Just who is Jesus

[other one]

Jesus: The Visible God of the Old Testament and the Conduit of the Father
The Bible presents a fascinating distinction between the Father and the divine figure who interacted with humanity in the Old Testament. Consider Exodus 24:9-11, where Moses, Aaron, Nadab, Abihu, and seventy elders of Israel ascend and see the God of Israel: "Under His feet was something like a pavement of sapphire stone, clear as the sky itself. And He did not lay His hand on the nobles of Israel; they saw God, and they ate and drank" (KJV, adapted). This is a remarkable encounter—direct, tangible, and unharmed.
Yet, Jesus complicates this picture in John 6:44-46: "No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him... Not that any man has seen the Father, except He who is from God; He has seen the Father" (KJV, adapted). If no one has seen the Father except Jesus, who did Moses and the elders see? This suggests the "God of Israel" they encountered wasn’t the Father but another divine figure—one I believe to be Jesus Himself in His pre-incarnate form.
The Word from the Beginning
John 1:1-10 lays the foundation: "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God... All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made" (KJV, adapted). This Word, who "became flesh" (John 1:14), is Jesus—existing with the Father from eternity, co-creator of all things, and the light shining into the darkness. The Old Testament saints didn’t know the Father directly; they interfaced with the Word, Jesus, who revealed God to them in a form they could grasp.
Jesus affirms this in John 8:56-58, responding to the Jews: "Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day; he saw it and was glad... Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM" (KJV, adapted). Here, Jesus claims the divine name "I AM" (Exodus 3:14), linking Himself to the God who appeared to Abraham and others. The Israelites saw and knew God through Him—not the Father in His unapproachable essence, but the Word who mediated divine presence.
The Humble Servant of the Father
Philippians 2:5-11 deepens this: "Christ Jesus, being in the form of God, did not regard equality with God something to be grasped, but emptied Himself, taking the form of a servant, being made in human likeness" (KJV, adapted). As the Word, Jesus was deity—yet He didn’t cling to equality with the Father. Instead, He humbled Himself, first as the divine agent in the Old Testament, then as a man, always serving the Father’s will. The Father worked through Him to manifest Himself to humanity, whether as the God of Israel or the crucified Savior.
In John 14:10-11, Jesus explains this unity: "The words I speak to you I do not speak on My own; the Father who dwells in Me does the works" (KJV, adapted). Even in flesh, Jesus remains the conduit of the Father’s power and purpose—a role unchanged from eternity.
Extending the Conduit to Us
This relationship extends beyond Jesus to us. In John 17:20-23, He prays: "I pray... for those who will believe in Me... that they may all be one, just as You, Father, are in Me, and I in You, that they also may be in Us" (KJV, adapted). Through His sacrifice and intercession, Jesus sends the Holy Spirit, connecting us to the Father. As 1 Corinthians 15:24-28 reveals, Jesus reigns until all enemies are subdued, then hands the kingdom to the Father, remaining subject to Him (KJV, adapted). He’s not eternally co-equal in authority but the faithful Son fulfilling the Father’s plan.
One God, Three Persons, One Purpose
1 Corinthians 8:4-6 ties it together: "There is no God but one... For us, there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things and for whom we exist, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things and through whom we exist" (KJV, adapted). The Father is the source, Jesus the means, and the Holy Spirit the presence indwelling us. You can’t have one without the others—they are distinct yet inseparable, united in thought, purpose, and action.
Redefining "God"
Our confusion stems from the word "god." In Hebrew and Greek, it denotes anything worshipped or wielding control—pagan deities, nature, money, even ourselves. The original texts lack capitalization distinctions; translators capitalize "God" for the Trinity. But for us, "God" is the Father, Son, and Spirit—three entities so intertwined they are one. It’s not a mystery or miracle; it’s a misunderstanding of a word. They operate as one because their will is one, and through Jesus’ work, we’re invited into that unity.

 

[Debp]

