Not exactly mrjhealth, Jesus gave His correct doctrine to only His Church not to you or your 'personal Holy Spirit' or to any religious affiliation with the exception of His Church. That One True Apostolic Church is the only Church that contains the doctrine that Jesus wants all of us Christians to follow.Yes, we all are correct when we agree on that it is the members that make up Christ's One True Church, but the question is which is the correct Church. We see in this verse Matt.18:15-18, notice ,first the Christians take the problemed brother amongst a few Christians, without success, then as you can see they take the brother with the problem to the Church,there was only One Church then as today with the very same doctrine.By Church it is to be noted that it is all Apostolic Churches that contain the very same unchangeable docrine from that time period up to today and tommorrow and all tommorrows to come [ Unchangeable Doctrinal Traditional Teachings ] those Traditions are from God not from mere-men as we find within Christ's One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church.Why is it that you refuse to believe in Christ's Apostolic Church ?
Spoken Word and Written Word are the Same
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What about this, neo, which Jesus Christ said to Peter, after His resurrection?
John 21:18 Verily, verily, I say unto thee, When thou wast young, thou girded thyself, and walked whither thou would: but when thou shalt be old, thou shalt stretch forth thy hands, and another shall gird thee, and carry [thee] whither thou would not. 19 This spake he, signifying by what death he should glorify God. And when He had spoken this, He said to him, Follow Me. Jesus was speaking to Peter only.
20 Then Peter, turning about, sees the disciple whom Jesus loved following; which also leaned on his breast at supper, and said, Lord, which is he that betrayeth thee? 21 Peter seeing him said to Jesus, Lord, and what [shall] this man [do]?
22 Jesus said to him, If I will that he tarry till I come, what [is that] to thee? follow thou Me. Jesus was speaking to Peter only.
Did you ever have any idea of that conversation between Jesus and Peter, or is it a surprise to you? Honest answer only, please
If I could Dragonfly, We see Jesus verbally reinstating the command to feed my sheep. After Peters denial, indicating Peter also needed recommissioned but the echo sounds familiar, I hear neo in Peter pointing at us and saying what about them my Lord. Such is a foundation based on Peter.
mjrhealth you wrote the following:"What about this, neo, which Jesus Christ said to Peter, after His resurrection?
John 21:18 Verily, verily, I say unto thee, When thou wast young, thou girded thyself, and walked whither thou would: but when thou shalt be old, thou shalt stretch forth thy hands, and another shall gird thee, and carry [thee] whither thou would not. 19 This spake he, signifying by what death he should glorify God. And when He had spoken this, He said to him, Follow Me. Jesus was speaking to Peter only." ------------------------------------------------ my answer from the bible is --------for 18, originally a proverb about old age, now used as a figurative reference to the crucifixion of Peter.
20 Then Peter, turning about, sees the disciple whom Jesus loved following; which also leaned on his breast at supper, and said, Lord, which is he that betrayeth thee? 21 Peter seeing him said to Jesus, Lord, and what [shall] this man [do]?
22 Jesus said to him, If I will that he tarry till I come, what [is that] to thee? follow thou Me. Jesus was speaking to Peter only.-------------------- my answer is explained from the bible , 21, 15-23 is---This section constitutes Peter's rehabilitation and emphasizes his role in the church.
John 21:18 Verily, verily, I say unto thee, When thou wast young, thou girded thyself, and walked whither thou would: but when thou shalt be old, thou shalt stretch forth thy hands, and another shall gird thee, and carry [thee] whither thou would not. 19 This spake he, signifying by what death he should glorify God. And when He had spoken this, He said to him, Follow Me. Jesus was speaking to Peter only." ------------------------------------------------ my answer from the bible is --------for 18, originally a proverb about old age, now used as a figurative reference to the crucifixion of Peter.
20 Then Peter, turning about, sees the disciple whom Jesus loved following; which also leaned on his breast at supper, and said, Lord, which is he that betrayeth thee? 21 Peter seeing him said to Jesus, Lord, and what [shall] this man [do]?
