Spirit filled believer?

[Cross8527]

In the beginning, not very impressive. A struggle and a fight. I swore at God. Fasted for days. Followed false dreams. Chased false signs. Thank God, that he is a good God, and gave me grace when I backed down.

I myself am learning to surrender to him it has been a long ongoing process but I am slowly learning the lesson. and I have done all you have stated as well but like you said he is a good God a very patient understanding and loving God

 

[Aunty Jane]

You have it backwards God is not confusing people by performing real miracles the enemy is confusing people by making many fake ones,

You seem to forget that the trickster is a mimic...it is he who copies what God does...in order to lead people astray. Even back in the days when Moses when he and his brother Aaron were sent to Pharaoh to demand the release of the Israelites from slavery. Pharaoh was guided by his false prophets and magic practicing priests. When Moses performed miracles in front of Pharaoh, his priests duplicated the miracles.....(Ex 7:8-25)....it is nothing new.

The “weeds” are imitation “Christians”...the product of a false religious system that came to the forefront only after the death of the apostles.......Christendom is not “Christianity”, but a poor and divided imitation of it. Her leaders can only persuade the ignorant.

Knowledge is power....and Satan made sure that knowledge was withheld from the people for centuries as they indoctrinated their members with false doctrines, most of whom were too afraid to rock the boat because the grand inquisitor was watching....so they just did as they were told...and the apostate church just went from bad to worse.

and there is not a single verse in scripture that states that the gifts or miracles have ceased not a single one and if the word of God itself doesn't say it why should we believe it? you chalk an actual healing done to the trick of the mind?

I have given you not only the Scriptural verse that confirms it, but the sound biblical reasons for why God took the first century miracles away. Only the pretender wants the miracles to continue because he is the reason why the majority in Christendom remain spiritual babes.

Yes the mind is a powerful thing but the mere fact his faith even if it was just his mind doing the work made him cured just shows that faith even if a trick of the mind can and does create miracles he had stage four cancer btw yet his faith made him clean.

You are now moving the goal posts.....those who were cured in the first century knew exactly who did the healing, and knew it was from God.....thus, many becoming Christ’s disciples.....but not all.

When Jesus fed the multitudes, and they followed him across the shore, he asked if they had come only for the free food, rather than the spiritual food he gave them after they were cured of their ailments and were satisfied with the food he gave them. Our motivation is also important.
Don’t Christendom’s charities also rely on free food? But how many come only for the food and are content to continue with their unchristian lifestyle. What is the point of that?
In times past they called them “rice Christians” who came for the rice, not the sermon.

You say people are gullible and spiritual babes for believing in such things yet Jesus never once said anything like that in fact he even could not do many miracles in one town because of their unbelief. Not that he would not but rather could not.

The miracles he could have performed would not have convinced those in his own hometown because he was just “the carpenter’s son”...they had seen him grow up, and now they were expected to accept him as the Messiah?! Jesus’ own siblings did not accept him as such until after his resurrection.
God gave them time to get over their familiarity.

I can see your very logical but that critically thinking mind will block your faith and in fact if you say they have ceased because of a lack of the real thing well that is the opposite mindset of one with faith

Critical thinking doesn’t block anything, but examines all things at a critical level.....it’s those who blindly accept things in ignorance without critical thinking that are the most at risk of falling for the ruse.
A thorough knowledge of the Bible is essential if we are to stand firm against the tricks of the devil...they don’t work on those with accurate knowledge.

Blessed are they who believe without seeing remember?

I think you need to take those words on board yourself. I believe without seeing...but do you?

if you can however show me one verse that says they have ceased then I will admit I am wrong but as far as I can tell there is not a single one and all throughout the word of God miracles happened because people had faith and those who doubted never saw them for themselves it is a pattern all throughout scripture so I will stand on his word not evidence what do you stand on?

