The Jerusalem which is above is the heavenly city of promise which God has prepared for His saints

[Truth7t7]

I’m not calling you a full preterist. I know you are Amil but you are arguing for an interpretation that I have only heard a full preterist argue for. I honestly don’t know exactly what any other full preterist would say but the one person I had a conversation with would’ve agreed with the approach you’re taking. Just saying.

The dividing line on "Full Preterism" is their claim the second coming has already been fulfilled, their explanation differs a bit between groups but that's the heretical outline on "Full Preterist"

Difference of belief in what we believe the NHNE will be like is non-essential, to deny a future NHNE is heretical IMHO

 

[grafted branch]

Not overall, I'm not. I say Rev 21 happens in the future, but a full preterist does not.

But that’s how symbolism works. You’re using symbolism to put it in the future and preterist use symbolism to put it in the past. I can also use symbolism to make it happen everyday, every time a person gets saved.

 

[Truth7t7]

Not looking to argue because we already agreed that we can't fully imagine it. But, in my view, fishing will seem not very interesting to you compared to what God has in store for us. Just my opinion. Set your expectations higher is all I'm saying. But, I'm with you that I can't wait. Looking forward to that is often what keeps me going each day through the trials and tribulations of life.

I agree no need to argue over a non-essential, it's going to be beyond the human imagination can't wait!

Jesus Is The Lord

 

[Truth7t7]

But that’s how symbolism works. You’re using symbolism to put it in the future and preterist use symbolism to put it in the past. I can also use symbolism to make it happen everyday, every time a person gets saved.

The very same way full preterist describe the second coming, many state when a person is saved that is their "Second Coming" of Jesus Christ "Heretical" IMHO

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

I agree no need to argue over a non-essential, it's going to be beyond the human imagination can't wait!

Jesus Is The Lord

This is something I hope all of us here can agree on. With that said, I do hope you are able to fish during that time. It's eternity, so I think you'll have time for it. LOL.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

But that’s how symbolism works. You’re using symbolism to put it in the future and preterist use symbolism to put it in the past. I can also use symbolism to make it happen everyday, every time a person gets saved.

What is the point? Clearly, there is some symbolism in the book of Revelation. No one denies that. There is disagreement over how much. Are you claiming otherwise or what?

 

[grafted branch]

The very same way full preterist describe the second coming, many state when a person is saved that is their "Second Coming" of Jesus Christ "Heretical" IMHO

Right, that’s why a symbolic interpretation is questionable unless there are multiple examples. A lamb being symbolic of Jesus works because of all the examples in the Bible but saying New Jerusalem coming down from heaven is symbolic of something is questionable.

 

[grafted branch]

What is the point? Clearly, there is some symbolism in the book of Revelation. No one denies that. There is disagreement over how much. Are you claiming otherwise or what?

No, I’m saying basing your interpretation of Jerusalem coming down from heaven on symbolism is no more convincing than a full preterist doing the same thing.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

No, I’m saying basing your interpretation of Jerusalem coming down from heaven on symbolism is no more convincing than a full preterist doing the same thing.

No offense, but I couldn't care less what you find to be convincing. It is described as "the bride, the Lamb's wife" (Rev 21:9). If you want to think that a literal city is Christ's bride, then I can't stop you.

 

[grafted branch]

No offense, but I couldn't care less what you find to be convincing. It is described as "the bride, the Lamb's wife" (Rev 21:9). If you want to think that a literal city is Christ's bride, then I can't stop you.

Isaiah 62:4(NIV) No longer will they call you Deserted, or name your land Desolate. But you will be called Hephzibah, and your land Beulah; for the LORD will take delight in you, and your land will be married.

No different than land being married.

 

[Marty fox]

I believe it will be somewhat like scripture explains it to be, I agree its beyond human comprehension

The Bible gives many hints of animals present, Isaiah 65 the wolf and lamb laying together, houses built, vineyards planted

Ezekiel 47 gives details of fish in the river of life, fishermen, fishing nets, the fruit on the tree of life is for eating

I agree we will know when the day comes, can't wait!

Thanks for the response, Jesus Is The Lord!

The Bible describes the wolf as Israels enemies and the lamb is a clean animal I believe that this is showing that Jews and gentiles will live in peace within the church

I also believe that the fishing in the river of life is the saints like Peter are fishers of men

 

[Truth7t7]

but saying New Jerusalem coming down from heaven is symbolic of something is questionable.

I Agree that New Jerusalem isn't symbolic as many have explained, but if the poster believes in a NHNE that erases the argument of what exactly New Jerusalem is or will be like IMHO, it's a non-essential, yes I disagree with their symbolic explanation just as you, no need to argue once the two sides have explained their views in this instance

If the poster denies a future NHNE that's a completely different subject

 

[Truth7t7]

The Bible describes the wolf as Israels enemies and the lamb is a clean animal I believe that this is showing that Jews and gentiles will live in peace within the church

I also believe that the fishing in the river of life is the saints like Peter are fishers of men

I Disagree with your symbolic interpretations, don't forget Isaiah 65:21-22 below that shows houses built, vineyards planted, and hands working, how's your magic symbolic machine going to interpret that below?

Isaiah 65:21-22KJV
21 And they shall build houses, and inhabit them; and they shall plant vineyards, and eat the fruit of them.
22 They shall not build, and another inhabit; they shall not plant, and another eat: for as the days of a tree are the days of my people, and mine elect shall long enjoy the work of their hands.

