Shall We Suffer In The Tribulation Period. I Think Not.

[Brother Mike]

Thank you Hammerstone..................... Lots of Christians gonna be surprised then............ Who desires the day of the Lord, what day will it be for you?

Even if you believe in some Rapture theory....... just going to church is not going to cut it...........

The Lord told me this a few years back..............

Only those that have conducted their life as if I am really Lord will be spared.

Many go to church, and don't even consider that they have a Lord...............Someone you follow and stick close to..........Do as your told and led to do......

Very interesting Hammerstone...... Also very eye opening.

Jesus Is Lord.

 

[01CobraVortech]

I'm not planning on fighting the AntiChrist. If you are fighting the Antichrist, then you missed it.

 

[jerryjohnson]

I'm not planning on fighting the AntiChrist. I...

Yes, I know. You are going to be in bed with him.

 

[01CobraVortech]

Yes, I know. You are going to be in bed with him.

Oh Jerry...the Word of God just doesn't always play out like a Hollywood movie, where you get to wear your camouflage gear and launch rpgs at him. But I admire your vivid imagination.

 

[lecoop]

Not going to use Scriptures............ just a point. Why do so many believe that we are going to be tested or suffer during the tribulation period? I was reading some web sites and it is suggest that we are "Tested" during this time.

Pretty strange the Lord would not be able to present to himself a glorious chruch, without spot or wrinkle.

(tons of other scripture ommitted for now)

I posted once that we are told that we will escape the wrath to come.......... someone corrected me and said, Ya, we escape God's wrath, but not Satans................. Well, then who is doing the testing if that is the case??

What about Satan? He's defeated and we have authority over him. The Name of Jesus never will loose power.

(Ya, but Brother Mike. It is given the devil power to make war with the saints and overcome them......)

Well, we must not escape the wrath to come then, unless we are not talking about the church.

You see, the Chruch is talked about until we get to the Churches at the start of Rev.............. The Church is not mentioned again until the end............ So what saints are we talking about here??

Even so..........Jesus said if we keep his word, we escape the trial....................Rev 3:10


Now let say we do have to be retried and the Blood just was not strong enough to get the job done. God has to make sure our names need to be in that book of life right? So, He sends his church in and gives Satan power to stomp on us for a bit.........

This is the same concept as purgatory folks!!!!!!!

I suppose we must believe in that also???

I started a end time thread!!!! Ya all should be happy now..............

Jesus Is Lord.

MIke, it is only a theory that one separates the wrath of Satan from the wrath of the Lord, for John shows us in Revelation that they are both happening at the same time. While the Beast is at the peak of his destruction, beheading millions who refuse his mark, God is pouring out the vials of his Wrath. They are concurrent. Therefore any theory that wants to separate them is a FALSE theory.

Next, God has a good word for the church during this same time: ESCAPE

Luke 21:36
Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.

But, God gave us a free will, and here too we have a choice: we can escape, if we can just believe the scriptures about the rapture. But if one desires to be left behind at the rapture, then this scripture fits them:

Rev 13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them:

Please don't misunderstand this verse: what it means is that most, not a few, are overcome. And if overcome, it certainly will mean beheading. Why would ANYONE want to be left behind, to face beheading? I think there is a verse that fits that too:

1 Corinthians 14:38
But if any man be ignorant, let him be ignorant.

Again, God gives us a choice. We can fight and argue against the rapture of the church - or we can simply believe it. As for the "saints" mentioned in many verses in Revelation: it does not in any way disprove a pretrib rapture. Of the billions that will be left behind, untold millions will understand their mistake, and will immediately turn to God. There will not be a lack of saints during the 70th week. Next, there will be Hebrews that will refuse the mark. If God chooses to call them saints, I certainly will not complain.

Coop

 

[Brother Mike]

lecoop:

Thank you for the input Iecoop!!!!!!

We need more of with Understanding as yourself.

Your version of "Escape" Means that there is a assumption that some Rapture event must occur.

