"My Ideal Home In Heaven"

[marks]

I like this! You're bringing out things I've had many discussions about with a dear friend over the last few years.

And these different "rules of being" have some application to us even now, and actually form the basis for our freedom from sin, and our ability to walk in the Spirit, and to commune with God, no matter what.

Much love!

 

[marks]

Well now, Paul was coupling those who had already gone to Heaven (i.e. the OT saints who were translated from Hades) with those still alive in the earth, to create a theological construct that all of us are essentially now seated with Christ in God because we are all part of His Body, and part of His body already was there and the rest would be eventually.

In Heaven the reality will have come and there will be not more need for theological constructs. But I do think I know what you mean in a way.

A "theological construct"? Isn't that just emptying the words of their meaning?

We are alive in Christ, and spirit children of God. God's spirit children are not terrestrial beings. For we know that if this earthly tent is folded up, we have a building from God, not made by hands, eternal in the heavens.

We have. Another "theological construct"? I'm sorry, I'm not trying to be harsh, only pointed. We have an eternal building from God, even as we live in these earthy tents. Put this together with other passages, seated in the heavenlies, hid with Christ in God, when He is revealed we shall be revealed with Him, all creation awaits the revealing of the glorious children of God,

And the whole reason we are no longer guilty of sin, and no longer under it's power, is that we are dead to our flesh by being separated from it through crucifixion with Christ, through being recreated these celestial beings, not even of the Adamic creation or line.

Much love!

 

[Hidden In Him]

A "theological construct"? Isn't that just emptying the words of their meaning?

No, Mark. Not unless you believe that living on earth as a Christian is as good an experience as living in Heaven will be. If someone suggested that, I would have to say with the apostle Paul, "If the gospel is not true, we are the most foolish of men."

But I don't wanna turn this into a debate thread, so let's just keep this to dreaming about Heaven some day. Post me some pictures of what you'd enjoy like what Pearl just did. That's the idea behind the thread.

God bless,
- H

 

[Hidden In Him]

These are beautiful, Pearl.

I remember when I was little, my great grandmother used to have a backyard that had all kinds of flowers around the entire border of it. Kinda like this looks:

She was the only Christian in my family, and I used to love going to visit. They would leave me with her for the day, and it was wonderful. We'd sit at the kitchen table and look out on the backyard, and play Monopoly and dominos, and eat cookies. Those were my fondest memories as a child, and I think she may have been the one who prayed me into eventually becoming a Christian. I didn't get saved until after she had passed away, but I think God honored her prayers regarding me.

Looking forward to seeing Grandma Grace again in Heaven some day. I bet her gardens are even more beautiful now.

 

[marks]

so let's just keep this to dreaming about Heaven some day.

I suppose we all dream in our own ways, yes?

We won't stop crying out to Him
Cause He hears us every time
Yeah He hears us every time

We won't stop pouring out our love to Him
Cause He loves us every time
Yeah He loves us every time

Wake up, the normal life
You can do what ever You want to
Shake up eternal signs
Because we want you

We won't stop going out to Him
Cause He meets us every time
Yeah He meets us every time

We won't stop living only for Him
Cause He's faithful every time
Yeah He's faithful every time

Wake up, the normal life
You can do what ever You want to
Shake up eternal signs
Because we want you

Wake up, the normal life
You can do what ever You want to God
Shake up eternal signs

Cause heaven is here now
He's all around us
Heaven is Jesus
It's the moment we meet

Wake up, the normal life
You can do what ever You want to
Shake up eternal signs
Because we want you

Much love!!

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Mansions Are Prepared for Us

As we walked up what looked like an unpaved, dirt path, I saw a gigantic house above the trees.

for the sake of conversation, when I first begin reading the word I would tape God’s promises to a wall upstairs. Bible verses mostly I got off line that claimed a promise. After going through struggles of healing I begin to pull those verses down and read them in context, sometimes they didn’t seem to be saying what I thought they were saying. A promise still, but not what I had originally thought.

two things you said, not to be a “Debbie downer” because I’m not doubting “mansions prepared” or “dwelling places to dwell in”
As in He is the restorer of paths to dwell in.

