The 144,000 before God at the end.

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The Light

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You haven't proven "thy people" are ethnic and not spiritual.
69 weeks have occurred before Messiah was cut off. Were these 69 weeks happening to the people of Daniel?



How do you determine when the seventy weeks shall be?
69 weeks have happened. The 70th week will happen after the fullness of the Gentiles comes in.

The seventy weeks must lead us to a period of time to finish transgression, make an end of sins, and make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in every lasting righteousness, to seal up the vison and prophecy, and anoint the most Holy.
And it will.

When and who does the seventy weeks point to? If you can't prove the time for fulfilling the prophesy, all you've done is throw out a verse of Scripture you IMAGINE proves your unbiblical doctrine.
Who did the 69 weeks that have already occurred point to?

When the fullness of the Gentiles comes in God will deal with His CHOSEN.
 

The Light

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Yes, it will. Multiple scriptures show the church doing just that. It's the entire purpose of the trib.

Please feel free to post those scriptures that show the Church going through the great tribulation.


No, what's simple is the 7th trump says that the wrath of God comes at that time, not 6 trumps earlier. You prefer your own beliefs over what Rev 11 says about when God's wrath begins.
Revelation 11 shows that the wrath of God is over and Christ has set up His kingdom on earth. It is the time of judgement.
 

The Light

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Where does Paul write that blindness in part that happened to Israel shall be lifted when the fulness of Gentiles come in? Paul is telling us that Israel shall be saved when the fullness of Gentiles come in to the same good olive tree of faith with Jews of faith.

The context shows us that Israel that shall be saved include Jews of faith as well as Gentiles of faith, but you imagine Paul is too stupid to understand "all Israel that shall be saved" cannot be speaking of ethnic Israel, but is speaking of the "Israel of God." All Israel that shall be saved through the Deliverer, who turns away ungodliness from JACOB!

Romans 11:25-28 (KJV) For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins. As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.
Jacob is Israel and not the Gentiles
 
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rwb

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69 weeks have occurred before Messiah was cut off. Were these 69 weeks happening to the people of Daniel?




69 weeks have happened. The 70th week will happen after the fullness of the Gentiles comes in.


And it will.


Who did the 69 weeks that have already occurred point to?

When the fullness of the Gentiles comes in God will deal with His CHOSEN.

You bring up the 69 weeks of vs 25??? How can you understand the 69 weeks if you can't understand 70 weeks of vs 24? Answer the questions and stop trying to change the focus to vs 25. Again, you give opinion after opinion without any proof for what you allege. It's clear you have no understanding of biblical prophecy.
 

rwb

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69 weeks have happened. The 70th week will happen after the fullness of the Gentiles comes in.

How can you possibly know this since you have no understanding of the 70 weeks prophesy of Daniel?
 

The Light

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You got nothing, because of spiritual blindness. 1 Corinthians 2:14
Well one thing I don't get, is why you claim you have replaced Israel but don't want to tie replacement theology to your doctrine. When you look up replacement theology on the net it is obviously your doctrine.
 

covenantee

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Well one thing I don't get, is why you claim you have replaced Israel but don't want to tie replacement theology to your doctrine. When you look up replacement theology on the net it is obviously your doctrine.
Provide a verbatim quote in which I claim to have replaced Israel. Include a link to the post from which the quote originates.
 
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rwb

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Jacob is Israel and not the Gentiles

Israel is the name given to Jacob! And whoever is of the faith of Abraham, from whom Jacob ascended, is called Israel of God. It matters not whether they are Jew or Gentiles, in Christ we are of the same Seed (Christ) Who came from Abraham, Isaac and JACOB!

Genesis 32:28 (KJV) And he said, Thy name shall be called no more Jacob, but Israel: for as a prince hast thou power with God and with men, and hast prevailed.

Genesis 35:10 (KJV) And God said unto him, Thy name is Jacob: thy name shall not be called any more Jacob, but Israel shall be thy name: and he called his name Israel.

Hosea 11:1 (KJV) When Israel was a child, then I loved him, and called my son out of Egypt
.

Romans 9:11-13 (KJV) (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth;) It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger. As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.
 
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rwb

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I think the ignorance of your questions have been addressed.

Really! Since you give only opinions without biblical support, I too shall give you mine. I think you don't answer because you don't have a clue! You have no understanding of Biblical prophesy, so you simply mouth what you have been taught or perhaps comes from your vivid imagination!
 
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covenantee

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Well one thing I don't get, is why you claim you have replaced Israel but don't want to tie replacement theology to your doctrine. When you look up replacement theology on the net it is obviously your doctrine.

Provide a verbatim quote in which I claim to have replaced Israel. Include a link to the post from which the quote originates.
My my, it's certainly become quiet.

Did your keyboard suddenly die? :laughing:
 

ewq1938

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Please feel free to post those scriptures that show the Church going through the great tribulation.

Posted them many times:

The church will be in the tribulation which is a war against the saints, where some Christians are killed. No one is raptured away to be saved from this:

Rev 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.


These people are already Christians when satan goes to make war against them. There is no scriptural support for the idea that the church is gone, then non-Christians suddenly accept Christ and become new Christians in the Tribulation and then fulfill the role of the persecuted church in the tribulation. That is a concept that does not appear in scripture.


Rev 13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.

Rev 6:9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
Rev 6:10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
Rev 6:11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

Mat 24:9 Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake.

Luk 21:16 And ye shall be betrayed both by parents, and brethren, and kinsfolks, and friends; and some of you shall they cause to be put to death.

Rev 11:3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
Rev 11:4 These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.
Rev 11:5 And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed.
Rev 11:6 These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will.
Rev 11:7 And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

Revelation 11 shows that the wrath of God is over and Christ has set up His kingdom on earth. It is the time of judgement.

Rev 11 says the wrath comes at the 7th trump not ends at the 7th trump. You are literally going against what is written and replacing with your own version.

Rev 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
Rev 11:16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,
Rev 11:17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.
Rev 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.
 

The Light

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Israel is the name given to Jacob! And whoever is of the faith of Abraham, from whom Jacob ascended, is called Israel of God. It matters not whether they are Jew or Gentiles, in Christ we are of the same Seed (Christ) Who came from Abraham, Isaac and JACOB!

Genesis 32:28 (KJV) And he said, Thy name shall be called no more Jacob, but Israel: for as a prince hast thou power with God and with men, and hast prevailed.

Genesis 35:10 (KJV) And God said unto him, Thy name is Jacob: thy name shall not be called any more Jacob, but Israel shall be thy name: and he called his name Israel.

Hosea 11:1 (KJV) When Israel was a child, then I loved him, and called my son out of Egypt
.

Romans 9:11-13 (KJV) (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth;) It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger. As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.
Right. And you think you have replaced Israel.