Jesus: The Visible God of the Old Testament and the Conduit of the Father
The Bible presents a fascinating distinction between the Father and the divine figure who interacted with humanity in the Old Testament. Consider Exodus 24:9-11, where Moses, Aaron, Nadab, Abihu, and seventy elders of Israel ascend and see the God of Israel: "Under His feet was something like a pavement of sapphire stone, clear as the sky itself. And He did not lay His hand on the nobles of Israel; they saw God, and they ate and drank" (KJV, adapted). This is a remarkable encounter—direct, tangible, and unharmed.
Yet, Jesus complicates this picture in John 6:44-46: "No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him... Not that any man has seen the Father, except He who is from God; He has seen the Father" (KJV, adapted). If no one has seen the Father except Jesus, who did Moses and the elders see? This suggests the "God of Israel" they encountered wasn’t the Father but another divine figure—one I believe to be Jesus Himself in His pre-incarnate form.
The Word from the Beginning
John 1:1-10 lays the foundation: "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God... All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made" (KJV, adapted). This Word, who "became flesh" (John 1:14), is Jesus—existing with the Father from eternity, co-creator of all things, and the light shining into the darkness. The Old Testament saints didn’t know the Father directly; they interfaced with the Word, Jesus, who revealed God to them in a form they could grasp.
Jesus affirms this in John 8:56-58, responding to the Jews: "Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day; he saw it and was glad... Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM" (KJV, adapted). Here, Jesus claims the divine name "I AM" (Exodus 3:14), linking Himself to the God who appeared to Abraham and others. The Israelites saw and knew God through Him—not the Father in His unapproachable essence, but the Word who mediated divine presence.
The Humble Servant of the Father
Philippians 2:5-11 deepens this: "Christ Jesus, being in the form of God, did not regard equality with God something to be grasped, but emptied Himself, taking the form of a servant, being made in human likeness" (KJV, adapted). As the Word, Jesus was deity—yet He didn’t cling to equality with the Father. Instead, He humbled Himself, first as the divine agent in the Old Testament, then as a man, always serving the Father’s will. The Father worked through Him to manifest Himself to humanity, whether as the God of Israel or the crucified Savior.
In John 14:10-11, Jesus explains this unity: "The words I speak to you I do not speak on My own; the Father who dwells in Me does the works" (KJV, adapted). Even in flesh, Jesus remains the conduit of the Father’s power and purpose—a role unchanged from eternity.
Extending the Conduit to Us
This relationship extends beyond Jesus to us. In John 17:20-23, He prays: "I pray... for those who will believe in Me... that they may all be one, just as You, Father, are in Me, and I in You, that they also may be in Us" (KJV, adapted). Through His sacrifice and intercession, Jesus sends the Holy Spirit, connecting us to the Father. As 1 Corinthians 15:24-28 reveals, Jesus reigns until all enemies are subdued, then hands the kingdom to the Father, remaining subject to Him (KJV, adapted). He’s not eternally co-equal in authority but the faithful Son fulfilling the Father’s plan.
One God, Three Persons, One Purpose
1 Corinthians 8:4-6 ties it together: "There is no God but one... For us, there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things and for whom we exist, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things and through whom we exist" (KJV, adapted). The Father is the source, Jesus the means, and the Holy Spirit the presence indwelling us. You can’t have one without the others—they are distinct yet inseparable, united in thought, purpose, and action.
Redefining "God"
Our confusion stems from the word "god." In Hebrew and Greek, it denotes anything worshipped or wielding control—pagan deities, nature, money, even ourselves. The original texts lack capitalization distinctions; translators capitalize "God" for the Trinity. But for us, "God" is the Father, Son, and Spirit—three entities so intertwined they are one. It’s not a mystery or miracle; it’s a misunderstanding of a word. They operate as one because their will is one, and through Jesus’ work, we’re invited into that unity.

@ArkangeMikail @Siddhi Koli The above post might be helpful to you since you are both originally from another religion.

 

[Aunty Jane]

Jesus: The Visible God of the Old Testament and the Conduit of the Father

I believe that Jesus was always “the logos”, but I do not believe that he was part of a triune god that the OT never spoke about. The God of Israel was “one”, not “three”. (Deut 6:4)
I believe he was always the “Son of God”, before and after his earthly mission.There is no mention of “God the Son” in a single passage of Scripture. “God the Holy Spirit” is missing too.

Consider Exodus 24:9-11, where Moses, Aaron, Nadab, Abihu, and seventy elders of Israel ascend and see the God of Israel: "Under His feet was something like a pavement of sapphire stone, clear as the sky itself. And He did not lay His hand on the nobles of Israel; they saw God, and they ate and drank" (KJV, adapted). This is a remarkable encounter—direct, tangible, and unharmed.
Yet, Jesus complicates this picture in John 6:44-46: "No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him... Not that any man has seen the Father, except He who is from God; He has seen the Father" (KJV, adapted). If no one has seen the Father except Jesus, who did Moses and the elders see? This suggests the "God of Israel" they encountered wasn’t the Father but another divine figure—one I believe to be Jesus Himself in His pre-incarnate form.

Yes, I believe that too, but again he was God’s only begotten son long before he became a human of flesh and blood. The God of Israel was Yahweh...a unique God with just one personality and one name. There was no one higher in existence than Yahweh. (Psalm 83:18)

Abraham’s encounter with three angels at Mamre (Gen 18) also gives us a glimpse of how God interacted with his human servants on earth, through angelic representatives. Only one of the three spoke for Yahweh....and the other two went on to Sodom to rescue Lot and his family before God brought the cities to ruin.
This may well have been the pre-incarnated Jesus, as the title “logos” can also mean “one who speaks for God” as his representative.
God cannot deal directly with sinful humans, so he appointed a mediator in the form of his son, Jesus.
As Jesus is “the one mediator between God and men”...how can he be God? He can be divine but that doesn’t make him deity.

John 1:1-10 lays the foundation: "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God... All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made" (KJV, adapted). This Word, who "became flesh" (John 1:14), is Jesus—existing with the Father from eternity, co-creator of all things, and the light shining into the darkness. The Old Testament saints didn’t know the Father directly; they interfaced with the Word, Jesus, who revealed God to them in a form they could grasp.

Actually the OT prophets spoke for God mostly, communing with them in ways not stated. Direct communication into their minds or audibly heard in their ears...the Bible doesn’t say.

But when it was in some visible form Paul tells us that Jesus is “the image of the one who is invisible” (Col 1:15)...how does an invisible God have a visible image? Only in his character and personality, which Jesus reflected perfectly.

