Acts 2:38 Peter was still preaching water baptism as necessary for salvation. The Cornelius experience and the Holy Spirit corrected his thinking. The disciples Paul encountered had not been baptized in the Holy Spirit but certainly had been baptized in water. Apollo didn't know about the baptism of the Holy Spirit but only John the Baptist's water baptism. My point is that the transition and unified message took some time. The Eunuch was in the dark.
Luke 1:43
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Faith alone for salvation. Evidence of salvation is works. Works are not necessary for salvation. Really difficult for someone to check the box on a list of works after finding Jesus from a hospital bed facing death or the soldier storming the beach at Normandy who was saved two days prior on the transport ship during a chapel service.
Sacraments are required for initiation into Christ and the new covenant and salvation Mk 16:16 acts 8:36-38
'The Father has set his seal' on Christ (John 6:27) and also seals us in him (cf. 2 Corinthians 1:22; Ephesians 1:23, 4:30). Because this seal indicates the indelible effect of the anointing with the Holy Spirit in the sacrament of Baptism,
Baptism indeed is the seal of eternal life." 87 The faithful Christian who has "kept the seal" until the end, remaining faithful to the demands of his Baptism, will be able to depart this life "marked with the sign of faith," 88 with his baptismal faith, in expectation of the blessed vision of God - the consummation of faith - and in the hope of resurrection.
St. Paul tells the faithful at Ephesus that they have been “sealed with the promised Holy Spirit.” This is in terms of an indelible character imprinted on the soul in the sacraments of baptism and confirmation. It is not as if this invisible mark is simply decorative. Rather, through it, we are enabled to participate in Christ’s mission and in his offices of priest, prophet, and king. Eph 1:13
Sealed by God eph 1:13 sealed by God (ez 36:25-27) in the ark of salvation by baptism just as Noah was sealed by God in the ark of the flood gen 7:16
1 Pet 3:20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.
21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!
(Ark of Noah a type of the church, member of Christ and his church and salvation by baptism!)
(Outside the ark of Noah none were saved, outside the church (the ark of salvation) none are saved!)
[QUOTE="David in NJ, post: 1151712, member:
In all scripture there is only one “handmaid of the Lord”
And it ain’t you
In all scripture there is only one “handmaid of the Lord”
And it ain’t you
Webers_Home
Well-Known Member
Bruce Atkinson
Active Member
In case anyone missed my post #140 in this thread, here's a condensed version of the need to look at context:
Let's look at the word 'rock' as used in the Bible. It's used in a total of 119 times in 106 verses in the KJV.
Old Testament -
Exodus 17:6 Behold, I will stand before thee there upon the rock in Horeb; and thou shalt smite the rock, and there shall come water out of it, that the people may drink. And Moses did so in the sight of the elders of Israel.
Deuteronomy 32:4 He is the Rock, his work is perfect: for all his ways are judgment: a God of truth and without iniquity, just and right is he.
2 Samuel 22:2 And he said, The LORD is my rock, and my fortress, and my deliverer;
2 Samuel 22:3 The God of my rock; in him will I trust: he is my shield, and the horn of my salvation, my high tower, and my refuge, my saviour; thou savest me from violence.
Psalms 62:2 He only is my rock and my salvation; he is my defence; I shall not be greatly moved.
New Testament
Matthew 7:24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:
1 Corinthians 10:4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ. (all quotes from the KJV, underlining mine)
So, unless one looks at the context of where the rock was used, then treating every 'rock' reference in the Bible to a large hard stone would be completely wrong.
Many times, the context of a verse is self evident. Only the spiritually blind would miss it.
Referring to peter as the rock of which Christ builds what He calls His church?
why did Christ change Peter’s name?
Bruce Atkinson
Active Member
In a few places in the KJV, the name Cephas is used to refer to Peter. Most notably,
John 1:42 And he brought him to Jesus. And when Jesus beheld him, he said, Thou art Simon the son of Jona: thou shalt be called Cephas, which is by interpretation, A stone. (KJV)
Why did Jesus call him a stone? I can only guess that He knew Peter will be the leader of the disciples after His ascension to heaven. Of special note, though, is Jesus is calling him a stone, not a rock.
As I noted in #267, 2 posts above, ones' thinking that Peter is either a solid, large rock, or the Lord in Matthew 16:18 is incorrect. So, to my thinking, the 'rock' being referred to is either the foundation of faith shown by Peter or Jesus knows that it is Peter that will defend Paul in the Jerusalem council (Galatians 2) roughly 20 years later as a witness that Gentile believers in Jesus' death for sins, burial and resurrection on the 3rd day according to scriptures are being saved, thus validating the beginning of the Gentile church(es) we know today.
