The Birthing Is Key

[robert derrick]

What religion and certainly the world cannot understand about God - in the scriptures, how in 'the world' can God have children. The world claims (some in the world) that we are all the children of God. Confusing all humanity in creation was created by God. It is easy I suppose to confuse the two because there is some very smart people that look at scripture and see that God has children now and assume we are all children. Now actually believing those scriptures and pin pointing the written word that says "you must be born again" is another situation. So we can take written scripture and read what it means to believe the word of God, and if I do believe I become a child of God by a completed finished work on the cross that killed who I was and birthed in me a new person - constituting an act of God to birth a child just like any other child that is born.

When Jesus got his Mary body - when he was coming into the world via the virgin birth and would walk among men as no other had ever walked because his father was God. What does scripture say;

35 And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God. - Luke 1:35.

The first birth by God to grip mankind and it is a pattern for the children of God today in being born again - a birth takes place. It may be different in alot of ways but a birthing will take place if you are a child of God. You are not a child just because you believed - you are are a child because when you believed a birth took place - scripture says to all humanity "you must be born again."

When you believe - a miracle happens to an individual - they get the complete Christ' in them the moment they believe. You don't get a little bit and as your mind gets right you get more - I have heard the theology from some that it is Christ' growing in you - no sir - you will do the growing in mind. When Christ' is birthed in the believer they receive him - the full and complete Christ' in you the hope of glory!

Footnote: Paul has become our pattern as well in following him into the "yeah deep things of God,." He gives us the answer to salvation - he tells a believer what has saved them and how it all came about (by a birthing). So Paul has to be followed in the epistles he wrote to us - the birthed again. Paul gives sound instruction to 'follow me as I follow the Lord Jesus Christ.' Why would that be so important to a believer? If they want to know how they have come to be who they are, they will have to follow Paul as written in scripture. The believer must see that 'before Paul there is NO in Christ' message. It couldn't be known it was not written down. Were people in Christ', yes absolutely that started on the day of Pentecost. But according to what is written what Paul had to say had been hid in God from the foundation of the world' - and that fact was! God Himself would birth children of his own by placing another person in the creature, constituting a birth and a child of God.

16 Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began, - Romans 16:25.

The real topic is about the blood of the Lamb. Adam had the pure blood of God, when God breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and he became a living soul.

It is the blood that has the life.

Jesus brought into the world the pure and incorruptible blood of God again, when He came into the world as God born of woman as man.

The one common denominator between the 1st and 2nd Adam was the incorruptible blood, wherein was eternal life to make the body immortal. The 1st Adam was fashioned of the dust of the ground to be made in the image of God, but the 2nd Adam was born the image of the invisible God. The 1st Adam fell short by transgression, and the 2nd Adam did not sin.

We are born of God by Jesus Christ to drink His incorruptible blood, which is drink indeed, and eat His uncorrupted flesh, which is meat indeed, and are made both incorruptible and immortal in the inner man, which is resurrected in His likeness.

Corruptible flesh and blood shall not inherit the kingdom of God, but them that are born of incorruptible blood and flesh of Jesus, being members of His uncorrupted body shall live forever, if they fall not after the similitude of Adam's transgression, but rather believe unto the end in the image of Christ Jesus.

Adam, being made in the image of God with incorruptible blood by the Spirit of God breathed into His nostrils, transgressed and corrupted his own blood, so that all born of him were born into sin, but Jesus, being born in the image of God with incorruptible blood by the Spirit in Himself, sinned not and corrupted not his own blood nor the flesh, so that all born of Him are born forgiven of sin, and in the image of Him after the inward man.

While yet we bear the image of the earthy in our mortal bodies, we have the image of the heavenly in our inward man, which is member of the body of Christ.

Adam was immortal by incorruptible blood and transgressed and died. Jesus was immortal by incorruptible blood and sinned not and yet died on the cross, that we might drink thereof and be born therewith and live forever in His likeness, so long as we sin not after the similitude of Adam's transgression.

We are born again by the Spirit with the blood of the Lamb in the inner man, ruling over the outer man who's deeds are crucified on the cross of Christ. We are no longer ruled by the sin of corruptible blood and flesh but are given life by the incorruptible blood and flesh of Jesus.

"Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers, But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot." (1 Peter 1)

Traditions of men are trash. The blood of Christ Jesus is treasure indeed.

 

[robert derrick]

Good job! You are pointing out the obvious. LOL A God impregnating a human woman was a common theme in Pagan mythology. It runs through several Pagan beliefs and a few in Greco-Roman mythologies. Alexander the Great said his father was a god.

So how do you figure that relates to Christianity?

When that impregnated thing is a created being by God, and thence deified by God, as Herakles, then you have classic mythology.

Which of course are unitarians giving lip service to the name of Jesus, but worshipping 'Jehovah' only.

Catholics turn Christianity into paganism by Mariology, and unitarians declare worship of Jesus to be paganism by Jehovah-only worship.

The true paganism of Christianity is Mary worship as Mother of God, and is Jehovah worship as Creator of Jesus as Son of God.

The Lord Jesus Christ is the One Saviour of the world, LORD, the LORD thy God, the Holy One of Israel, the Living and Great God.

Not the Father. The Father is nowhere mentioned as Saviour. The Lord called Jehovah was in heaven from everlasting with the Father and came down from heaven upon the earth as the Lord Jesus, the name that became above every other name, including that of His previous name Jehovah.

You worship a LORD Jehovah you know not, or think you know, but still know not.

The LORD called Jehovah become the Lord Jesus, and He it is that shall return upon the earth in the last great day of battle to establish His reign upon the earth: the LORD of LORDS, and KING of KINGS.

Nowhere else is the LORD mentioned in Scripture after the birth of the Savior and King Jesus Christ the Lord.

No LORD at all, except as returning LORD and KING.

 

[robert derrick]

I am not saying salvation is not about belief.
My point is that there are physical aspects...the physical relating to the spiritual.
I understand that some believe that all you have to do is believe and you have a ticket to heaven.
I am not one of those that believe that.
I believe that belief is important and contributes to totality of salvation.
I believe that repentance is important and contributes to totality of salvation.
I believe that baptism is important and contributes to totality of salvation.
I believe that the bread and wine is important and contributes to totality of salvation.
Now exactly what is the dividing line as to what does what is an interesting debate.

For example Christ said that if we do not perform the bread and wine ritual that we have no life in us and we do not abide in him.
Now what is it like to be "saved" but have no life in us and we do not abide in Christ?

But we can do an experiment...just believe...do not repent, do not be baptized and do not participate in communion. Then after it is all over, send us a post card and tell us how it all turned out for you.

Bottom line Christ said, Why do you call me Lord Lord, and not do what I say.

You mistake my meaning:

"I understand that some believe that all you have to do is believe and you have a ticket to heaven."

Agreed. Faith without works is dead.

"I believe that belief is important and contributes to totality of salvation."

Agreed. Faith with works is justified.

"Bottom line Christ said, Why do you call me Lord Lord, and not do what I say."

Agreed again. Be a doer of the Word and not a hearer only.

"just believe...do not repent, do not be baptized and do not participate in communion."

I do and I have and continue to do so. Because such outward works of repentance are proof of faith (Luke 3:8), and outward displays of ceremony are confession of faith (1 Peter 3:21), of the inward work of the Spirit which is the true work, much more so than the outward proofs and expressions of faith. So much more so as the blood of the Lamb is than that of bulls and goats.

As Paul said, pertaining to outward works of the law of Christ I am a Christian of the Christians. The 'holiness living' and 'church service works' of my Christian life would put many faithful believers to shame. I don't boast, but only acknowledge my background or religious 'creds'. But you are displaying a classic error of carnal mindedness vs the reality and truth of the Spirit, which is more real than flesh and blood and more wise than carnal understanding:

"I believe that the bread and wine is important and contributes to totality of salvation. Now exactly what is the dividing line as to what does what is an interesting debate."

True. The dividing line being between the Spirit inwardly and the flesh outwardly: drinking the blood and eating the flesh of the Son are true in deed in the Spirit, drinking the wine and eating the bread in communion service is outward confession only. If done with faith of Jesus in the heart, it is honest before God and man, if not, it is damned by God as worse than no participation at all, even if man knows it not. (Rom 14:13) (1 Cor 11:27)

"For example Christ said that if we do not perform the bread and wine ritual..."