If you will take a look at this thread.

http://www.christianityboard.com/topic/12112-the-rapture-lie/page__pid__83013__st__0&#entry83013

I discuss the Rapture. I talk about the points you made here, which were ignored in the OP. You can tell by what spirit was operating in the OP because of the condescending spirit. It was more about proving something wrong, than giving the Word in edification.

As for someone that does not have faith in the Rapture, then won't be raptured? I don't know........ No faith, no results. It will also be to shame those that deceive others to think the Church will be hear causing possible fear, and misplacing terms such as "Elect" The Lord is able to present himself a Church without spot or wrinkle. So, the Church would be "Elect" or chosen.

It would condemn some to think they may not be a "Elect" and have to suffer because they were not good enough.

head over to the thread and Read that. In that you will see my view.

Jesus Is Lord.

 

[fivesense]

Not going to use Scriptures............ just a point. Why do so many believe that we are going to be tested or suffer during the tribulation period? I was reading some web sites and it is suggest that we are "Tested" during this time.

Pretty strange the Lord would not be able to present to himself a glorious chruch, without spot or wrinkle.

(tons of other scripture ommitted for now)

I posted once that we are told that we will escape the wrath to come.......... someone corrected me and said, Ya, we escape God's wrath, but not Satans................. Well, then who is doing the testing if that is the case??
What about Satan? He's defeated and we have authority over him. The Name of Jesus never will loose power.
(Ya, but Brother Mike. It is given the devil power to make war with the saints and overcome them......)
Well, we must not escape the wrath to come then, unless we are not talking about the church.
You see, the Chruch is talked about until we get to the Churches at the start of Rev.............. The Church is not mentioned again until the end............ So what saints are we talking about here??
Even so..........Jesus said if we keep his word, we escape the trial....................Rev 3:10
Now let say we do have to be retried and the Blood just was not strong enough to get the job done. God has to make sure our names need to be in that book of life right? So, He sends his church in and gives Satan power to stomp on us for a bit.........
This is the same concept as purgatory folks!!!!!!!
I suppose we must believe in that also???
I started a end time thread!!!! Ya all should be happy now..............

Jesus Is Lord.

WOW, how naughty. A blatant disregard of the fundamentals. Trying to start a fire no doubt.

I get a kick out of how much confusion and debate takes place whenever people walk into a Jewish prophetic piece, written for Jewish believers, totally literal and yet to come, thinking they know what is says to "us". The nations, the gentiles are not even the subject here in the Unveiling of Jesus Christ, only being mentioned casually as small players on the scene.

The enemy loves it.
fivesense

 

[Brother Mike]

Fivesense:

WOW, how naughty. A blatant disregard of the fundamentals. Trying to start a fire no doubt.

Well, bored......... It is in the debate forum.......... over in the Rapture lie thread I suppose all agreed that we are protected, as well as some post here. So, I really did not get a chance to drag out scriptures. Hard when everyone agrees.

I have no idea of what you said in the rest of your post............. I assume it was all good though..

Be blessed!!!

Jesus Is Lord.

 

[Mercy777]

Yes I have read Newton's predictions it is interesting he was into this stuff ...However God promises he will return before those born in 1948 all die... its the one parable he told us to learn because it tells when the last days started you are living in that generation ... and its some 62 years old so Newton was wrong

I am new. Is there scripture on this? Just interested. Is it, " when Israel becomes a nation, that generation shall not pass before the coming of Christ? (paraphrasing)

God Bless,
Mercy

 

[Surf Rider]

"Shall we suffer in the tribulation period. I think not."

Maybe we should start thinking. LOL

I am new. Is there scripture on this? Just interested. Is it, " when Israel becomes a nation, that generation shall not pass before the coming of Christ? (paraphrasing)

God Bless,
Mercy

It might be prudent to not read this stuff. Or any stuff on it.

Scriptures state that we are to be taught of God. That God is our Father. That we have no need that any man teach us. That we are to have the mind of Christ. That those who are born of God hear His voice, and the voices of others they do not hear. And it also states that we are to test ourselves, to see if we are actually in the faith, as opposed to firmly believing that we are, when in fact we aren't.

