Intelligent design is philosophy/theology. It is not science. Evolution is a scientific theory that is the result of observing nature and reality. It is based on the logic of science and what is observable.This is how science works. That is what separates scientific theories from other "theories" which are not based on any observations or rationality (for example, one cannot compare Sumerian creation myth "theories" to the "theory" of gravity").ID posits that an uncreated, complex designer designed our universe, while simultaneously existing outside of the universe and independent of it (according to some versions). This is contrary to science (and impossible) and isnt based on any observations in reality. It is based on faith.Christians seem to be the only ones who are parading around ID. No one else seems to care about, whether that be the Jews, Muslims, Hindus, or Zoroastrians. I didn't mention the Buddhists because they are largely non-theists. Even if ID were true, there is no way to prove that this God is Jesus, Allah, Ganesh, Kali, Ahura Mazda, or Zeus. If it were proved that the God of ID was a non-Christian God, then Christians would be shooting themselves in the foot.This is why faith and philosophy that contradicts science (which is what ID does) should not be taught as an alternative to evolution. It should be taught, and explored, but in a philosophy or religious classroom.Otherwise, every single creation myth from every single religion is a legitimate "alternative" to scientific theory, and should be taught.With that said, questioning evolution is fine. There is nothing wrong with that. But it should be understood that ID is not a legitimate scientific alternative, and is instead a faith based alternative, and hence no comparison can be made. Faith is not a substitute for science. For example, I can have faith that if I jump off a cliff, I want fall but float. Observable reality shows that this is false.Do you agree? Should ID be taught in science classes? What about other creation myths?
Should Intelligent Design Be Taught as an Alternative to Evolution?
- Thread starter adren@line
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Everything has a beginning, everything started some where nothing starts from nothing.
ID posits that an uncreated, complex designer designed our universe, while simultaneously existing outside of the universe and independent of it (according to some versions). This is contrary to science (and impossible) and isnt based on any observations in reality. It is based on faith.
Science can only deal with nature has it is what your talking about goes outside the scope of science in general. Are you speaking in finite terms or infinite terms? Science can only explain things like the Big Bang up to nature that is where their explanation becomes plausible.The universe started from something....is the universe finite or infinite? There is a universal law of cause and effect. In fact, the whole basis of science is to observe the phenomena of the universe and to seek to understand its causes.
ID posits that an uncreated, complex designer designed our universe, while simultaneously existing outside of the universe and independent of it (according to some versions). This is contrary to science (and impossible) and isnt based on any observations in reality. It is based on faith.
Science can only deal with nature has it is what your talking about goes outside the scope of science in general. Are you speaking in finite terms or infinite terms? Science can only explain things like the Big Bang up to nature that is where their explanation becomes plausible.The universe started from something....is the universe finite or infinite? There is a universal law of cause and effect. In fact, the whole basis of science is to observe the phenomena of the universe and to seek to understand its causes.
This deals with physics and logic. Physics is based on hard math, endless sets of equations. Math is simply refined logic expressed through number form. In the end, everything that occurs or exists within the universe, and reality itself, can be described by a system of logic.Scientific empiricism draws conclusions as based on evidence. If no evidence exists, then one resorts to logic and math, which is what physics does.The big-bang, as often understood by the populace today, is based on an old and outdated version of theory, and does not take into account modern advances in physics.For one, many, if not most physicists (in my experience) do not believe in the outdated theory that time, energy, and space simply sprang into existence and were created at the moment of the big-bang.The most prevalent theories involve a universe that dies and is reborn, over and over again, through a continuous and infinite cycle. There are some that state that the universe will stop expanding, and eventually contract, while others state that the universe will simply die due to a big freeze or a heat death and eventually "reset".We then have the issue of time. All time is, is a measurement between a set of events or two events. Events require energy. Everything that exists, sans space itself (which is nothingness), is energy (whether particle or wave).The idea that "something cannot come from nothing" is based on the acceptance that time is linear, when there are many possibilities, which include:1. Time is cyclical and not linear.2. Time actually exists as two dimensions.3. Time is an illussion and does not exist at all.There are other plausible theories. "Everything comes from something" is based on the acceptance of time as linear. Further, scientific definitions of nature and reality describe everything that exists. Any God that would have to exist, would indeed exist within the universe (or a universe according to multiverse theory) and would be subject to the laws of the universe.This God would have to be made of energy, since there isnt anything else to be made of. A God that is made of energy and remain static and fixed and separate from the rest of the universe is a scientific impossibility since you, me, the chair you are sitting on, the tv, the planet, the galaxy, etc are all simply manifestations of energy that are transitioning from state to state. We then have the issue of all particles being an illussion. These theories state that all appearances of matter are indeed illusions, and do not exist. We have a theory also propagated by the late David Bohm (a famous physicist) that the universe itself is a grand illussion, a complex mind-trick and simply does not exist.All of these theories are based on hard math that is above me and 99.99% of the populace. ID is not based on hard math that describes reality, and is instead a faith-based alternative.
