The Days are getting shorter conspiracy?

[David H.]

Possibly. There's evidence that the length of a year changed and possibly during "historic" times, and there is the Nemesis hypothesis, which isn't exactly unreasonable, but unprovable unless we find a massive dark body in a large eccentric orbit around the sun.

As for historic times, I believe the year used to be a "perfect year" of 360 days when the axis was near vertical. This axial alignment would explain the abundance of tropical and subtropical fauna found in the arctic as the seasons would be less extreme. I am not to keen on the nemesis/Nibiru stuff though. I believe the fountains of the deep opening up could have caused this slow down in the same way thrust on a rocket can be used to control roll on a spaceship.

 

[michaelvpardo]

As for historic times, I believe the year used to be a "perfect year" of 360 days when the axis was near vertical. This axial alignment would explain the abundance of tropical and subtropical fauna found in the arctic as the seasons would be less extreme. I am not to keen on the nemesis/Nibiru stuff though. I believe the fountains of the deep opening up could have caused this slow down in the same way thrust on a rocket can be used to control roll on a spaceship.

The evidence for plate tectonics and continental drift is pretty strong, but if Pangea existed, there's no reason why a large cataclysmic shift couldn't have accomplished its breakup, and the world is full of geological anomalies pointing to cataclysmic changes, none of which can be absolutely dated.
Genesis chapter 10 gives us one peculiar verse:
To Eber were born two sons: the name of one was Peleg, for in his days the earth was divided; and his brother’s name was Joktan. Genesis 10:25.
Conventional thinking is that the phrase "in his days the earth was divided;" refers to the fall of the tower of Babel and the division of humanity by language, but the language of the verse is peculiar in using earth to describe humanity. (Everywhere else in the book of Genesis the word earth refers to the earth.)
I don't know how you can knock down a giant mud brick ziggurat and divide Noah's descendants up without some great cataclysm and moving land masses, but I'm open to suggestions.

 

[David H.]

The evidence for plate tectonics and continental drift is pretty strong, but if Pangea existed, there's no reason why a large cataclysmic shift couldn't have accomplished its breakup, and the world is full of geological anomalies pointing to cataclysmic changes, none of which can be absolutely dated.
Genesis chapter 10 gives us one peculiar verse:
To Eber were born two sons: the name of one was Peleg, for in his days the earth was divided; and his brother’s name was Joktan. Genesis 10:
Conventional thinking is that the phrase "in his days the earth was divided;" refers to the fall of the tower of Babel and the division of humanity by language, but the language of the verse is peculiar in using earth to describe humanity. (Everywhere else in the book of Genesis the word earth refers to the earth.)
I don't know how you can knock down a giant mud brick ziggurat and divide Noah's descendants up without some great cataclysm and moving land masses, but I'm open to suggestions.

I agree. The Uniformitarianism of science assumes constants, constant rates of decay, constant rates of erosion etc, in so doing they ignore the anomaly and the catastrophe. This also goes for other constants such as light speed.... When God said let there be light, there was light, instantaneously, this presumes that light speed has been decelerating since creation, Quickly at first, to where it is now, nearly at a constant.... a deceleration curve. Understanding this nullifies millions of light years for the age of the earth. (see link, Note this is a secular source)
Theory that challenges Einstein's physics could soon be put to the test

I Agree with you on Peleg as well and have noted that as well. Very few have seen this.

What all this does is throw into question the expected life of our sun (The sun shall not give its light) Which would result in the darkening of the moon as well, as per the sixth seal. When People start to see these things come to fruition, We will then see the "distress of nations", and "men's hearts failing them for fear" (Luke 21:23-24).... it is going to get to the point where you cannot explain it away with science, Even the "four pillars" of the that hold up the earth will be shaken... these are the four bonds that hold all matter together The 4 Fundamental Forces of Physics (thoughtco.com), As the "powers of heaven shall be shaken".

The four pillars

 

[David H.]

Dave you build your whole premise on "Theories" of man in this thread, and you claim a poster is looking at a human perspective and not God's?

