how we are made in His Image is not explicit in the story either, just that we are. Whatever we understand that to mean, we would probably all agree the story makes that fact a distinction between us and other created animals.
     
  3. EzrahEl21

    EzrahEl21 New Member

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    (DrBubbaLove;35770)
    Sure, it is the same Image. But unlike the Image we suggested in the orthodox Trinity view, which proceeds from the Father's mind of Himself and as such is a Perfect Likeness; man is understood by this verse to be created in some sense in that same Image. So while a "reflection" of the same Image there is nothing in the creation story to suggest man is a perfect reflection of that Image. And only Satan and perhaps the Mormons suggest that we can be. For that matter, and we would go off topic, how we are made in His Image is not explicit in the story either, just that we are. Whatever we understand that to mean, we would probably all agree the story makes that fact a distinction between us and other created animals.
    Would You Like To Try Again Answering The Question , Please ?
     
  4. Christina

    Christina New Member

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    God and the Angels are the us the sons of God are the AngelsGenesis 1:26 "And God said, "Let Us make man in Our image, after Our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth."God set out to make man exactly the way he is. Man was then created to look like the exact image of God, and his sons; the angels. If you ever wondered what an angel form looks like? Then look into a mirror, for we are created in their image.And I dont agree that God is three persons with one will this better said he is three parts of one person a Holy version of us but because he is God he can exist fully in all these parts simultaneously, that is he can be fully Father, Son, and Holy ghost at the same time.The same way we can be body, mind and spirit but we can not seperate these parts of us and survive he can
     
  5. DrBubbaLove

    DrBubbaLove New Member

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    (EzrahEl21;35773)
    Would You Like To Try Again Answering The Question , Please ?
    Sorry I misunderstood. You mentioned Gen 1:26 which refers to the creation of man, so I assumed you were asking in whose Image was man made and perhaps why or how that was different than the Perfect Image in Son of the Father. Sorry about that.God the Father is not made, created or begotten. He was, is and shall be forever more. He "is",meaning that His Nature and the existence of His Person are insepparable, and the orthodox would say the fuller meaning behind "I am that I am".
     