Yes they should be taught side by side.The Big Bang is not provable or recreatable in science.The primordial ooze is not recreatable or provable in science.Evolution from one lifeform to another is not recreatable or provable in science.Evolution is a faith based science which only has theories to back it up.Creation is a faith based science that has God and His word to back it up.Archeology is constantly finding evidence to back the Bible as well as evidence that counters evolution.Logic and science are imperfect but Gods word is perfect.Please name something about evolution that is provable.I understand that miricles are hard to prove with science, but they do happen and many have witnessed them. But no one has witnessed evolution. To evolve is to get stronger or better, but archeology has found tools, pottery, and structures that are far more superior to our own and they date back to the beginning of the Biblical time. Why hasnt man found ways to improve on these things, because truth be told we are actually de evolving rather than evolving.Your hard math cannot explain God because He is above any math amyone can come up with.
Your hard math cannot explain God because He is above any math amyone can come up with.
What is G-d above? Who made G-d? Everything comes from something it just does not appear from no where. Infinite is like numbers they just go forever.... G-d on the other hand could not be an finite being because being he created the universe so to speak he would have to have a hand in maintaining it.
For one, many, if not most physicists (in my experience) do not believe in the outdated theory that time, energy, and space simply sprang into existence and were created at the moment of the big-bang.
Its hard for them to believe because they cannot explain it.
What is G-d above? Who made G-d? Everything comes from something it just does not appear from no where. Infinite is like numbers they just go forever.... G-d on the other hand could not be an finite being because being he created the universe so to speak he would have to have a hand in maintaining it.
For one, many, if not most physicists (in my experience) do not believe in the outdated theory that time, energy, and space simply sprang into existence and were created at the moment of the big-bang.
Its hard for them to believe because they cannot explain it.
(adren@line;44278)
Intelligent design is philosophy/theology. It is not science. Evolution is a scientific theory that is the result of observing nature and reality. It is based on the logic of science and what is observable.This is how science works. That is what separates scientific theories from other "theories" which are not based on any observations or rationality (for example, one cannot compare Sumerian creation myth "theories" to the "theory" of gravity").ID posits that an uncreated, complex designer designed our universe, while simultaneously existing outside of the universe and independent of it (according to some versions). This is contrary to science (and impossible) and isnt based on any observations in reality. It is based on faith.Christians seem to be the only ones who are parading around ID. No one else seems to care about, whether that be the Jews, Muslims, Hindus, or Zoroastrians. I didn't mention the Buddhists because they are largely non-theists. Even if ID were true, there is no way to prove that this God is Jesus, Allah, Ganesh, Kali, Ahura Mazda, or Zeus. If it were proved that the God of ID was a non-Christian God, then Christians would be shooting themselves in the foot.This is why faith and philosophy that contradicts science (which is what ID does) should not be taught as an alternative to evolution. It should be taught, and explored, but in a philosophy or religious classroom.Otherwise, every single creation myth from every single religion is a legitimate "alternative" to scientific theory, and should be taught.With that said, questioning evolution is fine. There is nothing wrong with that. But it should be understood that ID is not a legitimate scientific alternative, and is instead a faith based alternative, and hence no comparison can be made. Faith is not a substitute for science. For example, I can have faith that if I jump off a cliff, I want fall but float. Observable reality shows that this is false.Do you agree? Should ID be taught in science classes? What about other creation myths?