Matthew 16:17-18 (KJV)
17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.
18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
"You are Christ the Son of the living God" is the rock that the Church will be built on.
not must be Peter’s person
Peter is already administering the kingdom
Already acting in the person of Christ even acting as mediator
It is Jesus Christ who identifies peter with himself!
Matt 17:24 And when they were come to Capernaum, they that received tribute money came to Peter, and said, Doth not your master pay tribute?
25 He saith, Yes. And when he was come into the house, Jesus prevented him, saying, What thinkest thou, Simon? of whom do the kings of the earth take custom or tribute? of their own children, or of strangers?
26 Peter saith unto him, Of strangers. Jesus saith unto him, Then are the children free.
27 Notwithstanding, lest we should offend them, go thou to the sea, and cast an hook, and take up the fish that first cometh up; and when thou hast opened his mouth, thou shalt find a piece of money: that take, and give unto them for me and thee.
It is Jesus Christ who identifies peter with himself! Matt 17:27
Jesus Christ gives the keys of the kingdom to peter matt 16:18-19 making him prime minister applying Isa 22:21-22 to peter
It’s Christ who does this
Why is the name of peter even mentioned?
Why does Christ change Peter’s name, God changing a persons name like Abram to Abraham or Jacob to Israel always signifies a mission or ministry!
Why does Christ give him the keys of jurisdictional authority that the prime minister holds under the king to administer the kingdom?
How do you govern the church and administer the kingdom with a confession?
How do you give jurisdictional authority to a confession? (Keys of the kingdom)
How do you give a confession the power to bind and loose?
also have to explain
Isa 22:21-22 jurisdictional authority of the keys and called father
Matt 28:19 go teach baptize
Jn 20:21-23 same mission power and authority as christ
Eph 2:20 church built on the apostles
Matt 23 successors of Moses have the jurisdictional authority and the power to bind and loose which Christ says must be obeyed, then taken from them matt 21:43 given to Peter and the apostles and their successors
Lk 22:29 And I appoint unto you a kingdom, as my Father hath appointed unto me;
30 That ye may eat and drink at my table in my kingdom, and sit on thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel.
31 And the Lord said, Simon, Simon, behold, Satan hath desired to have you, that he may sift you as wheat: (plural Peter and his successors)
32 But I have prayed for thee, that thy faith fail not: and when thou art converted, strengthen thy brethren.
Applies only to Peter as “prince of the apostles”!
Peter and his successors are the Leader of the apostles and the head of the church until Christ returns!
Matt 10:2 Now the names of the twelve apostles are these; The first, Simon, who is called Peter,
Lk 22:29 And I appoint unto you a kingdom, as my Father hath appointed unto me;
30 That ye may eat and drink at my table in my kingdom, and sit on thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel.
31 And the Lord said, Simon, Simon, behold, Satan hath desired to have you, that he may sift you as wheat: (plural Peter and his successors)
32 But I have prayed for thee, that thy faith fail not: and when thou art converted, strengthen thy brethren.
Lk 22:32 Christ prayed for Peter!
Peter is head of the church!
Isa 22:21-22 21 And I will clothe him with thy robe, and strengthen him with thy girdle, and I will commit thy government into his hand: and he shall be a father to the inhabitants of Jerusalem, and to the house of Judah.
22 And the key of the house of David will I lay upon his shoulder; so he shall open, and none shall shut; and he shall shut, and none shall open.
Matt 16:19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.
Matt 23:1 power and authority of the kingdom known in the keys and binding and loosing, Matt 21:43 kingdom shall be taken from you given to another who will bear fruit. (Peter the apostles in holy church Lk 22:29)
Matt 17:27 Jesus identified peter with himself.
Matt 16:17 Peter alone received revelation from the Father
Lk 22:32 Peter to strengthen his brethren (the apostles)
Jn 21:17 feed my sheep
Peter exercises his authority over the apostles and the church!
Acts 1:15
Acts 3:4
Acts 5:5 5:10
Acts 15:7
ONLY TO PETER CHRIST SAID: THOU ART PETER AND UPON THIS ROCK I WILL BUILT MY CHURCH, AND THE GATES OF HELL SHALL NOT PREVAIL AGAINST IT!Matt 16:18
Peter is the prime minister, father, and head of the church on earth until Christ returns Isa 22:21-22
Seat of peter remains Until Christ returns
Matt 28:19-20
Matthew 5:14
Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid.
