OFFICE OF POPE IN THE BIBLE

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Truth7t7

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You still can't tell the difference between good traditions that Paul commands us to keep, and the bad traditions of men. To you, all traditions are bad, there are no good traditions. This is not biblical.

One might loosely define tradition as the authoritative and authentic Christian history of theological doctrines and devotional practices. Christianity is fundamentally grounded in the earth-shattering historical events in the life of Jesus Christ (His incarnation, preaching, miracles, passion, crucifixion, resurrection, and ascension). Unfortunately, history is your enemy.

Eyewitnesses (Lk 1:1-2; Acts 1:1-3; 2 Pet 1:16-18) communicated these true stories to the early Christians, who in turn passed them on to other Christians (under the guidance of the Church’s authority) down through the ages. Therefore, Christian tradition, defined as authentic Church history, is unavoidable, and is a very good thing — not a “bad” thing at all.

Many read the accounts of Jesus’ conflicts with the Pharisees and get the idea He was utterly opposed to all tradition whatsoever. This isn’t true. A close reading of passages such as Matthew 15:3-9 and Mark 7:8-13 will reveal that He only condemned corrupt traditions of men, not tradition per se. He uses qualifying phrases like “your tradition,” “precepts of men,” “tradition of men,” as opposed to “word of God” or “the commandment of God” and so forth. St. Paul makes the same contrast:

Colossians 2:8 (RSV) ”See to it that no one makes a prey of you by philosophy and empty deceit, according to human tradition, according to the elemental spirits of the universe, and not according to Christ.”

By word of mouth or by letter
The New Testament explicitly teaches that traditions can be either good (from God) or bad (from men, when against God’s true traditions). Corrupt traditions from the Pharisees were bad; though many of their legitimate teachings were recognized by Jesus (see, e.g., Mt 23:3). The spoken gospel and the apostolic writings (some eventually formulated as Holy Scripture; some not) were altogether good — the authentic Christian tradition as revealed by the incarnate God to the apostles, and “ratified” by the Church.

The Greek word for “tradition” in the New Testament is paradosis. It occurs in Colossians 2:8, and in the following three passages:

1 Corinthians 11:2 “… maintain the traditions even as I have delivered them to you.”

2 Thessalonians 2:15 “… stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught by us, either by word of mouth or by letter.”

2 Thessalonians 3:6 “… the tradition that you received from us.”

St. Paul makes no distinction between written and oral tradition. He doesn’t regard oral Christian tradition as bad and undesirable. This is made even more clear in two other statements to Timothy:

2 Timothy 1:13 “Follow the pattern of the sound words which you have heard from me, …”

2 Timothy 2:2 “and what you have heard from me before many witnesses entrust to faithful men who will be able to teach others also.”

St. Paul is urging Timothy not only to “follow” his oral teaching which “heard from” him, but also to pass it on to others. This is a clear picture of authentic historical continuity of Christian doctrine: precisely what the Catholic Church calls sacred Tradition, or, when emphasizing the teaching authority of bishops in the Church, “apostolic succession.”

The phrase “deposit of faith” is also used when describing the original gospel teaching as handed over or delivered to the apostles (see, e.g., Acts 2:42, Jude 3). The Catholic Church considers itself merely the “custodian” or “guardian” of this public revelation or “deposit” from God, because we believe God set up His Church (Matthew 16), making St. Peter the leader, and that it has continued through history ever since. It’s all God’s doing, not ours. We participate in His plan by His grace and mercy only.

Pass it on
When the first Christians went out and preached the gospel of Jesus Christ after Pentecost, this was an oral tradition. Some of it was recorded in the Bible (e.g., in Acts 2) but most was not, and indeed could not be, for sheer volume (see John 20:30, 21:25). It was primarily this oral Christian tradition that turned the world upside down, not the text of the New Testament (many, if not most people couldn’t read then, anyway).

Accordingly, when the phrases “word of God” or “word of the Lord” occur in Acts and the epistles, they almost always refer to oral preaching, not to the written word of the Bible, as many Protestants (and probably a lot of Catholics, too) casually assume.