No one is doubting that the miracles took place with Jesus and his apostles in the first century.....what is in dispute is that they continued after the apostles died.....do you have proof that they did?
Because the first to infer that miracles still took place was the Roman Catholic church......formed over 300 years after Jesus died......do you believe that Mary appeared to children at Fatima in Portugal....or that weeping statues are a miracle? Do you believe that “saints” are chosen by the church, only if they can prove that a miracle took place at their hand?
Can you not see a bigger picture here?

Oh sorry I forgot to address the thing with Timothy and Paul, as to why he did not heal him well it never says but Paul also had a thorn at his side that he prayed to be removed but God wouldn't do it so maybe it has to do with something like tha

The “thorn” in Paul’s side was never really explained....it was inferred only in his frustration that it impeded him in some way....Paul calls the “thorn” in the flesh an “angel of Satan, to keep striking me, that I might not be overly exalted”. And there were false apostles and disturbers and enemies of Paul’s apostleship who would keep him from getting too exalted over his ministry. On the other hand, if the “thorn” was an irremovable affliction of his eyes or other part of his body, that could also serve as an angel of Satan to prick him with pessimism or an inferiority complex and a consequent discouragement. Whatever the thorn’s nature, Paul prayed three times for its removal....unsuccessfully.....and Paul stayed humble.

The apostles never used the gifts on themselves or each other.....they were used only for the benefit of unbelievers.

 

[Azim]

So being part of a charismatic church exposes you to these so called miracles?

From what you see...does any of it fit with what took place in the first century?
Did the apostles ever make a show of their miracles?
Is the falling down proof of God’s spirit? Couldn’t it just be a satanic trick....? What does it accomplish?

Is speaking in tongues a proof of God’s spirit? It’s gibberish and means nothing. I have spoken to those in charismatic churches only to discover that most fake them, or they would not be accepted by the other members. Only the honest ones will admit it.

Satan can only fool those who can be misled by him.....the ones who don’t bother to do their study of the Bible with a good translation as well as a good Concordance. You have to study all of it, not just the convenient bits. It takes time and effort, but most are willing to just be spoon fed. Ignorance is the devil’s playground.

No. You are quick to judge here. Any thing I would consider a miracle, which I have experienced or seen, usually has been outside of any church, through out my life. That is with me growing up in a Brethern church until my mid 20's, then attending my last church, the Baptist one, for most of my time until recently. The current church which I'm attending, though Pentecostal, I have never seen anyone fall down. I've been to this church in the past, on and off as well. The only thing I did witness is there are people at times who speak in tongues, during prayer, during special events. However, its usually just a few people. My view on tongues is that, when those in the early church spoke it, someone was around to interpret it. I also view that any gifts God gives a person, is not for self edification, however, it is to benefit others and glorify God.

 

[Azim]

These issues all have to do with true and solid faith. We in the Western world are spoiled, we will be last and those other very poor countries will be first in the Kingdom.
All things even the smallest of things given is very appreciated, us? Not as it should be.
It's in those small pockets of the world where the Christians are poor and have nothing where faith is. They are grateful for EVERYTHING.
I have a long time friend who is also a Christian. She has friends in parts of Africa who sends her videos now and then.
She recently shared one with me, my heart melted.
They were speaking to her through a video on their phone. They were a 30 something couple who have made their homes among the poorest and sickest of people. They speak of raising the dead like it is a normal (if not regular) occurrence! The other stories they told as they were trekking to a different village were all in solid FAITH. They touched me deeply so, I think it is a faith problem with most Christians in the Western Countries...JMHO. Good thread as this I believe crosses most Christians minds at some time in their walk, it did me one time.
God be with you!

We were talking about this on Wednesday during bible study, at the table I was sitting at. One thing God brought to mind, many years ago, is that even someone who is living on low income here in the west, can still be living as kings or queens compared to those in third world countries. We easily forget the blessings we have here. You make a great point about those living in the poor countries, will be the first in the Kingdom.

