Only one rapture of all the saints, and only one second coming of Christ

[WPM]

Debunked.
The Wycliffe Bible translated the word as "dissencioun" (i.e. "dissension"), not "departure".
Every Reformer, suffering under the apostate papal antichrist, would have laughed the idea of a rapture to scorn.
The myth of rapture in the verse did not appear until 1859.

Stop perpetuating rubbish.

You are being very diplomatic, bro. Lol.

 

[WPM]

Exactly.
My point to "the light " is that he says Jesus comes in power and great glory during the 7 yr trib and is here during the last year of the trib.

So all his doctrine has to be backed up.
As Jesus comes after the 7 yr trib in actual power and great glory..on the white horses.

I pivot off of "power and great glory", combined with the fact of WHEN HE DOES.
The Light says that is wrong.

Where is the Pretrib rapture of the Church, followed by your 7 year tribulation, followed by a 3rd coming?

 

[covenantee]

You are being very diplomatic, bro. Lol.

I repented and changed rubbish to bunk.

 

[The Light]

Like I said
The 2nd coming is on white horses IN POWER AND GLORY. Rev 19.
That is the ONLY coming in power and glory.
The ONLY ONE.

The Word of God gives us a timestamp of what happens at the end of the age.

1. The 6th seal is opened.
2. The Great Tribulation is over
3. Jesus returns - The Second Coming, when all eyes see the coming of the Lord
4. He sends His angels to gather the elect prior to His wrath being poured out on the earth as believers are not appointed to wrath.

You can believe what has been passed down that does not agree with the Word of God if you choose.

There are no white horses when Jesus comes in Matthew 24.
There is no Armageddon when Jesus comes in Matthew 24.

There is no harvest in Revelation 19.
The Day of the Lord is what occurs when the armies of heaven come to the earth. Jesus will speak the word and the armies of Armageddon will be destroyed. Do the angels come to harvest believers when the armies of heaven come? NO THE BELIEVERS ARE ALREADY IN HEAVEN and come as part of the army.

Use common sense that is not common days.

 

[CrowCross]

What? We do not believe in a 7-years trib. Scripture teaches that nowhere.

Like I thought, Pretrib is pure fiction.

When the pre-trib rapture happens (if you're still alive) are you going to complain to God about it?

Ah, God, it's not what your bible taught....so send me back.

 

[brightfame52]

The error i have addressed TWICE ALREADY, Is what you implied earlier.
I have asked you twice if you are implying that the AC is not a man, but something else.

Its been addressed.

 

[brightfame52]

There is nothing there for you to jump to that conclusion.

Yes it is, and Im not you.

 

[CrowCross]

24 “But in those days, after that tribulation, ‘the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light,

Rev 6:12 When he opened the sixth seal, I looked, and behold, there was a great earthquake, and the sun became black as sackcloth, the full moon became like blood,

Will the moon not give light or will its light be likened to blood?

Will the sun become black....or simply darkened?

 

[The Light]

Take those 3 verses that speak of a dark sun and post them side by side...in doing so you can see the differences.

Yes, two of them occur at the 6th seal as we see the stars fall from heaven at the 6th seal. The other verse occurs in the one year wrath of God.

 

[CrowCross]

Yes, two of them occur at the 6th seal as we see the stars fall from heaven at the 6th seal. The other verse occurs in the one year wrath of God.

Ohhhhhhhh-K. What ever.

Is there a web site or video that explains your view?

 

[The Light]

Rev 6:12 When he opened the sixth seal, I looked, and behold, there was a great earthquake, and the sun became black as sackcloth, the full moon became like blood,

Will the moon not give light or will its light be likened to blood?

In a lunar eclipse the sun is BOTH darkened and turned to blood. It happens at the same evert.

Jesus is talking in Matthew 24 and John has a vision in Revelation 6.

They are talking about the same event, but are seeing a different time that the event occurs.

Will the sun become black....or simply darkened?

Can a sun that is darkened become black?

Can one person see the sun darkening and then go inside and can another person come outside when the sun it totally black?

And let's keep reading

Revelation 6
....... And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth

Matthew 24
........and the stars shall fall from heaven

The stars are the angels. They fall from heaven because there is war in heaven during the great tribulation. The stars are cast to the earth for the wrath of God.

 

[The Light]

Ohhhhhhhh-K. What ever.

Is there a web site or video that explains your view?

Do you see white horses happening in the coming of Jesus in Matthew 24?
Do you see Armageddon happening in Matthew 24?