The New Testament itself is a record of primitive, apostolic Christianity. It is a development, so to speak, of both the Old Testament and early oral Christian preaching and teaching and tradition. The process of canonization of the New Testament took more than 300 years and involved taking into account human opinions and traditions as to which books were believed to be Scripture. It was not immediately obvious to all Christians (as some assume or argue).

Many notable Church fathers accepted books as part of Scripture which are not now so recognized (e.g., The Shepherd of Hermas, the Didache, epistle of Barnabas, 1 Clement). Many others didn’t accept certain canonical books until very late (e.g., Hebrews, James, 2 Peter, and Revelation). Thus, the Bible cannot be separated and isolated from tradition and a developmental process.

In Catholicism, Scripture and Tradition are intrinsically interwoven. They have been described as “twin fonts of the one divine well-spring” (revelation), and cannot be separated, any more than can two wings of a bird, two sides of a coin, or two blades of a pair of scissors.

The Church also has strong authority, so that the Catholic rule of faith consists of Scripture, Tradition, and the Church. This may be conceived in a word-picture as a “three-legged stool.” If you remove any one of the legs, the stool collapses; all three are equally necessary for it to stand up.

That is Catholicism: and (if anyone wonders about it) all these notions are firmly backed up by Scripture itself, without any contradiction as regards Catholic Tradition or Church dogma and doctrine.
http://www.themichigancatholic.org/2014/05/tradition-isnt-always-a-bad-word-in-scripture/
I think Catholic tradition is ugly, don't you?

Roman Catholics in Spain and Portugal parading around the streets, in what is dress from the inquisition period.

Called the "Capirote", different colors were inquisition punishment, "Red" was death.

Of course the Popes allows this hatred to continue.

"Brotherhoods In We Kill For Catholicism""

Imagine, parading around in Catholic inquisition garb in 2018, really?

100% Hatred, Blessed By The Pope!

Wikipedia: Holy Week in Malaga (in Spanish Semana Santa en Málaga), is the annual commemoration of the Passion of Jesus Christ that takes place during the last week of Lent, the week immediately before Easter. It is one of the main cultural events, religious and tourist attraction of Málaga.

Wikipedia: Capirote
Page issues

220px-Lagrimas_-_Fusionadas.jpg

Procession of the Reales Cofradías Fusionadas in Malaga, has more than 900 nazarenos
220px-Pollinica_-_Mayordomo.jpg

Brotherhood with green capirotes in Malaga
220px-SevillaNazarenoHSanRoque02.JPG

Brotherhood of Saint Rochus with velvet capirotes
 

epostle1

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I think Catholic tradition is ugly, don't you?

Roman Catholics in Spain and Portugal parading around the streets, in what is dress from the inquisition period.

Called the "Capirote", different colors were inquisition punishment, "Red" was death.

Of course the Popes allows this hatred to continue.

"Brotherhoods In We Kill For Catholicism""

Imagine, parading around in Catholic inquisition garb in 2018, really?

100% Hatred, Blessed By The Pope!

Wikipedia: Holy Week in Malaga (in Spanish Semana Santa en Málaga), is the annual commemoration of the Passion of Jesus Christ that takes place during the last week of Lent, the week immediately before Easter. It is one of the main cultural events, religious and tourist attraction of Málaga.

Wikipedia: Capirote
Page issues

220px-Lagrimas_-_Fusionadas.jpg

Procession of the Reales Cofradías Fusionadas in Malaga, has more than 900 nazarenos
220px-Pollinica_-_Mayordomo.jpg

Brotherhood with green capirotes in Malaga
220px-SevillaNazarenoHSanRoque02.JPG

Brotherhood of Saint Rochus with velvet capirotes
None of those are Sacred Traditions, they are customs peculiar to Spain. You think white Anglo-saxon American Protestant customs are the measure and arbitrator of all foreign customs. Everyone in the world should wear 3-piece suits because white Anglo-saxon American Protestants wear them??? That's bigotry.

Claiming the Pope allows hatred is stupid. You should change your user name. It doesn't suit your lies and falsehoods.
 