Jesus affirms this in John 8:56-58, responding to the Jews: "Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day; he saw it and was glad... Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM" (KJV, adapted). Here, Jesus claims the divine name "I AM" (Exodus 3:14), linking Himself to the God who appeared to Abraham and others.

In reading this passage from the Jewish Tanakh, it doesn’t say “I Am” but “I Will Be What I Will Be”.
The Jews had been in Egypt a long time, and far from the acceptance originally granted to Joseph’s kin, the Egyptian Pharaoh now saw their increasing numbers as a threat so he attempted to reign them in, trying to control their numbers by culling all the male children. Moses was an escapee from that situation.

So when he was called by God in the burning bush, Moses asked what he should say concerning the God they already knew existed, but who had plans for them as Abraham’s offspring. “I Will Be” was a promise...he would “be” or “become” whatever he needed to be in order to deliver the now numerous people, and through them, to produce their Messiah in his due time.
They would see this God in action, as their deliverer from slavery in Egypt and his victory over a stubborn Pharaoh.

The Israelites saw and knew God through Him—not the Father in His unapproachable essence, but the Word who mediated divine presence.

As God’s “firstborn” and his chief representative, the Son mirrored the Father in every way.
I don’t even know what “unapproachable essence” even means as it is not a Bible concept.
Israel knew who their God was, and he was not a threesome....he was “one God, the Father” as the apostles also stated. (1 Cor 8:5-6)

 

[Aunty Jane]

Continued....

Philippians 2:5-11 deepens this: "Christ Jesus, being in the form of God, did not regard equality with God something to be grasped, but emptied Himself, taking the form of a servant, being made in human likeness" (KJV, adapted). As the Word, Jesus was deity—yet He didn’t cling to equality with the Father.

Being in God’s “form” didn’t make him God, even though the word “theos” can mean God with a capital “G”, it can also have a range of other meanings....angels, satan, false gods, Jesus, and even human judges in Israel were called “theos” in the Bible, (John 10:31-36)....so John 1:1 does not mean what most people think it does. And Phil 2:5 doesn’t either. What “form” does God have? John tells us that “God is a spirit”, and that all who inhabit the spirit realm are also spirits. So as “the firstborn” “only begotten son”, Jesus was in spirit form too, before willingly being transformed into a mortal human, born to a woman on earth....so as to give his life for ours.

Instead, He humbled Himself, first as the divine agent in the Old Testament, then as a man, always serving the Father’s will. The Father worked through Him to manifest Himself to humanity, whether as the God of Israel or the crucified Savior.

As his Father’s representative, he always reflected his Father’s personality to his disciples.
Like Father, like Son.

God is an immortal who cannot die, no matter what form he takes. So Jesus cannot be God. His death is what redeems us.

Since Jesus is the only “mediator between God and man”, we have to understand what a mediator is. He is the facilitator of communication between two estranged parties, who speak to each other through this mediator. The mediator cannot be one of the parties. Which is why all of our prayers are to be addressed to the Father in the name of the Son.
He is the one “through” whom we can speak to God.

In John 14:10-11, Jesus explains this unity: "The words I speak to you I do not speak on My own; the Father who dwells in Me does the works" (KJV, adapted). Even in flesh, Jesus remains the conduit of the Father’s power and purpose—a role unchanged from eternity.

Yes, I guess he is a conduit of sorts, but Jesus is not the one providing the information....all that he taught came from the Father.....he is not it’s source, but the means by which we still have communication with a Holy God who cannot dwell in the presence of sinful flesh.

This relationship extends beyond Jesus to us. In John 17:20-23, He prays: "I pray... for those who will believe in Me... that they may all be one, just as You, Father, are in Me, and I in You, that they also may be in Us" (KJV, adapted). Through His sacrifice and intercession, Jesus sends the Holy Spirit, connecting us to the Father. As 1 Corinthians 15:24-28 reveals, Jesus reigns until all enemies are subdued, then hands the kingdom to the Father, remaining subject to Him (KJV, adapted). He’s not eternally co-equal in authority but the faithful Son fulfilling the Father’s plan.

Yes again, showing that he is, and always has been subservient.....never an equal with his God and Father.

1 Corinthians 8:4-6 ties it together: "There is no God but one... For us, there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things and for whom we exist, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things and through whom we exist" (KJV, adapted). The Father is the source, Jesus the means, and the Holy Spirit the presence indwelling us. You can’t have one without the others—they are distinct yet inseparable, united in thought, purpose, and action.

The Father is God alone...the Son is his representative and spokesman....and the Holy Spirit is the power behind everything.
Each plays a role in a Christian’s journey to baptism, as Jesus said in Matt 28:19-20...we are to be baptized “in the name of” (under the authority of) the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. Acknowledging the role that each played in our spiritual development and will continue to play an important role as we strive to maintain our faith and strengthen it for rough road ahead.

Our confusion stems from the word "god." In Hebrew and Greek, it denotes anything worshipped or wielding control—pagan deities, nature, money, even ourselves. The original texts lack capitalization distinctions; translators capitalize "God" for the Trinity. But for us, "God" is the Father, Son, and Spirit—three entities so intertwined they are one. It’s not a mystery or miracle; it’s a misunderstanding of a word. They operate as one because their will is one, and through Jesus’ work, we’re invited into that unity.