“mansions prepared for us” …mansions in the lexicon is “a dwelling place”. Mansions to me describe stately elegantly crafted structures. John 14:23-24 (an individual dwelling) or individual mansion is used only twice in the NT (both times by Christ. John 14:23-24 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him. [24] He that loves me not keeps not my sayings: and the word which you hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me. (to make one, abode, to remain, abide in Me, a dwelling place, lodging, room, mansions. Strong's Greek: 3438. μονή (moné) -- an abiding, an abode
From meno; a staying, i.e. Residence (the act or the place) -- abode, mansion

You asked if a home is not literal then how can one break in and corrupt it?
1 Corinthians 3:16-17 Know you not that you are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? [17] If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple you are.
how can any man defile the temple of God, which temple you are …unless it is a literal temple defiled?


Acts 7:48-50 However the most High dwells not in temples made with hands; as saith the prophet, [49] Heaven is my throne, and earth is my footstool: what house will you build me? saith the Lord: or what is the place of my rest? [50] Hath not my hand made all these things?

John 14:1-6 Let not your heart be troubled: you believe in God, believe also in me. [2] In my Father's house are many mansions(dwelling places), if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. [3] And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there you may be also. [4] And whither I go you know, and the way you know. [5] Thomas saith unto him, Lord, we know not where thou goest; and how can we know the way? [6] Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man comes unto the Father (a Dwelling place), but by me.

Is the way a garden of flowers in bloom with curves of bright colors on a path? Maybe so, but He seems to be saying He is the way to many dwelling places. “Mansions are prepared for us” “I go to prepare a place” …He paved the way? “As we walked up what looked like an unpaved, dirt path, I saw a gigantic house above the trees.” the Lord’s House above the trees?
(Psalm 49:6-20)

Why does it matter? Because Is there a promise in “I go to prepare a place for you, and if I go and prepare a place for you, then I will come and receive you unto myself, that where I am you will be also”
What I hear, wrong or right is…I go to prepare a place for you (in hearts. A place, room in the heart, mind body space…where every part is needful)

Then I will come again and receive you unto myself (they receive you not because there is
no room, place, or space for the Master First, if they receive not Me they won’t receive you)
That where I am, you will be also …those that Hear My voice have the Spirit and will receive of Mine, will receive of My own; that “where I am (My Spirit) there will be a place, space, room to receive you that where I am …you will be also.”
Does that makes sense? To me there is a promise that in Faith and prayer for the Holy Spirit to be given …a Gift? The Gift of Life?

 

[marks]

…I go to prepare a place for you (in hearts. A place, room in the heart, mind body space…where every part is needful)

This sounds like a living temple!



He who overcomes I will make a pillar in the house of My God.

Much love!

 

[Hidden In Him]

for the sake of conversation, when I first begin reading the word I would tape God’s promises to a wall upstairs. Bible verses mostly I got off line that claimed a promise. After going through struggles of healing I begin to pull those verses down and read them in context, sometimes they didn’t seem to be saying what I thought they were saying. A promise still, but not what I had originally thought.

two things you said, not to be a “Debbie downer” because I’m not doubting “mansions prepared” or “dwelling places to dwell in”
As in He is the restorer of paths to dwell in.

“mansions prepared for us” …mansions in the lexicon is “a dwelling place”. Mansions to me describe stately elegantly crafted structures. John 14:23-24 (an individual dwelling) or individual mansion is used only twice in the NT (both times by Christ. John 14:23-24 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him. [24] He that loves me not keeps not my sayings: and the word which you hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me. (to make one, abode, to remain, abide in Me, a dwelling place, lodging, room, mansions. Strong's Greek: 3438. μονή (moné) -- an abiding, an abode
From meno; a staying, i.e. Residence (the act or the place) -- abode, mansion

You asked if a home is not literal then how can one break in and corrupt it?
1 Corinthians 3:16-17 Know you not that you are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? [17] If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple you are.
how can any man defile the temple of God, which temple you are …unless it is a literal temple defiled?


