Remember the Sabbath Day to keep it holy

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bbyrd009

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Easter is the celebration of the rising of Christ. It is in the bible.
ah, i don't debate with members of a different religion than Christianity, wadr.

And Easter is not in the real Bible anywhere, is mostly why. I hope you understand?

Acts 12:4 Lexicon: When he had seized him, he put him in prison, delivering him to four squads of soldiers to guard him, intending after the Passover to bring him out before the people.

i thought i read you had left Catholicism, or were trying to escape it as we speak, that kind of thing
easter is pretty obviously about fertility i guess
 
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Marymog

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ah, i don't debate with members of a different religion than Christianity, wadr.

And Easter is not in the real Bible anywhere, is mostly why. I hope you understand?
I love Catholics, but i am from a different faith, and we can only disagree here
at least until you find a real Bible and start reading It:
Acts 12:4 Lexicon: When he had seized him, he put him in prison, delivering him to four squads of soldiers to guard him, intending after the Passover to bring him out before the people.

i thought i read you had left Catholicism, or were trying to escape it as we speak, that kind of thing
easter is pretty obviously about fertility i guess
Who gave you the authority to say Catholics or anyone that doesn't believe what you believe are members of a different religion? You are the supreme authority here on earth?
 

bbyrd009

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Who gave you the authority to say Catholics or anyone that doesn't believe what you believe are members of a different religion? You are the supreme authority here on earth?
what i mean is, if you are seeking Christ then you are fine with me, ok, and you can certainly call yourself a Christian if you like, and just ignore the looks you get when you explain that you are really Catholic, i don't care.

But you might also reflect upon this ideal person who claims to be seeking Christ, not knowing that Easter is not in the Bible?
Which is forgivable imo, being ignorance, but now teaching others the same heresy?

You draw the line, ok, i am not here to judge, and Prots are in the same boat anyway i guess, no difference really.
Believe that Easter is in the Bible if you like; but understand how you are going to be made into a hypocrite when you cannot Quote it ok, except after the scribes have got done with it.

I could even quote the directions for this in the Book, and this is the whole point of having many, many copies of the original, etc
 
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Marymog

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i can read a Bible, Mary, and i hope you have a blessed day, ok?
Are you saying that I nor the men of the Catholic Church can't read the bible????

I will...thank you.
 

bbyrd009

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Are you saying that I nor the men of the Catholic Church can't read the bible????
not so much that as that a different symbology is used, establishment or determinist doctrine v the dialectic symbology the Bible was written in, and can be read that way if you like. They made their choice, and you make yours. Seek your own salvation, or seek theirs. Stay inside the camp, or go outside it. Be the one taken, or the one left. Hmm, how many other ways are there to put it i wonder...leave the world, or stay in it, i mean do we need to argue whether the RCC is in the world or not? Or the UPCI, or any of the others? What institution means, iow?

See, this is a good thing to you, right, institutions?

so we would just be arguing at cross purposes
 
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gadar perets

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There were 3 types of law in the OT, moral, ceremonial, civil.
Moral would be the commandments.
Civil would be weddings or divorce.
Ceremonial would be the sacrifices.
This is common knowledge, but if necessary I'll look for something when I'm not on this tablet.
As I said, I never considered the Sabbath to be ceremonial,,but it's a thought.
Yes, I understand this division. All I am saying is that YHWH never made such a division. It is man made. Is divorce immoral? In many instances, yes. Therefore, it should not be boxed into a "civil" box.

However, what you say above is correct.
I "taught" the covenant's a couple of times ...in quotation marks because there's so much to know and I'm not a professor. But I'm forgetting a lot. I checked my notes and, yes, the sign for the Mosaic covenant is the Sabbath. But if we're to keep this sign, then we should also be keeping the sign of the abrahamic covenant...
Circumcision.
Correct. All believers should have their sons circumcised on the 8th day. Why? To be saved? No, but because YHWH commanded it. What is exempt in the NT from circumcision is new adult converts. Why? Because their time to get circumcised has passed. Certain adults were circumcised in the OT, but only at YHWH's command. NT converts have not been given such a command.

Each new covenant did not abolish the earlier ones, but it could have changed them or improved them.
As you stated, however, the apostles did keep the Sabbath, or so it would seem; whereas they specifically stated we are now circumcised in the heart, on the inside and not on the outside and that it was an unnecessary burden on the gentiles.
Circumcision, in and of itself, was not a burden. The unnecessary burden was seeking to be justified by circumcision. That is totally unacceptable.
 