 

[BlueNightingale]

No. You are quick to judge here. Any thing I would consider a miracle, which I have experienced or seen, usually has been outside of any church, through out my life. That is with me growing up in a Brethern church until my mid 20's, then attending my last church, the Baptist one, for most of my time until recently. The current church which I'm attending, though Pentecostal, I have never seen anyone fall down. I've been to this church in the past, on and off as well. The only thing I did witness is there are people at times who speak in tongues, during prayer, during special events. However, its usually just a few people. My view on tongues is that, when those in the early church spoke it, someone was around to interpret it. I also view that any gifts God gives a person, is not for self edification, however, it is to benefit others and glorify God.

Mennonite Brethren?

It is the Apostolic Pentecostal that will tend to push you back during prayer.

 

[Azim]

Mennonite Brethren?

It is the Apostolic Pentecostal that will tend to push you back during prayer.

In their Statement of Purpose, they call themselves “Christian Brethren”. I honestly don't know what the difference is, as I never looked into it.

 

[Nancy]

We were talking about this on Wednesday during bible study, at the table I was sitting at. One thing God brought to mind, many years ago, is that even someone who is living on low income here in the west, can still be living as kings or queens compared to those in third world countries. We easily forget the blessings we have here. You make a great point about those living in the poor countries, will be the first in the Kingdom.

Out of site out of mind when it comes to the very poor. Nobody wants to be bothered
Thanks for the reply Azim.

 

[BlueNightingale]

In their Statement of Purpose, they call themselves “Christian Brethren”. I honestly don't know what the difference is, as I never looked into it.

Mennonite Brethren is anabaptist group. Although a lot of anabaptists will simply go by Christian to refrain from a type of idolatry.

Anabaptist means basically rebaptizers, because, historically, they didn't believe in infant baptism and would "rebaptize" later when they reached an age of maturity enough to consent. There are different sects, the Amish, Hutterites, Mennonites, etc all come as branches from the anabaptist tree.

 

[Aunty Jane]

No. You are quick to judge here.

My ‘judgment’ of any church that is part of Christendom is the result of a lot of research and study. I was born and raised in Christendom, so I know what I have left behind.
There are foundational beliefs found in Christendom’s churches that are also found in all false religion. If any church holds to any or all of these beliefs, I will reject them outright.
These are...
1) Belief in more than one god, even forcing three gods into one entity.

2) Belief in an immortal soul that departs from the body in a conscious state after death.

3) The destination of those souls either to a heavenly bliss or a fiery hell.

None of these beliefs are biblical.

Any thing I would consider a miracle, which I have experienced or seen, usually has been outside of any church, through out my life. That is with me growing up in a Brethern church until my mid 20's, then attending my last church, the Baptist one, for most of my time until recently. The current church which I'm attending, though Pentecostal, I have never seen anyone fall down. I've been to this church in the past, on and off as well. The only thing I did witness is there are people at times who speak in tongues, during prayer, during special events. However, its usually just a few people. My view on tongues is that, when those in the early church spoke it, someone was around to interpret it. I also view that any gifts God gives a person, is not for self edification, however, it is to benefit others and glorify God.

1 Cor 14:27-28...
“And if someone speaks in a tongue, let it be limited to two or three at the most, and in turns, and someone must interpret. 28  But if there is no interpreter, he must keep silent in the congregation and speak to himself and to God.”
So, yes, you are correct...if any in the first century spoke in tongues, an interpreter had to be present or the person was to remain silent. What is the point of speaking a foreign language if no one knows what you are saying?
1 Cor 13:1-2...
“If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels but do not have love, I have become a clanging gong or a clashing cymbal. 2  And if I have the gift of prophecy and understand all the sacred secrets and all knowledge, and if I have all the faith so as to move mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing.”

As Paul always stressed love among his brethren, if that love was missing, then the gifts were meaningless.