So ask yourself, "when was the last time that I heard God's voice?" Do you hear it all the time? Do you understand it and obey it with alacrity?

Simple test, by the word of God itself.

So don't go to others for their take on the "truth" of God's word -- go to God alone. And until we are strong enough hear God's voice all the time, and recognize the "others" voices, we are foolish indeed to go to others for insight. We are to merely keep pointing others to Christ, and He will teach them, for as the word says, the tutor (decalogue) is gone, and the truth Teacher is now here.... if we are of Him.

I so often see that believers are led astray, simply because they delve into all sorts of views on eschatology, when it doesn't really matter one bit. Yet they are stunted, and some even killed spiritually, by this. It is a most common means for the Evil One to damage the spiritual plant. As the word of God states, let us not be ignorant of the wiles of the Devil.

Do all to stand. And when you have actually done all to stand, you will stand fast. Until then, you will not stand fast. At least that's what the word of God states. I believe it.

I counsel you to believe it also, and then live according to that truth.


blessings in Christ when you do this,

Surf Rider

 

[Mercy777]

"Shall we suffer in the tribulation period. I think not."

Maybe we should start thinking. LOL



It might be prudent to not read this stuff. Or any stuff on it.

Scriptures state that we are to be taught of God. That God is our Father. That we have no need that any man teach us. That we are to have the mind of Christ. That those who are born of God hear His voice, and the voices of others they do not hear. And it also states that we are to test ourselves, to see if we are actually in the faith, as opposed to firmly believing that we are, when in fact we aren't.

So ask yourself, "when was the last time that I heard God's voice?" Do you hear it all the time? Do you understand it and obey it with alacrity?

Simple test, by the word of God itself.

So don't go to others for their take on the "truth" of God's word -- go to God alone. And until we are strong enough hear God's voice all the time, and recognize the "others" voices, we are foolish indeed to go to others for insight. We are to merely keep pointing others to Christ, and He will teach them, for as the word says, the tutor (decalogue) is gone, and the truth Teacher is now here.... if we are of Him.

I so often see that believers are led astray, simply because they delve into all sorts of views on eschatology, when it doesn't really matter one bit. Yet they are stunted, and some even killed spiritually, by this. It is a most common means for the Evil One to damage the spiritual plant. As the word of God states, let us not be ignorant of the wiles of the Devil.

Do all to stand. And when you have actually done all to stand, you will stand fast. Until then, you will not stand fast. At least that's what the word of God states. I believe it.

I counsel you to believe it also, and then live according to that truth.


blessings in Christ when you do this,

Surf Rider

Surf Rider, I completely understand. I was only asking about scripture for the 1948 Israel. I had heard this years ago and I have never seen scripture for this. I wanted to read this for myself .

Thank you and God Bless,
Mercy

 

[veteran]

Surf Rider, I completely understand. I was only asking about scripture for the 1948 Israel. I had heard this years ago and I have never seen scripture for this. I wanted to read this for myself .

Mercy,

If you want to know that, look at the Jeremiah 24 prophecy. But it requires understanding of Bible history involving the "house of Judah" and Jerusalem.

The hingepoint of the prophecy is that God promised specifically to Judah (the good basket of figs), that He would bring them back into the land of promise and not remove them again. Since 70 A.D., most of them had been removed out of the holy land. And in the latter years (past few centuries) many of them having been going back. The height of that on-going return was in 1948 when Israel officially became a nation-state in the land again with a mass exodus of Judah back into the land, and a vote by the nations through the U.N. Charter to allow the creation of the state of Israel.

Matt 24:32-34
32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:
33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.
34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.
(KJV)


In Christ's Olivet discourse of Matt.24, He linked the parable of the fig tree with that prophecy. His Message was that the generation that sees the signs He gave of the end will not pass until all those things (signs) are fulfilled. The "these things" He referred to are seven signs of the end leading up to the time of His coming. The final sign He gave there in Matt.24 is about His future return, the second coming and gathering of His saints to Him. Those signs are about the events of the seven seals of Rev.6.