If the evolution theory is pushed on our children, which it is, then I believe that creation should be introduced. What other creation myths are you speaking of?We have had 5 children graduate from high school. Living in the south it is introduced(evoution) but not as fact or truth but as a theory. When they were tested on evolution they wrote the answer they were taught, but out in the margin of the paper they always wrote that they did not believe this theory it was just how they were taught about it.How do you explain all the facts in the Bible that were written long before they happen?
Intelligent design is philosophy/theology. It is not science. Evolution is a scientific theory that is the result of observing nature and reality. It is based on the logic of science and what is observable.This is how science works. That is what separates scientific theories from other "theories" which are not based on any observations or rationality (for example, one cannot compare Sumerian creation myth "theories" to the "theory" of gravity").ID posits that an uncreated, complex designer designed our universe, while simultaneously existing outside of the universe and independent of it (according to some versions). This is contrary to science (and impossible) and isnt based on any observations in reality. It is based on faith.Christians seem to be the only ones who are parading around ID. No one else seems to care about, whether that be the Jews, Muslims, Hindus, or Zoroastrians. I didn't mention the Buddhists because they are largely non-theists. Even if ID were true, there is no way to prove that this God is Jesus, Allah, Ganesh, Kali, Ahura Mazda, or Zeus. If it were proved that the God of ID was a non-Christian God, then Christians would be shooting themselves in the foot.This is why faith and philosophy that contradicts science (which is what ID does) should not be taught as an alternative to evolution. It should be taught, and explored, but in a philosophy or religious classroom.Otherwise, every single creation myth from every single religion is a legitimate "alternative" to scientific theory, and should be taught.With that said, questioning evolution is fine. There is nothing wrong with that. But it should be understood that ID is not a legitimate scientific alternative, and is instead a faith based alternative, and hence no comparison can be made. Faith is not a substitute for science. For example, I can have faith that if I jump off a cliff, I want fall but float. Observable reality shows that this is false.Do you agree? Should ID be taught in science classes? What about other creation myths?
If the evolution theory is pushed on our children, which it is, then I believe that creation should be introduced. What other creation myths are you speaking of?We have had 5 children graduate from high school. Living in the south it is introduced(evoution) but not as fact or truth but as a theory. When they were tested on evolution they wrote the answer they were taught, but out in the margin of the paper they always wrote that they did not believe this theory it was just how they were taught about it.How do you explain all the facts in the Bible that were written long before they happen?
..but describable via mathematics. Plus the new CERN particle accelerator is trying to prove theories related to the big bang.
..but is based on math and logic.
...but is based on observations in nature and previously established scientific facts.
Scientific theories that are based on math, logic, and evidence. Cant say the same for ID.
Creation contradicts science and isnt based on rationality or observation. It is based on revelation and faith. Anyways, which God and which book? The Quran and Allah? Indra and The Vedas? Ahura Mazda and The Gathas? Yaweh and the OT? Krishna and The Gita?Have you read all of those books? And if not, how can you know they are false if you havent read them?
Muslims claim the same about the Quran and Hindus about the Vedas. Even if there is evidence that counters evolution, that does not imply that the God of the Bible exists and created us or the universe.
Perfection is a relative ideal that has no objective definition. However, since logic is imperfect, please provide an argument for this without using logic.Also please provide an argument for everything you just stated without using logic.
If you apply the same standards to ID, youd see there is absolutely no evidence that the God of the Bible created us and the universe. There is plenty of evidence to back up evolution. Proof is a different matter.
Sure. I know many Hindus and Muslims who witness miracles. Does that mean that Vishnu and Allah exist?Or does it mean that Jesus grants miracles to non-believers. OR it could mean that Ganesh grants miracles to non-Hindus or Allah miracles to non-Muslims.In the end, miracles mean nothing in regards to figuring out what is true and what isnt.