GodsGrace

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Yes, I understand this division. All I am saying is that YHWH never made such a division. It is man made. Is divorce immoral? In many instances, yes. Therefore, it should not be boxed into a "civil" box.


Correct. All believers should have their sons circumcised on the 8th day. Why? To be saved? No, but because YHWH commanded it. What is exempt in the NT from circumcision is new adult converts. Why? Because their time to get circumcised has passed. Certain adults were circumcised in the OT, but only at YHWH's command. NT converts have not been given such a command.


Circumcision, in and of itself, was not a burden. The unnecessary burden was seeking to be justified by circumcision. That is totally unacceptable.
I used marriage as an example.
Jesus said "but I say" intending to change what Moses had done which was to change what God originally meant for marriage to be, in Genesis. Jesus said there can be no divorce except in case of adultery.

Then, in your opinion, we're still under the Law, capital L.
I'm thinking of Hebrews 6:6 and many verses in Romans, for instance 5:1. We are now justified through Christ, not through the Law, at which time, in the O.T., man was made righteous by his own actions, now we are made righteous through Christ.
 

amadeus

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I also say that every day is the Sabbath. But we do have to put aside one day a week for service.
Do we? Why do we? What is the matter with simply praying with ceasing and rejoicing in the Lord always? Meeting together is good, but why Sunday and why Saturday? Since school and work schedules are set as they are, one of those days is good for most. Since I neither work at a regular job nor do I attend school, they both work for me. I meet with my Lord seven days a week. I strive to do whatever He gives my heart to do seven days a week.

Give God the glory daily and without ceasing!
 
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GodsGrace

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Do we? Why do we? What is the matter with simply praying with ceasing and rejoicing in the Lord always? Meeting together is good, but why Sunday and why Saturday? Since school and work schedules are set as they are, one of those days is good for most. Since I neither work as a regular job nor do I attend school, they both work for me. I meet with my Lord seven days a week. I strive to do whatever He gives my heart to do seven days a week.

Give God the glory daily and without ceasing!
Yes. I agree with you. I don't care for one-day-a-week Christianity and I can, I think, assume most here are not like that. But I think it's important to have a church and go to the Mass or the service once a week. Not that I do this, sometimes I stop for months at a time, but I don't think it's a good idea. We need to meet and be united. Didn't Paul also say this:
Hebrews 10:25
 

gadar perets

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Hi,

Paul said, "let no one pass judgment on you in questions of food and drink or with regard to a festival or a new moon or a sabbath."
"No one", in that passage, refers to people outside the Body of Messiah. Look at the context of Colossians 2. In verses 4 and 8 Paul warns the Colossians about deceivers. Then again, in verse 18, Paul gives his final warning about these same deceivers. In what way were they trying to deceive the Colossians? Verse 8 tells us that they were trying to exalt the traditions of men over the Messiah (verses 8 & 19). Notice carefully the context; the traditions of men in verse 8, 18, and 22. The verses that occur between 8 and 22 must be understood based on the context of the traditions of men.

It was the deceivers of verses 4,8, and 18 that were judging the Colossians regarding the things mentioned in verse 16. They had been imposing their man-made commandments and traditions upon the Colossians. Paul told them not to allow anyone to judge them concerning those matters. An important addition was made in the KJV that does not appear in any Greek manuscript. The word "is " in verse 17 was added, which changes the meaning of Paul's statement. That is why it is written in italics. Retaining the word "is" implies the thought of shadow vs. reality. In other words, Messiah fulfilled the shadow of the things mentioned in verse 16. However, if you remove the added word "is", it implies that we should not let any man outside the body of Messiah judge us in respect to these things. Indeed that is in line with the context of Paul's previous statements. Notice Colossians 1:18 & 24 and Colossians 2:19, all of which teach us that the body of Messiah is the church or all true believers.

Verse 17 states that these things "are" a shadow of things "to come" not that they "were" a shadow that was now fulfilled. Paul wrote this epistle approximately 30 years after Messiah's death and resurrection and yet he still spoke of them as unfulfilled shadows of something in the future.

Sunday was the day Jesus was found to have been resurrected. Sunday was the day he appeared to the two disciples on the road to Emmaus and broke bread with them. Jesus first two appearance to the twelve disciples were on the following two Sundays. Five weeks later—on Sunday—the Holy Spirit descended on the apostles. EVEYTHING in the NT points to Sunday worship in the NT.
If your son's birthday falls on a Wednesday, do you celebrate every Wednesday as his birthday? The ONLY reason he resurrected on a Sunday was because he fulfilled the shadow of the wave sheaf offering of Leviticus 23: 9-11 which took place on Abib 16 (the first day of the week that particular year).