The “oneness” that Jesus speaks about is not a god with multiple personalities, but the Creator, his most trusted and faithful Son, and with the power of God’s spirit, can make all who come to him in faith, achieve what they could never do on their own. (John 6:44; 65)

 

[other one]

Continued....


Being in God’s “form” didn’t make him God, even though the word “theos” can mean God with a capital “G”, it can also have a range of other meanings....angels, satan, false gods, Jesus, and even human judges in Israel were called “theos” in the Bible, (John 10:31-36)....so John 1:1 does not mean what most people think it does. And Phil 2:5 doesn’t either. What “form” does God have? John tells us that “God is a spirit”, and that all who inhabit the spirit realm are also spirits. So as “the firstborn” “only begotten son”, Jesus was in spirit form too, before willingly being transformed into a mortal human, born to a woman on earth....so as to give his life for ours.

As his Father’s representative, he always reflected his Father’s personality to his disciples.
Like Father, like Son.

God is an immortal who cannot die, no matter what form he takes. So Jesus cannot be God. His death is what redeems us.

Since Jesus is the only “mediator between God and man”, we have to understand what a mediator is. He is the facilitator of communication between two estranged parties, who speak to each other through this mediator. The mediator cannot be one of the parties. Which is why all of our prayers are to be addressed to the Father in the name of the Son.
He is the one “through” who we can speak to God.

Yes, I guess he is a conduit of sorts, but Jesus is not the one providing the information....all that he taught came from the Father.....he is not it’s source, but the means by which we still have communication with a Holy God who cannot dwell in the presence of sinful flesh.

Yes again, showing that he is, and always has been subservient.....never an equal with his God and Father.

The Father is God alone...the Son is his representative and spokesman....and the Holy Spirit is the power behind everything.
Each plays a role in a Christian’s journey to baptism, as Jesus said in Matt 28:19-20...we are to be baptized “in the name of” (under the authority of) the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. Acknowledging the role that each played in our spiritual development and will continue to play an important role as we strive to maintain our faith and strengthen it for rough road ahead.

The “oneness” that Jesus speaks about is not a god with multiple personalities, but the Creator, his most trusted and faithful Son, and with the power of God’s spirit, can make all who come to him in faith, achieve what they could never do on their own. (John 6:44; 65)

Obviously I disagree with your understanding of the scripture.

 

[Aunty Jane]

Obviously I disagree with your understanding of the scripture.

That is entirely up to you. I post what the Bible says, not what Christendom teaches.

All are free to look up the Scriptures for themselves.

 

[GodsGrace]

Jesus: The Visible God of the Old Testament and the Conduit of the Father
The Bible presents a fascinating distinction between the Father and the divine figure who interacted with humanity in the Old Testament. Consider Exodus 24:9-11, where Moses, Aaron, Nadab, Abihu, and seventy elders of Israel ascend and see the God of Israel: "Under His feet was something like a pavement of sapphire stone, clear as the sky itself. And He did not lay His hand on the nobles of Israel; they saw God, and they ate and drank" (KJV, adapted). This is a remarkable encounter—direct, tangible, and unharmed.
Yet, Jesus complicates this picture in John 6:44-46: "No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him... Not that any man has seen the Father, except He who is from God; He has seen the Father" (KJV, adapted). If no one has seen the Father except Jesus, who did Moses and the elders see? This suggests the "God of Israel" they encountered wasn’t the Father but another divine figure—one I believe to be Jesus Himself in His pre-incarnate form.

Welcome to the Forum other one.
Yes, what you've stated above is accepted Christian theology.
It's called a theophony...any time God is seen by mankind, it is Jesus that is being seen.
God is Spirit and cannot be seen.

The Word from the Beginning
John 1:1-10 lays the foundation: "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God... All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made" (KJV, adapted). This Word, who "became flesh" (John 1:14), is Jesus—existing with the Father from eternity, co-creator of all things, and the light shining into the darkness. The Old Testament saints didn’t know the Father directly; they interfaced with the Word, Jesus, who revealed God to them in a form they could grasp.

Agreed.

Jesus affirms this in John 8:56-58, responding to the Jews: "Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day; he saw it and was glad... Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM" (KJV, adapted). Here, Jesus claims the divine name "I AM" (Exodus 3:14), linking Himself to the God who appeared to Abraham and others. The Israelites saw and knew God through Him—not the Father in His unapproachable essence, but the Word who mediated divine presence.
The Humble Servant of the Father
Philippians 2:5-11 deepens this: "Christ Jesus, being in the form of God, did not regard equality with God something to be grasped, but emptied Himself, taking the form of a servant, being made in human likeness" (KJV, adapted). As the Word, Jesus was deity—yet He didn’t cling to equality with the Father. Instead, He humbled Himself, first as the divine agent in the Old Testament, then as a man, always serving the Father’s will. The Father worked through Him to manifest Himself to humanity, whether as the God of Israel or the crucified Savior.
In John 14:10-11, Jesus explains this unity: "The words I speak to you I do not speak on My own; the Father who dwells in Me does the works" (KJV, adapted). Even in flesh, Jesus remains the conduit of the Father’s power and purpose—a role unchanged from eternity.
Extending the Conduit to Us
This relationship extends beyond Jesus to us. In John 17:20-23, He prays: "I pray... for those who will believe in Me... that they may all be one, just as You, Father, are in Me, and I in You, that they also may be in Us" (KJV, adapted). Through His sacrifice and intercession, Jesus sends the Holy Spirit, connecting us to the Father. As 1 Corinthians 15:24-28 reveals, Jesus reigns until all enemies are subdued, then hands the kingdom to the Father, remaining subject to Him (KJV, adapted). He’s not eternally co-equal in authority but the faithful Son fulfilling the Father’s plan.
One God, Three Persons, One Purpose
1 Corinthians 8:4-6 ties it together: "There is no God but one... For us, there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things and for whom we exist, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things and through whom we exist" (KJV, adapted). The Father is the source, Jesus the means, and the Holy Spirit the presence indwelling us. You can’t have one without the others—they are distinct yet inseparable, united in thought, purpose, and action.
Redefining "God"
Our confusion stems from the word "god." In Hebrew and Greek, it denotes anything worshipped or wielding control—pagan deities, nature, money, even ourselves. The original texts lack capitalization distinctions; translators capitalize "God" for the Trinity. But for us, "God" is the Father, Son, and Spirit—three entities so intertwined they are one. It’s not a mystery or miracle; it’s a misunderstanding of a word. They operate as one because their will is one, and through Jesus’ work, we’re invited into that unity.

