My agnostic friend says: "I don't need it." - How would you respond?

[St. SteVen]

My agnostic friend acknowledges that some people need something, like religion, to help them get along in life.
He considers himself to be in the group that doesn't need something, like religion, to help him get along in life.

I think this is his polite way of saying, crutches are fine for those who need them, but he doesn't need one.
Ironically, he walks using a cane. - LOL

Humor aside, how would you respond? Why do we need a relationship with God?
Or, more to the point, why does he need a relationship with God? Remember, he is agnostic,
so appeals to the existence of God and the reliability of the Bible have little bearing.

He was raised Lutheran, baptized and confirmed in the church.
Stopped going to church at some point. Married a Catholic woman that was also estranged from the church.
Which ended in a nasty divorce which nearly destroyed my friend. I have been an important support for him.
He is now remarried to a Protestant Christian who is also estranged from the church, but has a relationship with God.

/ cc: @ChristisGod @mailmandan @Lizbeth @quietthinker @amadeus @David in NJ @Hillsage @Lambano @Peterlag @marks @1stCenturyLady @St. SteVen

 

[amadeus]

Growing up I tried to be a devout Catholic. I backslid from that shortly after high school. In my 20's I may have been where your friend is. I decided I did not need God even though I never denied His existence. I trudged along my own way for few years even marrying during that time. When I was 32 my marriage was falling apart. It was then that we, my wife and I, asked some Christian friends to watch our kids while we went alone somewhere to somehow patch up our marriage. We had no intention initially to come to God, but that is what happened. Those Christian friends had never pushed us, but they were always there with any help they were able to provide in the way of babysitting, working on our car and so forth. Hoping to save our marriage intended to ask them to them to babysit our two toddlers. We ended up asking them to take us to church with them. They did and that was 48 years ago. God saved us and our marriage.

The key was that that family always served God but never pushed us or anyone to walk as they walked. Their lives were their witness to us. Will that work with your friend? I don't know, but God gives the increase. He may use you if you are ready to be used when and if the time comes...

 

[ScottA]

My agnostic friend acknowledges that some people need something, like religion, to help them get along in life.
He considers himself to be in the group that doesn't need something, like religion, to help him get along in life.

I think this is his polite way of saying, crutches are fine for those who need them, but he doesn't need one.
Ironically, he walks using a cane. - LOL

Humor aside, how would you respond? Why do we need a relationship with God?
Or, more to the point, why does he need a relationship with God? Remember, he is agnostic,
so appeals to the existence of God and the reliability of the Bible have little bearing.

He was raised Lutheran, baptized and confirmed in the church.
Stopped going to church at some point. Married a Catholic woman that was also estranged from the church.
Which ended in a nasty divorce which nearly destroyed my friend. I have been an important support for him.
He is now remarried to a Protestant Christian who is also estranged from the church, but has a relationship with God.

/ cc: @ChristisGod @mailmandan @Lizbeth @quietthinker @amadeus @David in NJ @Hillsage @Lambano @Peterlag @marks @1stCenturyLady @St. SteVen

That's the George Carlin explanation ("like orthopedic shoes")--and truly--no one needs "religion", in fact we would all be better off without it entirely. But that only refers to the short version of life (life in this world).

However, what many do not understand is that this short life comes with a gift from God and the option of living forever as you only briefly experience it in the prime of your life. What one is supposed to do...is not look at all this world as only the typical ups and downs that it is, but as an opportunity to attain what most only dream of in this life. Which is only done by close observation to the would-be "coincidences" that are placed in everyone's life as clues--and follow them!

Alternatively, you can indeed consider all the coincidences that are too many to be coincidence, as just that...and pass on that greater opportunity. It's a choice.

 

[MatthewG]

I would just say "Okay" and continue on with life. If times occurred of sharing and allowance of sharing things pertaining to the bible, then so be it.

 

[St. SteVen]

The key was that that family always served God but never pushed us or anyone to walk as they walked. Their lives were their witness to us. Will that work with your friend? I don't know, but God gives the increase. He may use you if you are ready to be used when and if the time comes...

That has been my approach basically.
I have known this gentleman for some 35 years. We were business colleagues.

We have continued the friendship. I really consider him to be my best friend.
He chose me as Best Man for his recent wedding.