 

[Marty fox]

I Disagree with your symbolic interpretations, don't forget Isaiah 65:21-22 below that shows houses built, vineyards planted, and hands working, how's your magic symbolic machine going to interpret that below?

Isaiah 65:21-22KJV
21 And they shall build houses, and inhabit them; and they shall plant vineyards, and eat the fruit of them.
22 They shall not build, and another inhabit; they shall not plant, and another eat: for as the days of a tree are the days of my people, and mine elect shall long enjoy the work of their hands.

I believe It’s describing the church age

 

[WPM]

Excellent verses. I can see that Jesus went to prepare a place just after the cross but I don’t see any other verses that describe Him creating a NHNE. If it’s took six days of work to create the first heaven and earth then it’s reasonable to think it would take a similar amount of time to create a NHNE.

When do you see the NHNE being created?

This is human reading. He spoke the Word and it was so.

 

[grafted branch]

This is human reading. He spoke the Word and it was so.

Well, Jesus said I go to prepared a place for you. Is there any reason to think He hasn’t prepared that place yet?

 

[Truth7t7]

I believe It’s describing the church age

Just a few verses before the houses being built and vineyards being planted with hands working it shows the picture seen is in the "New Heaven and Earth", your magic symbolic machine is 100% wrong claiming the church age, Marty your better than that I'll give you another try

Isaiah 65:17-19KJV
17 For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.
18 But be ye glad and rejoice for ever in that which I create: for, behold, I create Jerusalem a rejoicing, and her people a joy.
19 And I will rejoice in Jerusalem, and joy in my people: and the voice of weeping shall be no more heard in her, nor the voice of crying.
20 There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed.
21 And they shall build houses, and inhabit them; and they shall plant vineyards, and eat the fruit of them.
22 They shall not build, and another inhabit; they shall not plant, and another eat: for as the days of a tree are the days of my people, and mine elect shall long enjoy the work of their hands.

 

[Marilyn C]

There is a city that God has prepared for His saints. And it is the heavenly Jerusalem. which is not of this earth, that is our destiny and where we go when we die.

Hebrews 11, those of the OT, they all died in faith , but none of them received the promise until the Christ came as they could not be perfected without Christ.

Hebrews 11:16
But now they desire a better, that is, a heavenly country. Therefore God is not ashamed to be called their God, for He has prepared a city for them.

Hebrews 12:22
22 But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, to an innumerable company of angels, 23 to the [j]general assembly and church of the firstborn who are registered in heaven, to God the Judge of all, to the spirits of just men made perfect, 24 to Jesus the Mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling that speaks better things than that of Abel.

The Heavenly Hope​

13 These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off [e]were assured of them, embraced them and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth. 14 For those who say such things declare plainly that they seek a homeland. 15 And truly if they had called to mind that country from which they had come out, they would have had opportunity to return. 16 But now they desire a better, that is, a heavenly country. Therefore God is not ashamed to be called their God, for He has prepared a city for them.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
39 And all these, having obtained a good testimony through faith, did not receive the promise, 40 God having provided something better for us, that they should not be made perfect apart from us.
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But now they have received the promise as it is fulfilled in Christ and now Christ is seated at the right hand of God
Jesus said He would build His CHURCH. This is all part of the New Covenant begun by Christ, those who are in His church are registered in heaven, and not anyone else. But the OT saints would be also brought into His church after they died, but they had to wait for us as they could not be perfected without us, the church of Christ..
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1 Peter 3
21 There is also an antitype which now saves us—baptism (not the removal of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God), through the resurrection of Jesus Christ, 22 who has gone into heaven and is at the right hand of God, angels and authorities and powers having been made subject to Him.
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With the resurrection of Jesus Christ the way into the heavenly city is now opened to us all, those who died before in the OC have received the promise.

All the OT prophecies point to the kingdom of God and reigning from Jerusalem. But that kingdom's final state is not of this earth.
Jerusalem which is above is free, while the one of this earth is in bondage.

Galatians 4
25 for this Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia, and corresponds to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children— 26 but the Jerusalem above is free, which is the mother of us all. 27 For it is written:

“Rejoice, O barren,
You who do not bear!
Break forth and shout,
You who are not in labor!
For the desolate has many more children
Than she who has a husband.”

Hi Scott,

I agree we, the Body of Christ will be in heaven and not on the earth. However, we will be on Mount Zion, (symbolic of the Lord`s ruling throne). God the Father set His Son on the heavenly Mount Zion. (Ps. 2: 6) And that is where we will be also.

You see Jerusalem is made up of two parts - Mount Zion and the city.

Mount Zion - the Lord`s own throne with the Body of Christ.

The city, the New Jerusalem - the Old Testament Saints. It comes down out of heaven from God. It is the rule in the Universal area.

 

[Scott Downey]

Well, Jesus said I go to prepared a place for you. Is there any reason to think He hasn’t prepared that place yet?

He certainly has, and it is in the Holy City
A place for the people of God

 

[Scott Downey]

Hi Scott,

I agree we, the Body of Christ will be in heaven and not on the earth. However, we will be on Mount Zion, (symbolic of the Lord`s ruling throne). God the Father set His Son on the heavenly Mount Zion. (Ps. 2: 6) And that is where we will be also.

You see Jerusalem is made up of two parts - Mount Zion and the city.

Mount Zion - the Lord`s own throne with the Body of Christ.

The city, the New Jerusalem - the Old Testament Saints. It comes down out of heaven from God. It is the rule in the Universal area.

Well we can agree on some things. The city is inhabited now and has been for 2000 years. The people of God live there and are reigning with Him today.