Very good post.
You might get a better response if you make your desired topic of discussion shorter in length.
I have come to the conclusion that if a person does not believe Jesus is God, he cannot properly define himself as a Christian person. What do you think? Do we have a set of rules or not?

 

[GRACE ambassador]

Just Who Is JESUS? Great Question!!:

And, Very Well Said: "All are free to look up The Scriptures for themselves." Amen!:

A Very Vast Multitude Of Scriptures Are Here: Complete Case FOR The Triune GodHead!!
---------
And, precious friend(s), Please Be Very Richly Encouraged and Edified
In The Lord Jesus Christ and In His Precious Word Of Truth, Rightly
Divided:

The Bible: The BIG Picture

Amen.

 

[Davy]

That is entirely up to you. I post what the Bible says, not what Christendom teaches.

All are free to look up the Scriptures for themselves.

Now that's certainly a false statement; you do NOT post what The Bible actually shows about Jesus of Nazareth as part of The GODHEAD.


You haven't begun to address the following Bible Scripture...

Matt 1:21-23
21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call His name JESUS: for He shall save His people from their sins.
22 Now all this was done, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying,
23 "Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel", which being interpreted is, 'God with us.'
KJV

Isa 7:14
14 Therefore the Lord Himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel.
KJV

"God with us," a clear and direct statement declaration that Jesus of Nazareth is GOD come in the flesh!

Those who reject that clear statement of Bible Scripture show they have another spirit working in them. They reject that Jesus Christ is God come in the flesh, like Apostle John remarked in 1 John 4:3. When Jesus asked Peter who he thought He was, Peter told Him that He is The Son of God, THE CHRIST. That "Christ" part is a HEAVENLY DIVINE OFFICE IN THE GODHEAD.

 

[Aunty Jane]

Now that's certainly a false statement; you do NOT post what The Bible actually shows about Jesus of Nazareth as part of The GODHEAD.

There is no such word as “Godhead” in the Bible…..it is an invention of the Catholic church….just like “God the Son”…it doesn’t exist.

You haven't begun to address the following Bible Scripture...

Matt 1:21-23
21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call His name JESUS: for He shall save His people from their sins.
22 Now all this was done, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying,
23 "Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel", which being interpreted is, 'God with us.'
KJV

Isa 7:14
14 Therefore the Lord Himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel.
KJV

"God with us," a clear and direct statement declaration that Jesus of Nazareth is GOD come in the flesh!

OK…was Jesus named Immanuel?…..if not, why not?
The name Emanuel is not a direct statement or declaration that Jesus is God in the flesh.
He was God’s representative…”sent” by his Father on a mission to save the human race. (John 3:16)

God was “with” his nation by means of his Son, just as he was “with” his people through his appointed mediator Moses. Jesus is “the prophet like Moses“ who was foretold….he is also the mediator of the new covenant, as Moses was mediator of the old one.

Mary was told to name the child “Jesus” (Yeshua) meaning “Jehovah is Salvation”.
Jesus is not Jehovah.

Those who reject that clear statement of Bible Scripture show they have another spirit working in them. They reject that Jesus Christ is God come in the flesh, like Apostle John remarked in 1 John 4:3. When Jesus asked Peter who he thought He was, Peter told Him that He is The Son of God, THE CHRIST. That "Christ" part is a HEAVENLY DIVINE OFFICE IN THE GODHEAD.

Peter said he was ”the Son of God”.…not “God the Son”. (John 10:31-36)
His title “Christ” means “anointed one”……so, who anointed him?
Who raised him from the dead?
Who did Jesus pray to?

If you worship a God other than the one Jesus worshipped as a man on earth, and still worships even in heaven, you are breaking the first Commandment. (Exodus 20:3; Deut 6:4; Rev 3: 12)

 

[Taken]

Just who is Jesus

God Himself…

Who Sent forth His WORD…
In the Likeness AS a man

In a body God Prepared…

Purposing IN and Fulfilling IN Gods OWN Will TO Speak, Teach, Preach, Truth…
Which…
humans had, have, continually broadly Fail to Successfully accomplish, speaking, teaching, preaching Gods Truths

Eph 1:
[9] Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself:

Isa 55:
[11] So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.