But we talk often about spiritual things among many other mutual interests.
He commented to me the other day about how many Christians he knows.

The minister that officiated his wedding grew up in the same church as I did.
Small world. Maybe he'll get the message soon.

/

 

[Reggie Belafonte]

We do not need religion, we need Christ Jesus first and foremost in our life.
Everyone is religious in fact regardless of what they may claim in fact ! For they have idols that they look up to in this world in fact, as Jesus said of this world, that it is full of deceptions and delusions ! Jesus was totally correct on that and if one does not understand that issue they one is not Saved in fact, because that is the Key ! So one is a goose if you are playing along with this world. One has to seek The Kingdom of God ! to be Saved, least you be not in tune with Christ Jesus and become an abomination in fact, for such a one is Lost to this world.

When one is truly born again then you are the body of Christ and he is the Head ! and you are well pleased to serve him and you have riches beyond what any carnal man can dream of !

When people bag a Church or Christians they may be honest about that is the case from where they stand ? as they see it ! but they are Lost to the real issue. for they do not know Christ Jesus ! for most in the Churches don't ether, for they are only religious dupes, they are on about their religion ! that's devoid of Christ Jesus in fact ! For no Church nowadays will preach Christ Jesus for fear of offending the dupes !

You can preach Political Correctness and who will call such out, let along truly understand what this Idol that they serve so religiously truly is at all. For the zeal they have for PC if only they were that devoted to Christianity ? but if the Dupes truly knew that they serve the same ilk as the foundations of Nazism and Communism in fact, for they are the PC Kings in fact, for without PC such as the Nazis and Communist would never had a leg to stand on in fact ! but they of this world are drawn to such like fly's to such an infestation in fact, for they are Lost ! For They know not what they do ? because they are Lost to this world in fact.

You must seek the Kingdom of God ! for all will be added to you ! Then you will not be a Slave to such numb skull's !
You were born into this world a Slave to it and you need to progress out of Slavery, that's why Jesus said you must be born again, then this world is as dead to you ? for you do not abide in it, for you abide in Christ Jesus in fact first and foremost in your Life ! they you are not a Slave to such, you have become a Man ! not only a Boy or Girl anymore.

 

[Lambano]

I find his perception that following Christ fulfills some kind of need interesting. (A need that apparently he doesn't have.) There's some truth to that. What needs does following Christ fill?

• Dealing with our mortality and our fear?
• Assuaging our guilt for our sin?
• A need for purpose and meaning in life, to be part of something greater than ourselves?
• Our need to be loved?

I remember somebody (from my Bible study group?) saying that when she came to Christ, or when Jesus found her, He satisfied needs she didn't even know she had.

 

[Lambano]

Are there better reasons to follow Christ, other than we need a crutch?

 

[Windmillcharge]

how would you respond? Why do we need a relationship with God?
Or, more to the point, why does he need a relationship with God? Remember, he is agnostic,

Put the ball in his court and ask him just what does he believe about God?
Then ask him, what evidence does he have for that belief?

Scroll to the bottom of this article for a series of posts that give rational reasons for believing in God.
:-https://winteryknight.com/2023/11/09/atheist-gets-her-phd-in-astronomy-and-astrophysics-and-finds-evidence-for-god-8/

Have the attitude, he can believe what he likes, so long as he has a rational reason for believing it.
Be sure that you do too.

 

[St. SteVen]

Everyone is religious in fact regardless of what they may claim in fact ! For they have idols that they look up to in this world in fact,

I think this is a key point. Thanks. Spot on!
My friend is already relying on some, or many, things that he NEEDS.

Time for a study in COMPARATIVE "religions" with my friend. - LOL
He claims he doesn't need religion, but he already has one.
"How is that working?"

/

 

[Lambano]

Are there better reasons to follow Christ, other than we need a crutch?

I suppose at least it's good to know how badly I'm limping and need a crutch.

 

[St. SteVen]

Are there better reasons to follow Christ, other than we need a crutch?

Agree.
And I think my friend sees "religion" as a way some people use just to stay afloat.
But we know that it is much more elevating than that.

And I testify about what God means in my life, but he tends to rationalize it away.
As if God didn't really help me in that situation, there was another reason, or circumstance.

