Man has a part in his salvation=things to do, believe and say.

[justbyfaith]

Eph 2:8, For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Eph 2:9, Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Rom 5:1, Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:
Rom 5:2, By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.

So faith precedes grace.

 

[justbyfaith]

You cannot ask and receive apart from faith (I think that this is a given).

Therefore, since we receive the Holy Spirit through asking (cf. Luke 11:9-13), I would say that faith precedes receiving the Holy Spirit.

 

[Dave L]

At what point does grace come in...before or after faith and/or receiving the Holy Spirit?

In what order do you put faith, grace, and receiving the Holy Spirit?

1) _______
2) _______
3) _______

1) Arbitrary election of some fallen in Adam to salvation in Christ before the foundation of the world. 2) Christ paid for their sins on the cross before the foundation of the world in God's eternal decree. 3) God regenerates the elect in time giving them a heart to love him and an understanding of the truth evidenced by faith, a fruit of the Holy Spirit. Based on this, repentance and a holy life follows as the elect become more and more Christ like in their thinking and works of love.

 

[Dave L]

I have heard that a person can be saved (by grace) and then the Holy Spirit can come upon them later on in life. What do you think of this?

People are either saved eternally in God's mind or they are lost eternally in God's mind.

 

[Dave L]

Gal 3:14, That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.

The Holy Spirit produces faith in us that is evidence God saved us and the promises apply to us. We live expecting to receive them in faith.

 

[justbyfaith]

cont'd from #342...

So faith precedes grace and the Holy Spirit biblically.

Now, does the Holy Spirit precede grace, or does grace precede the Holy Spirit?

The answer actually does not matter to me too much.

What matters is that faith precedes grace and the Holy Spirit; and the latter two can come in either order, afaic.

 

[Dave L]

So faith precedes grace and the Holy Spirit biblically.

Now, does the Holy Spirit precede grace, or does grace precede the Holy Spirit?

The answer actually does not matter to me too much.

What matters is that faith precedes grace and the Holy Spirit; and the latter two can come in either order, afaic.

Grace; regeneration; faith; perseverance in holiness.

 

[justbyfaith]

The Holy Spirit produces faith in us that is evidence God saved us and the promises apply to us. We live expecting to receive them in faith.

You say that in contradiction to the scripture that you were answering. So you do not believe the Bible is the word of God?

 

[justbyfaith]

Grace; regeneration; faith; perseverance in holiness.

Again, in contradiction to certain scriptures, as Romans 5:2, which tell us that faith precedes grace in the Christian's life.

 

[Dave L]

You say that in contradiction to the scripture that you were answering. So you do not believe the Bible is the word of God?

You are reading works into scripture that are not there. It happens as a result of indoctrination. But if you try you can usually come to an understanding of grace.

 

[Dave L]

Again, in contradiction to certain scriptures, as Romans 5:2, which tell us that faith precedes grace in the Christian's life.

You are reading works into the passage. Try again.

 

[justbyfaith]

You are reading works into the passage. Try again.

And again, it should be clear from Ephesians 2:8-9 that faith and works are mutually exclusive.

 

[Waiting on him]

Again, in contradiction to certain scriptures, as Romans 5:2, which tell us that faith precedes grace in the Christian's life.

Romans 3:10-12 KJV
[10] As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: [11] There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. [12] They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.

Tecarta BibleYour implying that you were seeking God prior to rebirth Are you trying to make him a liar? Are you that puffed up

 

[justbyfaith]

You are reading works into scripture that are not there. It happens as a result of indoctrination. But if you try you can usually come to an understanding of grace.

Being condescending is not going to get you anywhere with me. I understand grace quite well, thank you very much.

 

[Dave L]

And again, it should be clear from Ephesians 2:8-9 that faith and works are mutually exclusive.

You must believe before you can act. And Faith is a fruit of the Holy Spirit.

 

[justbyfaith]

Romans 3:10-12 KJV
[10] As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: [11] There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. [12] They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.

Tecarta BibleYour implying that you were seeking God. Are you trying to make him a liar? Are you that puffed up

The scripture says that we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand. That means faith is the key that opens the door to the room we call grace. If I tell you that Jesus gives you the key, will that satisfy you? That would be an act of grace on Jesus' part, it is still not equal to the grace that we receive once we have entered in through the door.

 

[Dave L]

The scripture says that we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand. That means faith is the key that opens the door to the room we call grace. If I tell you that Jesus gives you the key, will that satisfy you? That would be an act of grace on Jesus' part, it is still not equal to the grace that we receive once we have entered in through the door.

A person must be saved before they can believe in the true sense.

 

[farouk]

The Holy Spirit produces faith in us that is evidence God saved us and the promises apply to us. We live expecting to receive them in faith.

Well, exactly. And we need day by day to "grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ" (2 Peter 3.18).

 

[Waiting on him]

You must believe before you can act. And Faith is a fruit of the Holy Spirit.

This troubles me many fail to see this. Does this mean they are void of the Spirit,or are they just possibly following a bad teaching?

 

[Dave L]

This troubles me many fail to see this. Does this mean they are void of the Spirit,or are they just possibly following a bad teaching?

I think so. But some are no doubt still in the dark on some matters.