The Holy Spirit

[[email protected]]

Well, I was with you, until you stated that Hell is the opposite of heaven and you started adding levels to both. Do you have any verses to back up those ideas?

His use of the term 'level' did not apply to spiritual divisions. It was meant to illustrate a point.

Since you raised the subject and question of levels of heaven, here is your answer.

3

There are three heavens and hell is not the opposite of paradise.
Hell is destruction, as different as a multi-storied apartment house is from a forest fire.

There aren't levels as in a video game. One doesn't progress from one to the other by shooting bad guys with a gun or by reciting lines from an ancient book.

The idea of 'levels' of heaven and hell comes from Dante Aguileri's book THE DIVINE COMEDY in which his poetic fiction created nine levels of hell and seven of heaven.
In his poem, the main character was taken on a fanciful tour of these areas. Unfortunately, a lot of people took the work seriously and accepted it as some sort of ridiculous spiritual vision.
For example, one of Dante's images of torture in hell/The Inferno is to be buried upside down in the dirt and to have someone press a burning iron on one's feet.
The image was adapted by George Lucas in his movie The Return of the Jedi where a small robot suffered the same sort of torment in Jabba the Hut's castle.

In reality, the Bible states in multiple places that there are three heavens.
See the book of Exodus for detailed descriptions of the origional pattern.

The design of the tabernacle as well as the temple of Solomon in Jerusalem (see Kings for that one) and the temple of Herod (see the gospels) serves as a template for spiritual heavenlies.
St. Paul later confirmed it when he testified that he knew of a man who had been caught up to the third heaven.
The book of Revelation also mentions it when it describes the great war in heaven between Michael and the Dragon.

The first heaven is outside the tabernacle/temple. That's where everybody lives, meets and works.
The second heaven is inside the walls or curtains of the temple/tabernacle. Only the people of God are admitted there. Everyone else is excluded.
The third heaven is the Holy of Holies. Only the high priest was admitted there, and then only once a year.

When Jesus died the curtain that divided the Holy of Holies from the inner court was ripped in two. In this way, God declared that all those in the court of the temple (second heaven) would be allowed access to God directly in the Holy of Holies (third heaven).
Such access is still rare and only allowed on occasion, but it is allowed and it is possible. No special priest, ordinance, or ceremony is necessary.
Note that those who are not the people of God are still excluded from fellowship with God in the Holy of Holies. They only know of God by rumor and by testimony of God's people.

The first heaven is the place where demons and unclean spirits live. (See the book of Revelation).
Following the great war in the third heaven, the great dragon and its followers were cast down to the earth (first heaven) where the Bible says the war continues.

Those who lose the war upon earth are imprisoned for a time or are destroyed forever.
Prisons, fire and the cemetary have no 'levels'. They are unique and/or permanent acording to their separate purpose.

This is the general Biblical pattern of the spiritual world.
One is free, of course, to accept a ficticous notion such as that presented by Dante or comic book stories.
However, one should be aware that the difference between fact and fantasy may result in a terrifying or joyous eternity as the case may be.

 

[mjrhealth]

Lets just see what Jesus had to say,

Mat 11:29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.

Joh 6:35 And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst.

Joh 6:48 I am that bread of life.
Joh 6:49 Your fathers did eat manna in the wilderness, and are dead.
Joh 6:50 This is the bread which cometh down from heaven, that a man may eat thereof, and not die.
Joh 6:51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.

Joh 10:7 Then said Jesus unto them again, Verily, verily, I say unto you, I am the door of the sheep.

Joh 10:9 I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture.

Joh 10:14 I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine.

Joh 11:25 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:

Joh 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.


Jesus is calling all men to Himself, He gave us the holy spirirt to lead us into the truth and teach us things to come, He never sent anyone to anbody else, except to show what He had done, ie the lepors to the pharisees ,

What is wrong with Jesus, that you cannot follow Him alone, would your faith die if you didnt have a bible, what is your faith in.

1Jn 5:6 This is he that came by water and blood, even Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth.
1Jn 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
1Jn 5:8 And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.
1Jn 5:9 If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater: for this is the witness of God which he hath testified of his Son.
1Jn 5:10 He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son.
1Jn 5:11 And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.
1Jn 5:12 He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.