And I think one MAJOR roadblock for him is politics.
The Christians he sees in the political realm are the worst people imaginable to him.
And that seems well-supported. Both politicians and conservative supporters.
I suppose the last thing he wants is to be aligned with that bunch.

/

 

[St. SteVen]

Have the attitude, he can believe what he likes, so long as he has a rational reason for believing it.
Be sure that you do too.

Thanks for your post and that link, I'll check it out.
Tell me what you think about this.

It seems to me that ultimately there is no leak-proof rational apologetic for the existence of God.
Reason being, it requires faith to come to God. If it was subjective truth, there would be no other reasonable option.

/

 

[St. SteVen]

I suppose at least it's good to know how badly I'm limping and need a crutch.

LOL
Your statement may ring truer than you know.

I saw a Christian forum topic some time back that asked the question:
If there were no afterlife, would you still follow Jesus?

I was shocked that the overwhelming majority of respondents said "No!"
Which I interpreted to mean that they saw NO VALUE in following Jesus in the here and now.
I was ill at the thought. And argued for the value. They just couldn't comprehend it. - smh

/

 

[St. SteVen]

I'll be meeting with my friend on Saturday if anyone wants to join me in a prayer
that God puts the right words in my mouth in that situation. Thanks.

Romans 8:26-27 NIV
In the same way, the Spirit helps us in our weakness.
We do not know what we ought to pray for,
but the Spirit himself intercedes for us through wordless groans.
27 And he who searches our hearts knows the mind of the Spirit,
because the Spirit intercedes for God’s people in accordance with the will of God.

/ @Lambano @Windmillcharge @MatthewG @Reggie Belafonte @ScottA @amadeus

 

[amadeus]

That has been my approach basically.
I have known this gentleman for some 35 years. We were business colleagues.

We have continued the friendship. I really consider him to be my best friend.
He chose me as Best Man for his recent wedding.

But we talk often about spiritual things among many other mutual interests.
He commented to me the other day about how many Christians he knows.

The minister that officiated his wedding grew up in the same church as I did.
Small world. Maybe he'll get the message soon.

/

Holding both him and you in prayer on this.

 

[Reggie Belafonte]

I'll be meeting with my friend on Saturday if anyone wants to join me in a prayer
that God puts the right words in my mouth in that situation. Thanks.

Romans 8:26-27 NIV
In the same way, the Spirit helps us in our weakness.
We do not know what we ought to pray for,
but the Spirit himself intercedes for us through wordless groans.
27 And he who searches our hearts knows the mind of the Spirit,
because the Spirit intercedes for God’s people in accordance with the will of God.

/ @Lambano @Windmillcharge @MatthewG @Reggie Belafonte @ScottA @amadeus

I have an idiot mate for years as such, then i gave up on him because i came to understand truly where he was at.
Then he came to me talking about supporting Christianity ? but the fact is, he is the type you do not need on your side in fact for he is a radical nut case who gets it all wrong !

I remember a mates Dad a Christian and a real good bloke ! well next door new people moved in, atheist ! and he did the right thing to invite her to his Church, well he regretted that totally ! for she was the worst type of christian you can get, a Devil ! trouble making rat bag loony ! goody two shoes clown that was full on into everyone's business a busybody ! nothing Christian at all, just a full on menace.

My mate is such a one, not like her but something on par, one who you have to inform others that he may be a mate of mine for we ride bikes together and work together at times but as for his religious views and some of his political views, as sure as hell, do not get me mixed up in his rubbish ! i beg of you ! i am not with him.

 

[St. SteVen]

I have an idiot mate for years as such, then i gave up on him because i came to understand truly where he was at.

I'd say that pretty much shows where you are at.

It's a BIG mistake to make people projects. And then abandon them when you don't get what you want.

/

 

[thelord's_pearl]

It's against the bible to be friends with unbelievers and the Holy Spirit told me that this yr, but you can help unbelievers if they're willing to listen to you and be there for them in that way because you care. "Do not be yoked with unbelievers for what does light have to do with darkness." God said that for a reason. They can pull you down.

 

[Lambano]

I'll be meeting with my friend on Saturday if anyone wants to join me in a prayer
that God puts the right words in my mouth in that situation. Thanks.

I will join you in that prayer.