The other aspect of speaking in foreign tongues was the fact that the disciples who received the Holy Spirit at Pentecost, spoke the languages of foreign visitors who had come to Jerusalem for the festival. They were hearing the gospel message in their own languages. There was a purpose to it. It was not just unintelligible gibberish.

1 Cor 14:33 says...”For God is a God not of disorder but of peace.”
Now put that in a modern context....

In the first century there was “one Lord, one faith, one baptism”...but at present there are literally thousands of different sects and denominations all claiming to teach Christian truth. Whom should we believe?

What is the evidence of one’s commitment to Christ’s teachings so that there are no excuses offered to ignore them, or for personal opinion to override some clearly stated positions. (Matt 7:21-23)

Genuine Christians are “no part of the world”....(John 18:36)....no part of its corrupt rulership, it’s greedy commercialism or its disgusting immorality.

Since 1 John 5:19 tells us that “the whole world lies in the power of the wicked one”, what part of “the world” is exempt?

How did Jesus demonstrate that he was “no part of the world” back then?
He purposely ignored the fact that his people were oppressed by the Roman rulers of the day and stayed away from any political involvement. Some among his nation were planning a revolt against the Romans and these were mentioned on one occasion involving Paul’s arrest. (Acts 21:37-38)
First-century historian Flavius Josephus describes these as “Sicarii” (dagger men) a band of fanatic Jewish patriots, unrelenting enemies of Rome, who engaged in organized political killings.....So there can be no patriotic Christians who will take up arms to kill the enemies of their nation, because we are commanded by Christ to “love your enemies” (Matt 5:43-44) If we would take up arms and kill our enemies, we might find that there are Christians of the same brotherhood on the opposing side. Whose side then would God take? (1 John 4:20-21) True Christians would not be there in the first place...not found in the military even training to kill their fellow man. (Rom 12:17-21)

Jesus did not chase wealth or power even though he was the son of the highest power in existence. He was born and raised in modest circumstances. And he did not advocate violence or bloodshed of any kind. He walked peacefully among sinners and offered them a better way of life because Christianity was not something you do on Sunday (which never was a Sabbath)...it was a commitment to live as Christ lived 24/7. It’s a life that brings peace, so we are to distance ourselves from the war-mongers.

How do you feel about such things?

 

[Cross8527]

You seem to forget that the trickster is a mimic...it is he who copies what God does...in order to lead people astray. Even back in the days when Moses when he and his brother Aaron were sent to Pharaoh to demand the release of the Israelites from slavery. Pharaoh was guided by his false prophets and magic practicing priests. When Moses performed miracles in front of Pharaoh, his priests duplicated the miracles.....(Ex 7:8-25)....it is nothing new.

The “weeds” are imitation “Christians”...the product of a false religious system that came to the forefront only after the death of the apostles.......Christendom is not “Christianity”, but a poor and divided imitation of it. Her leaders can only persuade the ignorant.

Knowledge is power....and Satan made sure that knowledge was withheld from the people for centuries as they indoctrinated their members with false doctrines, most of whom were too afraid to rock the boat because the grand inquisitor was watching....so they just did as they were told...and the apostate church just went from bad to worse.

I have given you not only the Scriptural verse that confirms it, but the sound biblical reasons for why God took the first century miracles away. Only the pretender wants the miracles to continue because he is the reason why the majority in Christendom remain spiritual babes.

You are now moving the goal posts.....those who were cured in the first century knew exactly who did the healing, and knew it was from God.....thus, many becoming Christ’s disciples.....but not all.

When Jesus fed the multitudes, and they followed him across the shore, he asked if they had come only for the free food, rather than the spiritual food he gave them after they were cured of their ailments and were satisfied with the food he gave them. Our motivation is also important.
Don’t Christendom’s charities also rely on free food? But how many come only for the food and are content to continue with their unchristian lifestyle. What is the point of that?
In times past they called them “rice Christians” who came for the rice, not the sermon.