Phil 2:
[8] And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

Heb 10:
[5] Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:

John 16:
[27] For the Father himself loveth you, because ye have loved me, and have believed that I came out from God.

John 3:
[13] And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

John 6:
[62] What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before?

John 17:
[5] And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

Pss 113:
[4] The LORD is high above all nations, and his glory above the heavens.

Heb 1:
[3] Who being the brightness of his glory,and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

Phil 2:
[6] Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:

Rev 4:
[11] Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created.

John 1:
[1] In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Gen 1:
[1] In the beginning God created…
[3] …God said

Gods WORD IS God, in as much as YOUR WORD IS YOU.

Matters not IF YOUR WORD comes forth out from YOU, it remains IN YOU, WITH YOU, IS YOU.

Matters not WHAT YOU CALL YOUR WORD…names, titles, descriptions, YOUR WORD IS YOU.

Same Applies to God, who created man IN HIS LIKENESS.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Aunty Jane]

Just who is Jesus

God Himself…

No declaration from Jesus or his Father claim that he is “God” with a capital “G”.
“Theos” is the word in Greek and it does not refer only to Yahweh. It is used of angels, human judges in Israel and Jesus.

The primary definition given for this word is...

1. “a god or goddess, a general name of deities or divinities” (Strongs)

It can also mean....

“refers to the things of God

1. his counsels, interests, things due to him

1. whatever can in any respect be likened unto God, or resemble him in any way
   1. God's representative or viceregent
      1. of magistrates and judges”.

So, not a word that always means just Yahweh. Context determines translation, so when this word is used in other contexts, those who are genuine Bible students will understand what is written, uncoloured by Christendom’s doctrines.

Who Sent forth His WORD…
In the Likeness AS a man

Yes...who did that? Is the ‘sender’ also the “sent”?
Jesus is described in Acts 4:27 as “God’s holy servant”......can God be his own servant?

So....can we take these verses one at a time to see what they really say....?

In a body God Prepared…

Yes, in a human body that God prepared for his son, so that redemption could take place. Redemption was a set price....a sinless life was taken from the human race descended from Adam and God provided a sinless life to be offered in exchange.....God is immortal and could not have paid the required payment. An immortal cannot die. Jesus had to die the same death as Adam in order for redemption to take place. If Jesus didn’t die, meaning that he was 100% human, we are not saved.

Purposing IN and Fulfilling IN Gods OWN Will TO Speak, Teach, Preach, Truth…
Which…
humans had, have, continually broadly Fail to Successfully accomplish, speaking, teaching, preaching Gods Truths

I couldn’t agree more! So who is teaching the real truth?

 

[Aunty Jane]

Continued...

Eph 1:
[9] Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself:

Yes, it is God’s will being carried out in the sacrifice of his precious son. There was no other way to redeem Adam’s children, born in sin through no fault on their part.

Isa 55:
[11] So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.

So what is “God’s word” that goes forth from his mouth? It is his stated will and purpose....it will always come to a successful conclusion and result in God’s original purpose being carried out.
So what was God’s original purpose for mankind on this Earth? A restoration of that original purpose has to be the outcome....so what is being restored? Why are we here?

Phil 2:
[8] And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

To whom was Christ obedient? Does one who is equally “God” in the flesh, need to obey himself?

Heb 10:
[5] Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:

Who prepared the body that Christ was given? Who is “thou” in that verse?

John 16:
[27] For the Father himself loveth you, because ye have loved me, and have believed that I came out from God.

Yes, but how? If I “came out” from my mother, am I saying that I am my mother?
If an ambassador came out of his nation’s government to represent them in another country....is he the government or a representative of it?

John 3:
[13] And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

Yes, the spirit being who became the man, Jesus came down from heaven where he had resided with his Father from “the beginning”. He has always been “the Son of God”. (Col 1:15; Rev 3:14)

John 6:
[62] What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before?

Yes....heaven was where “he was before” as “the logos”....the one who speaks for God and always has.
He was the voice in the burning bush...the the voice Moses heard in the tabernacle.

The Son of God was his first creation, making him unique as “monogenes theos”.....the only direct creation of his God and Father....the one who was used by his God to create everything else. (John 1:2-3; Col 1:16)

John 17:
[5] And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

Again, yes...the prehuman Jesus was “with” the Father from “the beginning”.
What “beginning” is this since the eternal God had no “beginning”?

What “world” is this? It is the “kosmos”....defined as...

1. an apt and harmonious arrangement or constitution, order, government
2. ornament, decoration, adornment, i.e. the arrangement of the stars, 'the heavenly hosts', as the ornament of the heavens. 1 Pet. 3:3
3. the world, the universe
4. the circle of the earth, the earth
5. the inhabitants of the earth, men, the human family”

So, yes, the prehuman Jesus was a glorious spirit being before his earthly sojourn, and returned to his Father as he stated in the same form as he had before......”put to death in the flesh but made alive in the spirit”.

 

[Aunty Jane]

Continued....

Pss 113:
[4] The LORD is high above all nations, and his glory above the heavens.

