"The heavens and the earth" were "created"--"WITHOUT FORM."

[ElieG12]

Why do you speculate so?

Unfortunately, your definition of "without form", is sorely lacking...as if to say God did not speak the earth it into being.

But no, it does not say, "In the beginning God remodeled the earth."

Long before creating a planet to inhabit it with living beings, there were places in the heavens that are invisible to our eyes and where millions of beings live in the form of spirits.

The earth was part of many astral bodies that fill the material Universe, of which we do not know what use they have for invisible spirits.

When God decided to create humans, he took the planet Earth, which was one of many millions of celestial bodies. This planet that already existed, created before of course, was chosen to fill it with life. God took it as it was before, molded it, adapted it, added details to it, ... until he filled it with life.

I am not inventing anything: if you do not know the order in which things appeared in the universe, you probably do not understand what Genesis 1:1 means.

 

[ScottA]

Long before creating a planet to inhabit it with living beings, there were places in the heavens that are invisible to our eyes and where millions of beings live in the form of spirits.

The earth was part of many astral bodies that fill the material Universe, of which we do not know what use they have for invisible spirits.

When God decided to create humans, he took the planet Earth, which was one of many millions of celestial bodies. This planet that already existed, created before of course, was chosen to fill it with life. God took it as it was before, molded it, adapted it, added details to it, ... until he filled it with life.

I am not inventing anything: if you do not know the order in which things appeared in the universe, you probably do not understand what Genesis 1:1 means.

You are speculating.

 

[ElieG12]

Don't hold me responsible for your lack of understanding about the cosmos' structure. Your perspective is limited to "planet Earth," while God is the Creator of the entire Universe, encompassing all stars, galaxies, galaxy clusters, and beyond. You're simply a grain of sand in some tiny corner... all nations are.

 

[ScottA]

Don't hold me responsible for your lack of understanding about the cosmos' structure. Your perspective is limited to "planet Earth," while God is the Creator of the entire Universe, encompassing all stars, galaxies, galaxy clusters, and beyond. You're simply a grain of sand in some tiny corner... all nations are.

I was speaking of and from the perspective of beyond all the created universe.

 

[ProDeo]

You are speculating.

@ElieG12 is not speculating at all, it is amazing Gen 1:1-2 (as old as it was written down) is in full sync with modern cosmology.

The question remains why in this way, the darkness.....

1John 1:5 This is the message we have heard from him and proclaim to you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.

Is it possible the darkness stands symbol for something?​

 

[ScottA]

@ElieG12 is not speculating at all, it is amazing Gen 1:1-2 (as old as it was written down) is in full sync with modern cosmology.

The reason I answered the way I did...is because I have not been speaking of "cosmology" per se, but rather posing the unavoidable question that in very few words God has declared from the beginning by saying what the world/universe is not.

 

[ElieG12]

... the earth was without form before creation--instead of the way it is written and declared from the beginning?

... but are you ready...or even willing?

After its creation, the earth was "formless and void," resembling a meteor or asteroid. Even the planets we recognize today are unlike our planet once it was reformed to support "physical" life.

If imagining the earth before its transformation is challenging, consider a rock. Though rocks are irregular and barren, they were originally made in that state and still they are perfect creations of God.

It appears you're not quite open to "be corrected". This might be a tough reality for someone who expects others to agree with their viewpoint.

 

[ScottA]

a meteor or asteroid

Neither of those are "formless."

Why do you keep digging that hole deeper?

 

[ProDeo]

The reason I answered the way I did...is because I have not been speaking of "cosmology" per se, but rather posing the unavoidable question that in very few words God has declared from the beginning by saying what the world/universe is not.

Hence my question about the darkness the earth was in, as we read -

1John 1:5 This is the message we have heard from him and proclaim to you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.

Is it possible the darkness stands symbol for something??

Who is totally darkness?, the devil, responsible for the first sin.

Gen 1:3 And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light.

God creating a place fit for the purpose to deal with the devil and deal with human sin.

 

[ScottA]

Hence my question about the darkness the earth was in, as we read -

1John 1:5 This is the message we have heard from him and proclaim to you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.

Is it possible the darkness stands symbol for something??

Who is totally darkness?, the devil, responsible for the first sin.

Gen 1:3 And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light.

