The Crippling Effects of Christian Dogma - Mindless Parroting of Apologetics

[St. SteVen]

Sectarianism. It's biblical. We've been doing it since almost day 1. Sects, sects, sects. We're obsessed with sects.

• Luke 5:30
  But the Pharisees and the teachers of the law who belonged to their sect complained to his disciples, “Why do you eat and drink with tax collectors and sinners?”
  
  
• Acts 24:5
  “We have found this man to be a troublemaker, stirring up riots among the Jews all over the world. He is a ringleader of the Nazarene sect
  
  
• Acts 24:14
  However, I admit that I worship the God of our ancestors as a follower of the Way, which they call a sect. I believe everything that is in accordance with the Law and that is written in the Prophets,
  
  
• Acts 26:5
  They have known me for a long time and can testify, if they are willing, that I conformed to the strictest sect of our religion, living as a Pharisee.
  
  
• Acts 28:22
  But we want to hear what your views are, for we know that people everywhere are talking against this sect.”

 

[St. SteVen]

Only Yahweh can identify which of us are truly "Christians" based on His view.

Until then... ???

I give Christians the benefit of the doubt until they show me otherwise. By their fruit...

We are fruit inspectors. - LOL

Apples and oranges. It's still ALL fruit.

]

 

[Spyder]

• Luke 5:30
  But the Pharisees and the teachers of the law who belonged to their sect complained to his disciples, “Why do you eat and drink with tax collectors and sinners?”
  
  
• Acts 24:5
  “We have found this man to be a troublemaker, stirring up riots among the Jews all over the world. He is a ringleader of the Nazarene sect
  
  
• Acts 24:14
  However, I admit that I worship the God of our ancestors as a follower of the Way, which they call a sect. I believe everything that is in accordance with the Law and that is written in the Prophets,
  
  
• Acts 26:5
  They have known me for a long time and can testify, if they are willing, that I conformed to the strictest sect of our religion, living as a Pharisee.
  
  
• Acts 28:22
  But we want to hear what your views are, for we know that people everywhere are talking against this sect.”

And thus my statement about "orthodox."

 

[St. SteVen]

And thus my statement about "orthodox."

Another facet of tribalism. - LOL

Mini-orthodoxy? - LOL

]

 

[Lambano]

Our Jewish cousins had their own sects. Even the sect of the Pharisees was divided into followers of Hillel and followers of Shammai.

 

[St. SteVen]

Our Jewish cousins had their own sects. Even the sect of the Pharisees was divided into followers of Hillel and followers of Shammai.

Like an orgy of religion. They were having sects with everyone. - LOL

The party of the Pharisees, the party of the Sadducees, and the Mazola party.




]

 

[St. SteVen]

I see this problem all too frequently on the forum. Parroting mindless dogma.

And claiming it was what God says, when the poster knows full well that it is a matter of their OWN personal opinion. (sigh)
What is the cure to this crippling malady? Do we need to pray for spiritual healing for our comrades?
When will they wake up and realize we are ONE body under the headship of Christ?

[

 

[Behold]

What is the cure to this crippling malady?

Obey this verse : Hebrews 13:9

and then : Carefully learn Paul's Doctrine .

Start here.

Romans 3:21-28

 

[Dan Clarkston]

And claiming it was what God says, when the poster knows full well that it is a matter of their OWN personal opinion.

And those that disagree with scripture falsely claim the person is just posting
their opinion in cases where scripture actually teaches what they are saying

So it works both ways ya know.

The "church" as a whole does NOT practice AGAPE love to one another

Many falsely believe and claim that when someone does not agree with them... they disagree because they are not walking in love which is not true.

If someone believes something that is obviously not scriptural... it actually IS the Love of God to try and correct them.

Elevating the book ABOVE the author.

That's the excuse given for why some do not believe what God says in His Word and it's how many continue in false doctrine.

God and His Word cannot be separated.... and it was the Lord Who directed what He has said to be put in to written form.

 

[Dan Clarkston]

What is the cure to this crippling malady?

Demanding that everyone agrees with you of course!

 

[St. SteVen]

Follow-up to previous topics:

"Christians don't know what they believe." - until they are brainwashed

Interesting that the Bible is "the Word of God", unless someone quotes a translation you disagree with.

Does questioning Christianity lead to Atheism? (depends)

Bibliolatry: Worship/knowledge of the book MORE than the author

Jesus is the answer. - But what's the question?

Source or Resource? - Understanding the difference

Inerancy - Define, or dismiss?

DECONSTRUCTION - How far is too far?

If our interpretation of scripture sidesteps common sense, did we get it right?

In BIBLE we trust? - Misplaced allegiance?

Would you surrender your own beliefs in the cause of doctrinal unity?

The tyranny of doctrinal unity - "Join or die."

The (potential) Treachery of Doctrine > My way, or the highway >

If everyone agreed, there wouldn't be much point to a forum - Agree, or disagree? - LOL

The Bliss of Religious Homeostasis - Don't Rock the Boat

Unity of the faith - at what cost?

Embracing Doctrinal Diversity - Unity in diversity

Choice of doctrine is driven by religious preconception - Spirituality is an individualized journey

Unity in exclusivity is mere tribalism - Nothing special there

Is there a cure for my religious upbringing? - other than atheism, I mean.

Any questions? - LOL

But seriously, I see this problem all too frequently on the forum. Parroting mindless dogma.
And claiming it was what God says, when the poster knows full well that it is a matter of their OWN personal opinion. (sigh)

- What is the cure to this crippling malady?
- Do we need to pray for spiritual healing for our comrades?
- When will they wake up and realize we are ONE body under the headship of Christ?