Pot, Kettle, Black?

Theories of men are secondary to the word of God. I am not trying to rationalize the Spiritual here, but trying to show you how my eschatology is built and my timelines. In this case I am trying to show you how the fourth trumpet happens during the Great tribulation, which means the trumpets in general occur during the Great tribulation. This is important because the beast that ascends out of the bottomless pit does not do so until the fifth trumpet, which means he is different than the Antichrist who is already in Power at the time. Most Prophecy scholars do not see this, nor understand this, and Like Oseas place the abomination of desolation in the middle of the final week.

You still have not answered my question on Romans 8. I am wondering how your view shows creation being delivered from the corruption of the fall?

 

[michaelvpardo]

I agree. The Uniformitarianism of science assumes constants, constant rates of decay, constant rates of erosion etc, in so doing they ignore the anomaly and the catastrophe. This also goes for other constants such as light speed.... When God said let there be light, there was light, instantaneously, this presumes that light speed has been decelerating since creation, Quickly at first, to where it is now, nearly at a constant.... a deceleration curve. Understanding this nullifies millions of light years for the age of the earth. (see link, Note this is a secular source)
Theory that challenges Einstein's physics could soon be put to the test

I Agree with you on Peleg as well and have noted that as well. Very few have seen this.

What all this does is throw into question the expected life of our sun (The sun shall not give its light) Which would result in the darkening of the moon as well, as per the sixth seal. When People start to see these things come to fruition, We will then see the "distress of nations", and "men's hearts failing them for fear" (Luke 21:23-24).... it is going to get to the point where you cannot explain it away with science, Even the "four pillars" of the that hold up the earth will be shaken... these are the four bonds that hold all matter together The 4 Fundamental Forces of Physics (thoughtco.com), As the "powers of heaven shall be shaken".

The four pillars

I had a small introduction to astrophysics while in university and was taught that stars "evolve" from one type to another as the concentration of elemental nuclei increase in a well described fusion of Hydrogen into Helium and then heavier more stable nuclei. I don't recollect how neutrons or electrons are supposed to be created, but the point is that the sun is supposed to change composition very gradually with consequent expansion of its diameter, a reduction in light emission, and an emission frequency shift to the red. Later changes are supposed to be an increased density of the solar core, consequent increase in gravitational flux, reduction in solar diameter, and slowing of the internal nuclear reactions as the core approaches the most stable nuclear configuration, that of iron.
According to the theory, our sun is supposed to be relatively young as determined by emission spectra, but emission spectra doesn't reveal elemental concentrations. My recollection of material I studied over 40 years ago is a bit suspect, but as I recall, the fusion cycles in the sun's core are supposed to change relatively abruptly and could theoretically cause relatively quick changes in solar emission intensity and frequency.
That said, cosmological theory, stellar genesis, theoretically requires very long periods of time, so "quick" transitions would still be lengthy to us.
One problem with the theory of solar elemental Genesis, as it was taught to me, was that iron should be the most common element in the universe, yet hydrogen appears to remain the most abundant. That problem is resolved by the assumption that the known universe is relatively young at around 9 billion years. My mind is unable to accept the concept of a young universe that is billions of years old, but that's what evolutionary theory requires. The very use of the word "evolution " to describe solar Genesis should be enough to make a person wary of the theory as it has absolutely nothing to do with Darwinian evolutionary theory other than allowing a very long period of time for random chance to accomplish what God did in 6 days.
My point though is that our understanding of nuclear physics and gravitational forces tells us that stars, including the sun, must be in a process of nuclear changes, some of which are quite sudden (as in the collapse of a star to become a nova or supernova.)
What the media doesn't tell us, what schools don't bother to teach kids, is that our planetary probes, our science, is telling us that the other planets in our solar system are warming up. It's not just our Earth, and the only possible explanation is either orbital changes or an increase in solar radiation at the lower end of the spectrum.
I don't know what kind of data was being collected by our latest solar probes, but the dynamics of the field interactions of plasmas in solar convective cells isn't fully understood or what role they play in solar metamorphosis, and some people are concerned.

