ROMANS: JUSTIFICATION BY FAITH

[Doug]

(Romans 5:1 KJV) Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:

By faith we are justified (declared righteous) at the present time; justification is in our possession as a gift, by grace. Justification is through Christ.

(Romans 3:28 KJV) Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

Justification is only by faith. The law could never justify unto eternal life.

(Romans 4:5 KJV) But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

Our faith is counted for righteousness not our works. The ungodly are justified by believing on Christ, by believing the gospel. We can not do anything to justify ourselves, being ungodly by nature.

(Habakkuk 2:4 KJV) Behold, his soul [which] is lifted up is not upright in him: but the just shall live by his faith.

The righteousness of God has always been by faith.

(Romans 5:10 KJV) For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

We were enemies of God, but being reconciled, we have peace with God.

(Psalm 85:10 KJV) Mercy and truth are met together; righteousness and peace have kissed [each other].

Righteousness and peace have kissed in Christ, even as John says in John 1:17.

(Colossians 1:20 KJV) And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, [I say], whether [they be] things in earth, or things in heaven.

We have been reconciled. God purposed to make peace with us and reconcile us through Christ Jesus, by the blood of his cross.

Wrath appears in scripture:

(Romans 1:18 KJV) For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;

Wrath is against all ungodliness and unrighteousness.

(Ephesians 2:3 KJV) Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.

Wrath is against the children of wrath.

(Romans 4:15 KJV) Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, [there is] no transgression.

The law can not be obeyed, and works wrath and cursing:

(Galatians 3:10, 13 KJV) 10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed [is] every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them. 13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed [is] every one that hangeth on a tree:

There was wrath according to prophecy:

(Matthew 3:7 KJV) But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees come to his baptism, he said unto them, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?

We have been saved from wrath and are justified by the blood of Christ:

(1 Thessalonians 5:9 KJV) For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

(Romans 5:9 KJV) Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

 

[justbyfaith]

In Romans 2:13 we are told that it is the doers of the law who will be justified.

This does not mean that we are justified through law-keeping; it means that those who are justified by Christ will not be violators of the law.

If we bear the fruit of the Spirit, there is no law that we will violate or that will condemn us for our behaviour (Galatians 5:22-23).

Therefore, there is a righteousness of the Lord apart from the law, that is nevertheless attested to by the law and the prophets (Romans 3:21), that it is righteousness indeed.

Fact of the matter is, the venue by which we obtain this righteousness is not through attempting to obey a set of do's and don'ts.

It is through walking not after the flesh but after the Spirit. And in this, the righteousness of the do's and don'ts will be fulfilled in us (Romans 8:4).

For we walk by faith, and not by sight (2 Corinthians 5:7).

Therefore, since in walking by faith we will be obedient to the leadings and promptings of the Holy Spirit who dwells within us, our righteousness, which amounts to being obedient to the standard of do's and don'ts, is not achieved by attempting to obey a set of do's and don'ts. It is achieved by faith.

 

[mjrhealth]

Therefore, since in walking by faith we will be obedient to the leadings and promptings of the Holy Spirit who dwells within us, our righteousness, which amounts to being obedient to the standard of do's and don'ts, is not achieved by attempting to obey a set of do's and don'ts. It is achieved by faith.

With that I whole heartedly agree, cept you keep throwing the "law" in there.

 

[justbyfaith]

With that I whole heartedly agree, cept you keep throwing the "law" in there.

The law is a schoolmaster to lead men to Christ (Galatians 3:24-25). It shows men that they are sinners in need of the Saviour (Romans 3:20). It has the power to convert the soul (Psalms 19:7 (kjv)).

While it does not have the power to impart life (Galatians 3:21).

So then, how does it convert the soul? By showing men that they need Jesus, to whom they then turn to for salvation.

 

[mjrhealth]

The law is a schoolmaster to lead men to Christ (Galatians 3:24-25). It shows men that they are sinners in need of the Saviour (Romans 3:20). It has the power to convert the soul (Psalms 19:7 (kjv)).

While it does not have the power to impart life (Galatians 3:21).

So then, how does it convert the soul? By showing men that they need Jesus, to whom they then turn to for salvation.

The law was "there"school master, not ours we have never had anything to do with it, you keep dumping it on us, are you sure your not SDA.

Joh_1:17 For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.

Which part did we get???

 

[justbyfaith]

The law was "there"school master, not ours we have never had anything to do with it, you keep dumping it on us, are you sure your not SDA.

Joh_1:17 For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.

Which part did we get???

See Galatians 3:23. If you have come to faith, there was a time when you were kept under the law.

'nuff said!

 

[mjrhealth]

See Galatians 3:23. If you have come to faith, there was a time when you were kept under the law.

'nuff said!