The miracles he could have performed would not have convinced those in his own hometown because he was just “the carpenter’s son”...they had seen him grow up, and now they were expected to accept him as the Messiah?! Jesus’ own siblings did not accept him as such until after his resurrection.
God gave them time to get over their familiarity.

Critical thinking doesn’t block anything, but examines all things at a critical level.....it’s those who blindly accept things in ignorance without critical thinking that are the most at risk of falling for the ruse.
A thorough knowledge of the Bible is essential if we are to stand firm against the tricks of the devil...they don’t work on those with accurate knowledge.

I think you need to take those words on board yourself. I believe without seeing...but do you?

No one is doubting that the miracles took place with Jesus and his apostles in the first century.....what is in dispute is that they continued after the apostles died.....do you have proof that they did?
Because the first to infer that miracles still took place was the Roman Catholic church......formed over 300 years after Jesus died......do you believe that Mary appeared to children at Fatima in Portugal....or that weeping statues are a miracle? Do you believe that “saints” are chosen by the church, only if they can prove that a miracle took place at their hand?
Can you not see a bigger picture here?

The “thorn” in Paul’s side was never really explained....it was inferred only in his frustration that it impeded him in some way....Paul calls the “thorn” in the flesh an “angel of Satan, to keep striking me, that I might not be overly exalted”. And there were false apostles and disturbers and enemies of Paul’s apostleship who would keep him from getting too exalted over his ministry. On the other hand, if the “thorn” was an irremovable affliction of his eyes or other part of his body, that could also serve as an angel of Satan to prick him with pessimism or an inferiority complex and a consequent discouragement. Whatever the thorn’s nature, Paul prayed three times for its removal....unsuccessfully.....and Paul stayed humble.

The apostles never used the gifts on themselves or each other.....they were used only for the benefit of unbelievers.

ok I can see we are not going to be able to reason with each on this so I will just agree to disagree

 

[rockytopva]

Spiritual Gifts - All unique
Spiritual Fruits - All the same

To have Spiritual Fruit calls us to walk as Christ walked. And that without ego, giving all glory for what we have to the Heavenly Father.

 

[Aunty Jane]

ok I can see we are not going to be able to reason with each on this so I will just agree to disagree

As you wish......I have done many years of research and Bible study to arrive at my conclusions, so no reasoning that goes against that research will stand up to scrutiny from my position.

Because I was born and raised in Christendom, I know what I left and why I rejected it. It was not a sudden decision but one that gnawed away at me over time to the point where I realized that the devil was having a lend of Christendom, and had disguised himself as “an angel of light” and trained “his ministers” in all the wrong doctrines. (2 Cor 11:14-15)

An apostasy was foretold and Christendom pretends that it never happened......that their hopelessly divided church system is somehow a product of God’s all powerful spirit.
God’s spirit unites his people....it does not divide them.

1 John 5: 18-20....NLT...
“We know that God’s children do not make a practice of sinning, for God’s Son holds them securely, and the evil one cannot touch them. We know that we are children of God and that the world around us is under the control of the evil one. And we know that the Son of God has come, and he has given us understanding so that we can know the true God. And now we live in fellowship with the true God because we live in fellowship with his Son, Jesus Christ. He is the only true God, and he is eternal life.”

I do not believe that the churches of Christendom have any idea who “the true God” actually is.
Only Jesus can show us who “the only true God” is...because the one who “sent” him, is revealed in the personality and teachings of his son. (John 17:3)

Matt 7:21-23 will be a sobering reality for the “many”. Matt 7:13-14 shows us that those who accept the truth will be “few”, just as it was in Jesus’ day. History is repeating...because humans always think they know better....but they never learn from the lessons of the past.

 

[Rockerduck]

As you wish......I have done many years of research and Bible study to arrive at my conclusions, so no reasoning that goes against that research will stand up to scrutiny from my position.