Do you see a harvest occurring in Revelation 19?

Why would I believe that the coming of Jesus in Matthew 24 has anything to do with Armageddon when the Word of God clearly shows this event occurs at the 6th seal. Jesus sends His angels to gather the elect prior to the wrath of God.

Why do you have believers on the earth during the wrath of God? We are not appointed to wrath but to receive salvation.

1 Thes 5
9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

The only people on the earth during the 7th seal wrath of God are the two witnesses, those from the nation of Israel that flee to a place of protection when the AOD is set up and unbelievers.

 

[The Light]

Rev 6 is LOOKING FORWARD TO REV 19, the second coming.

Or we could go with what is written. Jesus returns for a harvest at the 6th seal. He comes for the Jews. All return to heaven for the marriage supper which is why there is a great multitude in Rev 7.

It all falls in line perfectly. Both brides are in heaven during Gods wrath and then return to earth with the armies of heaven in Rev 19. Pretty much cut and dried.

 

[JimKnox]

I weary of people who misuse Scripture.
"God hath not appointed us to wrath" has no relation to the rapture. In context it is speaking of the salvation of our souls.

 

[WPM]

I weary of people who misuse Scripture.
"God hath not appointed us to wrath" has no relation to the rapture. In context it is speaking of the salvation of our souls.

Where is the Pretrib rapture of the Church, followed by your 7 year tribulation, followed by a 3rd coming?

1 Thessalonians 4:15-5:7 says: “we which are alive and remain unto the coming [Gr. parousia] of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. Wherefore comfort one another with these words. But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you. For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden [Gr. aifnídios meaning suddenly] destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape. But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief. Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness. Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober. For they that sleep sleep in the night; and they that be drunken are drunken in the night. But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation. For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ. Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him. Wherefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also ye do.”

We can see from the wording of the text that this passage is describing one unitary event. Paul correlates the rescue of God's people after coming of the Lord, with the pouring out of the wrath of God upon the wicked at the same time. He was talking to Christians here in Thessaloniki and expressing the same comfort for the same overall climatic event. He is assuring God’s people that this day when Christ comes as a thief in the night will not catch them unexpected. They will not be sleeping. They will be awake. He is exhorting them to “watch and be sober.”

 

[WPM]

Or we could go with what is written. Jesus returns for a harvest at the 6th seal. He comes for the Jews. All return to heaven for the marriage supper which is why there is a great multitude in Rev 7.

It all falls in line perfectly. Both brides are in heaven during Gods wrath and then return to earth with the armies of heaven in Rev 19. Pretty much cut and dried.

The extra-biblical statements get more and more and the avoided questions get larger and larger.

1. Where is your Pretrib rapture in Revelation?
2. Is Revelation 19 your 3rd rapture?
3. Where is your tribulation period following Matthew 24:44 (or any other rapture passage)?
4. Show us one Scripture that teaches that "the feasts of God are a picture of the end times"?
5. Show me New Testament Scripture that teaches that “there are two harvests? The grain harvest and the fruit harvest”?
6. Where is "the grain harvest" mentioned in the New Testament?
7. Where is "the fruit harvest " mentioned in the New Testament?
8. Where is "the barley harvest" that you have previously invented and foisted on Scripture mentioned in the New Testament?
9. Where is "the wheat harvest" that you have previously invented and foisted on Scripture mentioned in the New Testament?
10. Where is all this jargon about "on the Feast of Trumpets, the fall harvest feast" in the New Testament text or in any rapture passage?
11. Where in the New Testament does it say “there are two raptures – grain and fruit”?
12. Show us any Scripture that teaches there are "two" future "raptures"?
13. Where in the Bible does it teach that "the fig tree having two harvests are referring to two raptures”?
14. Where in the Scriptures does it teach that “the two folds of sheep are referring to two raptures”?
15. Where does it say anywhere in Scripture that “Noah is a picture of the Pretrib rapture” and “Lot is a picture of the Jewish harvest”?
16. Show us any Scripture that teaches "the Church is removed before the great tribulation, which is the time of testing"?
17. Show us any Scripture that teaches there is a "one-year wrath of God"?

Take them one at a time - if you can! Start with Number 1. Is that such a hard ask?

 

[WPM]

Do you see white horses happening in the coming of Jesus in Matthew 24?
Do you see Armageddon happening in Matthew 24?

Do you see a harvest occurring in Revelation 19?