If that were true, then the majority of archaeologists would agree with you, but they do not.
I can counter that the God I believe in above your God that is above the math.In the end, every phenom in reality can be described via some system of logic and science.But then again, math is logic, and since you dont like logic, please explain why and how without using logic.:study:
(setfree;44297)
If the evolution theory is pushed on our children, which it is, then I believe that creation should be introduced. What other creation myths are you speaking of?We have had 5 children graduate from high school. Living in the south it is introduced(evoution) but not as fact or truth but as a theory. When they were tested on evolution they wrote the answer they were taught, but out in the margin of the paper they always wrote that they did not believe this theory it was just how they were taught about it.How do you explain all the facts in the Bible that were written long before they happen?
A scientific theory is based either on hard math that no one on this forum understands (including myself) and hence have no credentials to discredit it, as well as observations in reality and previously established scientific facts and laws.Creation myths are based on vague speculation, in all religions (and I am not anti-religion). If we teach one myth, then me must teach all, as all are equaly as plausible if one disregards logic and science.As far as creation myths, here is a list:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creation_myths
If the evolution theory is pushed on our children, which it is, then I believe that creation should be introduced. What other creation myths are you speaking of?We have had 5 children graduate from high school. Living in the south it is introduced(evoution) but not as fact or truth but as a theory. When they were tested on evolution they wrote the answer they were taught, but out in the margin of the paper they always wrote that they did not believe this theory it was just how they were taught about it.How do you explain all the facts in the Bible that were written long before they happen?
A scientific theory is based either on hard math that no one on this forum understands (including myself) and hence have no credentials to discredit it, as well as observations in reality and previously established scientific facts and laws.Creation myths are based on vague speculation, in all religions (and I am not anti-religion). If we teach one myth, then me must teach all, as all are equaly as plausible if one disregards logic and science.As far as creation myths, here is a list:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creation_myths
(Two;44296)
What is G-d above? Who made G-d? Everything comes from something it just does not appear from no where. Infinite is like numbers they just go forever.... G-d on the other hand could not be an finite being because being he created the universe so to speak he would have to have a hand in maintaining it.Its hard for them to believe because they cannot explain it.
You wouldnt know that unless you spent many hours reviewing every scientific theory (or many) and reading up on what scientists believe.If you had done that, then you would know that it simply isnt as black and white as you make it. In modern physics, there are a number of modern theories that perfectly explain away "something from nothing" objections and id say the majority (IMO) do not believe in the big bang that Christians object to.Ive listed a few of them, which again arent based on revelation, but logic, evidence, and math.Either way, "something" and "nothing" are essentially the same thing. Space is "something" and hence most people refer to that as "nothing". What is "something" is often seen as matter, and matter constitutes less than 2% of the known universe.Matter is energy. Energy can be considered "something", but certain theories of physics do away with all particles in favor of them actually being waves.If we do not consider those theories then we have the scientific law as proposed by Einstein that energy can neither be created nor destroyed.
What is G-d above? Who made G-d? Everything comes from something it just does not appear from no where. Infinite is like numbers they just go forever.... G-d on the other hand could not be an finite being because being he created the universe so to speak he would have to have a hand in maintaining it.Its hard for them to believe because they cannot explain it.
You wouldnt know that unless you spent many hours reviewing every scientific theory (or many) and reading up on what scientists believe.If you had done that, then you would know that it simply isnt as black and white as you make it. In modern physics, there are a number of modern theories that perfectly explain away "something from nothing" objections and id say the majority (IMO) do not believe in the big bang that Christians object to.Ive listed a few of them, which again arent based on revelation, but logic, evidence, and math.Either way, "something" and "nothing" are essentially the same thing. Space is "something" and hence most people refer to that as "nothing". What is "something" is often seen as matter, and matter constitutes less than 2% of the known universe.Matter is energy. Energy can be considered "something", but certain theories of physics do away with all particles in favor of them actually being waves.If we do not consider those theories then we have the scientific law as proposed by Einstein that energy can neither be created nor destroyed.