22 Jesus said to him, If I will that he tarry till I come, what [is that] to thee? follow thou Me. Jesus was speaking to Peter only.-------------------- my answer is explained from the bible , 21, 15-23 is---This section constitutes Peter's rehabilitation and emphasizes his role in the church.
The question is will you now take the next step, and do as the Lord commanded Peter?
21 Peter seeing him said to Jesus, Lord, and what [shall] this man [do]?
22 Jesus said to him, If I will that he tarry till I come, what [is that] to thee? follow thou Me.
what [is that] to thee?
Right back at ya
follow thou Me
Who was it that SEEN recognized first the Lord?
[sup]5 [/sup]Then Jesus said to them, “Children, have you any food?”
They answered Him, “No.”
[sup]6 [/sup]And He said to them, “Cast the net on the right side of the boat, and you will find some.” So they cast, and now they were not able to draw it in because of the multitude of fish.
[sup]7 [/sup]Therefore that disciple whom Jesus loved said to Peter, “It is the Lord!”
disciple whom Jesus loved
[sup]15 [/sup]So when they had eaten breakfast, Jesus said to Simon Peter, “Simon, son of Jonah,[sup][b][/sup] do you love Me more than these?”
He said to Him, “Yes, Lord; You know that I love You.”
He said to him, “Feed My lambs.”
[sup]16 [/sup]He said to him again a second time, “Simon, son of Jonah,[sup][c][/sup] do you love Me?”
He said to Him, “Yes, Lord; You know that I love You.”
He said to him, “Tend My sheep.”
[sup]17 [/sup]He said to him the third time, “Simon, son of Jonah,[sup][d][/sup] do you love Me?” Peter was grieved because He said to him the third time, “Do you love Me?”
So I ask again who was being restored? recommissioned?
21 Peter seeing him said to Jesus, Lord, and what [shall] this man [do]?
22 Jesus said to him, If I will that he tarry till I come, what [is that] to thee? follow thou Me.
what [is that] to thee?
Right back at ya
follow thou Me
Who was it that SEEN recognized first the Lord?
[sup]5 [/sup]Then Jesus said to them, “Children, have you any food?”
They answered Him, “No.”
[sup]6 [/sup]And He said to them, “Cast the net on the right side of the boat, and you will find some.” So they cast, and now they were not able to draw it in because of the multitude of fish.
[sup]7 [/sup]Therefore that disciple whom Jesus loved said to Peter, “It is the Lord!”
disciple whom Jesus loved
[sup]15 [/sup]So when they had eaten breakfast, Jesus said to Simon Peter, “Simon, son of Jonah,[sup][b][/sup] do you love Me more than these?”
He said to Him, “Yes, Lord; You know that I love You.”
He said to him, “Feed My lambs.”
[sup]16 [/sup]He said to him again a second time, “Simon, son of Jonah,[sup][c][/sup] do you love Me?”
He said to Him, “Yes, Lord; You know that I love You.”
He said to him, “Tend My sheep.”
[sup]17 [/sup]He said to him the third time, “Simon, son of Jonah,[sup][d][/sup] do you love Me?” Peter was grieved because He said to him the third time, “Do you love Me?”
So I ask again who was being restored? recommissioned?
Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Lets see,
This line omits,
Going to church,
praying to saints,
worshiping statues,
praying to Mary.
following men,
baptism
confession to priests
earning our way, as if the price Jesus paid was not enough
works
religion is not from God, it adds "works", to the price, all of a sudden it s you trying to earn you place in heaven, Salvation a FREE gift from God, the Holy Spirirt a FREE gift from God,
Mat 20:24 And when the ten heard it, they were moved with indignation against the two brethren.
Mat 20:25 But Jesus called them unto him, and said, Ye know that the princes of the Gentiles exercise dominion over them, and they that are great exercise authority upon them.
Mat 20:26 But it shall not be so among you: but whosoever will be great among you, let him be your minister;
Jesus never insituted a hierarchy thats mans nonsense. Do you know why the veil in the temple was torn it two at Christs resurection, it was so that God could once again walk amongst men, no longer hidden behind a veil and smoke, but freely avaliable to those who Love Him, because thats what He always desired, but many do not want it that way.