This is how we judge what is truth, for they all agree with one another, and are not open to interpretaion by no man.

In His Love

 

[amadeus]

A conspicuous absence of scripture always leads to errors in judgment, lies and immoral behaviour.

THE WAGES OF SIN IS DEATH.
Romans 6:23

In case you didn't notice, there was scripture in my post, which you failed to quote here. My point in any case is that man doesn't have to "work" his way into hell [although he can do so.]. The place is already his if he fails to believe in the Son of God. Death is wages for wrongful work, but it could also be wages for laziness or apathy or selfishness or do nothingness.

[email protected]: Wages are the reward for work or the result of it.
One has to WORK for sin and the result of it is eternal separation/spiritual death.

No, a person can be a lazy couch potato and get the wages of death for his lack of effort.

[email protected]:The intent of the scripture here is to show that humans actively and purposely seek damnation.
It's called rebellion and sin.

My point again is that while a person may active engaged in committing sin, it is not necessary to do anything to be condemned. The condemnation is already there for anyone who does nothing at all. He simply does not believe in the name of the only begotten Son of God!

"He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already , because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God." John 3:18

[email protected]: A perfect example of it is the way posts on these pages deny God's righteous judgment and seek any and every way to justify themselves and their sin.

You are speaking to the wrong audience my friend. I began on the bottom of the heap and the only time I rise above that point is when and if God gives be a boost. If He doesn't give the increase, there is no increase for me or anyone else!

" I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase.

So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase." I Cor 3:6-7

[email protected]: God opposes it, punishes it in the world and destroys it after death.
There is an opportunity provided to turn away from it and to be forgiven of it, but there is NEVER an excuse for it nor an allowance for it.

Where is it that I disagreed with what you have said here?

[email protected]:God does not wink at sin.

I agree!

[email protected]: When a man vehemently pursues sin all his life and works at rejecting God's efforts at redemption and forgivness all his life he earns the reward he has so strenuously sought - HELL.

I agree, but there are some that are not so active as all that. They simply don't do anything at all to acknowledge God's Lordship and for their lack of effort they receive also death. As a matter of fact, they are already dead.. while they are still walking around! They simply never receive Life!

"... Follow me; and let the dead bury their dead." Matt 8:22

[email protected]: Hell is worse than prison or human perceptions of torture.
Hell is death; the loss of God and God's blessings including that which we call the self image.

There is no I in hell. The self is completely destroyed and lost.
That which is destroyed has NO opportunity to be restored. It is gone forever.
Earth is the place for second chances. Once earth is lost, so too is the opportunity for salvation lost.

"... the night cometh, when no man can work." John 9:4

[email protected]: Jesus said:"He who has found his life shall lose it, and he who has lost his life for My sake, shall find it."
- Math 10:39

Amen!

"Pray with ceasing"

"Rejoice in the Lord alway!"

 

[TexUs]

The fruits of one’s teachings will let us know if one is following God or not.

Unless those teachings contradict the teachings in the Bible. The "fruits" of one's teachings seem to suggest you mean as long as people hear the message and go out and be "good", that person is legit?
Scripture disagrees.


Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’


I do agree that yes, a person's fruit should be tested and examined in order to test the legitimacy, but it is not by our judgement but by God's: the Bible. It is our measuring stick, not our human perceptions.

The bible says: (Matthew 5:39) “You have learnt how it was said: ‘Eye for eye and tooth for tooth.’ But I say this to you: offer the wicked man no resistance.” But man has twisted that Word so as to allow man to kill?

Man has twisted the Word to mean "do not harm anyone for any reason".

The FACTs are that the first century church- the one that actually saw Christ- didn't read this and understand it as pacifism. We see Christians in war, we know of first century tomb stones with both professions to Christ AND military rank on them, etc.

Killing is OK if it's just. Murder is not. Most pacifists love to interpret it wrong but make no mistake, murder is the proper translation.
Killing is OK if you can save your family by shooting an intruder in self-defense. Shooting a random person on the street (murder) is not OK.

I wonder how a conversation between you and God would go if you let your family be raped, tortured, and killed in the name of pacifism.

What is wrong with Jesus, that you cannot follow Him alone, would your faith die if you didnt have a bible, what is your faith in.