Yes they where, they where married to the law shut up up from faith, we came to Christ by faith not by the law, The law was never given to the gentiles, you keep adding it.

Marriage

Rom 7:1 Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth?
Rom 7:2 For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.
Rom 7:3 So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man.
Rom 7:4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

Would you rather be married to the Law than Christ or is playing the Harlot a good thing, choosing another womans husband.

or as Christ put it

Luk 5:36 And he spake also a parable unto them; No man putteth a piece of a new garment upon an old; if otherwise, then both the new maketh a rent, and the piece that was taken out of the new agreeth not with the old.
Luk 5:37 And no man putteth new wine into old bottles; else the new wine will burst the bottles, and be spilled, and the bottles shall perish.
Luk 5:38 But new wine must be put into new bottles; and both are preserved.
Luk 5:39 No man also having drunk old wine straightway desireth new: for he saith, The old is better.
So is the law better than the hspirit and grace??

 

[justbyfaith]

Gentiles without faith in Christ are indeed under the law; it is the church (those who have faith in Jesus Christ, whether Jew or Gentile) that is not under the law.

In Romans 3:19-20, we find that all the world will be found guilty before God because of the law; this includes both Jew and Gentile; it is not speaking only of the Jew.

Therefore Gentiles are subject to the law; for the law gives them the knowledge of sin and shows them that they are guilty before a living and holy God.

Here:

Rom 3:19, Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.
Rom 3:20, Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

Also, consider:

Rom 3:30, Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith.
Rom 3:31, Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

The uncircumcision, or the Gentiles, are justified "through" faith. Whereas Jews are justified "by" it.

Yet we do not make void the law "through" faith...in other words, the Gentiles do not make void the law but they are to establish it.

 

[mjrhealth]

Gentiles are indeed under the law; it is the church that is not under the law.

In Romans 3:19-20, we find that all the world will be found guilty before God because of the law; this includes both Jew and Gentile; it is not speaking only of the Jew.

Therefore Gentiles are subject to the law; for the law gives them the knowledge of sin and shows them that they are guilty before a living and holy God.

Here:

Rom 3:19, Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.
Rom 3:20, Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

Also, consider:

Rom 3:30, Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith.
Rom 3:31, Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

The uncircumcision, or the Gentiles, are justified "through" faith. Whereas Jews are justified "by" it.

Yet we do not make void the law "through" faith...in other words, the Gentiles do not make void the law but they are to establish it.

Like I said what has the law to do with you, you are supposed to be a christian under grace, why are you so determined to prove your works by the law, the law will always be by works, its not of the Spirit. Should I ask again, im sure I asked before, are you sure your not SDA??.

 

[justbyfaith]

Like I said what has the law to do with you,

It is written on my heart and on my mind (Hebrews 8:8-10, Hebrews 10:16, Romans 8:7, Romans 8:4, 1 John 5:3, 2 John 1:6).

The love of the Lord that is shed abroad in my heart (Romans 5:5) through faith (Galatians 3:14) fulfills the righteousness of the law within me (Romans 13:8-10, Galatians 5:14, 1 John 5:3, 2 John 1:6, Romans 8:4).

 

[mjrhealth]

It is written on my heart and on my mind (Hebrews 8:8-10, Hebrews 10:16, Romans 8:7, Romans 8:4, 1 John 5:3, 2 John 1:6).

The love of the Lord that is shed abroad in my heart (Romans 5:5) through faith (Galatians 3:14) fulfills the righteousness of the law within me (Romans 13:8-10, Galatians 5:14, 1 John 5:3, 2 John 1:6, Romans 8:4).

Should I keep asking, what has the law to do with youy, a christian supposedly walking in Faith, will the shadow of the law forever hang over your head threatening you with death or is faith to far from you,

Php_3:9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:

All you have done so far is try and justify yourself keeping the law.

Rom_9:32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;

will you forever stumble

 

[historyb]

(Romans 5:1 KJV) Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:

By faith we are justified (declared righteous) at the present time; justification is in our possession as a gift, by grace. Justification is through Christ.

Not alone though, we are saved by Grace through faith

 

[justbyfaith]

Should I keep asking, what has the law to do with you <fify>, a Christian <fify> supposedly walking in Faith, will the shadow of the law forever hang over your head threatening you with death or is faith to far from you,

The law does not threaten me with death. As concerning condemnation, I am not under it (Romans 6:14), am dead to it (Romans 7:4, Galatians 2:19) and am delivered from it (Romans 7:6).

So, now, it is not any longer a taskmaster that condemns me when I fail, but now it is a set of wisdom principles by which I live and receive blessing through the living by them (James 1:25).

All you have done so far is try and justify yourself keeping the law.