In all His Love
Lets see,
This line omits,
Going to church,
praying to saints,
worshiping statues,
praying to Mary.
following men,
baptism
confession to priests
earning our way, as if the price Jesus paid was not enough
works
religion is not from God, it adds "works", to the price, all of a sudden it s you trying to earn you place in heaven, Salvation a FREE gift from God, the Holy Spirirt a FREE gift from God,
Mat 20:24 And when the ten heard it, they were moved with indignation against the two brethren.
Mat 20:25 But Jesus called them unto him, and said, Ye know that the princes of the Gentiles exercise dominion over them, and they that are great exercise authority upon them.
Mat 20:26 But it shall not be so among you: but whosoever will be great among you, let him be your minister;
Jesus never insituted a hierarchy thats mans nonsense. Do you know why the veil in the temple was torn it two at Christs resurection, it was so that God could once again walk amongst men, no longer hidden behind a veil and smoke, but freely avaliable to those who Love Him, because thats what He always desired, but many do not want it that way.
In all His Love
equals========= equals
Peter's effort works
Or the fishers of men
Now when Simon Peter heard that it was the Lord, he put on his outer garment (for he had removed it), and plunged into the sea. [sup]8 [/sup]But the other disciples came in the little boat (for they were not far from land, but about two hundred cubits), dragging the net with fish.
It was Peters Idea to go fishing
But who brought the catch in?
Again neo who is being restored?
You really need to check that foundation you stand on
Are you in the "little boat" bring in the catch? or splashing about in the serf?
[sup]14 [/sup]This is now the third time Jesus showed Himself to His disciples after He was raised from the dead.
From those verses we can clearly understand that Jesus after His resurrection gave Peter the jurisdiction of [ earthly shepherd, for Jesus is still the Chief Shepherd of both heaven and earth ] supreme shepherd and ruler over the whole flock on earth until Jesus returns.
You can twist a fence post into a bow-tie as well. What it means is it's no longer a fence post, though it might make a nice big bow-tie for your snowman. But when spring comes the only thing that's going to be left is that twisted fence post, The farmer will simply pitch it in the scrap pile.
Hi Rex and mjrhealth,
Nice work!
Great picture of God walking amongst men, mjrh, I've never seen a fence post twisted into a bow tie, Rex, but I have seen a scrap pile.
You're meaning Peter before he was born again?
Interesting to think that Peter could not have been through christening as a baby, isn't it?
Do you know that's what Roman Catholics mean by being 'born again'?
Hi neo,
Please tell me, how could your quote
for John 21:18 possibly be true, since Jesus was the first person ever to say it?
If I'm wrong about that, I'll happily concede, but where is your evidence that it had already been (when Jesus used it), an old proverb?
Nice work!
Great picture of God walking amongst men, mjrh, I've never seen a fence post twisted into a bow tie, Rex, but I have seen a scrap pile.
You're meaning Peter before he was born again?
Interesting to think that Peter could not have been through christening as a baby, isn't it?
Do you know that's what Roman Catholics mean by being 'born again'?
Hi neo,
Please tell me, how could your quote
for John 21:18 possibly be true, since Jesus was the first person ever to say it?
If I'm wrong about that, I'll happily concede, but where is your evidence that it had already been (when Jesus used it), an old proverb?
Maybe when you people gain the proper understanding of John's allegorical method and realize that it is an indispensable tool for understanding the signs which John has given his readers to enable them to come to knowledge and faith in Christ.
" ...... there are difficult things to understand, which the unlearned [ protestants with their myriad thousands of conficting interpretations ] ............,just as they do the rest of the Scriptures also, to their own destruction " 2 Cor.3:16
Don't forget it was the Catholic bishops with the guidance of the HS gave us the Canonical NT List of Books which all Christians have accepted, that could have only occured if they [ Catholic bishops ] understood [ correct "ONE TRUE INTERPRETATION of Holy Scripture ] what they selected.as being cannonical.If you disagree then how do you know that those Catholic bishops gave us the correct books between the covers of our Bibles ? Remember the bible never contained an inspired and infallible list of books that should belong in the bible.This never occurred until the Church selected which Books would make up the NT.