Rom 14:10 But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.
4 important questions:
1) How do you govern the church and administer the kingdom with a confession?
2) How do you give jurisdictional authority to a confession? (Keys of the kingdom)
3) How do you give a confession the power to bind and loose?
4) why did Christ give the keys to Peter (and only to Peter) keys of jurisdictional authority. Isa 22:21-22 why even bother to mention Peter if he is not involved?
Explain Jn 20:21 Peter and the apostles and their successors have the same mission, ministry, power, and authority as Christ! “As the father sent me, so I send you”!
Matt 28:19 christ communicates his authority to peter and the apostles to teach all nations, baptize all disciples!
Jn 20:21-23 apostles even have authority to forgive sins
Eph 2:20 church built on the apostles
Matt 23 the authority and power of the successors of Moses required to be obeyed are taken from them and given to Peter and the apostles
Jn 21:17
Peter commanded to Feed my sheep:
Webers_Home
Well-Known Member
.
FAQ: From whence did baby Jesus obtain a Y chromosome for his male
gender?
A: In the beginning, Eve's entire body was constructed with material taken
from Adam's body.
Seeing as how Eve is the mother of all women, then any material taken from
Mary's body to construct a Y chromosome for baby Jesus would be owed to
Eve's body.
The beauty of it is that a Y chromosome constructed with material taken
from Mary's body would not be an alien substance created ex nihilo; but
would be 100% natural, and easily traceable all the way back to Eve, and
from thence to the very dust that was used to construct Adam's body.
I can't prove any of this of course, but nevertheless I sincerely believe that
what I suggest herein actually took place when the power of the Most High
overshadowed Jesus' mom per Luke 1:35; and if my suggestion is true, then
little Jesus was thoroughly my fellow top to bottom-- biologically descended,
as I, from the Man that God created in the book of Genesis.
• Heb 2:17 . . He had to be made like his brethren in every way
_
FAQ: From whence did baby Jesus obtain a Y chromosome for his male
gender?
A: In the beginning, Eve's entire body was constructed with material taken
from Adam's body.
Seeing as how Eve is the mother of all women, then any material taken from
Mary's body to construct a Y chromosome for baby Jesus would be owed to
Eve's body.
The beauty of it is that a Y chromosome constructed with material taken
from Mary's body would not be an alien substance created ex nihilo; but
would be 100% natural, and easily traceable all the way back to Eve, and
from thence to the very dust that was used to construct Adam's body.
I can't prove any of this of course, but nevertheless I sincerely believe that
what I suggest herein actually took place when the power of the Most High
overshadowed Jesus' mom per Luke 1:35; and if my suggestion is true, then
little Jesus was thoroughly my fellow top to bottom-- biologically descended,
as I, from the Man that God created in the book of Genesis.
• Heb 2:17 . . He had to be made like his brethren in every way
_
Both Matthew and Luke leave no room for doubt on that (Mt 1:18; Lk 1:34–35, 3:23). That virginal motherhood is the guarantor of both Jesus’ divinity and Jesus’ humanity. It safeguards the truth that he was both fully God and fully man
Webers_Home
Well-Known Member
.
It is commonly believed among a pretty large number of Christians that
accountability for Adam's eating the forbidden fruit is transmitted to children
by means of their parents. But the language and grammar in the epistle to
Romans indicates that everyone's participation in Adam's act took place in
real time rather than taking place in their own time.
• Rom 5:12 . .Through one person sin entered the world, and through sin,
death, and thus death came to all, inasmuch as all sinned
The words "all sinned" are grammatically past tense rather than present or
future. In other words; everyone that is related, was related, and/or shall be
related to Adam took part in his act right then; whether virgin conceived or
normally conceived makes no difference because the act isn't transmitted by
one's parents, it was transmitted to everyone solely by one man working
alone and no one else. There's more.
• Rom 5:19 . .Through the disobedience of one person the many were made
sinners,
The words "were made sinners" are grammatically past tense rather than
present or future. In other words; everyone that is related, was related,
and/or shall be related to Adam became sinners by his act right then;
whether virgin conceived or normally conceived makes no difference
because complicity in Adam's act isn't transmitted by one's parents, it was
transmitted to everyone solely by one man working alone, and no one else.
There's more yet.