And here is the entire separation between the spiritual and the carnal: Jesus said to eat of His flesh and to drink of His blood that we may have Life in us, not to 'perform a ritual' that we may be justified.

You are speaking from the carnal mind. You have no understanding of the mind of Christ in the Spirit. The Spirit is He that quickens and gives life and is 'real' and true altogether for eternity. It is corruptible flesh and blood in this world that is but a puff of smoke. You focus on the external as the substance of truth, when you ought seek the substance of truth in the internal faith and Spirit of Jesus first. First things first.

You need the faith of Jesus in your heart, not just seeking to find Him by intellectual means when reading Scripture.

"Canst thou by searching find out God? canst thou find out the Almighty unto perfection?" (Job 11)

"Great is the LORD, and greatly to be praised; and his greatness is unsearchable." (Psalms 145)

"That I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ. And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery." (Eph 3)

You need to understand the 'reality' of being filled with his Spirit and drinking of His blood and eating of His flesh by the Spirit according to His own words: they are life indeed. I do not say disregard the outer communion, but rather give double honor to the Spirit as eternal Life, and then give proper honor to the outward display as confession thereof, only.

I am trying to help you to see beyond the intellectual and carnal understanding. When Jesus said we must drink of His blood, that we may have life, He meant it, literally. Not symbolically. The Spirit is the life, and the life is in His blood, the true and eternal life, not in the wine of communion as the Catholics mystify. The outward communion is symbolic to be respected in honest practise to represent the drinking of the blood, but the blood of the Son Himself is real indeed. His blood was real indeed as immortal man and God on earth, and His blood is real indeed as God and Saviour of man in heaven.

But if the Spirit is not God, but is only 'a force' to be reckoned with, and the drinking of the blood is symbolic performance of wine only, then there is no hope of knowing Him personally in deed and in truth. (1 John 3)

 

[Grailhunter]

You mistake my meaning:

"I understand that some believe that all you have to do is believe and you have a ticket to heaven."

Agreed. Faith without works is dead.

"I believe that belief is important and contributes to totality of salvation."

Agreed. Faith with works is justified.

"Bottom line Christ said, Why do you call me Lord Lord, and not do what I say."

Agreed again. Be a doer of the Word and not a hearer only.

"just believe...do not repent, do not be baptized and do not participate in communion."

I do and I have and continue to do so. Because such outward works of repentance are proof of faith (Luke 3:8), and outward displays of ceremony are confession of faith (1 Peter 3:21), of the inward work of the Spirit which is the true work, much more so than the outward proofs and expressions of faith. So much more so as the blood of the Lamb is than that of bulls and goats.

As Paul said, pertaining to outward works of the law of Christ I am a Christian of the Christians. The 'holiness living' and 'church service works' of my Christian life would put many faithful believers to shame. I don't boast, but only acknowledge my background or religious 'creds'. But you are displaying a classic error of carnal mindedness vs the reality and truth of the Spirit, which is more real than flesh and blood and more wise than carnal understanding:

"I believe that the bread and wine is important and contributes to totality of salvation. Now exactly what is the dividing line as to what does what is an interesting debate."

True. The dividing line being between the Spirit inwardly and the flesh outwardly: drinking the blood and eating the flesh of the Son are true in deed in the Spirit, drinking the wine and eating the bread in communion service is outward confession only. If done with faith of Jesus in the heart, it is honest before God and man, if not, it is damned by God as worse than no participation at all, even if man knows it not. (Rom 14:13) (1 Cor 11:27)

"For example Christ said that if we do not perform the bread and wine ritual..."

And here is the entire separation between the spiritual and the carnal: Jesus said to eat of His flesh and to drink of His blood that we may have Life in us, not to 'perform a ritual' that we may be justified.

You are speaking from the carnal mind. You have no understanding of the mind of Christ in the Spirit. The Spirit is He that quickens and gives life and is 'real' and true altogether for eternity. It is corruptible flesh and blood in this world that is but a puff of smoke. You focus on the external as the substance of truth, when you ought seek the substance of truth in the internal faith and Spirit of Jesus first. First things first.