God creating a place fit for the purpose to deal with the devil and deal with human sin.

God has indeed created a place with the universe for the purpose of dealing with sin.

However, as for darkness: There is no darkness in God, also described as "no shadow of turning", because it is Time that makes for the darkness. Briefly, in order to beget a Son of many sons, born of His spirit--meant the dividing of Himself--and eternity, into increments of time wherein each comes forth--as Paul said, "but each one in his own order" (or time). It is then that from the power of God and light in creation, that matter was created (giving the earth and all that is in it, "form." It is matter/form then that has cast the shadows of darkness. But eternity divided into increments of time did something else also: It created the gulf or void between God and man and this world. Which is made manifest--as proof, by Space. Thus the creation of Space, Time, and Matter.

In the fulness of time, then comes the end--the end of the divide and gulf, the end of times, and the end of darkness.

 

[ProDeo]

So no spiritual meaning of - The earth was without form and void, and darkness... according to you?

While when God creates the new heavens, new earth and new Jerusalem it's all about light and splendor.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

So no spiritual meaning of - The earth was without form and void, and darkness... according to you?

Consider 1 John 1:5 This is the message we have heard from him and proclaim to you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.

To me it’s necessary to consider what is written and to at least consider with a shift in perspective, I’ve found repeatedly it’s the perspective and at any time a perspective can change.
“God is Light, and in him is no darkness.”
There are lots of verses that help with a perspective of how there is no darkness in Him.

“God is Light, and in Him is no darkness”
Consider I wear corrective eyeglasses to see through. I have a horrible stigmatism. It has destroyed how I see things off in the distance. I can see well enough up close, but seeing a far off my eye sight is blurred to where I can’t even make out trees have leaves on them. You may say what does this have to do with “God is Light, and in Him there is no darkness.” ? Maybe nothing but I’m going with the thought because I’m trying to help with Romans 14:5 One man esteems one day above another: another esteems every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.

We repeat this when needing the reminder “God works all things together for His purpose in those who love Him.”

In Him …there is no more darkness. Although Mans heart was in darkness and man knew Him not (having this stigmatism—as not a splinter but a beam in his own eyes—they could not see a far off the coming of the Lord. Where He is not far off, but has come near unto you.

We also have the verses where if the eye is darkness, then the whole body is full of darkness. But if the eye be light, then the whole body is full of Light.

“God is Light, and in him is no darkness.”
Psalm 139:6-12 Such knowledge is too wonderful for me; it is high, I cannot attain unto it. [7] Where will I go from Your spirit? (Who was it that He asked, will you also go away No, Lord for to whom shall we go when you hold Life?) or where will I flee from your presence? [8] If I ascend up into heaven, You are there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, You are there. [9] If I take the wings of the morning, and dwell in the uttermost parts of the sea; [10] Even there shall your hand lead me, and Your right hand shall hold me. [11] If I say, Surely the darkness shall cover me; even the night shall be light about me. [12] Yea, the darkness hides not from You; but the night shines as the day: the darkness and the light are both alike to You.

In God there is no darkness: but the night shines as day: the darkness and the light are both alike to You.
To me is perspective. Where first there is as the world that now is, where there is a hierarchy of pride, arrogance and exalting one against another. I get it speaks of days, but in the whole context it is debates and squabbles and slander of Should one eat or should one not eat, and which is better? Where one lifts one high against the other.
Romans 14:5 One man esteems one day above another: another esteems every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.
^yet the “another esteems every day alike. It reminds me of Paul saying I’ve been instructed to be content whether I’m abased or abounding, I’ve been instructed to be both: hungry and full.

Maybe all that is rambling but I am persuaded it is better to not exalt one day against another, but instructed in both to be satisfied. To me how God sees is for sure not as man sees, where man’s eyes having darkness is full of darkness, being eaten up with it. That is scary. Because is that How God sees when in God there is no darkness, but every day is alike to Him. Both darkness and Light are alike to Him. Philippians 4:6-9 Be careful for nothing; but in every thing by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known unto God. [7] And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus. [8] Finally, brothers, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.(yet I forget it, how He says “I know the good things I have prepared for you, I know My thoughts towards you to do good and not evil ) [9] Those things, which you have both learned(remember Paul was instructed and taught to be content, learning both to be satisfied and hungry), and received, and heard, and seen in me, do: and the God of peace shall be with you.