Truth7t7

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None of those are Sacred Traditions, they are customs peculiar to Spain. You think white Anglo-saxon American Protestant customs are the measure and arbitrator of all foreign customs. Everyone in the world should wear 3-piece suits because white Anglo-saxon American Protestants wear them??? That's bigotry.

Claiming the Pope allows hatred is stupid. You should change your user name. It doesn't suit your lies and falsehoods.
No those below are Spanish Catholics, That Sit Under The Same Pope You Do, Hatred In Action and religiously Celebrated!

Will You Deny Your Spanish Brethren, After All They Were The Foundation For Great Persecution Of God's Church?

Please Post One Article, Where The Catholic Pope Condemns The Actions Seen And Celebrated?

Roman Catholics in Spain and Portugal parading around the streets, in what is dress from the inquisition period.

Called the "Capirote", different colors were inquisition punishment, "Red" was death.

Of course the Popes allows this hatred to continue.

"Brotherhoods In We Kill For Catholicism""

Imagine, parading around in Catholic inquisition garb in 2018, really?

100% Hatred, Blessed By The Pope!

Wikipedia: Holy Week in Malaga (in Spanish Semana Santa en Málaga), is the annual commemoration of the Passion of Jesus Christ that takes place during the last week of Lent, the week immediately before Easter. It is one of the main cultural events, religious and tourist attraction of Málaga.

Wikipedia: Capirote
Page issues

220px-Lagrimas_-_Fusionadas.jpg

Procession of the Reales Cofradías Fusionadas in Malaga, has more than 900 nazarenos
220px-Pollinica_-_Mayordomo.jpg

Brotherhood with green capirotes in Malaga
220px-SevillaNazarenoHSanRoque02.JPG

Brotherhood of Saint Rochus with velvet capirotes
 

epostle1

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The Spanish Inquisition has been exposed as a Protestant fraud, but you can't stop harping over outdated propaganda. All the anti-Catholic crap you swallow has damaged your brain.
https://www.crisismagazine.com/2011/the-truth-about-the-spanish-inquisition
That is not a Catholic page. But you are so brainwashed you can't accept anything that contradicts your myths. You are a cruel, mean ugly sadist just like phoneman.
 

Truth7t7

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The Spanish Inquisition has been exposed as a Protestant fraud, but you can't stop harping over outdated propaganda. All the anti-Catholic crap you swallow has damaged your brain.
https://www.crisismagazine.com/2011/the-truth-about-the-spanish-inquisition
That is not a Catholic page. But you are so brainwashed you can't accept anything that contradicts your myths. You are a cruel, mean ugly sadist just like phoneman.
The Spanish Inquisition never happened?

Just like the Jewish Holocaust and Armenian Genocide never happened.

Real Big Smiles To That One!

Wikipedia: Inquisition
was a group of institutions within the government system of the Catholic Church whose aim was to combat public heresy committed by baptized Christians. It started in 12th-century France to combat religious dissent, in particular the Cathars and the Waldensians. Other groups investigated later included the Spiritual Franciscans, the Hussites (followers of Jan Hus) and the Beguines. Beginning in the 1250s, inquisitors were generally chosen from members of the Dominican Order, replacing the earlier practice of using local clergy as judges.[1] The term Medieval Inquisition covers these courts up to mid-15th century.
 

epostle1

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100% Hatred, Blessed By The Pope!
What a sick conclusion! If anybody blesses hate, it's some of the fanatics in this forum, and you are one of them. You have never been to Portugal or Spain, but you are an expert based on a few photos in wikipedia.
Did the Whore of Babylon canonize the Bible? Did the anti-Christ teach the full doctrine of the Trinity in 451 AD? The Pope doesn't bless customs and he always teaches against hate. You are a disgrace to spirit filled Christians world wide.
 

epostle1

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The Spanish Inquisition never happened?

Just like the Jewish Holocaust and Armenian Genocide never happened.

Real Big Smiles To That One!