Acts 7:48-50 However the most High dwells not in temples made with hands; as saith the prophet, [49] Heaven is my throne, and earth is my footstool: what house will you build me? saith the Lord: or what is the place of my rest? [50] Hath not my hand made all these things?

John 14:1-6 Let not your heart be troubled: you believe in God, believe also in me. [2] In my Father's house are many mansions(dwelling places), if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. [3] And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there you may be also. [4] And whither I go you know, and the way you know. [5] Thomas saith unto him, Lord, we know not where thou goest; and how can we know the way? [6] Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man comes unto the Father (a Dwelling place), but by me.

Is the way a garden of flowers in bloom with curves of bright colors on a path? Maybe so, but He seems to be saying He is the way to many dwelling places. “Mansions are prepared for us” “I go to prepare a place” …He paved the way? “As we walked up what looked like an unpaved, dirt path, I saw a gigantic house above the trees.” the Lord’s House above the trees?
(Psalm 49:6-20)

Why does it matter? Because Is there a promise in “I go to prepare a place for you, and if I go and prepare a place for you, then I will come and receive you unto myself, that where I am you will be also”
What I hear, wrong or right is…I go to prepare a place for you (in hearts. A place, room in the heart, mind body space…where every part is needful)

Then I will come again and receive you unto myself (they receive you not because there is
no room, place, or space for the Master First, if they receive not Me they won’t receive you)
That where I am, you will be also …those that Hear My voice have the Spirit and will receive of Mine, will receive of My own; that “where I am (My Spirit) there will be a place, space, room to receive you that where I am …you will be also.”
Does that makes sense? To me there is a promise that in Faith and prayer for the Holy Spirit to be given …a Gift? The Gift of Life?

I read through it, Victory, but much of your interpretations here are what's called spiritualizations of the texts. Many do this with things like "Israel" simply referring to the church now, and there is no more reference to the literal nation of Israel in scripture anymore, and God is done with the nation prophetically. Scott A is very famous for this, which is why I find him cordial but very tough to talk to on scripture sometimes. If one is not careful, the entirety of scripture can be spiritualized away into anything. But God chose a very real nation called Israel in the earth during ancient times, and will act on their behalf once again before it is done. So too with the parallels between the literal, material inheritance that the Israelites attained after entering the promised land and the literal inheritance they will inherit in the one to come. The earth will be ruled from the city of Jerusalem on this earth during the millennium, and it will not be make believe.

But I find with some it is more difficult to accept what the Spirit is saying to the churches because their faith is not strong enough yet to fully trust it, and/ or their senses are not yet attuned to hearing the voice of God to trust that either. So it's a bit of a different matter than simply misreading verses as saying something they actually don't. It's more actually a matter of faith, and where a person is in their spiritual development to believe in what the Lord actually has for them. I was once there myself.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

I read through it, Victory, but much of your interpretations here are what's called spiritualizations of the texts. Many do this with things like "Israel" simply referring to the church now, and there is no more reference to the literal nation of Israel in scripture anymore, and God is done with the nation prophetically. Scott A is very famous for this, which is why I find him cordial but very tough to talk to on scripture sometimes. If one is not careful, the entirety of scripture can be spiritualized away into anything. But God chose a very real nation called Israel in the earth during ancient times, and will act on their behalf once again before it is done. So too with the parallels between the literal, material inheritance that the Israelites attained after entering the promised land and the literal inheritance they will inherit in the one to come. The earth will be ruled from the city of Jerusalem on this earth during the millennium, and it will not be make believe.

But I find with some it is more difficult to accept what the Spirit is saying to the churches because their faith is not strong enough yet to fully trust it, and/ or their senses are not yet attuned to hearing the voice of God to trust that either. So it's a bit of a different matter than simply misreading verses as saying something they actually don't. It's more actually a matter of faith, and where a person is in their spiritual development to believe in what the Lord actually has for them. I was once there myself.

with all due respect how do you interpret
‘He that eats my flesh, and drinks my blood, dwells in me, and I in him.’ John 6:56

 

[VictoryinJesus]

This sounds like a living temple!



