Only one rapture of all the saints, and only one second coming of Christ

[Truth7t7]

All take the mark
Every man, woman and child.
Rev 7
16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

Everyone refusing it dies.
Power is given the AC to overcome the saints.
The saints overcome the AC by the blood of the lamb and the word of their testimony and they loved not their lives unto the death.
IOW THEY ALL DIE FROM THEIR TESTIMONY.
Rev 12
11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.



Rev13
7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
9 If any man have an ear, let him hear.

All dead.
The earth "cleansed" of believers.
Nobody to rapture.

Rev7
13 And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they?
14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
15 Therefore are they before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple: and he that sitteth on the throne shall dwell among them.
16 They shall hunger no more, neither thirst any more; neither shall the sun light on them, nor any heat.
17 For the Lamb which is in the midst of the throne shall feed them, and shall lead them unto living fountains of waters: and God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes.

All dead. A billion nobody can count.
In heaven DURING the trib.



Your doctrine disagrees?

D

 

[brightfame52]

The point was that the "as one man" teachings in the scriptures, identifies "the man of sin" (revealed).

Yeah that stands, the Man of sin is unredeemed man and his religious philosophies that override the revelation of God as to how God saves sinners. Rev 13:8

18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.

Remember when Eve had Cain the child of wicked one ? Notice what she called him Gen 4:1

And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the Lord.

Cain brought a offering that God rejected, he didnt bring it in Faith as Abel did. Scripture presents the way of cain as evil Jude 1:11

Woe unto them! for they have gone in the way of Cain, and ran greedily after the error of Balaam for reward, and perished in the gainsaying of Core.

Cain was of the wicked one 1 Jn 3:12

12 Not as Cain, who was of that wicked one, and slew his brother. And wherefore slew he him? Because his own works were evil, and his brother's righteous.

Man unredeemed, unregenerated is the Man of sin !

 

[rwb]

Christ came in 70AD the same way the Lord came in the verse below, not physically but symbolically in judgement

Isiaah 19:1
A prophecy against Egypt: See, the Lord rides on a swift cloud and is coming to Egypt. The idols of Egypt tremble before him, and the hearts of the Egyptians melt with fear.

The judgment depicted allegorically came to spiritually turn Egypt from idols to the true God. We know this because the Lord never literally rode on a swift cloud to bring judgment. There is no allegoric depiction of that which came literally to Israel of Old. The judgment of God came physically upon the nation of Old to bring it to an utter ruin. That's why you cannot argue the Lord came spiritually to judge the nation of Old in the same way the Lord was often allegorically or spiritually spoken of as having come or coming to judge nations of Old.

To summarize, the Old Testament prophets often allegorically describe nations under God's judgment as symbols of the world's moral and spiritual corruption. The Old allegorically describe Babylon, Assyria, Egypt, Moab, Damacus, Gaza, Philistia, Sidon, Tyre, Ammon, Kedar, and Hazor as nations under God's coming judgment before the advent of Christ.

Will you also say the Lord came each time He sent judgment against nations?

 

[rebuilder 454]

You just don't follow Christ's words or those of His apostles do you...
But you do love a book of disjointed visions, which must be interpreted by God to a person...

Visions are like parables, which are a mystery.

Matthew 13
10 And the disciples came and said to Him, “Why do You speak to them in parables?”

11 He answered and said to them, “Because it has been given to you to know the [a]mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it has not been given. 12 For whoever has, to him more will be given, and he will have abundance; but whoever does not have, even what he has will be taken away from him. 13 Therefore I speak to them in parables, because seeing they do not see, and hearing they do not hear, nor do they understand. 14 And in them the prophecy of Isaiah is fulfilled, which says:

‘Hearing you will hear and shall not understand,
And seeing you will see and not perceive;
15 For the hearts of this people have grown dull.
Their ears are hard of hearing,
And their eyes they have closed,
Lest they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears,
Lest they should understand with their hearts and turn,
So that I [b]should heal them.’

Ok. We see your insults and disdain for me personally.

Now try "concept vs concept"
I forgive your little weaponizing of Gods word for some voo doo curse you are conjuring up against the brethren.
Now get you some Jesus time, swallow all that hurt and let's go.
Let's see what you can come up with BIBLICALLY.

 

[rebuilder 454]

Yeah that stands, the Man of sin is unredeemed man and his religious philosophies that override the revelation of God as to how God saves sinners. Rev 13:8

18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.

Remember when Eve had Cain the child of wicked one ? Notice what she called him Gen 4:1

And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the Lord.