Wikipedia: Inquisition
was a group of institutions within the government system of the Catholic Church whose aim was to combat public heresy committed by baptized Christians. It started in 12th-century France to combat religious dissent, in particular the Cathars and the Waldensians. Other groups investigated later included the Spiritual Franciscans, the Hussites (followers of Jan Hus) and the Beguines. Beginning in the 1250s, inquisitors were generally chosen from members of the Dominican Order, replacing the earlier practice of using local clergy as judges.[1] The term Medieval Inquisition covers these courts up to mid-15th century.
I never said the Spanish Inquisition never happened. Can't you read? Nowhere does your infallible wikipedia claim the death of millions. The only ones still teaching that crap are ignorant paranoid funnymentalists. Your fanaticism is ugly. https://www.crisismagazine.com/2011/the-truth-about-the-spanish-inquisition
The OP has you terrified, that's why all the rabbit trails. Since wikipedia is your favorite source, Anti-Catholicism - Wikipedia try that on for size and stop annoying me.
Do you have one clue what the Cathars taught? No, you don't. The thread is about the office of Pope in the Bible. If you want to talk about your Inquisition myths, open a thread. Unfortunately, modern scholarship and historical context is not on your side. So stay on topic and stop denying the scriptures in the OP.
 
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epostle1

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The reference to Isaiah 22 shows that the structure of Jesus’ kingdom was modeled on King David’s dynastic court. In Luke 1.32-33 Jesus’ birth is announced in royal terms. He will inherit the throne of his father David. He will rule over the house of Jacob and his kingdom shall never end. Like Eliakim, to whom Jesus refers, Peter is to be the appointed authority in this court, and as such his role is that of steward and ruler in the absence of the High King, the scion of the House of David. That Peter assumes this pre-eminent role of leadership in the early church is attested to throughout the New Testament from his first place in the list of the apostles, to his dynamic preaching on the day of Pentecost, his decision making at the Council of Jerusalem and the deference shown to him by St Paul and the other apostles.

Did Jesus plan the monarchical papacy? He did not plan for the sometimes corrupt, venal and worldly papacy that it has sometimes become down through history, but Jesus did plan for one man to be his royal delegate on earth. He did plan for one man to lead the others (Lk.22.32) He did plan for one man to take up the spiritual and temporal leadership of his church. This is shown not only through the famous passage from Matthew 16, but also in the final chapter of John’s gospel where Jesus the Good Shepherd hands his pastoral role over to Peter.
http://www.patheos.com/blogs/standingonmyhead/the-early-papacy-2
 
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Truth7t7

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The reference to Isaiah 22 shows that the structure of Jesus’ kingdom was modeled on King David’s dynastic court. In Luke 1.32-33 Jesus’ birth is announced in royal terms. He will inherit the throne of his father David. He will rule over the house of Jacob and his kingdom shall never end. Like Eliakim, to whom Jesus refers, Peter is to be the appointed authority in this court, and as such his role is that of steward and ruler in the absence of the High King, the scion of the House of David. That Peter assumes this pre-eminent role of leadership in the early church is attested to throughout the New Testament from his first place in the list of the apostles, to his dynamic preaching on the day of Pentecost, his decision making at the Council of Jerusalem and the deference shown to him by St Paul and the other apostles.

Did Jesus plan the monarchical papacy? He did not plan for the sometimes corrupt, venal and worldly papacy that it has sometimes become down through history, but Jesus did plan for one man to be his royal delegate on earth. He did plan for one man to lead the others (Lk.22.32) He did plan for one man to take up the spiritual and temporal leadership of his church. This is shown not only through the famous passage from Matthew 16, but also in the final chapter of John’s gospel where Jesus the Good Shepherd hands his pastoral role over to Peter.
http://www.patheos.com/blogs/standingonmyhead/the-early-papacy-2
Jesus didn't hand his authority from Peter to Constatines Pope in the Roman St. Peter' Basilica, built by Emperor Constatine.

Christians are Led by God's Holy Spirit, the Church of Jesus Christ is led by married men, this excludes Roman Catholicism's unmarried, Pope, Cardinals, and Priest's.