The two on the way to Emmaus were not having a worship service. Yeshua also appeared to the disciples on a Monday (John 20:26). Now what? Should we make all Mondays holy days as well? The ONLY reason the Holy Spirit descended on the first of the week is because that is when the 50th day fell from Abib 16 that year according to Jewish reckoning which is what Yeshua followed. Had Yeshua resurrected the following year, he would have resurrected on a different day of the week and Pentecost would have fallen on a different day of the week.

Paul tells us, "On the first day of every week, each of you is to put something aside and store it up......" Why the first day of the week? Because that is the day the early Church met for worship and broke bread in remembrance of Jesus.
Because he would not allow such heavy work to be done on the Sabbath. They were not collecting money, but food for the starving brethren.

And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread,...Acts 20
Acts 2:46 And they, continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart,​

They loved each other and wanted to fellowship DAILY, not just on Sundays. Breaking bread together took place on every day. Perhaps we should all start having communion every day?

In Post #14 you partially quoted Acts 13:42-44 to make your point. How dishonest. You INTENTIANLLY left out the words "And when the Jews were gone out of the synagogue,....In CONTEXT we know that Paul went to the synagogue on the Sabbath to preach and convert the Jews because that is where you would find the Jews gathered. If you were a Jew you wouldn't go to a Christian church on a Tuesday night to try and convert them because NO ONE WOULD BE THERE!!! Even though we should be there everyday. ;)

Maybe the wolves are the ones who came up with your theory?

Mary
Here come the personal attacks. Congratulations on lasting this long without getting personal. Yes, Paul was preaching at a Jewish synagogue on the Sabbath, but the Gentiles wanted to hear him the next Sabbath, not the next Sunday.
 
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gadar perets

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A ceremony is a ritual observance practiced or kept at certain times. In the case of the 10 commandments it is the Sabbath (Saturdays) that was the only ceremonial commandment.
Thanks for telling us what our Creator forgot to tell us.
 

amadeus

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First, the word "alike" is in italics in the KJV because it is not in the Greek. There is nothing wrong with esteeming every day, after all, YHWH made them all. If we choose to worship Him seven days a week, so be it and halleluyah! However, that does not change the fact that as we worship Him every day we must also rest from labor on one day, the Sabbath.
And what does Jesus say of the Sabbath?

"And he saith unto them, Is it lawful to do good on the sabbath days, or to do evil? to save life, or to kill? But they held their peace." Mark 3:4

If all that we do is "good" or if we are at least to do everything good, what does setting aside a day mean? The natural children of Israel without the Holy Ghost in them were trying obeying all of the written rules, but we are trying to obey God directly. What is He saying to us?

Consider first what Peter said:

"Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?" Acts 15:10

And then consider also what Jesus said:

"And when he putteth forth his own sheep, he goeth before them, and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice." John 10:4

And so what is it that He is saying to me? Should I follow another? If He tells what to do, or not, and I am obeying, what is wrong and what is not good? We have received more than the natural children of Israel, so is not more required of us? Not 1 day per week but every day is the day for hearing His voice, obeying Him od and doing good, is it not?
 

amadeus

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The Catholic Church has services everyday in Churches all around the world. We do this in remembrance of Him everyday, just like the NT Christians did. Do you?
I do. I haven't missed a day of remembrance with Him in years. Is any amount enough?
 

amadeus

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Who gave you the authority to say Catholics or anyone that doesn't believe what you believe are members of a different religion? You are the supreme authority here on earth?
While he @bbyrd009 or any man has time, he has the dominion over his own direction... even if he chooses the wrong direction, same as you, same as me. The only supreme authority anywhere is God. But for an allotted time period, God gave man the rule over himself. Every man or woman except Jesus has used that authority to disobey what God has spoken. The only Way to always go right is to always obey God. The only way any man can always obey God is to always hear His voice and to always obey His voice.
 

gadar perets

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And what does Jesus say of the Sabbath?

"And he saith unto them, Is it lawful to do good on the sabbath days, or to do evil? to save life, or to kill? But they held their peace." Mark 3:4

If all that we do is "good" or if we are at least to do everything good, what does setting aside a day mean? The natural children of Israel without the Holy Ghost in them were trying obeying all of the written rules, but we are trying to obey God directly. What is He saying to us?