I am not justified by my keeping of the law. I am justified through faith in the blood of Christ which sanctifies me (Hebrews 13:12, Hebrews 10:29) and cleanses me from all sin (1 John 1:7).

And what is the definition of sin, except that it is the transgression of the law (1 John 3:4)?

Rom_9:32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;

will you forever stumble

That is actually one of my favorite passages in all of holy scripture; and I do not stumble at that stumbling stone.

I do not trust in my ability to keep the law as being my salvation; my trust is wholly in the blood of Christ.

The blood of Jesus sanctifies me (Hebrews 13:12, Hebrews 10:29) and cleanses me from all sin (1 John 1:7) so that I am not disobedient to the requirement of the law.

However, the root of my salvation is not in my lack of disobedience, but in my faith in the blood of Jesus.

It is that my faith apprehends the blood of Jesus, by which I am saved and made holy.

One might stumble at this knowledge and think that they must be saved by becoming holy. That is not the case. One is saved by the blood of Jesus; and the salvation itself has as one of its aspects the fact that we are made holy.

Therefore, we don't save ourselves by trying to live a holy life. The Lord saves us through our faith in the blood of Jesus which indeed makes us holy. It is indeed a miraculous effect instituted by the blood of Christ.

 

[mjrhealth]

And what is the definition of sin, except that it is the transgression of the law (1 John 3:4)?

No it is not, see what happens you read to much and dont ask enough, The bible is not God it is not Jesus, The truth is in Jesus if you choose to seek Him.

Teh law has noting to do with us so stop adding it, has no bearing on ones salvation, so why do you insist on adding it too. You read the bible and think because you do, you have it right, and we can see can this forum the debacle that causes.

 

[justbyfaith]

Teh law has noting to do with us so stop adding it, has no bearing on ones salvation,

2Co 13:5, Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

2Co 5:17, Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

The old things is the previous lifestyle of sinning against the law of God; the all things that are become new is the new life of walking in holiness and bearing the fruit of the Spirit against which there is no law.

Rom 3:20, Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

You can know whether or not you are walking as a new creature in Christ by looking into and continuing in the perfect law of liberty.

The one who turns away his ears from hearing the law, even his prayer shall be an abomination.

 

[mjrhealth]

The one who turns away his ears from hearing the law, even his prayer shall be an abomination.

Well if the law you want go join the SDA church you are 90% there, im sure they would be happy to have another join them in there delusion. You will insist on adding too, We are saved by grace though faith, nothing eles.

 

[justbyfaith]

Well if the law you want go join the SDA church you are 90% there, im sure they would be happy to have another join them in there delusion. You will insist on adding too, We are saved by grace though faith, nothing else. <fify>

The verse in question is found in Proverbs 28:9.

And it doesn't say that we obey the law in order to be saved.

The emphasis is on hearing the law.

We have the tendency of thinking we are all that if we do not come into contact with the law from time to time. The law gives us the knowledge of sin (Romans 3:20). It shows us that we are sinners, when we measure our lives up to it, if we are not born of God.

If we are born of God, then it shows us that we are righteous before Him.

1Jo 3:22, And whatsoever we ask, we receive of him, because we keep his commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in his sight.

By looking to the law of liberty we can begin to see where we are going wrong and also make course corrections in the way that we are living. Then, as we live right, we can have the assurance that our prayers are answered.

 

[mjrhealth]

If we are born of God, then it shows us that we are righteous before Him.

You still stuck in the past,

Joh 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.
Joh 16:8 And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:
Joh 16:9 Of sin, because they believe not on me;
Joh 16:10 Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more;
Joh 16:11 Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged.

Ever since Pentecost, it has being by the Spirit, still today rejected of men replaced by replaced with study and religions and mens fables and fancies. Like I said go find Him than you will see. How long will you keep your idol before Him and keep Him shut out, as long as it is first you will always make Him last.

 

[justbyfaith]

@mjrhealth, please tell us what your relationship with Christ is like.

Do you hear a voice in your mind who claims to be Jesus Christ?

How do you hear from Him?

Personally, I hear from the Lord by reading His word. He is perfectly capable of speaking to me through words that He has inspired to be written as an integrated message system, composed of 66 books by 40 different authors over a period of 2,000 years and over 3 different continents; and yet there is continuity in its pages and there are no contradictions therein.

The scriptures are they which testify of Christ. How is it that you do not accept all of their testimony concerning Christ?

 

[mjrhealth]

Do you hear a voice in your mind who claims to be Jesus Christ?

How do you hear from Him?

Joh 10:26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.
Joh 10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
Joh 10:28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.

Well you are obviously listening to someone, just not Him, all claim to be by the spirit yet by there very own words deny Him.

Mat_10:20 For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father which speaketh in you.

How can you hear when you say your are not listening.