How ya gonna juggle God's word's below, to fit your Catholic Church :)

Nothing personal, just the truth of God's word, Catholicism don't meet the basic criteria of Church, a fact!

1 Timothy 3 King James Version (KJV)
3 This is a true saying, if a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work.
2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;
3 Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous;
4 One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity;
5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
6 Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.
7 Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.
8 Likewise must the deacons be grave, not doubletongued, not given to much wine, not greedy of filthy lucre;
9 Holding the mystery of the faith in a pure conscience.
10 And let these also first be proved; then let them use the office of a deacon, being found blameless.
11 Even so must their wives be grave, not slanderers, sober, faithful in all things.
12 Let the deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well.
 
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BreadOfLife

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You are not doing what Paul did, and it is that difference that is not biblical.

He very clearly stated that those who are in Christ are a new creation, that it is no longer we who live, but Christ who lives in us. But he also spoke to and of those who were hearing the gospel for the first time and of that transitional time before wholly coming to Christ. But the two do not mix any more than light mixes with darkness.

So then, better if you preached to the one or to the other, and not go back to that time which should now be past, but should now be well defined as distinctly different. Otherwise you mix what should no longer be mixed, and give a foothold to those who would linger in their fleshly nature with excuse, as if from authority. Such lingering is without any authority or excuse.
WRONG.

Romans 7 is ALL about the fact that although we are IN Christ and we are a new SPIRITUAL creation in Christ - we are STILL IN THE FLESH. We STILL struggle with sin and temptations of the flesh.

We will never be "free" of the flesh until we die.
 

epostle1

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Jesus didn't hand his authority from Peter to Constatines Pope in the Roman St. Peter' Basilica, built by Emperor Constatine.
Sylvester was the 33rd pope, whose authority is traced back to Peter. Constantine had nothing to with the pope's authority. What ever Constantine did for the Church has nothing to do with church authority. These myths about Constantine have already been exposed. You have a short memory.

Christians are Led by God's Holy Spirit, the Church of Jesus Christ is led by married men, this excludes Roman Catholicism's unmarried, Pope, Cardinals, and Priest's.
For the second time, give me the names of Jesus and Paul's wives. Your sick persecution of Catholics is stupid.[/quote]

How ya gonna juggle God's word's below, to fit your Catholic Church :)

Nothing personal, just the truth of God's word, Catholicism don't meet the basic criteria of Church, a fact!

1 Timothy 3 King James Version (KJV)
3 This is a true saying, if a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work.
2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;
3 Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous;
4 One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity;
5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
6 Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.
7 Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.
8 Likewise must the deacons be grave, not doubletongued, not given to much wine, not greedy of filthy lucre;
9 Holding the mystery of the faith in a pure conscience.
10 And let these also first be proved; then let them use the office of a deacon, being found blameless.
11 Even so must their wives be grave, not slanderers, sober, faithful in all things.
12 Let the deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well.
How many times do I have to go over this? You can't learn. Your anti-Catholic bigotry has damaged your brain. Repeating what I already said about this is a waste of time with you.
 

epostle1

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Was the early church de-centralized?

Independent Evangelical churches follow the Baptist Successionist idea that the early church was de-centralized. They like to imagine that the early Christians met in their homes for Bible study and prayer, and that in this pure form they existed independently of any central authority. It is easy to imagine that long ago in the ancient world transportation and communication was rare and difficult and that no form of centralized church authority could have existed even if it was desirable.

The most straightforward reading of the Acts of the Apostles shows this to be untrue, and a further reading of early church documents shows this to be no more than a back-projected invention. In the Acts of the Apostles what we find is a church that is immediately centralized in Jerusalem. When Peter has his disturbing vision in which God directs him to admit the Gentiles to the Church, he references back at once to the apostolic leadership in Jerusalem.(Acts 11:2)

The mission of the infant church was directed from Jerusalem, with Barnabas and Agabus being sent to Antioch (Acts 11:22,27) The Council of Jerusalem (Acts 15) was convened to decide on the Gentile decision and a letter of instruction was sent to the new churches in Antioch, Syria and Cilicia. (Acts 15:23) We see Philip, John Mark, Barnabas and Paul traveling to and from Jerusalem and providing a teaching and disciplinary link from the new churches back to the centralized church in Jerusalem.