 

[marks]

What the media doesn't tell us, what schools don't bother to teach kids, is that our planetary probes, our science, is telling us that the other planets in our solar system are warming up.

I've actually been seeing this reported in a few places!

Imagine my surprise!!

And BTW . . . you seem to have retained a lot!

Much love!

 

[marks]

I don't know how you can knock down a giant mud brick ziggurat and divide Noah's descendants up without some great cataclysm and moving land masses, but I'm open to suggestions.

Just dividing people into languages would, I think, insure that they will cease to work cooperatively. But I do think it likely there were still some tectonic changes going on, marsupials in Australia, and all that!

Much love!

 

[marks]

Possibly. There's evidence that the length of a year changed and possibly during "historic" times, and there is the Nemesis hypothesis, which isn't exactly unreasonable, but unprovable unless we find a massive dark body in a large eccentric orbit around the sun.

I think there's a good case to be made that the year used to be 360 days. I think that it will return to that following the cataclysm which begins the 70th week.

Much love!

 

[marks]

Matthew 24:22-23 KJV
22) And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.
23) Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.

Days less than 24 hours? Or fewer days?

Revelation 8:12 KJV
And the fourth angel sounded, and the third part of the sun was smitten, and the third part of the moon, and the third part of the stars; so as the third part of them was darkened, and the day shone not for a third part of it, and the night likewise.

16 hour days? Or 8 additional hours of darkness within the 24 hour day?

Revelation 16:10 KJV
And the fifth angel poured out his vial upon the seat of the beast; and his kingdom was full of darkness; and they gnawed their tongues for pain,

In this plague, the darkness is complete, what before was 1/3.

Also the bowl turns the whole ocean to blood. The trumpet was 1/3.

The bowl burns everywhere, the trumpet 1/3.

Much love!

 

[Truth7t7]

Theories of men are secondary to the word of God. I am not trying to rationalize the Spiritual here, but trying to show you how my eschatology is built and my timelines. In this case I am trying to show you how the fourth trumpet happens during the Great tribulation, which means the trumpets in general occur during the Great tribulation. This is important because the beast that ascends out of the bottomless pit does not do so until the fifth trumpet, which means he is different than the Antichrist who is already in Power at the time. Most Prophecy scholars do not see this, nor understand this, and Like Oseas place the abomination of desolation in the middle of the final week.

You still have not answered my question on Romans 8. I am wondering how your view shows creation being delivered from the corruption of the fall?

Dave I agree with Oseas, the Abomination of Desolation starts the 3.5 year tribulation, when the Antichrist is revealed in Jerusalem

Daniel 9:27 states the evil man will be present on earth to the consummation or ultimate end

Concerning the Beast of Revelation 17 we have discussed this and I disagree with your claim that he is different from the beast of Rev 13, hes the same human man, 7 heads and ten horns

Regarding Roman's 8, missed that question, post again

In Love, Jesus Is The Lord

 

[David H.]

Matthew 24:22-23 KJV
22) And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.
23) Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.

Days less than 24 hours? Or fewer days?

Revelation 8:12 KJV
And the fourth angel sounded, and the third part of the sun was smitten, and the third part of the moon, and the third part of the stars; so as the third part of them was darkened, and the day shone not for a third part of it, and the night likewise.

16 hour days? Or 8 additional hours of darkness within the 24 hour day?

Revelation 16:10 KJV
And the fifth angel poured out his vial upon the seat of the beast; and his kingdom was full of darkness; and they gnawed their tongues for pain,

In this plague, the darkness is complete, what before was 1/3.

Yes, i think it is days being shortened refers to 16 hour days... Notice "and the night likewise"

 

[David H.]

Regarding Roman's 8, missed that question, post again

Here is the passage:

For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God. For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope, Because the creature (Creation) itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God. For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now. And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body. (Romans 8:19-23, Parenthesis mine)

Here is the question.

Just curious how you view the Romans 8 passage that says creation will be delivered from the bondage of corruption. When does this occur in your eschatology?