(setfree;44302)
adren@line, Have you read the Bible?
Ive read the Bible, the Torah, the Quran, the Vedas, the Upanishads, the Gathas, the Gita, Aristotle, Plato, the Pali Canon, and some other stuff. I also follow scientific theories and have tried my best to have a very fundamental grasp of physics and evolution.I haven't read all of these cover to cover but most. I firmly believe that any truth seeker is in absolutely no position to discredit something else unless they understand what they are discrediting and are intimately familiar with it (or atleast enough to hold and intelligent conversation).And btw, a belief in ID is discrediting science, and hence has no place in a science class room.
adren@line, Have you read the Bible?
Ive read the Bible, the Torah, the Quran, the Vedas, the Upanishads, the Gathas, the Gita, Aristotle, Plato, the Pali Canon, and some other stuff. I also follow scientific theories and have tried my best to have a very fundamental grasp of physics and evolution.I haven't read all of these cover to cover but most. I firmly believe that any truth seeker is in absolutely no position to discredit something else unless they understand what they are discrediting and are intimately familiar with it (or atleast enough to hold and intelligent conversation).And btw, a belief in ID is discrediting science, and hence has no place in a science class room.
(setfree;44302)
adren@line, Have you read the Bible?
Apparently not based on the assumptions being made. Your not answering the question. How can something come from nothing? How was the universe created if not by a supreme being? G-d has to be infinite as I said in order to maintain a creation that was created by him. You may have read the Torah but you obviously did not understand it.
adren@line, Have you read the Bible?
Apparently not based on the assumptions being made. Your not answering the question. How can something come from nothing? How was the universe created if not by a supreme being? G-d has to be infinite as I said in order to maintain a creation that was created by him. You may have read the Torah but you obviously did not understand it.
If you were a Christian and filled with the Holy Spirit, you would understand just how illogical all your so called logic is. I can prove the truth of the Bible but you would be unwilling to do what it takes to understand that proof. You are so blinded, according to the Bible, by your science and logic that you would not beleive anything outside of those things even if God Himself were to share them with you. There is no religion that is true, but the personal relationship with Jesus Christ. So until you can prove evolution without a doubt then I would suggest you find something else to place your faith in.What evidence do you refer to? All you have is math and science and they are flawed. The majority of the archeological evidence for evolution is fradulent. My favorite is a pigs tooth that is supposed to be one of our ancestors, a pigs tooth and they built a whole humanoid from that. Now that is funny. Now there is plenty of evidence for creation and the Biblical record of other contraversial subjects that is suppressed by the mainstream scientific community. We have the evidence of the parting of the red sea that is supressed. We have evidence of man walking with dinosaurs that is suppressed. We have scalples that have been found that are sharper and longer lasting than modern day versions from digs of 5000 year old civilizations, and they are supressed.Come on give some of the socalled evidence, please.Do you not understand that there are more scientist who believe in creation than do evolution? And do you realize that they are threatened by other scientist and elite financers to keep their mouths shut. Please research this phenominon, it may surprise you.
(Two;44308)
Apparently not based on the assumptions being made. Your not answering the question. How can something come from nothing? How was the universe created if not by a supreme being? G-d has to be infinite as I said in order to maintain a creation that was created by him. You may have read the Torah but you obviously did not understand it.
I did answer "something from nothing", atleast twice.As far as God being infinite, that would mean that the universe, you, me, and everything is God, or part of God.That would imply a philosophy of pantheism, monism, or non-dualism. That is not monotheism.Infinity means no boundaries. If you believe that we were created and are seperate from God, then God cannot be infinite since there is a boundary between creation and creator , and hence this negates infinity, since infinity means no boundaries or border.The only truly infinite God is the God of Hindu philosopy, and the God of many of the Greek philosophers.All three Semitic faiths preach in monotheism and creator/creation dualism, which negates monism (dualism vs monism being a classical philosophical problem).
Apparently not based on the assumptions being made. Your not answering the question. How can something come from nothing? How was the universe created if not by a supreme being? G-d has to be infinite as I said in order to maintain a creation that was created by him. You may have read the Torah but you obviously did not understand it.