Because I was born and raised in Christendom, I know what I left and why I rejected it. It was not a sudden decision but one that gnawed away at me over time to the point where I realized that the devil was having a lend of Christendom, and had disguised himself as “an angel of light” and trained “his ministers” in all the wrong doctrines. (2 Cor 11:14-15)

An apostasy was foretold and Christendom pretends that it never happened......that their hopelessly divided church system is somehow a product of God’s all powerful spirit.
God’s spirit unites his people....it does not divide them.

1 John 5: 18-20....NLT...
“We know that God’s children do not make a practice of sinning, for God’s Son holds them securely, and the evil one cannot touch them. We know that we are children of God and that the world around us is under the control of the evil one. And we know that the Son of God has come, and he has given us understanding so that we can know the true God. And now we live in fellowship with the true God because we live in fellowship with his Son, Jesus Christ. He is the only true God, and he is eternal life.”

I do not believe that the churches of Christendom have any idea who “the true God” actually is.
Only Jesus can show us who “the only true God” is...because the one who “sent” him, is revealed in the personality and teachings of his son. (John 17:3)

Matt 7:21-23 will be a sobering reality for the “many”. Matt 7:13-14 shows us that those who accept the truth will be “few”, just as it was in Jesus’ day. History is repeating...because humans always think they know better....but they never learn from the lessons of the past.

If you knew Jesus, you would not have any questions. John 10:27 - My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me.

I know Jesus.

 

[Carl Emerson]

I have spoken with many Christians about this but few can actually say they saw the hand of God or a miracle or divine intervention

Count me in...

 

[LoveYeshua]

These issues all have to do with true and solid faith. We in the Western world are spoiled, we will be last and those other very poor countries will be first in the Kingdom.
All things even the smallest of things given is very appreciated, us? Not as it should be.
It's in those small pockets of the world where the Christians are poor and have nothing where faith is. They are grateful for EVERYTHING.
I have a long time friend who is also a Christian. She has friends in parts of Africa who sends her videos now and then.
She recently shared one with me, my heart melted.
They were speaking to her through a video on their phone. They were a 30 something couple who have made their homes among the poorest and sickest of people. They speak of raising the dead like it is a normal (if not regular) occurrence! The other stories they told as they were trekking to a different village were all in solid FAITH. They touched me deeply so, I think it is a faith problem with most Christians in the Western Countries...JMHO. Good thread as this I believe crosses most Christians minds at some time in their walk, it did me one time.
God be with you!

Jesus Himself gives us the key to understand it. He said, “According to your faith let it be to you” (Matthew 9:29). When He prayed or worked miracles, He was assured to be answered because He was one with the Father and trusted fully in Him.

The difference between a believer who walks in the Spirit and one who does not is often found in the closeness of their relationship with God, their faith, and their obedience. Jesus said, “If you abide in Me, and My words abide in you, you will ask what you desire, and it shall be done for you” (John 15:7). This means that those who live deeply connected to Him, letting His words live in their heart, will pray with assurance and see God’s power more clearly.

 

[Aunty Jane]

If you knew Jesus, you would not have any questions. John 10:27 - My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me.

I know Jesus.

That is what they all say......so who are the “few” and who are the “many”? (Matt 7:13-14; 21-23)
Jesus knows and that is all that matters....

 

[Cross8527]

As you wish......I have done many years of research and Bible study to arrive at my conclusions, so no reasoning that goes against that research will stand up to scrutiny from my position.

Because I was born and raised in Christendom, I know what I left and why I rejected it. It was not a sudden decision but one that gnawed away at me over time to the point where I realized that the devil was having a lend of Christendom, and had disguised himself as “an angel of light” and trained “his ministers” in all the wrong doctrines. (2 Cor 11:14-15)

An apostasy was foretold and Christendom pretends that it never happened......that their hopelessly divided church system is somehow a product of God’s all powerful spirit.
God’s spirit unites his people....it does not divide them.