" ...... there are difficult things to understand, which the unlearned [ protestants with their myriad thousands of conficting interpretations ] ............,just as they do the rest of the Scriptures also, to their own destruction " 2 Cor.3:16
Don't forget it was the Catholic bishops with the guidance of the HS gave us the Canonical NT List of Books which all Christians have accepted, that could have only occured if they [ Catholic bishops ] understood [ correct "ONE TRUE INTERPRETATION of Holy Scripture ] what they selected.as being cannonical.If you disagree then how do you know that those Catholic bishops gave us the correct books between the covers of our Bibles ? Remember the bible never contained an inspired and infallible list of books that should belong in the bible.This never occurred until the Church selected which Books would make up the NT.
Thats the second thing that discusses me about you. One, you blasphemy the Spirit at work within me.
Then you rush in and try to catch some air under your wings on the after-glow.
Then you rush in and try to catch some air under your wings on the after-glow.
I AM surprised that no one has posted anything about the meaning of the word 'WORD' in the bible. as you probably know there are 2 different meaning. one is rhema and the other is logos. so it all comes down to whether we received from God himself or it came through other means. remember that these two words are not the same so as to the OP it all comes down to how the word is given.
if i need to go into detail on this just ask.
God bless
if i need to go into detail on this just ask.
God bless
Neo, gotta love you man.
You always say that anyone that does not agree with you just does not understand your Catholic doctrine. I think you are probably, right. When you put all the RCC writings together, it's quite a bit to go through (kind of like the IRS regulations). Well, when it comes to the simplicity of Christ, just give me a Bible and the Holy Spirit because your extra-biblical writings are very confusing and voluminous. It takes less that one day to come into the Kingdom of God, but weeks and weeks to become a Catholic. Isn't there something wrong with that picture?
I will post for the masses (for you) about 1500 pages of official Catholic dogma/law for those interested in knowing what they need to believe if they want to be a Catholic.
CATECHISM OF THE CATHOLIC CHURCH
Code of Canon Law
Are you suggesting that's what 2 Corinthians 3:16 says?
Funny...my Bible says...
Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.
sorry, try 2 Peter 3:16
Axehead, you wrote the following: " Well, when it comes to the simplicity of Christ, just give me a Bible and the Holy Spirit because your extra-biblical writings are very confusing and voluminous. It takes less that one day to come into the Kingdom of God, but weeks and weeks to become a Catholic. Isn't there something wrong with that picture?"
Oh really, is that why you Protestants have over 30,000 different conflicting interpretations of the Bible , doesn't sound as if there is much simplicity within your Protestant ilk?
You're funny. Sometimes it's 400 sometimes it's 30,000. I will tell you that there are much more than 30,000 churches of Christ in the world and they all mostly believe the main doctrines and tenets of the faith. They all agree much more with one another than with you and the RCC which itself has many schisms and divisions within their ONE Church. In fact, some Orders are actually very antagonistic and competitive towards other Orders. The animosity is very bad, all within one organization. Would you like me to list the schism and antagonisms? I won't do that. You already know them.
We believe in freedom of thought (so does the Holy Spirit) and we have healthy freedom of thought in non-Catholic churches. We endeavor to keep the unity of the faith in the bond of peace. You and your cohorts have brought anything but peace to this board. What do you have to say about that?
But as an example, I have much more unity with my brothers and sisters IN CHRIST here on CyB though they are all in different churches than I will ever have with you and your gang. You and your gang are not doing too well trying to put a wedge between Christians of different expressions. I probably have more in common than the most extreme Protestant on this board than you. There is virtually nothing that you and I have any unity in because we have different Fathers. "Call no man on earth, Father...".
I have been to over 25 countries in my life and have found important common ground with Christians in many different churches. The unity of the Spirit and love for the brethren is unmistakable. Those who love the Lord are also unmistakable. Sadly, you don't know what we are talking about.
Psa 16:3 But to the saints that are in the earth, and to the excellent, in whom is all my delight.
I am hoping and praying that even you will see the light, someday.
Axehead
Sorry, I still didn't see anything about "protestants with their myriad thousands of conficting interpretations"....
As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable shift, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction. 2 Peter 3:16
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