• Rom 5:12 . .Therefore, just as through one person sin entered the world,
and through sin, death, and thus death came to all
The words "death came to all" are grammatically past tense rather than
present or future. In other words; everyone that is related, was related,
and/or shall be related to Adam was condemned to death by his act right
then; whether virgin conceived or normally conceived makes no difference
because the death sentence isn't transmitted by one's parents, it was
transmitted to everyone solely by one man working alone, and no one else.
Now if Jesus Christ is our fellow man, then he too was affected by Adam's
act; which means of course that had Jesus not been crucified he would've
eventually died anyway just like everyone else.
_
It is commonly believed among a pretty large number of Christians that
accountability for Adam's eating the forbidden fruit is transmitted to children
by means of their parents. But the language and grammar in the epistle to
Romans indicates that everyone's participation in Adam's act took place in
real time rather than taking place in their own time.
• Rom 5:12 . .Through one person sin entered the world, and through sin,
death, and thus death came to all, inasmuch as all sinned
The words "all sinned" are grammatically past tense rather than present or
future. In other words; everyone that is related, was related, and/or shall be
related to Adam took part in his act right then; whether virgin conceived or
normally conceived makes no difference because the act isn't transmitted by
one's parents, it was transmitted to everyone solely by one man working
alone and no one else. There's more.
• Rom 5:19 . .Through the disobedience of one person the many were made
sinners,
The words "were made sinners" are grammatically past tense rather than
present or future. In other words; everyone that is related, was related,
and/or shall be related to Adam became sinners by his act right then;
whether virgin conceived or normally conceived makes no difference
because complicity in Adam's act isn't transmitted by one's parents, it was
transmitted to everyone solely by one man working alone, and no one else.
There's more yet.
• Rom 5:12 . .Therefore, just as through one person sin entered the world,
and through sin, death, and thus death came to all
The words "death came to all" are grammatically past tense rather than
present or future. In other words; everyone that is related, was related,
and/or shall be related to Adam was condemned to death by his act right
then; whether virgin conceived or normally conceived makes no difference
because the death sentence isn't transmitted by one's parents, it was
transmitted to everyone solely by one man working alone, and no one else.
Now if Jesus Christ is our fellow man, then he too was affected by Adam's
act; which means of course that had Jesus not been crucified he would've
eventually died anyway just like everyone else.
_
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Webers_Home
Well-Known Member
.
The so-called fallen nature is believed to be propagated by men. Along with
that is the belief that baby Jesus eluded the fallen nature by his virgin
conception.
Oh? Then whence did Eve obtain the fallen nature?
She was constructed with material taken from Adam's body prior to the
forbidden fruit incident. Since himself tasted the fruit after his wife was
already in existence; then it was impossible for Adam to pass the fallen
nature to her by means of procreation.
In the past, I was sure that the chemistry of the forbidden fruit had
something to do with the first couple's altered moral perception; but now I
seriously doubt it because Eve was the first to eat the fruit, and when she
did, nothing happened. Eve remained just as shameless in the buff as
before. It wasn't till Adam tasted the fruit that she began to feel exposed; so
I'm pretty sure that the underlying cause is far more serious than the
chemistry of that fruit.
If Eve's fallen condition wasn't due to the fruit, nor due to Adam's genetics,
then what? Well; obviously the Serpent did it to them, a.k.a. the Devil (Rev
20:2)
He has the power of death (Heb 2:14) and the ability to tamper with the
human body and the human mind in ways not easily detected; e.g. Luke
13:16, Mark 5:1-5, and Eph 2:2.
The Serpent was apparently all set and ready to wield his power the moment
that Adam crossed the line and ate that fruit. It amazes me how quickly it
takes effect. Not long after Adam tasted the fruit, he and his wife both
immediately set to work cobbling together some rudimentary aprons to
cover up their pelvic areas.
FAQ: Why wasn't the woman effected by the Serpent's power when she
tasted the forbidden fruit?
A: It was apparently God's decision that if sin and death were to come into
the world, they would come via a lone male's actions just as life and
righteousness would later be offered to the world via a lone male's actions.
(Rom 5:12-21)
FAQ: When does the Serpent go to work on people. . . in the womb or out of
the womb?
A: Adam and his wife demonstrate that it can be done on adults, but I'm
guessing that for most of us it's in the womb; and if not in the womb, then
certainly no later than when we're born. (Ps 51:5 & 58:3)
As for baby Jesus, it's very likely that the Devil was simply unable to
overcome the eternal life abiding within him.
• John 5:26 . . As the Father has life in himself, so He has granted the Son to
have life in himself.