  6. Christina

    Christina New Member

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    Elohim occurs 2.700 times. Its first occurrence connects it with creation, and give it its essential meaning as the Creator. It indicates His relation to mankind as His creatures (see note on 2 Chron. 18:31, where it stands in contrast with Jehovah as indicating covenant relationship). 'Elohim is God the Son, the living "WORD" with creature form to create (John 1:1. Col. 1:15-17. Rev. 3:14); and later, with human form to redeem (John 1:14). "Begotten of His Father before all worlds; born of His mother, in the world." In this creature form He appeared to the Patriarchs, a form not temporarily assumed. 'Elohim is indicated (as in A.V.) by ordinary small type, "God". See table on page 7. Jehovah. While Elohim is God as the Creator of all things, Jehovah is the same God in covenant relation to those whom He has created (Cp. 2Chron. 18:31). Jehovah means the Eternal, the Immutable One, He Who WAS, and IS, and IS TO COME. The Divine definition is given in Gen. 21:33. He is especially, therefore, the God of Israel; and the God of those who are redeemed, and are thus now "in Christ". We can say "My God," but not "My Jehovah", for Jehovah is "MY God." Jehovah is indicated (as in A.V.) by small capital letters, "LORD"' and by "GOD" when it occurs in combination with Adonai, in which case LORD GOD = Adonai Jehovah. The name Jehovah is combined with ten other words, which form what are known as "the Jehovah Titles." in the Hebrew Canon (Ap. 1). All are noted in the margin, in all their occurrences:-- JEHOVAH-JIREH = Jehovah will see, or provide. Gen. 22:14. JEHOVAH-ROPHEKA = Jehovah that healeth thee. Ex. 15:26. JEHOVAH-NISSI = Jehovah my banner. Ex. 17:15. JEHOVAH-MeKADDISHKEM = Jehovah that doth sanctify you. Ex. 31:13. Lev. 20:8; 21:8; 22:32. Ezek. 20:12. JEHOVAH-SHALOM = Jehovah [send] peace. Judg. 6:24. JEHOVAH-ZeBA'OTH = Jehovah of hosts. 1Sam. 1:3, and frequently. JEHOVAH-ZIDKENU = Jehovah our righteousness. Jer. 23:6; 33:16. JEHOVAH-SHAMMAH = Jehovah is there. Ezek. 48:35. JEHOVAH-ELYON = Jehovah most high. Ps. 7:17; 47:2; 97:9. JEHOVAH-RO'I = Jehovah my Shepherd. Ps. 23:1. We have seven of these, experimentally referred to, in Ps. 23, inasmuch as Jehovah, the "Good," "Great," and "Chief Shepherd," is engaged, in all the perfection of His attributes, on behalf of His sheep:-- In verse 1, we have No. 1 above. In verse 2, we have No. 5. In verse 3, we have Nos. 2 and 7. In verse 4, we have No. 8. In verse 5, we have Nos. 3 and 4. Jah is Jehovah in a special sense and relation. Jehovah as having BECOME our Salvation (first occ. Ex. 15:2), He Who IS, and WAS, and IS TO COME. It occurs 49 times (7 x 7. See Ap. 10). Compare Psalm 68. 4, 18. EL is essentially the Almighty, thought the word is never so rendered (see below, "Shaddai"). EL is Elohim in all His strength and power. It is rendered "God" as Elohim is, but El is God the Omnipotent. Elohim is God the Creator putting His omnipotence into operation. Eloah (see below) is God Who wills and orders all, and Who is to be the one object of the worship of His people. El is the God Who knows all (first occ. Gen. 14:18:22) and sees all (Gen. 16:13) and that performeth all things for His people (Ps. 57:2); and in Whom all the Divine attributes are concentrated. El is indicated in this edition by type in large capital letters, thus: "GOD." It is sometimes transliterated in proper names Immanue-'el, Beth-'el, &c., where it is translated, as explained in the margin. Eloah is Elohim, Who is to be worshipped. Eloah is God in connection with His Will rather than His power. The first occurrence