CadyandZoe
Well-Known Member
Jesus began his ministry by calling the people to "repent for the kingdom of heaven is at hand." In your view, what is Jesus asking people to do exactly?
PETER AND PAUL ON BAPTISMS AND THE HOLY GHOST
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This really is a question that begs for a lot of study on the part of the one who seeks for the answer. But let me just give you some of the many things that one should look into, relative to that. One must stay in the context of the situation of the Israelites (the Jews) in those times, when Jesus came to the world and began His earthly ministry.
The Jews were at that point in time under the dominion of the Romans, under the rule of strangers, who are idolaters. They had no longer an independent government of their own. Idolatry was everywhere, even amongst them. And if you will look at the priesthood, the teachers of the law, you will have an idea what became of Israel. So, what had happened to the Levitical priesthood, even the shepherds who should watch over them and guide them? We learn in scriptures that the Pharisees and Scribes, shut up the kingdom of heaven against them; they devour widows’ houses, and for a pretense make long prayers; they travel land and sea to win one proselyte, and when he is won, they make him twice as much a son of hell as themselves; they are hypocrites, fools, and blind guides; they pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have neglected the weightier matters of the law: justice and mercy and faith; they cleanse the outside of the cup and dish, but inside they are full of extortion and self-indulgence; they are like whitewashed tombs which indeed appear beautiful outwardly, but inside are full of dead men’s bones and all uncleanness; full of hypocrisy and lawlessness; Serpents, brood of vipers; they honor God with their lips, but their heart is far from God; in vain they worship God, teaching as doctrines the commandments of men. They laid aside the commandment of God, and hold the tradition of men. What do you think then became of those whom they teach, the people of Israel? Israel was not taught of the truth, and so many, if not all, were as lost sheep, led astray by those who were given the office and duty to be shepherds who watch over and guide them.
Comes now Jesus. He preached "Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand." Jesus was telling Israel that it was time for them to repent (change their minds), for the kingdom of God is at hand. Concerning what were they to repent from? Considering the context of the time as briefly discussed in the foregoing paragraph, broadly, that would be concerning their sin against the God of their fathers ~ Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Moses. Ultimately speaking, the sin of unbelief or lack of faith, in the one true God.
Tong
R1045
If baptism was continuing to be practiced as it had been up to that time, I don't see an issue here at all.
Baptism was what they did to gentile converts to Judaism, that's why the Pharisees were so offended at the suggestion that they needed to be baptized.
The people saw it as coming out of what they saw to be the failed religious system of the day, into a new personal commitment to God.
If the disciples continued to baptize with the same mind, it would be that the gentiles - go into all the nations - were joining to the Jews, and they, and the Jews also were being baptized into the Israel of God.
Paul was not sent to baptize, because he had been sent to preach the Gospel, as the Gospel was now being given directly to the gentiles.
Much love!
Last edited:
CadyandZoe
Well-Known Member
What would it mean to change one's mind about sin and continue in it? Didn't John the Baptist talk about deeds of repentance?
To continue in sin is an indication that one had not truly repented from it. Deeds of repentance are external good works, the product of repentance, that which show and is evidence of the inward repentance professed to be genuine and sincere.
Tong
R1046
Scriptures says nothing about that.
A man of Ethiopia, a eunuch of great authority under Candace the queen of the Ethiopians, had come to Jerusalem to worship. This would suggest that the eunuch may either be a Jew, if not, a proselyte of Judaism, if not, a God-fearer. What is obvious in this Ethiopian, coming from Ethiopia which is many hundreds of miles from Jerusalem, who had made a pilgrimage "to worship" Yahweh, is his having a great interest in the Jews' religion. So perhaps he may have already known about water baptism, for Judaism required water baptism of converts. Or Philip may have told him of baptism. We could only guess.
Tong
R1149
I said, regarding your question in post #26, that we could only guess. So, what is your point with your statement there? Please elaborate.
Tong
R1151
What scriptures says is this, that God's salvation of man is by grace through faith. Scriptures does not say that God's salvation of man is by grace through baptism.
Tong
R1152
It says there he who does not believe will be condemned. Do you know of scriptures that says he who is not baptized is condemned?
Tong
R1153
Mark 16:16 The requirements for those who are being saved cannot be undone by the requirements for those not being saved! He who believes and is baptized is still required for salvation? Heaven and earth may pass away but my words shall not pass away!
Baptism!
Ez 36:25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.
26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put withi n you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.
Matt 28:19 ( Disciples by baptism not faith alone)
Mk 1:4 John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.
