The Elect and Predestination - the unfortunate implications

  • Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.

    You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Rockerduck

Well-Known Member
Nov 7, 2022
1,418
1,210
113
70
Marietta, Georgia.
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Problem is, hyper-Clavinists generally don't make a discernible distinction.



I guess the idea is that many (all?) are called but few are chosen, so to speak. That always seemed kinda backwards to me, but I'm getting used to and even comfortable with that as time passes. The LORD and I have this understanding/inside joke, if you will, that "I don't know jack." It helps me to be still and know that... You get the picture, of course.

An old preacher I really admired by the name of E.E. Cleveland used to say "We-e-ell, you know how the LORD is" whenever He would manifest His awesome power/wisdom in a special way.



My newly embraced, old-age curmudgeony is making it increasingly difficult for me to even entertain the usual arguments for odds-based atonement. I see the broad/many/narrow/few illustration more as representing the nature of wrothful children and the difficulty of parting with our cherished views. I don't know what could have ever possessed someone to see this as an "us-and-them" model except as they have never struggled with human nature and therefore simply "don't get it."

The whole idea that Christ was one of the "us" before Bethlehem and then cast His lot with the "them" (us-us) seems to up-end the whole notion of elitism, doesn't it?

I confess I'm quite literally losing my patience for people who state their soteriological cases in a dismissive, unyielding way. I'm not happy about it, but there it is. I especially have a problem with millennials and Gen-Xers who feel no need to show even the slightest bit of regard for their elders.

When I listen to someone older than myself offer some wisdom, I'm grateful enough for their going to the trouble of the gesture to be gracious in return unless, of course, they go out of their way to engage in some undignified rhetoric that contributes more to a problem than a solution.

But I've said too much.

:)
It was a nice discussion until you went on the attack.
 

Rockerduck

Well-Known Member
Nov 7, 2022
1,418
1,210
113
70
Marietta, Georgia.
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Why do you consider that an attack?

[
Your topic was good for a discussion. barney brought up hyper c., and not a good description. I appreciated the non-C discussion. The bible canon was available way before Calvin. Those that agree with predestination are Christians too. We must respect another Christian's views.
 
  • Like
Reactions: St. SteVen

St. SteVen

Well-Known Member
Feb 5, 2023
11,002
4,517
113
69
Minneapolis
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Your topic was good for a discussion. barney brought up hyper c., and not a good description. I appreciated the non-C discussion. The bible canon was available way before Calvin. Those that agree with predestination are Christians too. We must respect another Christian's views.
Fair enough, thanks.
Were you able to adequately present your position?
How would you summarize?

[
 

Rockerduck

Well-Known Member
Nov 7, 2022
1,418
1,210
113
70
Marietta, Georgia.
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Fair enough, thanks.
Were you able to adequately present your position?
How would you summarize?

[
I do find that when we read the bible, we have our individual experiences, that we view God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit. As we read the Word of God, it seems to support our views to a degree. These degrees overlap and Christians can all agree on most doctrines. :) So, discussions can be lively, but no, my way or the highway. I have belief views that are unchangeable, but I recognize others views as well.
 
  • Like
Reactions: St. SteVen