There's been debate between scholars when the Jer.24 prophecy was fulfilled. Some treat the 1967 war when Israel took back all of Jerusalem as its fulfillment. But alas, Israel gave a section of Jerusalem back to the Palestinians after that war.

Thus, the formation of the nation-state of Israel again in the holy land of promise in 1948 may serve as the fig tree parable start time generation, if the signs of the end our Lord Jesus gave is happenning along with it. And it would simply mean we may expect those signs to be fulfilled within that generation, which includes the sign of Christ's return and our gathering. Biblically, there's several different longevity times for a generation, which is not as important as being able to recognize those signs our Lord gave.

Also, some try to move the time of those signs Christ gave in Matt.24 back to 70 A.D. and the days of Christ's Apostles. Problem with that is that the final sign our Lord Jesus gave there is about His second coming which includes our literal gathering to Him as written. That reveals those signs were not fulfilled back in the days of His Apostles, nor any other previous times before our days.

Now if today's nation-state of Israel was sieged and conquered again, with Judah scattered out of the land again, then that prophecy would not show fulfillment yet. So far that has not happened, even though it's been attempted several times since 1948.

 

[Mercy777]

Mercy,

If you want to know that, look at the Jeremiah 24 prophecy. But it requires understanding of Bible history involving the "house of Judah" and Jerusalem.

The hingepoint of the prophecy is that God promised specifically to Judah (the good basket of figs), that He would bring them back into the land of promise and not remove them again. Since 70 A.D., most of them had been removed out of the holy land. And in the latter years (past few centuries) many of them having been going back. The height of that on-going return was in 1948 when Israel officially became a nation-state in the land again with a mass exodus of Judah back into the land, and a vote by the nations through the U.N. Charter to allow the creation of the state of Israel.

Matt 24:32-34
32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:
33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.
34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.
(KJV)


In Christ's Olivet discourse of Matt.24, He linked the parable of the fig tree with that prophecy. His Message was that the generation that sees the signs He gave of the end will not pass until all those things (signs) are fulfilled. The "these things" He referred to are seven signs of the end leading up to the time of His coming. The final sign He gave there in Matt.24 is about His future return, the second coming and gathering of His saints to Him. Those signs are about the events of the seven seals of Rev.6.

There's been debate between scholars when the Jer.24 prophecy was fulfilled. Some treat the 1967 war when Israel took back all of Jerusalem as its fulfillment. But alas, Israel gave a section of Jerusalem back to the Palestinians after that war.

Thus, the formation of the nation-state of Israel again in the holy land of promise in 1948 may serve as the fig tree parable start time generation, if the signs of the end our Lord Jesus gave is happenning along with it. And it would simply mean we may expect those signs to be fulfilled within that generation, which includes the sign of Christ's return and our gathering. Biblically, there's several different longevity times for a generation, which is not as important as being able to recognize those signs our Lord gave.

Also, some try to move the time of those signs Christ gave in Matt.24 back to 70 A.D. and the days of Christ's Apostles. Problem with that is that the final sign our Lord Jesus gave there is about His second coming which includes our literal gathering to Him as written. That reveals those signs were not fulfilled back in the days of His Apostles, nor any other previous times before our days.

Now if today's nation-state of Israel was sieged and conquered again, with Judah scattered out of the land again, then that prophecy would not show fulfillment yet. So far that has not happened, even though it's been attempted several times since 1948.

Thanks a million for the scripture!
As soon as I began reading this I knew what you were speaking of because I had studied it long ago. It just clicked when I read it because of a neighbor speaking this when I was about 8-10. At that time I had no knowledge of the Lord, but that prophecy stuck with me. Who would of known a child with no religious upbringing would meet Jesus at 15 and a neighbor speaking His words would be remembered in another generation? God is magnificent!
I remember the history of Jerusalem well so this just reinterated what I was thinking.

God Bless Veteran,
Mercy.