Not sure how you have applied this but, the “LORD” here, as the capital letters suggest, is Yahweh.
There is no one more glorious than the Father. All spirit beings are glorious according to Scripture....even satan was formerly a glorious creature. (Ezekiel 28:13, 14, 17)

Heb 1:
[3] Who being the brightness of his glory,and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

Yes again....”the brightness of his glory” means that he shared heavenly glory with his Father....and he “sat down at the right hand of the majesty on high”....Does God sit next to himself? Why did he sit down at God’s right hand? Was there someone sitting at his left? There is no mention of anyone occupying that place.

Did the Jews believe that their Messiah was going to be God incarnate? Did Jesus ever once claim to be “God” with a capital “G” or was reference to Jesus as “theos”, “god” with a small “g”? Look up the meaning of “theos” again (above in post #12)....Jesus can be “divine” or “God like”, without being deity. This word is used for the human judges in Israel. (John 10:31-36)
To worship a deity other than Yahweh was a breach of the first Commandment.

Phil 2:
[6] Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:

That is a terrible translation....and not what it says at all.....
The ESV renders verse 6&7....
“who, though he was in the form of God, did not count equality with God a thing to be grasped, but emptied himself, by taking the form of a servant, being born in the likeness of men.”

Which is the very opposite to what other translations say. He did NOT COUNT EQUALITY WITH GOD A THING TO BE GRASPED”.
And what is the “form of God”? The Bible states that ”God is a spirit” (John 4:24) So Jesus was also in spirit “form” in heaven, but he wasn’t God.

Rev 4:
[11] Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created.

Who alone possessed the power to create all things?
To whom did God give his power to act on his behalf in the creation of all things?
Col 1:13-16 answers....
“He has delivered us from the domain of darkness and transferred us to the kingdom of his beloved Son, in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins. He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation. For by him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things were created through him and for him. And he is before all things, and in him all things hold together.” (ESV)

Read that carefully and see that the Son is “the firstborn of ALL CREATION” and was the agency “through” whom creation came.....all creation was made “through him and for him”....God’s gift to his “beloved Son”.

John 1:
[1] In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Read it in Greek and see that there are two mentions of “theos” in that well known verse......only one has the definite article “ho” which is used only of Yahweh....the second is just “theos” without the definite article, making that two “gods” (divine mighty ones) in that verse....only one of which is “God” with a capital “G”.

Rendered correctly it should read...
“In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with Yahweh, and the Word was divine.”

Gen 1:
[1] In the beginning God created…

Yes he did. The power of God’s spirit was used in the creation of all things....but all things came into existence “through” the Son....Yahweh was the architect, and his Holy Spirit was the power used to create everything.

[3] …God said

Gods WORD IS God, in as much as YOUR WORD IS YOU.

God’s Word is his spokesman....one who speaks for God....one who speaks God’s words to others.

The three angels who appeared to Abraham at Mamre....one spoke for God...Most likely the pre-human Jesus. Read the account in Genesis ch 18.
Was God in human form there? Or was an angel representing him?

In every instance, the Scriptures you have used are cherry picked to support a doctrine that does not exist in the Bible. Only a Bible student unhindered by Christendom’s false doctrines will see the clear truth of what the Bible has said all along.....we should allow it to speak for itself.

 

[GRACE ambassador]

Just Who Is Jesus?
Great Question, Because All over The God's Precious Word Of Truth, He Is The
Central Figure!

Complete Case FOR The Triune GodHead, Jesus At The Center!!

And, From Creation To The Three Books Of JUDGMENT! He Is God, The SON,
The Creator And Righteous Judge Of Every believer And All Unbelievers, who
we continue to FOR...

--------------
And, precious friend(s), Please Be Very Richly Encouraged and Edified
In The Lord [ God ] Jesus Christ and In His Precious Word Of Truth, Rightly
Divided:

The Bible: The BIG Picture

Amen.

 

[Taken]

No declaration from Jesus or his Father claim that he is “God” with a capital “G”.


Disagree with you.

Heb 1:
[1] God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets…

[8] But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.

… can God be his own servant?

Of course.
Every time God “Does His Will” He SERVES Himself.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

So what is “God’s word” that goes forth from his mouth?

Gods Oral Speech AND Gods Word in the likeness AS a human man, that human men could SEE and HEAR.

Are you aware SPIRITS… God Himself, Angels, (holy or fallen) Have the POWER to appear to human men, in the Likeness as a human ?

Scripture Verifies…(with a Precept warning)

Heb 13:
[2] Be not forgetful to entertain strangers: for thereby some have entertained angels unawares.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

In every instance, the Scriptures you have used are cherry picked

Absolutely!

Cherry-Picking Scriptures that have no valid Context to a Point would be utterly Ignorant.

to support a doctrine that does not exist in the Bible.

The Doctrine itself is Expressly Revealed in Scripture…and was expressly “cherry-picked”… and quoted.

John 1:
[1] In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Further verification can be “cherry-Picked” throughout Scripture… Exactly… the Names, Titles, Descriptions…Revealed that Correctly Apply TO the Word of God.

Hint: (IS NOT OF This World)
IS:
Word, Lord, Rabbi, High Priest, Faithful, Savior, Without Beginning, Son of God, JESUS, the Christ, Maker, Lamb, Truth, Life, Way, KING, Prince of Peace, Mighty God, The Everlasting Father, One, etc., etc.
…as much as a person chooses to “cherry-Pick” the Scriptures of WHAT IS Gods WAY, “From” the Scriptures that IS NOT Gods Way.