You need the faith of Jesus in your heart, not just seeking to find Him by intellectual means when reading Scripture.

"Canst thou by searching find out God? canst thou find out the Almighty unto perfection?" (Job 11)

"Great is the LORD, and greatly to be praised; and his greatness is unsearchable." (Psalms 145)

"That I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ. And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery." (Eph 3)

You need to understand the 'reality' of being filled with his Spirit and drinking of His blood and eating of His flesh by the Spirit according to His own words: they are life indeed. I do not say disregard the outer communion, but rather give double honor to the Spirit as eternal Life, and then give proper honor to the outward display as confession thereof, only.

I am trying to help you to see beyond the intellectual and carnal understanding. When Jesus said we must drink of His blood, that we may have life, He meant it, literally. Not symbolically. The Spirit is the life, and the life is in His blood, the true and eternal life, not in the wine of communion as the Catholics mystify. The outward communion is symbolic to be respected in honest practise to represent the drinking of the blood, but the blood of the Son Himself is real indeed. His blood was real indeed as immortal man and God on earth, and His blood is real indeed as God and Saviour of man in heaven.

But if the Spirit is not God, but is only 'a force' to be reckoned with, and the drinking of the blood is symbolic performance of wine only, then there is no hope of knowing Him personally in deed and in truth. (1 John 3)

The deep side of it is not my point.

Baptism and communion have a physical side and a spiritual side and they are connected.
If they do not warm up the baptismal, you will notice the cold of the physical.
When they hand you the cracker and kool-aid in church, you should know that someone baked the cracker and stirred the kool-aid.
Physical and spiritual events happening simultaneously.

Well how does that happen it is a mystery....and people like to speculate and it runs the gambit

Now science and religion are moving together on this. If you get into Astro-Physics and Quantum Mechanics you will read about dimensions. Well these dimensions can be equated to Heaven...spiritual plane...So then you have what is called parallel universes that exist side by side or even co-existing in the same plane or space. So then when something like baptism or communion occurs the water and or the crackers are doing something in our physical plane and at the same time having an affect in the spiritual plane.

 

[theefaith]

Rationalization. There’s nothing in the Bible that says Jesus had step brothers or step sisters

Nothing says they are children of Mary
And it does say she will have only one child, God with us
Isa 7:14

 

[robert derrick]

The deep side of it is not my point.

Baptism and communion have a physical side and a spiritual side and they are connected.
If they do not warm up the baptismal, you will notice the cold of the physical.
When they hand you the cracker and kool-aid in church, you should know that someone baked the cracker and stirred the kool-aid.
Physical and spiritual events happening simultaneously.

Well how does that happen it is a mystery....and people like to speculate and it runs the gambit

Now science and religion are moving together on this. If you get into Astro-Physics and Quantum Mechanics you will read about dimensions. Well these dimensions can be equated to Heaven...spiritual plane...So then you have what is called parallel universes that exist side by side or even co-existing in the same plane or space. So then when something like baptism or communion occurs the water and or the crackers are doing something in our physical plane and at the same time having an affect in the spiritual plane.

Ok, I see. No, I don't believe in 'veritable' blood and flesh of wine and cracker, nor am I particularly interested in quantum mechanics, spiritual physics, dimensional planes etc... except in areas of practical use.

The only thing happening on the inside of anyone doing anything in this life, is if it is with faith or not.

The Spirit and the Spiritual kingdom of God is more real and lasting than the physical of earthy flesh and blood, and no part of God's inward work has anything to do with flesh and blood, except that we sin or err or do works without faith in our mortal bodies, or there is healing by God.

I.e. I only go deep, because everything about God is deep. (1 Cor 2:10)

The Spirit is everything, the flesh profits nothing, nor has anything to do with it, except we allow the flesh to corrupt the inner man.

 

[robert derrick]

"And it does say she will have only one child, God with us."

It's so silly to keep watching people corrupt Scripture just to keep their foolish doctrines.

A virgin shall bear a son, Immanuel. Not bear only one...

I mean, really, what's the point? Why go thru all the little stupid games, when you can just believe and do the true, which is much easier, more sure, and blessed of God, rather than condemned as false??

Foolish children playing with grown up things.