After the martyrdom of James the leadership shifts to Peter and Paul. The authority is not centered on Jerusalem, but through their epistles to the various churches, we see a centralized authority that is vested in Peter and Paul as apostles. This central authority was very soon focused on Rome, so that St Ignatius, a bishop of the church in Antioch would write to the Romans in the year 108 affirming that their church was the one that had the “superior place in love among the churches.’”

Historian Eamon Duffy suggests that the earliest leadership in the Roman church may have been more conciliar than monarchical because in his letter to the Corinthians, Clement of Rome doesn’t write as the Bishop of Rome, but even if this is so Duffy confirms that the early church believed Clement was the fourth Bishop of Rome and read Clement’s letter as support for centralized Roman authority. He also concedes that by the time of Irenaeus in the mid second century the centralizing role of the Bishop of Rome was already well established. From then on, citation after citation from the apostolic Fathers can be compiled to show that the whole church from Gaul to North Africa and from Syria to Spain affirm the primacy of the Bishop of Rome as the successor of Peter and Paul.

The acceptance of this centralized authority was a sign of belonging to the one true church so that St Jerome could write to Pope Damasus in the mid 300s, “I think it is my duty to consult the chair of Peter, and to turn to a church whose faith has been praised by Paul… My words are spoken to the successor of the fisherman, to the disciple of the cross. As I follow no leader save Christ, so I communicate with none but your blessedness, that is with the chair of Peter. For this, I know, is the rock on which the church is built!”
 

Truth7t7

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Sylvester was the 33rd pope, whose authority is traced back to Peter. Constantine had nothing to with the pope's authority. What ever Constantine did for the Church has nothing to do with church authority. These myths about Constantine have already been exposed. You have a short memory.

For the second time, give me the names of Jesus and Paul's wives. Your sick persecution of Catholics is stupid.


How many times do I have to go over this? You can't learn. Your anti-Catholic bigotry has damaged your brain. Repeating what I already said about this is a waste of time with you.[/QUOTE]
Non response, you concede the facts below.

Christians are Led by God's Holy Spirit, the Church of Jesus Christ is led by married men, this excludes Roman Catholicism's unmarried, Pope, Cardinals, and Priest's.

How ya gonna juggle God's word's below, to fit your Catholic Church :)

Nothing personal, just the truth of God's word, Catholicism don't meet the basic criteria of Church, a fact!

1 Timothy 3 King James Version (KJV)
3 This is a true saying, if a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work.
2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;
3 Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous;
4 One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity;
5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
6 Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.
7 Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.
8 Likewise must the deacons be grave, not doubletongued, not given to much wine, not greedy of filthy lucre;
9 Holding the mystery of the faith in a pure conscience.
10 And let these also first be proved; then let them use the office of a deacon, being found blameless.
11 Even so must their wives be grave, not slanderers, sober, faithful in all things.
12 Let the deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well.
 

epostle1

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For the fourth time, who was Jesus and Paul married to ???, since you so strongly oppose celibacy. I have had enough of your immaturity, denials and stupid bashing. I don't debate with angry children.
image.jpg
 

ScottA

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WRONG.

Romans 7 is ALL about the fact that although we are IN Christ and we are a new SPIRITUAL creation in Christ - we are STILL IN THE FLESH. We STILL struggle with sin and temptations of the flesh.

We will never be "free" of the flesh until we die.
You can deny it and make bold your claims - but if the old man is not dead already...you simply wouldn't know the truth.
 

Taken

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As already proved, it is perfectly biblical for Christians to call their priests “father”.

No. It has not been proven, it simply has been claimed.

And therefore, since “father” is a biblical address for priests, the two words, added together, form an address that does not violate the Scriptures.

There is no scripture that comes to such a "therefore" conclusion, that contradicts Jesus' teaching.


" that is obviously teaching the Lord's Word and Forgiveness and Blood, are NOT Sufficient."