JESUS’ Testimony.

John 10:
[30] I and MY FATHER ARE ONE.

Gods’ Testimony, TO MOSES…
Deut. 6:
[1] Now these are the commandments, the statutes, and the judgments, which the LORD your God commanded to teach you, that ye might do them in the land whither ye go to possess it:

[4] Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God IS ONE LORD:

Cherry-Picking Scripture… God speaking to ISAIAH…

Isa. 9:
[6] For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counseller, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

Because YOU have NOT arrived at the Understanding to CALL the Son…”The mighty God, The Everlasting Father”…

Does NOT mean “other men have Not Arrived to The Mysterious Spiritual Understanding…”
That The Lord God Almighty IS ONE God.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Davy]

There is no such word as “Godhead” in the Bible…..it is an invention of the Catholic church….just like “God the Son”…it doesn’t exist.

Doesn't have to be. The Matthew 1:23 verse declaring the meaning of Jesus Name "Immanuel" as "God with us" is enough to know that Jesus is GOD come in the flesh. And trying to assign that as an invention of the Catholic Church is an EXCUSE away from accepting that written Matthew 1:20-23 Scripture.

OK…was Jesus named Immanuel?…..if not, why not?
The name Emanuel is not a direct statement or declaration that Jesus is God in the flesh.

Yes it is... a DIRECT STATEMENT that Jesus is GOD come in the flesh. That is what "God with us" there means, as written. You are in DENIAL by another spirit, those who have wrongly taught you that Jesus Christ is not God come in the flesh...

1 John 2:22
22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.
KJV

1 John 4:3
3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
KJV

2 John 7
7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.
KJV

What's so important that Jesus of Nazareth, the man, had come in the flesh? Nothing, for regarding just Jesus' flesh body, He was born of woman like us.

But the fact that Jesus of Nazareth is also THE CHRIST, and that CHRIST had come in the flesh as Jesus of Nazareth, is... the matter John was pointing to.

 

[Aunty Jane]

Let me just correct a few things here.....

Doesn't have to be. The Matthew 1:23 verse declaring the meaning of Jesus Name "Immanuel" as "God with us" is enough to know that Jesus is GOD come in the flesh. And trying to assign that as an invention of the Catholic Church is an EXCUSE away from accepting that written Matthew 1:20-23 Scripture.

How was God “with” his people all through Bible history? Wasn’t it through his human representatives?

Do you understand why Yahweh had to appoint his Son as his mediator? (1 Tim 2:5-6) Do you know what the role of a mediator is?

Sin is a barrier between flawed humans and our perfect God.....sin caused a separation, and God himself filled the breach by appointing a “go between”....someone who could keep the lines of communication open between us and our Maker. A mediator cannot be one of the parties....he is the one who facilitates communication with God, as we can pray to him “in Jesus’ name”.

Yes it is... a DIRECT STATEMENT that Jesus is GOD come in the flesh. That is what "God with us" there means, as written. You are in DENIAL by another spirit, those who have wrongly taught you that Jesus Christ is not God come in the flesh...

That is not what the Bible says at all.....no one is denying anything true.....denying what the Bible never says is ridiculous. What are we denying? We are confirming what Jesus himself said......not once did he ever say that he was God incarnate.....find me one clear unequivocal statement where Jesus ever said that.
Jesus only ever said that he was “the Son of God”...not once did he ever say that he was “God the Son”. That is a Catholic invention.

Let’s examine the Scriptures you quoted....

1 John 2:22
22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.
KJV

No one denies that “Jesus is the Christ”...he himself said he was. No one is “denying the Father and the Son”....we just understand what the Bible says about them....and your third party is invariably missing.

1 John 4:3
3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
KJV

Who is “denying that Jesus Christ came in the flesh”....not us.....of course we acknowledge that Jesus came in the flesh....what we deny is that God would even need to come in the flesh?
God is an immortal who cannot die....so, who sent Jesus? (John 17:3; John 3:16)

2 John 7
7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.
KJV

Again no one is denying that “Jesus came in the flesh”.....we deny that Jesus was God in the flesh.
No Scripture says so. You are reading into those verses what they do not say. You are assuming that they mean what you want them to....they don’t.

What's so important that Jesus of Nazareth, the man, had come in the flesh? Nothing, for regarding just Jesus' flesh body, He was born of woman like us.

Do you understand why he had to be born of a woman like us?
Do you know how redemption worked in Israel?
The redeemer had to provide the exact equivalent of what the debtor owed. Can you tell me how God could ever be the equivalent of his own creation? And then tell me how mere humans can kill God?

But the fact that Jesus of Nazareth is also THE CHRIST, and that CHRIST had come in the flesh as Jesus of Nazareth, is... the matter John was pointing to.

Yes! ...don’t you understand that no one is questioning this...?
Jesus did come in the flesh....there is no denying this.....but you cannot provide any Scriptural evidence for your assertions....because there are none....I have examined the Scriptures carefully and I assure you that there is not a single direct statement that proves that the trinity is true.

John 1:1 does not say in English what it says in Greek.....it’s the Greek that’s important.....not the English.

Do some research....look up the word “theos”....and see what it really means.