The Jesuits ... What is their role? Part 1 and 2

[Mungo]

Holocaust deniers also have their 'justifications' as do all oppressive systems.....would you expect a system that murders, extorts and deceives to refrain from lying? [/quote]

You just cannot accept the truth which is that your OP was a pack of lies and falsehoods.

Ultimately, all will be required to render account of their words and actions to him who judges justly.

Yes, you should remember that and tremble

 

[Mungo]

Sure. This is the standard response of Catholics when their history is exposed. Nothing new in your denials and accusations of lies and exaggerations.

And that is a standard response when lies and falsehoods are exposed.

 

[Mungo]

Can a man bring justified charges against unacceptable behaviour and attitudes and not be accused of being unloving?

Yes they can. But you don't bring justified charges.
You bring lies and deceptions.

Look at your OP. A total falsehood based on a 16th century forger, a lying man who claimed to be an ex-Jesuit when he wasn't and a Congressional Record that wasn't about what was claimed.

The whole thing was lies and deceptions. I was hoping that you would apologise but it appears your are unrepentant.
May God have mercy on your soul.

 

[Mungo]

Correct. The sheep need to be warned about the wolves. There is real spiritual danger in the errors of Catholicism. This is not about those who have been deceived but the deceivers. Indeed Catholics are told to come out of their church, which is a part of Mystery Babylon.

The Catechism of the Catholic Church (CCC) teaches its adherents that the god of the Muslims -- Allah -- is the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob -- the one true God of Christians (Father, Son, and Holy Spirit). THIS IS SERIOUS DECEPTION.

"841 The Church's relationship with the Muslims. "The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind's judge on the last day'

There are four clear errors in this paragraph:

1. Muslims are included in God's plan of salvation. The truth is that only those who obey the Gospel are included in God's plan of salvation. Muslims must turn to Christ as Lord an Saviour in order to be saved. Which means they must repudiate Islam.

2. Muslims profess to hold the faith of Abraham. The truth is that Abraham did not worship Allah but the LORD God Almighty. Yahweh (the LORD) is also the name of Christ, who said to Moses that He was the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, whose name was I AM THAT I AM (or I AM). He told the Jews of His day that He was "I AM" and if they did not believe this they would die in their sins.

3. Muslims adore the one merciful God. The truth is that Muslims worship the moon god Allah, and Allah condemns the triune Godhead in the Quran. The Quran attacks and rejects the Holy Trinity, the deity of Christ, and the crucifixion and resurrection of Christ.

4. Muslims worship mankind's judge on the last day. The Bible tells us that it is Christ who is mankind's Judge (Acts 17:30,31), but Muslims regard Jesus as merely a prophet, and one who is inferior to Mohammad.

Now Pope Francis has been calling Muslims "brothers" over and over again in his public declarations. But they cannot be "brothers" of Christians, since they regard Christians and Jews as infidels who will be consigned to Hell. Now if this is not a grand deception, we do not know the meaning of deception.

As usual an attempt to change the topic when you can't justify your lies and hatred.

 

[justbyfaith]

Stephen found himself in contentious situation too. Who was wrong in that situation? I'd say the people who created the contention.

Stephen created the contention. By speaking word that the people who heard him did not want to believe; and so they responded with hatred.

I think it should be clear Paul meant he was operating in a contentious climate and not that he was creating the contention himself.

Galatians 5:11 tells us that the preaching of the Cross is offensive to the unbeliever. So Paul preached a message that in its very nature would produce contention; in that the people hearing him would be offended and respond with that offense in mind.

May God have mercy on your soul.

I think that what you're not realizing is that people are not saved through membership in the Catholic Church; but they are saved or condemned over whether or not they believe in Christ and what He did for them on the Cross.

 

[BreadOfLife]

The denial comes as no surprise. The RC system is built on it. History is its witness.

NONSENSE.

Alberto Rivera, who was a friend of professional anti-Catholic and rampant liar, Jack Chick had quite a checkered past before settling in Southern California - and NONE of it as an ordained priest. He was a con man from Spain who was chased out of Europe by the authorities who were hot on his trail for a number of confidence schemes including check fraud and credit card theft.

By the way - this is not only according to Catholic sources - but according to the PROTESTANT publication, Cornerstone Magazine's expose on this phony (The Alberto Story, Cornerstone Magazine, Vol. 9, No. 53, 1981, pp 29-31).
His claims that his sister was a Catholic nun who witnessed many "horrors" also turned out to be a big fat LIE.
Oh, he DID have a sister - but she was never a nun.

For you to even mention this this criminal in your anti-Catholic tirade is almost laughable - if not so pathetically desperate.
shame on you for propagating well-debunked LIES . . .

 

[Jane_Doe22]

Galatians 5:11 tells us that the preaching of the Cross is offensive to the unbeliever. So Paul preached a message that in its very nature would produce contention; in that the people hearing him would be offended and respond with that offense in mind.

Paul preached Truth, the right ways, and brought goodness to the table.
That's radically different than person A lecturing person B about the "evil" things A thinks B believes.

I think that what you're not realizing is that people are not saved through membership in the Catholic Church; but they are saved or condemned over whether or not they believe in Christ and what He did for them on the Cross.

Dude: Catholics believe in Jesus and His sacrifice on the cross.
I'm sure that @Mungo , would be totally cool telling you his/her testimony of Christ & His sacrifice.
You're also welcome to a Stations of the Cross event, and see for yourself the importance of it to Catholics. Or many other events.

 

[Giuliano]

Stephen created the contention. By speaking word that the people who heard him did not want to believe; and so they responded with hatred.