associates this name with worship (Deut. 32:15, 17). Hence it is the title used whenever the contrast (latent or expressed) is with false gods or idols. Eloah is essentially "the living God" in contrast to inanimate idols. Eloah is rendered "God", but we have indicated it by type thus: GOD. Elyon first occurs in Gen. 14:18 with El, and is rendered "the most high (God)". It is El and Elohim, not as the powerful Creator, but as "the possessor of heaven and earth." Hence the name is associated with Christ as the Son of "the Highest" (Luke 1:35). It is Elyon, as possessor of the earth, Who divides the nations "their inheritance". In Ps. 83:18, He is "over all the earth". The title occurs 36 times (6 x 6 or 62 See Ap. 10). Elyon is the Dispenser of God's blessings in the earth; the blessings proceeding from a Priest Who is a King upon His throne (cp. Gen. 14:18-22 with Zech. 6:13; 14:9). Shaddai is in every instance translated "Almighty", and is indicated by small capital letters ("ALMIGHTY"). It is God (El), not as the source of strength, but of grace; not as Creator, but as the Giver. Shaddai is the All-bountiful. This title does not refer to His creative power, but to His power to supply all the needs of His people. Its first occurrence is in Gen. 17:1, and is used to show Abraham that He Who called him out to walk alone before Him could supply all his need. Even so it is the title used in 2Cor. 6:18, where we are cal 1000 led to "come out" in separation from the world. It is always used in connection with El (see above). Adon is one of the three titles (ADON, ADONAI, and ADONIM), all generally rendered "Lord"; but each has its own peculiar usage and association. They all denote headship in various aspects. They have to do with God as "over-lord." Adon is the Lord as Ruler in the earth. We have indicated this in type by printing the preceding article or pronouns in small capitals, not because either are to be emphasized, but to distinguish the word "Lord" from Adonai, which is always so printed in the A.V. Adonai is the Lord in His relation to the earth; and as carrying out His purposes of blessing in the earth. With this limitation it is almost equivalent to Jehovah. Indeed, it was from an early date so used, by associating the vowel points of the word Jehovah with Adon, thus converting Adon into Adonai. A list of 134 passages where this was deliberately done is preserved and given in the Massorah (107-115). (See Ap. 32) We have indicated these by printing the word like Jehovah, putting an asterisk, thus: LORD*. Adonim is the plural of Adon, never used of man. Adonim carries with it all that Adon does, but in a greater and higher degree; and more especially as owner and proprietor. An Adon may rule others who do not belong to him. Hence (without the article) it is often used of men. But Adonim is the Lord Who rules His own. We have indicated it by type, thus: LORD. The three may be thus briefly distinguished:-- Adon is the Lord as overlord or ruler. Adonim is the Lord as owner. Adonai is the Lord as blesser. The Types used to indicate the above titles, in the text, are as follows:-- God = Elohim. GOD = Jehovah (in combination with Adonai, "Lord"). GOD* = Jehovah in the Primitive Texts, altered by Sopherim to Elohim as the Printed Text. (See Ap. 32.) GOD = El. GOD = Eloah. LORD = Jehovah. THE LORD = Jah. LORD* = Jehovah in the Primitive Texts, altered by Sopherim to Adonai as in the Printed Text. (See Ap. 32.) Lord = Adonai. LORD = Adonim. ALMIGHTY = Shaddai. MOST HIGH = Elyon. The Combinations are indicated as follows:-- Adonai Jehovah = Lord GOD. Jehovah Elohim = LORD God. Elyon El = MOST HIGH GOD. El Shaddai = GOD ALMIGHTY.
     