That is SOOO confusing instructed to be both satisfied and hungry. Sounds like instructed to be both Light and dark. It can’t be though…but instead it’s esteeming both alike, as in the passages concerning esteeming one day above another or esteeming both alike: the Word says both days, whether to eat or not eat give thanks unto God.

 

[ScottA]

So no spiritual meaning of - The earth was without form and void, and darkness... according to you?

While when God creates the new heavens, new earth and new Jerusalem it's all about light and splendor.

As it is written, "darkness" came after creation, as did "form." As I explained, it was by and from the power of God (energy) and light (light), that "form" (matter), which is the cause of "darkness."

As it is also written (man being made of the same elements as the universe): the elements return to the earth and the spirit returns to God who gave it. Which is to say, that as man is as a seed planted in the flesh that dies and then is raised up a new spiritual creation--the same is true of the greater elements of this worldly heavens and earth. Yes. leaving no shadow of darkness, for the man born of the spirit returns to God and is One, with no shadow-casting division between, as exists in the times of men and this world.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

God has indeed created a place with the universe for the purpose of dealing with sin.

However, as for darkness: There is no darkness in God, also described as "no shadow of turning", because it is Time that makes for the darkness. Briefly, in order to beget a Son of many sons, born of His spirit--meant the dividing of Himself--and eternity, into increments of time wherein each comes forth--as Paul said, "but each one in his own order" (or time). It is then that from the power of God and light in creation, that matter was created (giving the earth and all that is in it, "form." It is matter/form then that has cast the shadows of darkness. But eternity divided into increments of time did something else also: It created the gulf or void between God and man and this world. Which is made manifest--as proof, by Space. Thus the creation of Space, Time, and Matter.

In the fulness of time, then comes the end--the end of the divide and gulf, the end of times, and the end of darkness.

Lol I’m not laughing at what you shared. I’m laughing because Jonah is so peculiar.

With your understanding of shadow, form and time. And what you are trying to share in this topic/thread. what you think of: Jonah 4:5-11, ‘So Jonah went out of the city, and sat on the east side of the city, and there made him a booth, and sat under it in the shadow, till he might see what would become of the city. [6] And the LORD God prepared a gourd, and made it to come up over Jonah, that it might be a shadow over his head, to deliver him from his grief. So Jonah was exceeding glad of the gourd. [7] But God prepared a worm when the morning rose the next day, and it smote the gourd that it withered. [8] And it came to pass, when the sun did arise, that God prepared a vehement east wind; and the sun beat upon the head of Jonah, that he fainted, and wished in himself to die, and said, It is better for me to die than to live. [9] And God said to Jonah, Do you well to be angry for the gourd? And he said, I do well to be angry, even unto death. [10] Then said the LORD, You have had pity on the gourd, for the which you have not labored, neither made it grow; which came up in a night, and perished in a night: [11] And should not I spare Nineveh, that great city, wherein are more than sixscore thousand persons that cannot discern between their right hand and their left hand; and also much cattle?’

 

[ScottA]

Lol I’m not laughing at what you shared. I’m laughing because Jonah is so peculiar.

With your understanding of shadow, form and time. And what you are trying to share in this topic/thread. what you think of: Jonah 4:5-11, ‘So Jonah went out of the city, and sat on the east side of the city, and there made him a booth, and sat under it in the shadow, till he might see what would become of the city. [6] And the LORD God prepared a gourd, and made it to come up over Jonah, that it might be a shadow over his head, to deliver him from his grief. So Jonah was exceeding glad of the gourd. [7] But God prepared a worm when the morning rose the next day, and it smote the gourd that it withered. [8] And it came to pass, when the sun did arise, that God prepared a vehement east wind; and the sun beat upon the head of Jonah, that he fainted, and wished in himself to die, and said, It is better for me to die than to live. [9] And God said to Jonah, Do you well to be angry for the gourd? And he said, I do well to be angry, even unto death. [10] Then said the LORD, You have had pity on the gourd, for the which you have not labored, neither made it grow; which came up in a night, and perished in a night: [11] And should not I spare Nineveh, that great city, wherein are more than sixscore thousand persons that cannot discern between their right hand and their left hand; and also much cattle?’

You got it!