[

 

[amigo de christo]

Follow-up to previous topics:

"Christians don't know what they believe." - until they are brainwashed

Interesting that the Bible is "the Word of God", unless someone quotes a translation you disagree with.

Does questioning Christianity lead to Atheism? (depends)

Bibliolatry: Worship/knowledge of the book MORE than the author

Jesus is the answer. - But what's the question?

Source or Resource? - Understanding the difference

Inerancy - Define, or dismiss?

DECONSTRUCTION - How far is too far?

If our interpretation of scripture sidesteps common sense, did we get it right?

In BIBLE we trust? - Misplaced allegiance?

Would you surrender your own beliefs in the cause of doctrinal unity?

The tyranny of doctrinal unity - "Join or die."

The (potential) Treachery of Doctrine > My way, or the highway >

If everyone agreed, there wouldn't be much point to a forum - Agree, or disagree? - LOL

The Bliss of Religious Homeostasis - Don't Rock the Boat

Unity of the faith - at what cost?

Embracing Doctrinal Diversity - Unity in diversity

Choice of doctrine is driven by religious preconception - Spirituality is an individualized journey

Unity in exclusivity is mere tribalism - Nothing special there

Is there a cure for my religious upbringing? - other than atheism, I mean.

Any questions? - LOL

But seriously, I see this problem all too frequently on the forum. Parroting mindless dogma.
And claiming it was what God says, when the poster knows full well that it is a matter of their OWN personal opinion. (sigh)

- What is the cure to this crippling malady?
- Do we need to pray for spiritual healing for our comrades?
- When will they wake up and realize we are ONE body under the headship of Christ?

[

Under the headship of CHRIST , not men who use that name and yet preach
a unity , a love , a fellowship which is contrary to the unity , the love , the fellowship of CHRIST .
Many do parrot mindless dogma .
TIME FOR SCRIPTURAL REMINDERS . rather than parroting mindless dogma .
Choice of doctrine is driven by religious pre conception ,
I HAVE the CURE for that problem . ITS called read the bible for oneself and BELIEVE ALL things
and not rather pick and choose and twist things . You want a cure to the madness
THEN BIBLE UP cause men are creating and have created all this madness .
IF we want to know if what we believe is true and that we follow the true pattern of Christ and the apostels ,
THEN bible up and get busy learning that truth for oneself .

 

[Behold]

Follow-up to previous topics:

"Christians don't know what they believe." - until they are brainwashed

For example, lets say you are a Universalist, who is leading people to Hell, by telling them that there is no Hell, and everyone goes to heavven.
So, is this person "brainwashed" or just religious and lost?

Well, if they are a Chrisitan, then they are what Paul refers to as "who hath bewitched you, that you no longer obey the truth".

Hebrews 13:9, says, that the deceived and deceiving Universalist has no real foundation of faith, so, they are caught up in a "doctrine of devils"... and usually this (fakir) type has been through many theologies over time.... trying to find one that fits them today.......and another one tomorrow.

 

[St. SteVen]

For example, lets say you are a Universalist, who is leading people to Hell, by telling them that there is no Hell, and everyone goes to heavven.
So, is this person "brainwashed" or just religious and lost?

Once again, you are misrepresenting my position.

[

 

[Behold]

Once again, you are misrepresenting my position.

Lets find out.... if you are lying again.

Do you believe that a sinner has to be forgiven their sin, and be born again on this Earth, = before they die, if they want to go to heaven?

Thats a "yes or no"...in case you are confused... @St. SteVen

 

[Behold]

Once again, you are misrepresenting my position.

Lets find out.... if you are lying again.

Do you believe that a sinner has to be forgiven their sin, and be born again on this Earth, = before they die, if they want to go to heaven?

Thats a "yes or no"...in case you are confused... @St. SteVen

 

[Augustin56]

Surprisingly (or not), you nailed it. What you wrote is what this thread is about.
But you raise a VERY interesting comparison.
1) The Christianity "of faith"
2) The Christianity "of wisdom"

Here's a question to discuss.
Are we saved by faith, or saved by wisdom?

/

I suspect you may be creating a false dichotemy here. Wisdom is a a right judgment in accord with eternal law or simply put, seeing things as God sees them. Are you proposing that wisdom somehow opposes faith or is in some way an impediment to faith? Or does it help one be more faithful?

 

[St. SteVen]

I suspect you may be creating a false dichotemy here. Wisdom is a a right judgment in accord with eternal law or simply put, seeing things as God sees them. Are you proposing that wisdom somehow opposes faith or is in some way an impediment to faith? Or does it help one be more faithful?

I'm saying that wisdom is not enough. Faith is the application of that wisdom.
You might be defining faith differently than I am here.
Without faith, it is impossible to please God.
A person may have faith but lack wisdom. (in some way)
The faith of a mustard seed is enough. How much wisdom is enough?

[

 

[Augustin56]

I'm saying that wisdom is not enough. Faith is the application of that wisdom.
You might be defining faith differently than I am here.
Without faith, it is impossible to please God.
A person may have faith but lack wisdom. (in some way)
The faith of a mustard seed is enough. How much wisdom is enough?

[

Gotcha. We are in agreement, then. In a related theme, there is a misunderstanding by some with regard to faith and reason. True faith is never infrarational (below reason), i.e., "believe because I say so." True faith is always suprarational. Once reason has done all it can, THEN faith steps in.

 

[St. SteVen]

Gotcha. We are in agreement, then. In a related theme, there is a misunderstanding by some with regard to faith and reason. True faith is never infrarational (below reason), i.e., "believe because I say so." True faith is always suprarational. Once reason has done all it can, THEN faith steps in.

Yes, thanks.
This is why I am apposed to memorized apologetics with no reasoned study involved.

[