1Jn 5:6 This is he that came by water and blood, even Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth.
1Jn 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
1Jn 5:8 And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.
1Jn 5:9 If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater: for this is the witness of God which he hath testified of his Son.
1Jn 5:10 He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son.
1Jn 5:11 And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.
1Jn 5:12 He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.

This is how we judge what is truth, for they all agree with one another, and are not open to interpretaion by no man.

That entire passage is talking about men teaching something contrary to the gospel (IE, the testimony of men, not the testimony of God).
You also omitted the next verse:
"I write these things to you"... Apparently, the Apostle thought it was necessary to provide the church a written testimony stating such things so they can weigh it against what they're told.

 

[Thankful 1]

[/color][/b]
Unless those teachings contradict the teachings in the Bible. The "fruits" of one's teachings seem to suggest you mean as long as people hear the message and go out and be "good", that person is legit?
Scripture disagrees.


Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’


I do agree that yes, a person's fruit should be tested and examined in order to test the legitimacy, but it is not by our judgement but by God's: the Bible. It is our measuring stick, not our human perceptions.


Man has twisted the Word to mean "do not harm anyone for any reason".

The FACTs are that the first century church- the one that actually saw Christ- didn't read this and understand it as pacifism. We see Christians in war, we know of first century tomb stones with both professions to Christ AND military rank on them, etc.

Killing is OK if it's just. Murder is not. Most pacifists love to interpret it wrong but make no mistake, murder is the proper translation.
Killing is OK if you can save your family by shooting an intruder in self-defense. Shooting a random person on the street (murder) is not OK.

I wonder how a conversation between you and God would go if you let your family be raped, tortured, and killed in the name of pacifism.


That entire passage is talking about men teaching something contrary to the gospel (IE, the testimony of men, not the testimony of God).
You also omitted the next verse:
"I write these things to you"... Apparently, the Apostle thought it was necessary to provide the church a written testimony stating such things so they can weigh it against what they're told.

(Matthew7:21-23) “It is not those who say to me, ‘Lord, Lord’, who will enter the kingdom of Heaven but the person who does the will of My Father in Heaven. When the day comes many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, cast out demons in your name, work many miracles inyour name?’ Then I shall tell them totheir faces: I have never known you; away from me, you evil men!”



The will of our Father is to produce good fruits, to obey his Word.



Jesus told us to love our enemies.



Christians up until Constantine the Great were pacifist.



Remember this:

(1 John 3: 5 - 6) “ Now you know that He appeared in order to abolish sin, and that in Him there is no sin; anyone who lives in God does not sin, and anyone who sins has never seen Him or known Him.”



(1 John 3:8) “He who does what is sinful is of the devil, because the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the devil's work”



Ask yourself: did your teacher who taught you about God sin? If your teacher or teachers did sin then you were taught about God by the devil.

 

[veteran]

Luke 22:35-38
35 And He said unto them, When I sent you without purse, and scrip, and shoes, lacked ye any thing? And they said, Nothing.
36 Then said He unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.
37 For I say unto you, that this that is written must yet be accomplished in Me, And he was reckoned among the transgressors: for the things concerning Me have an end.
38 And they said, Lord, behold, here are two swords. And He said unto them, It is enough.
(KJV)

The second time Jesus sent His disciples out to preach The Gospel, He told them to go buy a sword if they didn't have one.

Deception is what happens when we fail to read ALL of God's Word to get a complete picture. It's obvious by that Luke 22 example our Lord Jesus did not intend for His disciples to ultimately give up their God-given inalienable right to self-defense.

 

[veteran]

His use of the term 'level' did not apply to spiritual divisions. It was meant to illustrate a point.

Since you raised the subject and question of levels of heaven, here is your answer.

3

There are three heavens and hell is not the opposite of paradise.
Hell is destruction, as different as a multi-storied apartment house is from a forest fire.

There aren't levels as in a video game. One doesn't progress from one to the other by shooting bad guys with a gun or by reciting lines from an ancient book.

The idea of 'levels' of heaven and hell comes from Dante Aguileri's book THE DIVINE COMEDY in which his poetic fiction created nine levels of hell and seven of heaven.
In his poem, the main character was taken on a fanciful tour of these areas. Unfortunately, a lot of people took the work seriously and accepted it as some sort of ridiculous spiritual vision.
For example, one of Dante's images of torture in hell/The Inferno is to be buried upside down in the dirt and to have someone press a burning iron on one's feet.
The image was adapted by George Lucas in his movie The Return of the Jedi where a small robot suffered the same sort of torment in Jabba the Hut's castle.