1 John 5: 18-20....NLT...
“We know that God’s children do not make a practice of sinning, for God’s Son holds them securely, and the evil one cannot touch them. We know that we are children of God and that the world around us is under the control of the evil one. And we know that the Son of God has come, and he has given us understanding so that we can know the true God. And now we live in fellowship with the true God because we live in fellowship with his Son, Jesus Christ. He is the only true God, and he is eternal life.”

I do not believe that the churches of Christendom have any idea who “the true God” actually is.
Only Jesus can show us who “the only true God” is...because the one who “sent” him, is revealed in the personality and teachings of his son. (John 17:3)

Matt 7:21-23 will be a sobering reality for the “many”. Matt 7:13-14 shows us that those who accept the truth will be “few”, just as it was in Jesus’ day. History is repeating...because humans always think they know better....but they never learn from the lessons of the past.

If you did all that research that is well and good but the fact you are unable to provide any actual proof that they have ended makes me wonder what evidence you found from your research.

That is the issue though isn't it? my stance on the subject only requires faith it doesn't require evidence or research just that I believe on the other side of the fence however to say they have died out does require evidence otherwise it is just an opinion.

It is not hard to believe in miracles and it doesn't require proof just faith but it is hard to to speak against miracles because faith is not involved rather proof is required. If you can provide a single verse that the miracles have ended I will admit to be being wrong but without that I just don't see how we can come to an understanding

I mean can you provide one verse just one? and if not why should I believe your stance on the matter? I am willing to admit I was wrong if you can do that but I am not trying to argue or anything I just am going to need a little biblical evidence in order to change my understanding I can tell you are intelligent so surely you must understand that one who has believed for so long is not going to just change their minds like that it is going to have to be grounded on the word or at the very least some kind of scriptural based proof

 

[Rockerduck]

That is what they all say......so who are the “few” and who are the “many”? (Matt 7:13-14; 21-23)
Jesus knows and that is all that matters....

Matthew 22:14 - For many are called and few are chosen. I read this verse as literal, many are called, and they are, and Jesus chooses a few. That is why I and a "few" more here, declare our chosen status. Yet, many are called. There are many ways to be called, but make no mistake, you'll know when you are called.
Luke 18:13 - The tax collector is Justified, not the Pharisee.
Put your bible down and pray to Jesus, humbly and in submission, for His salvation. If you have pride, Jesus won't hear you. Get rid of trying to control your life. Submit to Jesus and make Him Lord over you, then it is no longer you who lives, but Christ in you.

 

[Behold]

No one is doubting that the miracles took place with Jesus and his apostles in the first century.....what is in dispute is that they continued after the apostles died....

The miracles will always continue, as this is God's blessing and care upon the Christians.
This is the blessing of Abraham that comes on the saved Gentiles.

What can be "disputed" is ........

You have the "ACTS"........in the NT... and the correct title is the "Acts of the Apostles"..
So, you have denominations that are built on trying to copy and perform those same "Acts"..
And the issue is, you have the "Signs of an Apostle" that are the Acts of the Apostles, and that is specific to the Apostles ministry.
So, when you have Christians trying to perform, or copy, or produce, something that is specific to the Apostles ministry, then you get a incredible amount of FAKE being produced in these "signs and wonders" types of Denominations.

 

[Cross8527]

The miracles will always continue, as this is God's blessing and care upon the Christians.
This is the blessing of Abraham that comes on the saved Gentiles.

What can be "disputed" is ........

You have the "ACTS"........in the NT... and the correct title is the "Acts of the Apostles"..
So, you have denominations that are built on trying to copy and perform those same "Acts"..
And the issue is, you have the "Signs of an Apostle" that are the Acts of the Apostles, and that is specific to the Apostles ministry.
So, when you have Christians trying to perform, or copy, or produce, something that is specific to the Apostles ministry, then you get a incredible amount of FAKE being produced in these "signs and wonders" types of Denominations.

I never thought of it that way, that makes perfect sense.