"THAT" being what you CALL your holy father, had nothing to do with the point of "sufficiency" of the Lord to Convert a man ONCE and forever.

For the third time:

Matt. 23:9 – Jesus says, “call no man father.” But Protestants use this verse in an attempt to prove that it is wrong for Catholics to call priests “father.”

This is an example of “eisegesis”

You say the WORD, "Call" twice in your post, but then fail to comprehend the significance of "CALLING" and "ADDRESSING" and "TITLING" a man "holy father", instead of simply looking toward a man AS a "father" figure, or as a "holy" man.

Jesus warns us not to elevate anyone to the level of our heavenly Father.

And? That is the point. You elevate your "pope", by CALLING, ADDRESSING, & TITLING him, "holy father".

Jesus Himself, "CALLS" His Father, "CALLS" God in Heaven........"Holy Father"..John 17:11

No where in Scripture IS ANY earthly man CALLED "holy father".
THAT IS a man-made Catholic conclusion, and NOT Scriptural.

.... don't be so arrogant.

Ditto.
 

epostle1

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40. Protestants' excessive mistrust of the flesh ("carnality") often leads to (in evangelicalism or fundamentalism) an absurd legalism (no dancing, drinking, card-playing, rock music, etc.).

38. Catholicism upholds the "incarnational principle," wherein Jesus became flesh and thus raised flesh and matter to new spiritual heights.

133. Protestantism has little concept of the Tradition and biblical doctrine of mortifying the flesh, or, suffering with Christ: Mt 10:38; 16:24: Rom 8:13,17; 1 Cor 12:24-6; Phil 3:10; 1 Pet 4:1,13.

134. Likewise, Protestantism has lost the Tradition and biblical doctrine of vicarious atonement, or redemptive suffering with Christ, of Christians for the sake of each other: Ex 32:30-32; Num 16:43-8; 25:6-13; 2 Cor 4:10; Col 1:24; 2 Tim 4:6.
 

BreadOfLife

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You can deny it and make bold your claims - but if the old man is not dead already...you simply wouldn't know the truth.
You need to learn the difference between the flesh and the spirit.
 

epostle1

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Judges 17:10; 18:19 – priesthood and fatherhood have always been identified together. Fatherhood literally means “communicating one’s nature,” and just as biological fathers communicate their nature to their children, so do spiritual fathers communicate the nature of God to us, their children, through (hopefully) teaching and example. Judges 17:10; 18:19 IS DENIED BY TAKEN, TRUTH7T7, AND OTHERS.

Acts 7:2; 22:1,1 John 2:13 – elders of the Church are called “fathers.” Acts 7:2; 22:1,1 John 2:13 IS DENIED BY TAKEN, TRUTH7T7, AND OTHERS.

Titus 1:4 – Paul calls Titus his true “child” in a common faith. Priests are our spiritual fathers in the family of God. ACCORDING TO TAKEN, TRUTH7T7, AND OTHERS, PAUL IS A HERETIC.

1 Peter 5:13 – Peter refers to himself as father by calling Mark his “son.” ACCORDING TO TAKEN, TRUTH7T7, AND OTHERS, PETER DOESN'T KNOW ANYTHING.

1 John 2:1,13,14 – John calls the elders of the Church “fathers.” TAKEN, TRUTH7T7, AND OTHERS, CAN'T FIND 1 John 2:1,13,14.
1 Cor. 4:15 – Paul writes, “I became your father in Christ Jesus.” That's because Paul is a Catholic.

1 John 2:1,18,28; 3:18; 5:21; 3 John 4 – John calls members of the Church “children.” ACCORDING TO TAKEN, TRUTH7T7, AND OTHERS, JOHN MUST BE A PEDOPHILE.