I did answer "something from nothing", atleast twice.As far as God being infinite, that would mean that the universe, you, me, and everything is God, or part of God.That would imply a philosophy of pantheism, monism, or non-dualism. That is not monotheism.Infinity means no boundaries. If you believe that we were created and are seperate from God, then God cannot be infinite since there is a boundary between creation and creator , and hence this negates infinity, since infinity means no boundaries or border.The only truly infinite God is the God of Hindu philosopy, and the God of many of the Greek philosophers.All three Semitic faiths preach in monotheism and creator/creation dualism, which negates monism (dualism vs monism being a classical philosophical problem).
(RobinD69;44309)
If you were a Christian and filled with the Holy Spirit, you would understand just how illogical all your so called logic is. I can prove the truth of the Bible but you would be unwilling to do what it takes to understand that proof. You are so blinded, according to the Bible, by your science and logic that you would not beleive anything outside of those things even if God Himself were to share them with you. There is no religion that is true, but the personal relationship with Jesus Christ. So until you can prove evolution without a doubt then I would suggest you find something else to place your faith in.What evidence do you refer to? All you have is math and science and they are flawed. The majority of the archeological evidence for evolution is fradulent. My favorite is a pigs tooth that is supposed to be one of our ancestors, a pigs tooth and they built a whole humanoid from that. Now that is funny. Now there is plenty of evidence for creation and the Biblical record of other contraversial subjects that is suppressed by the mainstream scientific community. We have the evidence of the parting of the red sea that is supressed. We have evidence of man walking with dinosaurs that is suppressed. We have scalples that have been found that are sharper and longer lasting than modern day versions from digs of 5000 year old civilizations, and they are supressed.Come on give some of the socalled evidence, please.
There is also evidence of the events of the Gita dating back to 3000BC, does that mean that the Gita is true and Krishna is God and Jesus inst?There is also "evidence" from the Quran in regards to predictions made by Mohhamed. The Hindu Vedas and other texts predicted the coming of Jesus AND Mohhamed. Does that mean that Indra is God?In the end, all of this "evidence" is only acknowledged and accepted by the people who believe in whatever religion the theory endorses. Science exists independently of religion and answers only to what is observable in nature, as well as logic.You and I are able to communicate through a computer, through the internet, through the merits of science. No amount of praying is going to make a comptuer or modern medicine simply "pop into" existence.
If you were a Christian and filled with the Holy Spirit, you would understand just how illogical all your so called logic is. I can prove the truth of the Bible but you would be unwilling to do what it takes to understand that proof. You are so blinded, according to the Bible, by your science and logic that you would not beleive anything outside of those things even if God Himself were to share them with you. There is no religion that is true, but the personal relationship with Jesus Christ. So until you can prove evolution without a doubt then I would suggest you find something else to place your faith in.What evidence do you refer to? All you have is math and science and they are flawed. The majority of the archeological evidence for evolution is fradulent. My favorite is a pigs tooth that is supposed to be one of our ancestors, a pigs tooth and they built a whole humanoid from that. Now that is funny. Now there is plenty of evidence for creation and the Biblical record of other contraversial subjects that is suppressed by the mainstream scientific community. We have the evidence of the parting of the red sea that is supressed. We have evidence of man walking with dinosaurs that is suppressed. We have scalples that have been found that are sharper and longer lasting than modern day versions from digs of 5000 year old civilizations, and they are supressed.Come on give some of the socalled evidence, please.
There is also evidence of the events of the Gita dating back to 3000BC, does that mean that the Gita is true and Krishna is God and Jesus inst?There is also "evidence" from the Quran in regards to predictions made by Mohhamed. The Hindu Vedas and other texts predicted the coming of Jesus AND Mohhamed. Does that mean that Indra is God?In the end, all of this "evidence" is only acknowledged and accepted by the people who believe in whatever religion the theory endorses. Science exists independently of religion and answers only to what is observable in nature, as well as logic.You and I are able to communicate through a computer, through the internet, through the merits of science. No amount of praying is going to make a comptuer or modern medicine simply "pop into" existence.