In reality, the Bible states in multiple places that there are three heavens.
See the book of Exodus for detailed descriptions of the origional pattern.

The design of the tabernacle as well as the temple of Solomon in Jerusalem (see Kings for that one) and the temple of Herod (see the gospels) serves as a template for spiritual heavenlies.
St. Paul later confirmed it when he testified that he knew of a man who had been caught up to the third heaven.
The book of Revelation also mentions it when it describes the great war in heaven between Michael and the Dragon.

The first heaven is outside the tabernacle/temple. That's where everybody lives, meets and works.
The second heaven is inside the walls or curtains of the temple/tabernacle. Only the people of God are admitted there. Everyone else is excluded.
The third heaven is the Holy of Holies. Only the high priest was admitted there, and then only once a year.

When Jesus died the curtain that divided the Holy of Holies from the inner court was ripped in two. In this way, God declared that all those in the court of the temple (second heaven) would be allowed access to God directly in the Holy of Holies (third heaven).
Such access is still rare and only allowed on occasion, but it is allowed and it is possible. No special priest, ordinance, or ceremony is necessary.
Note that those who are not the people of God are still excluded from fellowship with God in the Holy of Holies. They only know of God by rumor and by testimony of God's people.

The first heaven is the place where demons and unclean spirits live. (See the book of Revelation).
Following the great war in the third heaven, the great dragon and its followers were cast down to the earth (first heaven) where the Bible says the war continues.

Those who lose the war upon earth are imprisoned for a time or are destroyed forever.
Prisons, fire and the cemetary have no 'levels'. They are unique and/or permanent acording to their separate purpose.

This is the general Biblical pattern of the spiritual world.
One is free, of course, to accept a ficticous notion such as that presented by Dante or comic book stories.
However, one should be aware that the difference between fact and fantasy may result in a terrifying or joyous eternity as the case may be.

I've got to somewhat disagree with that, even though Gen.1:1 "heaven" is plural in the Hebrew, for there's only two different dimensions of existence proclaimed in God's Word, this earthly dimension and the heavenly dimension which exists behind a veil.

I agree Dante's inference was wrong too, for he obviously had gotten his info from the Cabalists who believe in over 7 planes of existence, this earthly being one of them.

Taylor is right, a deeper Bible study on the idea of heaven and hell reveals that 'hell' is a heavenly abode for the wicked, not the lake of fire. Per Rev.20:14, the abode of hell goes into the "lake of fire". It reveals hell is indeed a place of separation in the heavenly away from God, like our Lord Jesus showed in the story of Lazarus and the rich man in Luke 16.

After Christ's return that abode of hell will still exist for the wicked, but our Lord called it the "outer darkness". It apparently has different levels of separation, for it includes Satan's prison that he is locked into. In Rev.22:14-15 our Lord described the place where the wicked will be as being outside the gates of the holy city. That holy city is on the earth at that time per Rev.20:9.

So it's not really about different 'levels' like dimensions, but more like different levels of separation away from God's Presence, which is the Tabernacle pattern.

For Christ's thousand years reign, the heavenly dimension in part is going to be revealed right here on this earth, with the "beloved city" and "camp of the saints" existing right here on earth where Jerusalem is, and with the temple, tree of life, and God's River which Ezekiel was given to write about. But after the lake of fire event when Satan and the abode of hell and wicked are destroyed, the heavenly is going to be fully revealed on earth, with a renewed heaven and earth, made perfect for God's Eternal Kingdom. It's that final manifestation which is the one Apostle Paul was talking about with the "third heaven" idea (new heavens and a new earth). The heavens plural refer to both God's covering around the earth in that future time, and the heavenly cube that will stretch out from the New Jerusalem on earth.

 

[TexUs]

Christians up until Constantine the Great were pacifist.

Including Christ, right? After trashing the temple?
Or what about his final bloodshed with blood running in the streets during the last days?