  7. EzrahEl21

    EzrahEl21 New Member

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    (kriss;35775)
    God and the Angels are the us the sons of God are the AngelsGenesis 1:26 "And God said, "Let Us make man in Our image, after Our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth."God set out to make man exactly the way he is. Man was then created to look like the exact image of God, and his sons; the angels. If you ever wondered what an angel form looks like? Then look into a mirror, for we are created in their image.And I dont agree that God is three persons with one will this better said he is three parts of one person a Holy version of us but because he is God he can exist fully in all these parts simultaneously, that is he can be fully Father, Son, and Holy ghost at the same time.The same way we can be body, mind and spirit but we can not seperate these parts of us and survive he can
    With All Do Respect There One Thing God Can Not Do , And That Is Become Less Then Himself And Still Be God ... Sorry .
     
  8. EzrahEl21

    EzrahEl21 New Member

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    (kriss;35778)
    Elohim occurs 2.700 times. Its first occurrence connects it with creation, and give it its essential meaning as the Creator. It indicates His relation to mankind as His creatures (see note on 2 Chron. 18:31, where it stands in contrast with Jehovah as indicating covenant relationship). 'Elohim is God the Son, the living "WORD" with creature form to create (John 1:1. Col. 1:15-17. Rev. 3:14); and later, with human form to redeem (John 1:14). "Begotten of His Father before all worlds; born of His mother, in the world." In this creature form He appeared to the Patriarchs, a form not temporarily assumed. 'Elohim is indicated (as in A.V.) by ordinary small type, "God". See table on page 7. Jehovah. While Elohim is God as the Creator of all things, Jehovah is the same God in covenant relation to those whom He has created (Cp. 2Chron. 18:31). Jehovah means the Eternal, the Immutable One, He Who WAS, and IS, and IS TO COME. The Divine definition is given in Gen. 21:33. He is especially, therefore, the God of Israel; and the God of those who are redeemed, and are thus now "in Christ". We can say "My God," but not "My Jehovah", for Jehovah is "MY God." Jehovah is indicated (as in A.V.) by small capital letters, "LORD"' and by "GOD" when it occurs in combination with Adonai, in which case LORD GOD = Adonai Jehovah. The name Jehovah is combined with ten other words, which form what are known as "the Jehovah Titles." in the Hebrew Canon (Ap. 1). All are noted in the margin, in all their occurrences:-- JEHOVAH-JIREH = Jehovah will see, or provide. Gen. 22:14. JEHOVAH-ROPHEKA = Jehovah that healeth thee. Ex. 15:26. JEHOVAH-NISSI = Jehovah my banner. Ex. 17:15. JEHOVAH-MeKADDISHKEM = Jehovah that doth sanctify you. Ex. 31:13. Lev. 20:8; 21:8; 22:32. Ezek. 20:12. JEHOVAH-SHALOM = Jehovah [send] peace. Judg. 6:24. JEHOVAH-ZeBA'OTH = Jehovah of hosts. 1Sam. 1:3, and frequently. JEHOVAH-ZIDKENU = Jehovah our righteousness. Jer. 23:6; 33:16. JEHOVAH-SHAMMAH = Jehovah is there. Ezek. 48:35. JEHOVAH-ELYON = Jehovah most high. Ps. 7:17; 47:2; 97:9. JEHOVAH-RO'I = Jehovah my Shepherd. Ps. 23:1. We have seven of these, experimentally referred to, in Ps. 23, inasmuch as Jehovah, the "Good," "Great," and "Chief Shepherd," is engaged, in all the perfection of His attributes, on behalf of His sheep:-- In verse 1, we have No. 1 above. In verse 2, we have No. 5. In verse 3, we have Nos. 2 and 7. In verse 4, we have No. 8. In verse 5, we have Nos. 3 and 4. Jah is Jehovah in a special sense and relation. Jehovah as having BECOME our Salvation (first occ. Ex. 15:2), He Who IS, and WAS, and IS TO COME. It occurs 49 times (7 x 7. See Ap. 10). Compare Psalm 68. 4, 18. EL is essentially the Almighty, thought the word is never so rendered (see below, "Shaddai"). EL is Elohim in all His strength and power. It is rendered "God" as Elohim is, but El is God the Omnipotent. Elohim is God the Creator putting His omnipotence into operation. Eloah (see below) is God Who wills and orders all, and Who is to be the one object of the worship of His people. El is the God Who knows all (first occ. Gen. 14:18:22) and sees all (Gen. 16:13) and that performeth all things for His people (Ps. 57:2); and in Whom all the Divine attributes are concentrated. El is indicated in this edition by type in large capital letters, thus: "GOD." It is sometimes transliterated in proper names Immanue-'el, Beth-'el, &c., where it is translated, as explained in the margin. Eloah is Elohim, Who is to be worshipped. Eloah is God in connection with His Will rather than His power. The first occurrence associates this name with worship (Deut. 32:15, 17). Hence it is the title used whenever the contrast (latent or expressed) is with false gods or idols. Eloah is essentially "the living God" in contrast to inanimate idols. Eloah is rendered "God", but we have indicated it by type thus: GOD. Elyon first occurs in Gen. 14:18 with El, and is rendered "the most high (God)". It is El and Elohim, not as the powerful Creator, but as "the possessor of heaven and earth." Hence the