Cain brought a offering that God rejected, he didnt bring it in Faith as Abel did. Scripture presents the way of cain as evil Jude 1:11

Woe unto them! for they have gone in the way of Cain, and ran greedily after the error of Balaam for reward, and perished in the gainsaying of Core.

Cain was of the wicked one 1 Jn 3:12

12 Not as Cain, who was of that wicked one, and slew his brother. And wherefore slew he him? Because his own works were evil, and his brother's righteous.

Man unredeemed, unregenerated is the Man of sin !

Nope.
The bible is explicit against that error.

Way way off

 

[rebuilder 454]

You just don't follow Christ's words or those of His apostles do you...
But you do love a book of disjointed visions, which must be interpreted by God to a person...

Visions are like parables, which are a mystery.

Matthew 13
10 And the disciples came and said to Him, “Why do You speak to them in parables?”

11 He answered and said to them, “Because it has been given to you to know the [a]mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it has not been given. 12 For whoever has, to him more will be given, and he will have abundance; but whoever does not have, even what he has will be taken away from him. 13 Therefore I speak to them in parables, because seeing they do not see, and hearing they do not hear, nor do they understand. 14 And in them the prophecy of Isaiah is fulfilled, which says:

‘Hearing you will hear and shall not understand,
And seeing you will see and not perceive;
15 For the hearts of this people have grown dull.
Their ears are hard of hearing,
And their eyes they have closed,
Lest they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears,
Lest they should understand with their hearts and turn,
So that I [b]should heal them.’

You still can not answer if rev 19 is the second coming.
So many sentences.
You seem to tell us you don't know, but instead use 3 or 4 unrelated paragraphs to say it.

 

[rebuilder 454]

Some general comeback???
You can not unpack it so you threw spitballs at it.

You got nuked, and can not debate me.

...and can not stay on topic.

 

[The Light]

• Show us any Scripture that teaches there is a "one-year wrath of God"?

Isaiah 34
8 For it is the day of the Lord's vengeance, and the year of recompences for the controversy of Zion.

Your turn.

Who are the foolish virgins?

 

[brightfame52]

Nope.
The bible is explicit against that error.

Way way off

Im spot on.

 

[ScottA]

Nope.
The bible is explicit against that error.

Way way off

Most who believe that to be error add in something that is not in the scriptures, something of the misinterpretations and teachings of men.

 

[Earburner]

Jesus speaking, "The kingdom of God cometh not with observation" Luke 17:20

So much for Greek language.

Let's not allow those choice words in that verse to swim alone.

Luke 17
20 And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:

21 Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

22 And he said unto the disciples, The days will come, when ye shall desire to see one of the days of the Son of man, and ye shall not see it.

23 And they shall say to you, See here; or, see there: go not after them, nor follow them.

24 For as the lightning, that lighteneth out of the one part under heaven, shineth unto the other part under heaven; so shall also the Son of man be in his day.

25 But first must he suffer many things, and be rejected of this generation.

26 And as it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man.

27 They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noah entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all.

28 Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded;

29 But the SAME day [of 24 hours] that Lot WENT OUT of Sodom, it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.

30 EVEN THUS shall it be in the SAME [24 hours] day, WHEN the Son of man is revealed.
Please compare with KJV 2 Thes. 1:7-10, to find out "WHEN" is "WHEN".

But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us. 2 Cor. 4:7.

 

[CrowCross]

The great tribulation is NOT the wrath of God. The great tribulation is when the dragon is killing believers. These believers that are killed during the great tribulation will be mostly of the 12 tribes. They are Jews. When the abomination of desolation is set up, the final 3 and half years of the 70th week of Daniel will begin.

The wrath of God..Rev 6 and onwards until Christ makes His final return at the end of the 7 year wrath is world wide.

Do you like the Noahide law?

The Church will be in heaven before the great tribulation as we can escape all these things that will come to pass. The great tribulation is the hour of temptation that will come on all the world.

The church will be removed prior to Rev 6 and the white horse.

The second coming occurs at the 6th seal.

I disagree.

The Lord comes for the second harvest of the fig tree. He removes believers from the earth as believers are not appointed to wrath. The 7th seal is the wrath of God.

Who opens the first seal?

The great tribulation and the wrath of God are not the same thing.

Through out the tribulation begins in Rev 6:1....shortly after the christian restrainers are removed ...and the antichrist make the news.

 

[CrowCross]

When Jesus returns the way He left, it is not referring to the rapture.

When Jesus comes for His bride He will not touch the earth.