We have been given the Holy Spirit to empower us to obey. It is a function of the Holy Spirit under the New Covenant to cause us to obey YHWH's Torah which has been written on our hearts and minds (Jeremiah 31:33; Ezekiel 36:26-27). The Sabbath day is part of that Torah. Rejecting the Sabbath is rejecting the leading of the Holy Spirit. That is not good.

Consider first what Peter said:

"Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?" Acts 15:10
The yoke was not obeying Moses or getting circumcised. The yoke was doing those things in order to be saved.

Acts 15:1 And certain men which came down from Judaea taught the brethren, and said, Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved.
Acts 15:11 But we believe that through the grace of the Master Yeshua Messiah we shall be saved, even as they.

Salvation by works is impossible, but we were ordained unto good works as a result of our salvation. Obedience to YHWH is a fruit of our salvation, not the means to it.

And then consider also what Jesus said:

"And when he putteth forth his own sheep, he goeth before them, and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice." John 10:4

And so what is it that He is saying to me? Should I follow another? If He tells what to do, or not, and I am obeying, what is wrong and what is not good? We have received more than the natural children of Israel, so is not more required of us? Not 1 day per week but every day is the day for hearing His voice, obeying Him od and doing good, is it not?
No, you should not follow another. You should follow Yeshua as he follows his Father and does His will. It is Father YHWH's will to keep His Sabbath Day holy and not defile it by working on that day. If you obey Yeshua, then do as he says and do good on the Sabbath Day. He was referring to the 7th day of the week. We do good on that day by obeying YHWH and not working. There are also many other ways to do good on the Sabbath, but when we change the Sabbath from the 7th day to the first day or abolish it altogether, we do EVIL.
 
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gadar perets

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While he @bbyrd009 or any man has time, he has the dominion over his own direction... even if he chooses the wrong direction, same as you, same as me. The only supreme authority anywhere is God. But for an allotted time period, God gave man the rule over himself. Every man or woman except Jesus has used that authority to disobey what God has spoken. The only Way to always go right is to always obey God. The only way any man can always obey God is to always hear His voice and to always obey His voice.
His voice already said;

"Remember the Sabbath day to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: But the seventh day is the sabbath of YHWH thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: For in six days YHWH made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore YHWH blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.
Israel failed to obey because the commandments were external, written on stone. Now they are to be written internally on our hearts. He can certainly speak to us through other means besides His commandments, but not to the exclusion of what is written in His Word, the Scriptures and in our hearts.
 
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gadar perets

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I used marriage as an example.
Jesus said "but I say" intending to change what Moses had done which was to change what God originally meant for marriage to be, in Genesis. Jesus said there can be no divorce except in case of adultery.
Yeshua was not trying to change what Moses said and Moses did NOT change what YHWH said. YHWH gave Moses the words of Deuteronomy 24:1-4. The Jews mangled it by allowing divorce for any reason. Yeshua restored the intent of the command. The "uncleanness" of Deuteronomy 24:1 refers to sexual immorality (not just adultery). He actually upheld Moses.

Then, in your opinion, we're still under the Law, capital L.
We are not under the Law, but we must obey the Law. To not be "under the Law" means to not be subject to its condemnation. We are not under any of the Ten Commandments (nine according to Christians), but we must obey them. Are you free to commit adultery, murder and theft? No. Why? Because the Law remains intact and is written in our hearts. Sadly, many Christians refuse to allow the Holy Spirit to write the Sabbath command there.

I'm thinking of Hebrews 6:6 and many verses in Romans, for instance 5:1. We are now justified through Christ, not through the Law, at which time, in the O.T., man was made righteous by his own actions, now we are made righteous through Christ.
I'm not sure why you brought up Hebrews 6:6, but as for Romans 5:1, I am not and never have said we are justified (made righteous) through the Law. Nor are we saved through the Law. Obedience to any Law, whether it be the Sabbath or not stealing, is a fruit of salvation, not the means to it. We are justified by faith, not Law. Even though every believer is justified by faith, they still obey nine of the Ten Commandments. The Sabbath is the problem because they have been taught FALSELY that it is changed or abolished. Satan is no dummy. The best way to get a believer to sin is by deceiving him/her into believing the Law is abolished or changed. The Law is like a mirror. When you look into it you see the dirt on your face (adulteries, thefts, idolatry, etc.), but it the mirror is broken, as with the Sabbath, then you can't see your sins against it on your face. Therefore, you won't go to Yeshua to have your Sabbath breaking cleansed and forgiven. Diabolical indeed!
 
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