name is associated with Christ as the Son of "the Highest" (Luke 1:35). It is Elyon, as possessor of the earth, Who divides the nations "their inheritance". In Ps. 83:18, He is "over all the earth". The title occurs 36 times (6 x 6 or 62 See Ap. 10). Elyon is the Dispenser of God's blessings in the earth; the blessings proceeding from a Priest Who is a King upon His throne (cp. Gen. 14:18-22 with Zech. 6:13; 14:9). Shaddai is in every instance translated "Almighty", and is indicated by small capital letters ("ALMIGHTY"). It is God (El), not as the source of strength, but of grace; not as Creator, but as the Giver. Shaddai is the All-bountiful. This title does not refer to His creative power, but to His power to supply all the needs of His people. Its first occurrence is in Gen. 17:1, and is used to show Abraham that He Who called him out to walk alone before Him could supply all his need. Even so it is the title used in 2Cor. 6:18, where we are cal 1000 led to "come out" in separation from the world. It is always used in connection with El (see above). Adon is one of the three titles (ADON, ADONAI, and ADONIM), all generally rendered "Lord"; but each has its own peculiar usage and association. They all denote headship in various aspects. They have to do with God as "over-lord." Adon is the Lord as Ruler in the earth. We have indicated this in type by printing the preceding article or pronouns in small capitals, not because either are to be emphasized, but to distinguish the word "Lord" from Adonai, which is always so printed in the A.V. Adonai is the Lord in His relation to the earth; and as carrying out His purposes of blessing in the earth. With this limitation it is almost equivalent to Jehovah. Indeed, it was from an early date so used, by associating the vowel points of the word Jehovah with Adon, thus converting Adon into Adonai. A list of 134 passages where this was deliberately done is preserved and given in the Massorah (107-115). (See Ap. 32) We have indicated these by printing the word like Jehovah, putting an asterisk, thus: LORD*. Adonim is the plural of Adon, never used of man. Adonim carries with it all that Adon does, but in a greater and higher degree; and more especially as owner and proprietor. An Adon may rule others who do not belong to him. Hence (without the article) it is often used of men. But Adonim is the Lord Who rules His own. We have indicated it by type, thus: LORD. The three may be thus briefly distinguished:-- Adon is the Lord as overlord or ruler. Adonim is the Lord as owner. Adonai is the Lord as blesser. The Types used to indicate the above titles, in the text, are as follows:-- God = Elohim. GOD = Jehovah (in combination with Adonai, "Lord"). GOD* = Jehovah in the Primitive Texts, altered by Sopherim to Elohim as the Printed Text. (See Ap. 32.) GOD = El. GOD = Eloah. LORD = Jehovah. THE LORD = Jah. LORD* = Jehovah in the Primitive Texts, altered by Sopherim to Adonai as in the Printed Text. (See Ap. 32.) Lord = Adonai. LORD = Adonim. ALMIGHTY = Shaddai. MOST HIGH = Elyon. The Combinations are indicated as follows:-- Adonai Jehovah = Lord GOD. Jehovah Elohim = LORD God. Elyon El = MOST HIGH GOD. El Shaddai = GOD ALMIGHTY.
    Thank You For Your Answer .... Check This Out Ok . Genesis R.T. 2;18 , 10;10 , 14;19 -20 The name ANU means '' He Who Is Above '' and '' The Heavenly One '' . Other name for ANU are AN which mean '' Heavenly One '' . and ANA which mean '' I Am '' . ANU is the ruler of all the ANUNNAQI and ELOHEEM . He is what you would call '' The Great Deity , The Warrior , The Noble One , And The Decision Maker '' . ANU is The Most High , ELYOWN ELYOWN EL . ANUNNAQI / ELOHEEM Genesis R.T. 1;1-12 , 14 , 16 - 18 , 20 -22 , 24 -28 , 31 ; 2;2 ; 3;1, 5,6,9 ; 4;25 ; 5 ; 1 , 22; 6;2; 7;16 ; 8;1 ; 9 ;1 ; 20;3 ; 22;9 , 12 ; 27;28 ; 28;4 , 30;20 ; 35;4 , 5 ; 41 ; 39 The word '' ANUNNAQI '' means '' Those Who ANU Sent Down , From Heaven To Earth '' . They came from the skies to the planet earth which was originally called Tiamat meaning '' Maiden Of Life ''. And also referred to as Tamtu And Tiwawat , And Qi , Ki , Tiamat .. Is also called Terra , Orb , Arduwt Or Ard . When the greek got hold of the word Qi , They changed it to Ge < Greek > Where the word Geo < Greek > comes from . . The ANUNNAQI in The Bible are called ELOHEEM . They got their name ANUNNAQI When they were coming to Earth . The ANUNNAQI are a race of Supreme Beings . The word ANUNNAQI is used within The Ancient Tablets such as The Enuma Elish , The Gilgamesh Epics , Etc . The word ELOHEEM means ''' These Beings '' Or '' A Group Of ELOHS '' . ELOHEEMS Are angels of El or messengers of EL ELOH Who is ANU . They are physical Angelic Beings , Not Spooks Or Spirits Or Ghost . They are a host of beings that do the work of EL < Aramic > While on The Planet Earth under an appointed being . Then they are called El < Aramic > Who is under AL or El The word '' ELOHEEM '' Is found throughout '' The Scroll Of Genesis and is Falsely translated as '' God '' The name ELOHEEM Is used for Both Agreeable And Disagreeable Beings And Even Humans As In Exodus 7 ; 1 , When YAHUWA < Aramic > Told MOSES That He Will Make Him An ELOHEEM For The PHARAOH .
     