He who overcomes I will make a pillar in the house of My God.

Much love!

makes me think of
Psalm 23:6: Surely goodness and lovingkindness will follow me all the days of my life, And I will dwell in the house of the LORD forever.

 

[Hidden In Him]

with all due respect how do you interpret
‘He that eats my flesh, and drinks my blood, dwells in me, and I in him.’ John 6:56

Yes, some things are spiritualizations, Victory. The trick is in knowing which are and which are not. Like I said, some people spiritualize Christ away until He has supposedly not come in the flesh. In such a case they would say the Christ HAS no blood, and never did. See what I mean? The same is true of our inheritance in Heaven. It is a reality, just like Chicago and New York and England are realities, regardless of whether some wish to spiritualize Heaven into some kind of religious metaphor or not.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Like I said, some people spiritualize Christ away until He has supposedly not come in the flesh. In such a case they would say the Christ HAS no blood, and never did. See what I mean?

that is NOT what I was attempting to do. I’m not questioning if Christ has come in the flesh, or has been manifested, or am I questioning that he lowered himself and took on the likeness of our image. but that wasn’t what we were discussing but instead mansions. Do you think I would not love a mansion prepared for me? Do you think I wouldn’t love for it to be exactly as you have said and also just like all the witness accounts you have provided that says they have been there and seen the mansions? I’m only saying when I struggle those verses say something to me that sometimes, is not what I originally thought it was. You seemed to suggest it is a lack of faith. I asked what about one verse being spiritualized, and others not. You said “it is tricky”.

The same is true of our inheritance in Heaven. It is a reality, just like Chicago and New York and England are realities, regardless of whether some wish to spiritualize Heaven into some kind of religious metaphor or not.

Again, I get what you are saying. But what is the difference between sowing spiritual things and reaping carnal things? 1 Corinthians 9:11 If we have sown unto you spiritual things, is it a great thing if we shall reap your carnal things?

Is it so bad to take a step back and pause to ask if He is really speaking about many mansions as the dwelling place He prepared; saying “if it were not so, I would have told you.”

 

[Hidden In Him]

Is it so bad to take a step back and pause to ask if He is really speaking about many mansions as the dwelling place He prepared; saying “if it were not so, I would have told you.”

Yes and no. I have questioned many things about the Christian faith, especially early on in my walk with Him. But I sought Him out diligently and He began giving me answers to the questions I needed answers for...

This may or may not be a difference between us, I don't know. I wasn't necessarily saying it was a lack of faith on your part, just that it was on mine early on. I questioned the truth of creation, the existence of Heaven, etc. and especially the notion that there were mansions and luxuries there. Very early on I viewed that as a materialistic way of looking at Christianity and the promises of God, so I kinda rejected it. But this was long before I knew very much of anything. I once questioned everything so I fully sympathize with believers doing so, but I've seen the Lord confirm things to me so many times now concerning His word that I believe there also comes a time when you no longer do question things; when a lot of what the Lord has taught you just comes together and many of the questions you once had are no longer there.

But as to this question, I simply hold to what the Spirit is consistently saying regarding the issue. When supported by scripture itself, I would now consider it an act of faithlessness on my part if I didn't.

 

[Taken]

"My Ideal Home In Heaven"
OP^

Interesting.
I think Heaven is pure light yet not light as we see as white, but more so with colors we have not yet seen.
And Earth is our permanent home without a barrier to Heaven. More so the barrier opened and as it is in heaven so also shall be on Earth. Earth as intended dirt, but with the absolute beauty of heaven shining down on Earth forever.
God, Peace, Beauty of color, music and endless knowledge.

No...sorrow, sickness, diseases, landfills, garbage, stink, weeds, concrete, planes, trains, automobiles, pollution, trinket junk, plastic, stores, appliances, phones, tv’s, money, clothing, pantries, chemicals, cleaning products, cooking, creams, medicines, prisons, high rise businesses, apts., On and on...