 

[Truth7t7]

Here is the passage:

Here is the question.

Just curious how you view the Romans 8 passage that says creation will be delivered from the bondage of corruption. When does this occur in your eschatology?

The scripture you present Romans 8:19-23 clearly teaches it's the redemption of the mortal body, this glorified body will be received at the second coming, in the last day resurrection (The End)

Yes the whole creation will be New at the second coming, as the Lord returns in fire and final judgement, dissolving this earth by fire as you have been shown several times

Yes the Lamb will Lay with the Lion in the (Eternal Kingdom) in the New Heaven, Earth, Jerusalem, as seen in Isaiah chapters 11 & 65, After the Lords return as the New creation will be revealed

Behold I Make All Things New
Revelation 21:5

Romans 8:22-23KJV
22 For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.
23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.

As scripture clearly teaches below in 1 Corinthinas 15:23-24 , when Jesus Christ returns then comes (The End)

Many disregard (Then Cometh The End) as they desire to see a mortal Millennial Kingdom on earth, after the coming of Jesus Christ

afterward they that are Christ's at his coming. Then cometh the end, not a Millennial Kingdom on this earth as many falsely claim

(Then Cometh The End)

(Death Is Swallowed Up In Victory)

1 Corinthians 15:21-26 & 51-54KJV
21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.
22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

 

[Oseas]

This Post is about the fourth Trumpet and the shortening of the day and night by 1/3 and showing how this occurs durring the Great tribulation as an act of God's Mercy as shown in Matthew 24:22. How do you explain the shortening of the day by 1/3?

Please leave the endless bickering about whose eschatology is right to other posts, and stick to the topic of the post. Then we can learn from one another as opposed to condemning one another constantly. I do not agree with @Truth7t7 in his eschatology, But he is entitled to his opinion as are are you. When we discuss our opinions in a civil way and explain why we believe what we believe That is when dialogue happens as opposed to monologue.

Dodwell's theory is a from a secular scientist, who came to find that the ancient archeological sites that pointed to equinoxes and and solstices had a specific time when they began to be built. This date points directly to the Flood of Noah, According the dates for this deduced from scripture. This is no different than using Archeology found in Persia to determine the dates when event s happened to Israel such as Xerxes decrees to rebuild Jerusalem and the temple, which give historical credence to scripture. It is not about bringing "human perspective" into Spiritual prophecy.

So Yes, some events in revelation have a Spiritual meaning, and fulfillment but others are literal and Physical and ones we will experience in the natural world, and the fourth trumpet I believe is one of them. If you believe this has a Spiritual fulfillment of some sort please explain this. Do You feel the 1260 days of the great tribulation are shortened to less than that number of days? Or that the length of the days is shortened to somewhere around 16 hours which would be physically caused by the spin of the earth on its axis increasing accordingly?

David, I work with the Word of GOD and I must say that the "fourth trumpet" is not linked with Matt.24:v.22, and has nothing to do with the "shortening of day and night by 1/3" according to your imagination or speculation, or even opinion. By the Word of GOD-the Word is GOD- what you say in your post is clearly a mix of tares with wheat, the tares will be burned with everlasting fire in fulfillment of the Word of GOD.

Be sure that there will not be any physical phenomenon of shortening by 1/3 in the day and night as you are proposing, no, there will not be at all. Your interpretation has no biblical sense, but merely human conceptions and speculations that only please your ego, but not GOD, because GOD is the Truth, your interpretation and theory no.

The great Tribulation is linked to persecutions and great sufferings, and not to a physical phenomenons as you say according you posted, and linking them to the fouth trumpet.
In fact, mainly a small number of Israelites, servants of God, a remnant, they will be saved and delivered from the power of a false messiah -John 5:v.43 -, the MAN Beast of the earth like a lamb having two horns, and he speaks as Dragon-Revelation 13:v.11to18.
In fact, a false lamb, a false messiah, an IMPOSTOR, an esoteric, and kabbalistic, and spiritist messiah who will rule Israel and will be the main or principal guide of the esoteric, and kabbalistic, and spiritist Judaism.