  9. EzrahEl21

    EzrahEl21 New Member

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    (DrBubbaLove;35776)
    Sorry I misunderstood. You mentioned Gen 1:26 which refers to the creation of man, so I assumed you were asking in whose Image was man made and perhaps why or how that was different than the Perfect Image in Son of the Father. Sorry about that.God the Father is not made, created or begotten. He was, is and shall be forever more. He "is",meaning that His Nature and the existence of His Person are insepparable, and the orthodox would say the fuller meaning behind "I am that I am".
    Thank You For Your Answer Also . I Have To Get Back To Work I'll Give You My Answer Later Ok . [​IMG]
     
  10. Morning_Joy

    Morning_Joy New Member

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    can you guys explain what it means when someone says that we were created in the image of the angels? I don't understand it.
     
  11. Christina

    Christina New Member

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    The angels look like us Angels are often mistaken for men in scripture and only reconized by those who are met to see them as angels They came to visit Lot stayed the night ate ect.They look like us but are spirit this is not a ghost spirit but appears with subtance and can often appear as man. Remember the wrestling story where the angel wrestledwith the man
     
  12. Unorthodox Christian

    Unorthodox Christian New Member

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    (EzrahEl21;35754)
    Who Is Yashu'a Talking Too In This Verse . Matthew 6 ; 9 And I Quote ; "This, then, is how you should pray: " 'Our Father in heaven, hallowed be your name, :study:
    John 3:13And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.Yeshua HaMashiach is talking to The Spirit In Him. Remember the Words Logos, En Morphe. The Body of Yeshua HaMashiach is the Manifested Word of God, made in the Likeness of men and God Dwelled in Him. John 1:1,14 Colossians 2:9.How Can Yeshua HaMashiach(THE SON OF MAN) say in this verse that The Son of Man is in Heaven yet he's there speaking to his disciples? Cause When He Prayed, it was his Human Nature, The MANIFESTED WORD OF YHWH speaking to the Deity in Him, which was God the Father.
     
  13. EzrahEl21

    EzrahEl21 New Member

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    (Unorthodox Christian;35828)
    John 3:13And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.Yeshua HaMashiach is talking to The Spirit In Him. Remember the Words Logos, En Morphe. The Body of Yeshua HaMashiach is the Manifested Word of God, made in the Likeness of men and God Dwelled in Him. John 1:1,14 Colossians 2:9.How Can Yeshua HaMashiach(THE SON OF MAN) say in this verse that The Son of Man is in Heaven yet he's there speaking to his disciples? Cause When He Prayed, it was his Human Nature, The MANIFESTED WORD OF YHWH speaking to the Deity in Him, which was God the Father.
    According To Genesis 1 ; 26 Psalm Chapter 82 John 10 ; 34 - 35 Says We're God's But That Doesn't Make Us The Creator . Now Does It ?:study:
     