Why would I believe that the coming of Jesus in Matthew 24 has anything to do with Armageddon when the Word of God clearly shows this event occurs at the 6th seal. Jesus sends His angels to gather the elect prior to the wrath of God.

Why do you have believers on the earth during the wrath of God? We are not appointed to wrath but to receive salvation.

1 Thes 5
9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

The only people on the earth during the 7th seal wrath of God are the two witnesses, those from the nation of Israel that flee to a place of protection when the AOD is set up and unbelievers.

1 Thessalonians 4:15-5:7 says: “we which are alive and remain unto the coming [Gr. parousia] of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. Wherefore comfort one another with these words. But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you. For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden [Gr. aifnídios meaning suddenly] destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape. But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief. Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness. Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober. For they that sleep sleep in the night; and they that be drunken are drunken in the night. But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation. For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ. Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him. Wherefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also ye do.”

How does the wicked survive this? They do not! Read the text.

 

[ewq1938]

I believe in three separate persons and one "Godhead" Father, Son, Holy Spirit

What does that tell you, read it real slow

Jesus Is The Lord

Is Jesus also God the Son?

 

[WPM]

Both brides are in heaven during Gods wrath and then return to earth with the armies of heaven in Rev 19. Pretty much cut and dried.

LOL. You are totally delusional. You come out with these extra-biblical statements and beliefs and show no proof of them in God's inspired Word. This sums up your theology. This adds another question to my list, bringing it to 18. You have been totally incapable of answering any of these. You clearly make it up as you go.

1. Where is your Pretrib rapture in Revelation?
2. Is Revelation 19 your 3rd rapture?
3. Where is your tribulation period following Matthew 24:44 (or any other rapture passage)?
4. Show us one Scripture that teaches that "the feasts of God are a picture of the end times"?
5. Show me New Testament Scripture that teaches that “there are two harvests? The grain harvest and the fruit harvest”?
6. Where is "the grain harvest" mentioned in the New Testament?
7. Where is "the fruit harvest " mentioned in the New Testament?
8. Where is "the barley harvest" that you have previously invented and foisted on Scripture mentioned in the New Testament?
9. Where is "the wheat harvest" that you have previously invented and foisted on Scripture mentioned in the New Testament?
10. Where is all this jargon about "on the Feast of Trumpets, the fall harvest feast" in the New Testament text or in any rapture passage?
11. Where in the New Testament does it say “there are two raptures – grain and fruit”?
12. Show us any Scripture that teaches there are "two" future "raptures"?
13. Where in the Bible does it teach that "the fig tree having two harvests are referring to two raptures”?
14. Where in the Scriptures does it teach that “the two folds of sheep are referring to two raptures”?
15. Where does it say anywhere in Scripture that “Noah is a picture of the Pretrib rapture” and “Lot is a picture of the Jewish harvest”?
16. Show us any Scripture that teaches "the Church is removed before the great tribulation, which is the time of testing"?
17. Show us any Scripture that teaches there is a "one-year wrath of God"?
18. Can you show us anywhere in God’s holy Word that describes God having “two brides in heaven during Gods wrath”?

 

[Scott Downey]

On the Godhead and 'the mystery of the faith'

Bible Gateway passage: 1 Timothy 3 - 21st Century King James Version

This is a true saying: If a man desire the office of bishop, he desireth a good work. A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behavior, given to hospitality, apt at teaching; not given to wine, not violent, not greedy for filthy lucre, but patient, not...

www.biblegateway.com

This is a true saying: If a man desire the office of bishop, he desireth a good work.

2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behavior, given to hospitality, apt at teaching;

3 not given to wine, not violent, not greedy for filthy lucre, but patient, not a brawler, not covetous;

4 one who ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all dignity.

5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)

6 He must not be a novice in the faith, lest being lifted up with pride, he fall into the condemnation of the devil.

7 Moreover he must have a good reputation with those who are outsiders, lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.

8 Likewise must the deacons be serious, not double tongued, not given to much wine, not greedy for filthy lucre,

9 holding the mystery of the faith with a pure conscience.

10 And let these also first be proved; then, being found blameless, let them make use of the office of a deacon.

11 So also must their wives be serious, not slanderers, sober, faithful in all things.

12 Let each deacon be the husband of one wife, ruling his children and his own house well.

13 For those who have ministered the office of deacon well purchase for themselves a good standing and great boldness in the faith, which is in Christ Jesus.

14 These things I write unto thee, hoping to come unto thee shortly,

15 but if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou ought to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.

16 And beyond controversy, great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen by angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.