When Jesus comes for the 2nd harvest at the 6th seal, He will remain in the clouds and send His angels to gather the elect from the earth.

When it is talking about Jesus returning like He left, the Word is talking about when He sets His feet on the Mount of Olives.

I disagree.

The way Jesus ascended is NOTHING like the way He will return and set His feet on the Mt. of Olives.
If you can point out any similarity between Jesus ascension and return at the Mount of Olives....please do.
Don't forget the white horses.

 

[The Light]

The church will be removed prior to Rev 6 and the white horse.

Yes. And prior to the great tribulation.

I disagree.

Why would you disagree that the second coming occurs at the 6th seal?

Are you unable to use deductive reasoning and understand that when the 6th is opened, all the tribes mourn and they see the Son of man coming in the clouds?

What don't you see?

Matthew 24
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Revelation 6
12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;

13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.

Who opens the first seal?

Who opens all the seals?

Through out the tribulation begins in Rev 6:1....shortly after the christian restrainers are removed ...and the antichrist make the news.

Nope. The beginning of sorrows begins in Rev 6:1. The tribulation of those days which is the great tribulation begins when the abomination of desolation is set up in the midst of the week. There remains 3.5 years in the 70th week of Daniel.

 

[ScottA]

Let's not allow those choice words in that verse to swim alone.

Luke 17
20 And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:

21 Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

22 And he said unto the disciples, The days will come, when ye shall desire to see one of the days of the Son of man, and ye shall not see it.

23 And they shall say to you, See here; or, see there: go not after them, nor follow them.

24 For as the lightning, that lighteneth out of the one part under heaven, shineth unto the other part under heaven; so shall also the Son of man be in his day.

25 But first must he suffer many things, and be rejected of this generation.

26 And as it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man.

27 They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noah entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all.

28 Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded;

29 But the SAME day [of 24 hours] that Lot WENT OUT of Sodom, it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.

30 EVEN THUS shall it be in the SAME [24 hours] day, WHEN the Son of man is revealed.
Please compare with KJV 2 Thes. 1:7-10, to find out "WHEN" is "WHEN".

But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us. 2 Cor. 4:7.

Yes: "when he shall come to be glorified in his saints."

...and that "fire" is Holy fire (spirit).

Also, regarding our "seeing" Him, John tells us that we will see Him as He is because we will be like Him.

All of which means we will see Him in spirit, and the unbelieving world will not see His coming, but be consumed as with fire, Holy fire.

 

[The Light]

I disagree.

The way Jesus ascended is NOTHING like the way He will return and set His feet on the Mt. of Olives.
If you can point out any similarity between Jesus ascension and return at the Mount of Olives....please do.

Does Jesus set His feet on the earth when He comes for the Church?
Does Jesus set His feet on the earth when He comes for the 12 tribes? See below.

Revelation 14
14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.

15 And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe.

16 And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.

Here's another view of the same event. He sends His angels. He does not come to the earth.

Matthew 24
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Don't forget the white horses.

Do you see any white horses here?

Acts1
9 And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight.

10 And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel;

11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

This is when Jesus returns to the earth. He returns in LIKE MANNER. He doesn't ride a white down.

Zechariah 14
4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

 

[WPM]

Isaiah 34
8 For it is the day of the Lord's vengeance, and the year of recompences for the controversy of Zion.

Your turn.

Who are the foolish virgins?

The words "day" and "year" are used spiritually to simply means this is the "time." It does not equate to the duration of 12 months. You really do not get language or Scripture. You twist it to support your error.

Now, will you start answering my questions?

 

[ewq1938]

When the christians are gathered and depart with Jesus as the restrainer is removed.

No, the Apostasy happens long before that.

 

[The Light]

The words "day" and "year" are used spiritually to simply means this is the "time." It does not equate to the duration of 12 months. You really do not get language or Scripture. You twist it to support your error.

Spiritually huh? Is this spiritually also?

Ezekiel 4
6 And when thou hast accomplished them, lie again on thy right side, and thou shalt bear the iniquity of the house of Judah forty days: I have appointed thee each day for a year.

Now, will you start answering my questions?

I have already started. Now answer mine please.

Who are the foolish virgins?

 

[WPM]

Spiritually huh? Is this spiritually also?

Ezekiel 4
6 And when thou hast accomplished them, lie again on thy right side, and thou shalt bear the iniquity of the house of Judah forty days: I have appointed thee each day for a year.


I have already started. Now answer mine please.

Who are the foolish virgins?

They are professing believers. Five are genuine and five are not. Therefore five are ready and five are not.