By the way, the man Beast of earth -Rev.13:v.11 to 18- he already was born decades ago and must manifest himself in days to come, the coming of this satanic MAN is at door and will manifest before Christ coming.

Be careful, or get ready


P.S.
If all believers in JESUS, Jews and Gentiles, had to be raptured before the Great Tribulation, the Lord JESUS would not need to say everything He said in Matt.24:v.15 to 24 about persecutions and manifestation of false Christs(Antichrist, evidently), and warned the people in verse 25, saying: 25 Behold, I have told you before. (Before they happen, of course)

 

[Oseas]

Luke 20:v.35-36

35 But they which shall be accounted WORTHY to obtain that world (the Kingdom of GOD-third heavenly place in Christ), and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry, nor are given in marriage:

36 Neither can they die any more: for they are equal unto the angels; and are the children of God, being the children of the resurrection.

 

[Truth7t7]

By the way, the man Beast of earth -Rev.13:v.11 to 18- he already was born decades ago and must manifest himself in days to come, the coming of this satanic MAN is at door and will manifest before Christ coming.

There have been untold claims of who the future (The Man Beast) is, the Pope's, Rothschild's, Hitler, the king of Spain, Obama, Trump, on and on

Who is the (Man Beast) you claim was born decades ago, that will manifest himself in days to come?

 

[Oseas]

There have been untold claims of who the future (The Man Beast) is, the Pope's, Rothschild's, Hitler, the king of Spain, Obama, Trump, on and on

Who is the (Man Beast) you claim was born decades ago?

In the post is written this Beast will manifest yet
and he will be the main ruler of Israel as messiah. (a false messiah, of course)

In fact, mainly a small number of Israelites, servants of God, a remnant, they will be saved and delivered from the power of a false messiah -John 5:v.43 -, the MAN Beast of the earth like a lamb having two horns, and he speaks as Dragon-Revelation 13:v.11to18.
In fact, a false lamb, a false messiah, an IMPOSTOR, an esoteric, and kabbalistic, and spiritist messiah who will rule Israel and will be the main or principal guide of the esoteric, and kabbalistic, and spiritist Judaism.
By the way, the man Beast of earth -Rev.13:v.11 to 18- he already was born decades ago and must manifest himself in days to come, the coming of this satanic MAN is at door and will manifest before Christ coming.

Be careful, or get ready

 

[Truth7t7]

In the post is written this Beast will manifest yet
and he will be the main ruler of Israel as messiah. (a false messiah, of course)

Ok you claim this beast was born decades ago, once again who is it?

 

[Oseas]

Ok you claim this beast was born decades ago, once again who is it?

I have said the man Beast of the earth- the false messiah of the Jews - was already born decades ago, of course, because the time of his manifestation is geting, he will manifest in days to come, he will be revealed in his time as is written, it cannot be before, neither after, GOD is in control, nothing random happens.

Since he is at the age to manifest, but doesn't manifest because it is determined to happen in its own time, then he comes and goes in Israel, walking in secret, up and down, to and fro, among the people, but they don't know yet that this satanic man, the man of sin, son of perdition, he will manifest himself as their messiah.

When he manifest himself, the entire WORLD will be dazzled by the presence of a messiah in Israel, a false messiah, an IMPOSTOR, in fact a false Christ. The channel of Tv CNN mainly and of the whole world will show the manifestation of the false messiah.

Around the world, the Pastors, and Bichops, and Evangelists, among others, will preach in the pulpit of the Churches saying Christ(yeah Christ, NOT JESUS) CAME BACK, and a multitude of their followers also will preach saying Christ (NOT JESUS) RETURNED, and many will be deceived.

Be careful, or get ready

 

[Oseas]

Hear who has ear to hear.

Let no man deceive you by any means: for the Day shall not come, except there come...that man of sin, the son of perdition.
Who will oppose and exalt himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God will sit in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God. Check it in 2 Thes.2:v.3-4