  14. Unorthodox Christian

    Unorthodox Christian New Member

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    Do you know THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A CAPITAL G AND A LOWER CASE G? Brother?Here are Definition of God/god. 1. God 1. A being conceived as the perfect, omnipotent, omniscient originator and ruler of the universe, the principal object of faith and worship in monotheistic religions. 2. The force, effect, or a manifestation or aspect of this being. 2. A being of supernatural powers or attributes, believed in and worshiped by a people, especially a male deity thought to control some part of nature or reality. 3. An image of a supernatural being; an idol. 4. One that is worshiped, idealized, or followed: Money was their god. 5. A very handsome man. 6. A powerful ruler or despot.We are AN IMAGE OF A SUPERNATURAL BEING, and ADAM HAD DOMINION OVER THE WORLD! We are not GOD, we are gods. Distinguish the Difference. We don't create, but make more of something that is already in existence.We have the Attributes of GOD in us. Love, Caring, Sharing, Anger, Zeal, Jealousy, Rage, Parenting
     
  15. forgivenWretch

    forgivenWretch New Member

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    (Unorthodox Christian;35844)
    Do you know THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A CAPITAL G AND A LOWER CASE G? Brother? Here are Definition of God/god. 1. God 1. A being conceived as the perfect, omnipotent, omniscient originator and ruler of the universe, the principal object of faith and worship in monotheistic religions. 2. The force, effect, or a manifestation or aspect of this being. 2. A being of supernatural powers or attributes, believed in and worshiped by a people, especially a male deity thought to control some part of nature or reality. 3. An image of a supernatural being; an idol. 4. One that is worshiped, idealized, or followed: Money was their god. 5. A very handsome man. 6. A powerful ruler or despot.We are AN IMAGE OF A SUPERNATURAL BEING, and ADAM HAD DOMINION OVER THE WORLD! We are not GOD, we are gods. Distinguish the Difference. We don't create, but make more of something that is already in existence.We have the Attributes of GOD in us. Love, Caring, Sharing, Anger, Zeal, Jealousy, Rage, Parenting

    "Do you know THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A CAPITAL G AND A LOWER CASE G? Brother?"
    How can one ask another, such a question, when they neither know the difference? :naughty: it's G or g?
    we are gods
    please speak for your self,or is that exactly what you are doing?
     
  16. DrBubbaLove

    DrBubbaLove New Member

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    (Morning_Joy;35824)
    can you guys explain what it means when someone says that we were created in the image of the angels? I don't understand it.
    Have never heard it put that way myself. Am pretty sure if I understand that position that it is not orthodox, so someone else will need to answer as to what that means.The orthodox view is that angels, like us were also made in His Image and principally that is that they are rational beings, like us. Some alternative views have held that made in the Image and Likeness could refer to form (bodies) but the orthodox view has always been that it refers to some attribute(s) rather than a form. Strictly speaking this view holds that the Father is purely Spirit and has no body, neither does the Holy Spirit or Jesus before the Incarnation. The same view also holds that all angels are spiritual beings, though very powerful and capable of taking physical forms. When taking physical form it represents either their power over physical matter to make a form for themselves (animate dust for example) or an ability to make us see what they want us to see (in our minds but it looks and maybe even feels real). Either way the manifestations of angels are not really a "part" of what they are, but something they can do.
     