Let me ask you a question. When, in Luke 3:14, the soldiers talk to John the Baptist, he doesn't scold them for being soldiers. He tells them to go on as usual but be content with what they earn.
Why was there no great uproar over Christians in the military, if this was supposedly such a sure thing?
Why are the earliest writers, such as Polycarp, mum on the issue of military service?
Why does one make the assumption the church suddenly fell from pacifism because of one emperor? These same people who were boiled in oil and hung upside down on their crosses- were so convinced and convicted of what they believed they'd DIE for it, suddenly fell away from pacifism? I'm sorry but history doesn't support this anywhere.
Why would God change? Speak about going to war with Israel on one hand but against personal vengeance on the other- wouldn't you have to maintain that he CHANGED?


In any regard, pacifists like you have VASTLY overstated your case for it- because there was no condemnation on pacifism. At most it was something that was largely seen as a non-issue or indifferent.


That said, consider these additional facts.
Origen was a pacifist because of his personal beliefs. Yet often ignored by Pacifists, wrote such things in his prayer diary: For those fighting in a righteous cause, and for the King who reigns righteously, that whatsoever is opposed to those who act righteously be destroyed.
Tertullian was your biggest pacifist, I'd say, and yet while he opposed military (because of the idolatrous circumstances, is what most pacifists ignore), did the same: Without ceasing, for all our emperors, we offer prayer. We pray for life prolonged; for security to the empire; for protection to the imperial house; for brave armies….


If these men were opposed to war in principle, why did they support it?


So again- all these serves to show you that pacifists have vastly overstated their case.
Onward to reality.
We know of at least 8 pre-Constantine tombstones, Christian, which identify the believers as in the military.
The armies of the East were largely Christian around 303AD (Pre-Constantine)
Eusebius records history of Christian soldiers who died because of their faith.
Armenia was one of the first churches. The Apostles Thaddeus and Bartholomew preached there. Armenia was the first Christian nation. When forced to renounce Christianity in 312AD, what did they do? They took up arms and defeated the Roman army, is what they did.
Eusebius records Christian soldiers praying for battle for rain, and the armies received rain and they thanked God for it.
Even in the Apocrypha, Jesus is portrayed as striking someone dead. I realize it is not Scripture but the question is still... If the early church was truly pacifist, why are we finding all of these accounts? It means people clearly did not view Christ as pacifist.




I can go on and on. There's a distinct lack of evidence for Pacifism in the early church. Pacifists vastly overstate their case while also being flat out WRONG when it comes to hard evidence like archeological discoveries and historical documents.

 

[TexUs]

Ask yourself: did your teacher who taught you about God sin? If your teacher or teachers did sin then you were taught about God by the devil.

Spreading a gospel contrary to what was preached (ooohhh, like... Christians must be perfect) leads to a curse from God so all I've got to say is be ready when you meet him face to face.



But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed. As we have said before, so now I say again: If anyone is preaching to you a gospel contrary to the one you received, let him be accursed.


What is the gospel? Paul tells us later on in the letter


yet we know that[sup](AD)[/sup] a person is not justified[sup][a][/sup] by works of the law[sup](AE)[/sup] but through faith in Jesus Christ, so we also have believed in Christ Jesus, in order to be justified by faith in Christ and not by works of the law,[sup](AF)[/sup] because by works of the law no one will be justified.


Doesn't stop there, he even goes on to call people foolish who incorporate works into their salvation


O foolish Galatians! Who has bewitched you?[sup](A)[/sup] It was before your eyes that Jesus Christ was publicly[sup](B)[/sup]portrayed as crucified. [sup]2[/sup]Let me ask you only this:[sup](C)[/sup] Did you receive the Spirit by works of the law or by[sup](D)[/sup] hearing with faith?


And even more


For all who rely on works of the law are[sup](N)[/sup] under a curse; for it is written,[sup](O)[/sup] "Cursed be everyone who does not[sup](P)[/sup]abide by all things written in the Book of the Law, and do them." Now it is evident that[sup](Q)[/sup] no one is justified before God by the law, for[sup](R)[/sup] "The righteous shall live by faith."


I realize this will fall on deaf ears but you must ask yourself if you are WRONG (Let's face it, you've never once addressed any texts contrary to your view)- what will the punishment be for someone departing from the gospel.

 

[th1b.taylor]

Out of nine forums, only this one has taken this, same, post and fallen into pointless argument, So0me have found positive and fruitful discussion and in one forum there is even enlightenment taking place, but here, you fight?