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Yes and no. I have questioned many things about the Christian faith, especially early on in my walk with Him. But I sought Him out diligently and He began giving me answers to the questions I needed answers for...

This may or may not be a difference between us, I don't know. I wasn't necessarily saying it was a lack of faith on your part, just that it was on mine early on. I questioned the truth of creation, the existence of Heaven, etc. and especially the notion that there were mansions and luxuries there. Very early on I viewed that as a materialistic way of looking at Christianity and the promises of God, so I kinda rejected it. But this was long before I knew very much of anything. I once questioned everything so I fully sympathize with believers doing so, but I've seen the Lord confirm things to me so many times now concerning His word that I believe there also comes a time when you no longer do question things; when a lot of what the Lord has taught you just comes together and many of the questions you once had are no longer there.

But as to this question, I simply hold to what the Spirit is consistently saying regarding the issue. When supported by scripture itself, I would now consider it an act of faithlessness on my part if I didn't.

you could be right. It has only been about five or six years for me. I get some on here have decades of growth. So yeah I question a lot.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Yes and no. I have questioned many things about the Christian faith, especially early on in my walk with Him. But I sought Him out diligently and He began giving me answers to the questions I needed answers for...

This may or may not be a difference between us, I don't know. I wasn't necessarily saying it was a lack of faith on your part, just that it was on mine early on. I questioned the truth of creation, the existence of Heaven, etc. and especially the notion that there were mansions and luxuries there. Very early on I viewed that as a materialistic way of looking at Christianity and the promises of God, so I kinda rejected it. But this was long before I knew very much of anything. I once questioned everything so I fully sympathize with believers doing so, but I've seen the Lord confirm things to me so many times now concerning His word that I believe there also comes a time when you no longer do question things; when a lot of what the Lord has taught you just comes together and many of the questions you once had are no longer there.

But as to this question, I simply hold to what the Spirit is consistently saying regarding the issue. When supported by scripture itself, I would now consider it an act of faithlessness on my part if I didn't.

I woke this morning thinking about “estate” and the meaning of what is an “estate” immediately I think of an gated entrance to floral gardens, paved or a concrete drive with a mansion nestled privately behind towering oak trees.

Jude 1:6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he has reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.

The reason “estate” was on my mind this morning was because “condescend to men of low estate.” As in Romans 12:16 Be of the same mind one toward another. Mind not high things, but condescend to men of low estate. Be not wise in your own conceits.

Does this mean condescend to those based off the size and condition of their houses?

 

[Hidden In Him]

Does this mean condescend to those based off the size and condition of their houses?

No. It simply means those with a lower status in society. The translation of "estate" did not carry any intentional reference to housing, Victory; they should have avoided any confusion by simply translating the word as "lowly," because that's what he Greek word simply means.

 

[marks]

I woke this morning thinking about “estate” and the meaning of what is an “estate” immediately I think of an gated entrance to floral gardens, paved or a concrete drive with a mansion nestled privately behind towering oak trees.

Jude 1:6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he has reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.

The reason “estate” was on my mind this morning was because “condescend to men of low estate.” As in Romans 12:16 Be of the same mind one toward another. Mind not high things, but condescend to men of low estate. Be not wise in your own conceits.

Does this mean condescend to those based off the size and condition of their houses?

I don't think God is trying to point our attention to "the size of our 'mansion'", or what sort of "compound" we're going to call our private space. In this world, yes, people judge by such things, but we're not to.

"Of low estate" is just to say, they have a lowly status in society's eyes. For myself, I used to be more focused on the material, but I've come to see that the "stuff", houses, whatever, it's all like dust compared to the ability and opportunity to engage in spiritual-love relationships with others. That to me is the real treasure.

One dream I have for the eternal . . . both my father and father in owned sailboats. My FIL in particular lived on his schooner for over 40 years, sailing the world. I'd like to take a few decades or so to handcraft a sailboat so they can teach me to sail. I'd like that, I think!

Much love!