  17. Unorthodox Christian

    Unorthodox Christian New Member

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    (forgivenWretch;35849)
    How can one ask another, such a question, when they neither know the difference? :naughty: it's G or g? please speak for your self,or is that exactly what you are doing?
    John 10:32-42Jesus answered them, Many good works have I showed you from the Father; for which of those works do ye stone me? 33The Jews answered him, For a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God. 34Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, ye are gods? 35If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came (and the scripture cannot be broken), 36say ye of him, whom the Father sanctified and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God? Do you see what Jesus Is saying Here? Psalms 82:6 I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High.He's Quoting himself!They were gonna kill him Cause he Said HE'S THE SON OF YAH!Then made himself equal with YHWH. He then says, I called you gods, Yet you say it's blaphemy to call myself the Son of YHWH, to make myself Equal with YHWH when I AM YHWH. god meaning dominion over the world or what he's given us, NOT A CENTER OF WORSHIP OR IDOL. GOD is the Center of Worship and Idol! He is the Creator. Before he was even called GOD, YHWH, HE WAS ELOHIM. The Self Existing One, he wasn't called God then because he wasn't Worshipped. He was Elohim, the Self Existing One.
     
  18. Morning_Joy

    Morning_Joy New Member

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    ohso, does YHWH mean "I AM", or does Elohim? I'm just curious
     
  19. Unorthodox Christian

    Unorthodox Christian New Member

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    YHWH is I AM THAT I AMIt originally was EhYeh Asher EhYeh, I will be that I will beThat's in Exodus, as time Moves on he is the I AM THAT I AM YHWHElohim means the True God, but it also carries other meanings. Like in Genesis, He wasn't YHWH or Elohim(True God), he was Elohim the Self Existing One. Then when he created Adam, he was Elohim, the Worshipped One. Carry the Self EXISTING one, into the Worshipped one. MAKING HIM GOD.
     
  20. EzrahEl21

    EzrahEl21 New Member

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    (Unorthodox Christian;35844)
    Do you know THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A CAPITAL G AND A LOWER CASE G? Brother?Here are Definition of God/god. 1. God 1. A being conceived as the perfect, omnipotent, omniscient originator and ruler of the universe, the principal object of faith and worship in monotheistic religions. 2. The force, effect, or a manifestation or aspect of this being. 2. A being of supernatural powers or attributes, believed in and worshiped by a people, especially a male deity thought to control some part of nature or reality. 3. An image of a supernatural being; an idol. 4. One that is worshiped, idealized, or followed: Money was their god. 5. A very handsome man. 6. A powerful ruler or despot.We are AN IMAGE OF A SUPERNATURAL BEING, and ADAM HAD DOMINION OVER THE WORLD! We are not GOD, we are gods. Distinguish the Difference. We don't create, but make more of something that is already in existence.We have the Attributes of GOD in us. Love, Caring, Sharing, Anger, Zeal, Jealousy, Rage, Parenting
    I Love The Way You Play On Words But Hey NoBigThing It To Be Expect . Being You Want To Know < THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A CAPITAL G AND A LOWER CASE G? > I Answer Your Question Because You Think I Can't Answer It [​IMG]. In My Next Post But Let Me Leave You With A Though Ok .(Where Did God Come From ?) The Biblical Concepts Of God Was Created In The Hearts And Minds Of Their Authors And As These Authors Became Aithentic , Their Documents Became Authentic And With The Pages Of Their Docments Called Scripture, God Was Born If You Try To Question A Theologian Or Religious Scholar On The Subject Of God , And Ask Them Not To Use Their Bible, They Would Not Be AbleTo Do It For It Was These Authors Who Made The Opening Statement In The Old Testament Of The HebrewOr Jews Also Called The Torah . In The Beginning God ( Elohim ) Created The Heavens And The Earth '' Or Genesis 1 ; 1 And '' In The Beginning Was The Word And The Word Was With God ( Thehos ) And The Word Was God ( Thehos ) The Same Was In The Beginning With God ( Thehos ) . All Things Was Made By Him And Without Him Was Not Anything Made That Was Made ' In The New Testament Of The Christian's John 1 ; 1 - 3 Authored By Men Who Say They Were Inspired From On High To Teach Man Of A God , Who Is Every Man's Personal God , Yet Mediators Were Necessary As If God Could Not Merely Think His Being Into Everyone's Heart Without The Stress And Strain Of Religious Instructions . :study:
     
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