Matt. 3:9; Luke 3:8 – Jesus refers to Abraham as our “father.”
Mark 11:10 – the people cried out blessed is the kingdom of our “father” David that is coming!
Luke 1:32 – God’s angel says Jesus will be great and be given the throne of his “father” David.
Luke 1:55 – Mary says that He spoke to our “fathers,” to Abraham and to his posterity for ever.
Luke 1:73 – Zechariah says the oath which he swore to our “father” Abraham.
Luke 16:24,30 – Jesus, in His parable about the rich man, says our “father” Abraham.
John 4:12 – the Samaritan woman asks Jesus if He is greater than our “father” Jacob.
John 7:22 – Jesus refers to the “fathers” who gave the Jews the practice of circumcision.
John 8:56 – Jesus tells the Jews your “Father” Abraham rejoiced that he was to see my day.
Acts 3:13,25; 5:30 – Peter teaches that the God of our “fathers” glorified His servant Jesus and raised Him to life.
Acts 4:25 – Peter and John pray to God and refer to our “father” David.
Acts 7:11-12, 15,19,38,44-45,51-52 – Stephen refers to our “fathers” in the faith.
Acts 7:32 – Stephen calls God the God of our “fathers.”
Acts 13:17,32,36; 24:14; 26:6; 28:17,25 – Paul also refers to the God of our “fathers” in the faith.
Acts 22:3 – Paul says he was educated according to the strict law of our “fathers.”
Acts 22:14 – Ananias says the God of our “fathers.”
Rom. 4:1 – Paul calls Abraham our “forefather.”
Rom. 4:16-17 – Paul says that Abraham is the “father” of us all and the “father” of many nations.
Rom. 9:10 – Paul calls Isaac, a spiritual leader, our “forefather.”
1 Cor. 10:1 – Paul says that our “fathers” were all under the cloud, referring to the Old Testament spiritual leaders.
Gal. 1:14 – Paul says that he was zealous for the tradition of his “fathers.”
2 Tim. 1:3 – Paul thanks God whom he serves with a clear conscience as did his “fathers” in faith.
Heb. 1:1 – the author says God spoke of old to our “fathers.”
Heb. 3:9 – the Holy Spirit says that your “fathers” put me to the test.
Heb. 8:9 – God says not like the covenant that I made with their “fathers.”
James 2:21 – James says was not our “father” Abraham justified by works when he offered his son Isaac?
1 Peter 1:18 – Peter says you were ransomed from the futile ways inherited from your “fathers.”
2 Peter 3:4 – Peter says ever since the “fathers” fell asleep, all things have continued as they were from the beginning.
ACCORDING TO TAKEN, TRUTH7T7, AND OTHERS, "FATHER" IS NEVER USED AS A TITLE FOR HUMANS IN SCRIPTURE
 
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epostle1

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As already proved, it is perfectly biblical for Christians to call their priests “father”. However, the address “holy” is a word the Protestant Church of Christ reserves for God alone, but is its reservation biblically substantiated?

We know that Herod feared John, knowing that he was a righteous and holy man (Mark 6:20). The prophet Zechariah’s prophecy referred to holy prophets (Luke 1:70), and St. Luke’s narrative also referred to holy prophets (Acts 3:21). Did St. Peter mistakenly call the writers of Scripture the holy men of God(2 Peter 1:21 Douay-Rheims)? Was St. Peter not referring to men when he wrote about a holy priesthood(1 Peter 2:5 Revised Standard Version)? Was Sarah not one of the holy women who hoped in God (1 Peter 3:5)? And did St. Peter not encourage the Church to remember the predictions of the holy prophets (2 Peter 3:2)? (All emphases added.)

Clearly, the “Bible alone” does not reserve the address “holy” for God alone, but rather, suggests that there are indeed holy men and women. And therefore, since “father” is a biblical address for priests, the two words, added together, form an address that does not violate the Scriptures.

Where are the terms Bible , Rapture, premillenialism, total immersion, eternal security, King James Version, sola scriptura, total depravity, faith alone, (except James 2:24, where it is rejected), WHERE ARE THESE TERMS FOUND EXPLICITLY IN THE BIBLE??? NOWHERE! Where in the Bible does it say that each and every title, doctrine, devotion and practice must explicitly found in the Bible to be valid?? NOWHERE! That too is a man made Protestant tradition.

Taken bellyaches about two biblical words put together, holy father, while he uses unbiblical terms.
What hypocrisy!
 
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