Veteran, thanks for your insight, it is right on! I'm going to assume that you are as you have chosen to be known and shout, GARY OWEN to you and God bless from an old Cavalryman with a couple of medals.

 

[Rach1370]

You all dont get it do you, Jesus said it Himself,

Joh 5:39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.
Joh 5:40 And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life.

See what studying the bible has done, brought all these foolish arguements and bickering, What is it hat Christ has to do, to get your attention, was it not enough that He die on the cross for you all, was it not enought that He gaves us the Holy Spirit to teach us and gude us into the truth, that you have to believe that God would give us a book so we could study it then spend our lives destroying one another with words, how stupid do we think God is. The written word cannot bring you life, ony Jesus can, and as long as you keep yourself from Him you will; never grow. I can never deny the word for Jesus is Gods word, and as He says, " the words thta I SPEAK they are spirit and they are life, The written word is just that, an ink stain on a piece of paper that will fade in time, but Gods word which is spirit will never fail".

In His Love

Is it just me, or does anyone else find this a little funny? "Don't read the Bible....the Bible says so".
mjrhealth tells us we are foolish and untrue to read the bible, but then he quotes from it himself?

Strange times.

 

[Rach1370]

I disagree that the bible is the only way one can know if a teaching is from God or not.
The bible was not assembled for many years after Jesus ascended into Heaven.
The fruits of one’s teachings will let us know if one is following God or not.

I don't necessarily disagree with these statements. God is sovereign and all powerful, so indeed He could teach anyone anything if He chose. However, what He chose was to speak to us through His word, so for this very reason we cannot dismiss the bible.
True, the bible as we have it today was not in existance back in Jesus' day, for the obvious reason that it was still being written. Obviously God had important things happening in those early church days that He felt necessary for us to know. But even if those days were not important, the scriptures are still divinely inspired, therefore of both great worth to us and quite frankly not in our pay grade to dismiss.
Again its true that genuine Christians produce good fruit and the bible tells us what this fruit looks like. We do no rely on 'it just feels right' or warm fuzzies from our actions to tell us if they are right or not...we rely on what God has told us.

Jesus personally told me to get more into the written Word, but I had been following him for over a year before he had me read the Word.
There is a peace that comes with following the Holy Spirit. A peace that is not present when evil is around.

The problem with this is that too often people are led astray. You can claim that you feel the 'rightness' of your actions, the peace and positive communication you get from following God alone, but how do you know, truly, that its God? Please do not think I'm saying it's not, for you. But how many people do you think are out there "following thier heart", who would say what you are, with the same conviction, who are following demons? We are told that Satan himself can appear as an angel of light, and that he is the prince of liars. If it was in his best interest (to led people away from God) he would portray light and love...all good things, but if they point even a fraction away from God, then he has won.
Am I saying its bad to have an intimate relationship with God? To follow His Spirit and follow His convictions? No way!! But the way we know, without a doubt, that we are not being decieved by evil, is to check everything against the word God Himself gave to us....He gave it for a good reason, and therefore its good to use it!

I have found that the bible can be a negative to one’s growth toward God. People have twisted, watered down the Word of God to where it has become very misleading.

It's true people can manipulated, change, liar and twist to achieve whatever end they want. We are a fallen race, and as sad as that is, that blame cannot be placed on the Bible. God gave it to us and every word within it is good, for growth, correction and to learn about our Lord and to realise the more we know, the more we love!
That is why it is so important to find a church that teaches the Bible as it is, no if's and no but's. And this is where you'll find your close relationship with the Holy Spirit so important. If someone makes a claim about scripture that just doesn't ring true for you; that just makes you pause or feel uncomfortable, then it's a good bet that scripture it being twisted.....and when scripture is twisted then God Himself is being misrepresented.

Example: Jesus told me that we were not to hurt/harm anyone for any reason.

The Bible tells us this too. Granted there are times in scripture where God has deemed to just to "go to war", but that is totally another topic! But Jesus teaches us to love, really love others. And when we truly love others we seek only good for them, not harm or saddness.

You see, by reading the scriptures we are not giving up the Holy Spirit or that close relationship with our father. By reading the Bible we learn more of Him, and truly, the more I learn, the more amazed I am, the more I completely love God for who He is and what He has done!