• 1John 5:11 . . God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in His son.
• 1John 4:4 . .The one who is in you is greater than the one who is in the
world.
_
The so-called fallen nature is believed to be propagated by men. Along with
that is the belief that baby Jesus eluded the fallen nature by his virgin
conception.
Oh? Then whence did Eve obtain the fallen nature?
She was constructed with material taken from Adam's body prior to the
forbidden fruit incident. Since himself tasted the fruit after his wife was
already in existence; then it was impossible for Adam to pass the fallen
nature to her by means of procreation.
In the past, I was sure that the chemistry of the forbidden fruit had
something to do with the first couple's altered moral perception; but now I
seriously doubt it because Eve was the first to eat the fruit, and when she
did, nothing happened. Eve remained just as shameless in the buff as
before. It wasn't till Adam tasted the fruit that she began to feel exposed; so
I'm pretty sure that the underlying cause is far more serious than the
chemistry of that fruit.
If Eve's fallen condition wasn't due to the fruit, nor due to Adam's genetics,
then what? Well; obviously the Serpent did it to them, a.k.a. the Devil (Rev
20:2)
He has the power of death (Heb 2:14) and the ability to tamper with the
human body and the human mind in ways not easily detected; e.g. Luke
13:16, Mark 5:1-5, and Eph 2:2.
The Serpent was apparently all set and ready to wield his power the moment
that Adam crossed the line and ate that fruit. It amazes me how quickly it
takes effect. Not long after Adam tasted the fruit, he and his wife both
immediately set to work cobbling together some rudimentary aprons to
cover up their pelvic areas.
FAQ: Why wasn't the woman effected by the Serpent's power when she
tasted the forbidden fruit?
A: It was apparently God's decision that if sin and death were to come into
the world, they would come via a lone male's actions just as life and
righteousness would later be offered to the world via a lone male's actions.
(Rom 5:12-21)
FAQ: When does the Serpent go to work on people. . . in the womb or out of
the womb?
A: Adam and his wife demonstrate that it can be done on adults, but I'm
guessing that for most of us it's in the womb; and if not in the womb, then
certainly no later than when we're born. (Ps 51:5 & 58:3)
As for baby Jesus, it's very likely that the Devil was simply unable to
overcome the eternal life abiding within him.
• John 5:26 . . As the Father has life in himself, so He has granted the Son to
have life in himself.
• 1John 5:11 . . God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in His son.
• 1John 4:4 . .The one who is in you is greater than the one who is in the
world.
_
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that’s the purpose for the immaculate conception to prevent Christ from being contaminated with original sin
I'm not sure I agree that Christ needed the immaculate conception for that purpose. Mary was not without sin. I do not think God needed man for assurance of Jesus Christ deity or a sinless life. On the surface your statement has some merit but with serious thought I can't see it.
"For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy." I Cor 7:14
Webers_Home
Well-Known Member
.
According to the language and grammar of Rom 5:12-21, original sin isn't
transmitted by one's parents; it was transmitted to everyone long, long ago
as a one-time event by one solo man working alone, and no others; not
even his wife even though she had a role in the caper.
_
According to the language and grammar of Rom 5:12-21, original sin isn't
transmitted by one's parents; it was transmitted to everyone long, long ago
as a one-time event by one solo man working alone, and no others; not
even his wife even though she had a role in the caper.
_
What could this verse possibly mean? Paul was conscious of the reality that as the early church grew in numbers as the gospel was preached, there would arise situations within the church where members of the community have unbelieving spouses whom they married prior to their conversion – creating these sort of these seemingly ‘impure’ marriages where one spouse was a ‘believer’ and the other was an ‘unbeliever’. Believing spouses often felt the tension in their marriages, and wondered whether the union with their spouses defiled them, defiled Christ, and defiled their children. Others began to even ponder whether to divorce their unbelieving spouses in order to find and marry a Christian partner.
Paul was not about to make the cross of Christ the trademark for homewrecking. It would bring great disrepute to Christ and his gospel if Christian spouses were infamously known by their neighbours for destroying their marriages by leaving their pagan husbands and wives for other men and women of the faith. This is why Paul says in verse 12 that if “any brother has a wife who is not a believer and she is willing to live with him, he must not divorce her” (cf. 7:13). This marital union in no way defiles the believer or their children, “For the unbelieving husband has been sanctified through his wife, and the unbelieving wife has been sanctified through her believing husband” (7:14). What we see is the very opposite – the family home becomes set apart by the very presence of that Christian spouse.
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