Mark 16:16 he who believes and is baptized shall be saved!
John1:26 John answered them, saying, I baptize with water: but there standeth one among you, whom ye know not; (John prepared the way by baptism)
John 2:6 And there were set there six waterpots of stone, after the manner of the purifying of the Jews, containing two or three firkins apiece. (Old covenant prefiguring of baptism, purification from sin)
John3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. (Baptism)
John 3:22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized. 23 And John also was baptizing in Aenon near to Salim, because there was much water there: and they came, and were baptized.(Baptism)
John 4:4 When therefore the Lord knew how the Pharisees had heard that Jesus made and baptized more disciples than John.
Act 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.(Baptism)
Acts 8:36 And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized?
37 And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
Acts 22:16 And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.
Rom 3:24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
Rom 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
Romans 6:3
Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. Ephesians 4:5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism, Colossians 2:12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.
Titus 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; (baptism)
1 Peter 1:22
Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently: see Ez 36
1 Pet 3:20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.
21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!
(Ark of Noah a type of the church, member of Christ and his church and salvation by baptism!)
(Outside the ark and the church there is no salvation!)
————— Context of Jn 3:5 “born again”
John1:26 John answered them, saying, I baptize with water: but there standeth one among you, whom ye know not; (John prepared the way by baptism)
John 2:6 And there were set there six waterpots of stone, after the manner of the purifying of the Jews, containing two or three firkins apiece. (Old covenant prefiguring of baptism, purification from sin)(His disciples believed because the mother of God interceded Jn 2:11)
John3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. (Baptism)
John 3:22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized. 23 And John also was baptizing in Aenon near to Salim, because there was much water there: and they came, and were baptized.(Baptism)
John 4:4 When therefore the Lord knew how the Pharisees had heard that Jesus made and baptized more disciples than John.
Born again means Baptism!
Ez 36:25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.
26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put withi n you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.
Matt 28:19 ( Disciples by baptism not faith alone)
Mk 1:4 John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.
Mark 16:16 he who believes and is baptized shall be saved!
John1:26 John answered them, saying, I baptize with water: but there standeth one among you, whom ye know not; (John prepared the way by baptism)
John 2:6 And there were set there six waterpots of stone, after the manner of the purifying of the Jews, containing two or three firkins apiece. (Old covenant prefiguring of baptism, purification from sin)
John3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. (Baptism)
John 3:22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized. 23 And John also was baptizing in Aenon near to Salim, because there was much water there: and they came, and were baptized.(Baptism)
John 4:4 When therefore the Lord knew how the Pharisees had heard that Jesus made and baptized more disciples than John.
Act 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.(Baptism)
Acts 8:36 And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized?
37 And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
Acts 22:16 And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.
Rom 3:24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
Rom 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
Romans 6:3
Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. Ephesians 4:5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism, Colossians 2:12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.
Titus 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; (baptism)
1 Peter 1:22
Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently: see Ez 36
1 Pet 3:20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.
21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!
(Ark of Noah a type of the church, member of Christ and his church and salvation by baptism!)
(Outside the ark and the church there is no salvation!)
————— Context of Jn 3:5 “born again”
John1:26 John answered them, saying, I baptize with water: but there standeth one among you, whom ye know not; (John prepared the way by baptism)
John 2:6 And there were set there six waterpots of stone, after the manner of the purifying of the Jews, containing two or three firkins apiece. (Old covenant prefiguring of baptism, purification from sin)(His disciples believed because the mother of God interceded Jn 2:11)
John3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. (Baptism)
John 3:22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized. 23 And John also was baptizing in Aenon near to Salim, because there was much water there: and they came, and were baptized.(Baptism)
John 4:4 When therefore the Lord knew how the Pharisees had heard that Jesus made and baptized more disciples than John.
Born again means Baptism!
Requirements for those not being saved??? Please clarify.
Mark 16:15 And He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature. 16 He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned.
In verse 15, Jesus commanded the eleven apostles to preach the gospel. What is the gospel?
In verse 16, it says "He who believes .....". Believes what? Obviously, the gospel they were to preach. What do you say is the gospel they preached? Is it baptism?
Tong
R1154
You already asked me this and I have already answered that under post #27.
So, again, we could only guess.
Now, what is your answer to my question: What do you say is the gospel they preached? Is it baptism?
Tong
R1155
CadyandZoe
Well-Known Member
The ritual of baptism was a cultural practice marking the beginning of the disciples' new life as the student of the teacher. The reason the eunuch knew about it was because all teachers baptized students. This was a well known cultural practice.
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