(adren@line;44312)
There is also evidence of the events of the Gita dating back to 3000BC, does that mean that the Gita is true and Krishna is God and Jesus inst?There is also "evidence" from the Quran in regards to predictions made by Mohhamed. The Hindu Vedas and other texts predicted the coming of Jesus AND Mohhamed. Does that mean that Indra is God?In the end, all of this "evidence" is only acknowledged and accepted by the people who believe in whatever religion the theory endorses. Science exists independently of religion and answers only to what is observable in nature, as well as logic.You and I are able to communicate through a computer, through the internet, through the merits of science. No amount of praying is going to make a comptuer or modern medicine simply "pop into" existence.
Please Please share this evidence you claim. I havent seen anything but opinions and claims. Come on if you are going to do this, do it right. So far you have done nothing but call us a bunch of loony liars with your claims and opinions, but no evidence.Oh this is so funny, the Gita is believed to have been written from beteen the 5th and 2nd centuries BC and you have claimed 3000BC. Please get you claims some factual evidence.
There is also evidence of the events of the Gita dating back to 3000BC, does that mean that the Gita is true and Krishna is God and Jesus inst?There is also "evidence" from the Quran in regards to predictions made by Mohhamed. The Hindu Vedas and other texts predicted the coming of Jesus AND Mohhamed. Does that mean that Indra is God?In the end, all of this "evidence" is only acknowledged and accepted by the people who believe in whatever religion the theory endorses. Science exists independently of religion and answers only to what is observable in nature, as well as logic.You and I are able to communicate through a computer, through the internet, through the merits of science. No amount of praying is going to make a comptuer or modern medicine simply "pop into" existence.
Please Please share this evidence you claim. I havent seen anything but opinions and claims. Come on if you are going to do this, do it right. So far you have done nothing but call us a bunch of loony liars with your claims and opinions, but no evidence.Oh this is so funny, the Gita is believed to have been written from beteen the 5th and 2nd centuries BC and you have claimed 3000BC. Please get you claims some factual evidence.
reach: You Go Girl!!!As far as God being infinite, that would mean that the universe, you, me, and everything is God, or part of God.
Where do these people come from? G-d is infinite in order to maintain a universe an infinite being cannot be finite that would mean that G-d created then said to heck with it I am done but he did not. And you made my point we are from G-d created from G-ds plan as an overall part of his grand scheme.
In the end, all of this "evidence" is only acknowledged and accepted by the people who believe in whatever religion the theory endorses. Science exists independently of religion and answers only to what is observable in nature, as well as logic.
Agian science can only explain what is observable in nature anything beyond that is guessing.
You and I are able to communicate through a computer, through the internet, through the merits of science. No amount of praying is going to make a comptuer or modern medicine simply "pop into" existence.Reply With Quote
Where did this stuff come from out of the blue? It had to have a starting point to exist. Are these things infinite or finite? Will they last forever or just be a fad and fade into eternity. The universe had to have a starting point in Genesis it starts "In the beginning" do we consider that finite or infinite? Or do we accept it as a leap of faith?
Where do these people come from? G-d is infinite in order to maintain a universe an infinite being cannot be finite that would mean that G-d created then said to heck with it I am done but he did not. And you made my point we are from G-d created from G-ds plan as an overall part of his grand scheme.
In the end, all of this "evidence" is only acknowledged and accepted by the people who believe in whatever religion the theory endorses. Science exists independently of religion and answers only to what is observable in nature, as well as logic.
Agian science can only explain what is observable in nature anything beyond that is guessing.
You and I are able to communicate through a computer, through the internet, through the merits of science. No amount of praying is going to make a comptuer or modern medicine simply "pop into" existence.Reply With Quote
Where did this stuff come from out of the blue? It had to have a starting point to exist. Are these things infinite or finite? Will they last forever or just be a fad and fade into eternity. The universe had to have a starting point in Genesis it starts "In the beginning" do we consider that finite or infinite? Or do we accept it as a leap of faith?
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