Galatians 5:11 tells us that the preaching of the Cross is offensive to the unbeliever. So Paul preached a message that in its very nature would produce contention; in that the people hearing him would be offended and respond with that offense in mind.

Neither of them created contention. If you think so, I think you need to do some serious praying.

 

[Giuliano]

NONSENSE.

Alberto Rivera, who was a friend of professional anti-Catholic and rampant liar, Jack Chick had quite a checkered past before settling in Southern California - and NONE of it as an ordained priest. He was a con man from Spain who was chased out of Europe by the authorities who were hot on his trail for a number of confidence schemes including check fraud and credit card theft.

By the way - this is not only according to Catholic sources - but according to the PROTESTANT publication, Cornerstone Magazine's expose on this phony (The Alberto Story, Cornerstone Magazine, Vol. 9, No. 53, 1981, pp 29-31).
His claims that his sister was a Catholic nun who witnessed many "horrors" also turned out to be a big fat LIE.
Oh, he DID have a sister - but she was never a nun.

For you to even mention this this criminal in your anti-Catholic tirade is almost laughable - if not so pathetically desperate.
shame on you for propagating well-debunked LIES . . .

Their crude attacks on the Catholic Church only gives it more credibility in my eyes. It must be doing something right to get attacked like that.

Matthew 5:11 Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.

By their fruits, you can know them. I cannot believe anyone who spews out hate and lies can have any useful message for me; and I am sad some people fall for their lies and hate.

 

[historyb]

Oh good grief! Not that rubbish about he Jesuit Oath and Alberto Rivera.

None of it is true. Some lies about the Catholic Church never die, They just keep circulating on Anti-Catholic web sites and gullible people believe them.

Do you really want me to waste time refuting this rubbish or will you withdraw it and do some real research?

Well you know what they say about people that believe the trash he posted. Idiots will believe anything

 

[FollowHim]

Oh good grief! Not that rubbish about he Jesuit Oath and Alberto Rivera.

None of it is true. Some lies about the Catholic Church never die, They just keep circulating on Anti-Catholic web sites and gullible people believe them.

Do you really want me to waste time refuting this rubbish or will you withdraw it and do some real research?

This all reads like a paraniods dream that the enemy are everywhere.

It is absurd an oath of infraltration makes any sense except as anti propoganda. Loyalty to ones superior ok, but not this. Jesuits believe in the RCC and want to uphold it. Oaths to the church yes, persecution of heretics through trials, true, not this.

 

[Jane_Doe22]

This all reads like a paraniods dream that the enemy are everywhere.

It is absurd an oath of infraltration makes any sense except as anti propoganda. Loyalty to ones superior ok, but not this. Jesuits believe in the RCC and want to uphold it. Oaths to the church yes, persecution of heretics through trials, true, not this.

Again: I'm not a Catholic. I have no personal stakes in this matter.
There are people out there whom are blatant anti-Catholic, including some on this board. That's not being paranoid, rather just a stating fact.
Another fact is that there are also non-Catholics posters whom aren't anti-Catholic and even people whom treat others with respect & love.

 

[FollowHim]

Again: I'm not a Catholic. I have no personal stakes in this matter.
There are people out there whom are blatant anti-Catholic, including some on this board. That's not being paranoid, rather just a stating fact.
Another fact is that there are also non-Catholics posters whom aren't anti-Catholic and even people whom treat others with respect & love.

I am protestant, annibaptist, and hold no animosity. I have read some conspiracy guys, covid is made up etc. Some are probs flat earthers as well, lizards rule, UFO hangers cross the USA.

I am sure some are just trolls and some actually believe it. I have been called possessed for preaching love and repentance so I am pre warned. .. . Lol

 

[Jane_Doe22]

I am protestant, annibaptist, and hold no animosity. I have read some conspiracy guys, covid is made up etc. Some are probs flat earthers as well, lizards rule, UFO hangers cross the USA.

I am sure some are just trolls and some actually believe it. I have been called possessed for preaching love and repentance so I am pre warned. .. . Lol

Honestly, my comment was in general. There are anti-Catholic folks on this board. There's also non-Catholics whom are friendly & respectful to Catholics.

I don't know you, @FollowHim, specifically enough to say whether or not you're anti- or pro- anything.

 

[FollowHim]

Honestly, my comment was in general. There are anti-Catholic folks on this board. There's also non-Catholics whom are friendly & respectful to Catholics.

I don't know you, @FollowHim, specifically enough to say whether or not you're anti- or pro- anything.

I know, I was just clarifying where I was

 

[justbyfaith]

Dude: Catholics believe in Jesus and His sacrifice on the cross.

I know: but he was implying that he was going to get it for not being Catholic.

His specific words:

May God have mercy on your soul.

.
.
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Neither of them created contention. If you think so, I think you need to do some serious praying.

Read the book of Acts. The apostles were the reason for great tumults from those they preached to on not a few occasions.

Again: I'm not a Catholic. I have no personal stakes in this matter.

But you are a Mormon and have a vested interest in this because you are in the same boat with Catholics in that both of your religions claim that the exposers of their deeper secrets are actually lying.

There are people out there whom are blatant anti-Catholic,

And I am not one of them. I care about Catholics; while I am against Catholocism.

Because in teaching that Mary is a co-redeemer with Christ, they diminish the work of Christ on the Cross so that it may not be trusted in to the fullest extent. And this is in fact a salvation issue.

 

[Giuliano]

Read the book of Acts. The apostles were the reason for great tumults from those they preached to on not a few occasions.

The Apostles didn't attack other people. They got attacked.

 

[justbyfaith]

The Apostles didn't attack other people. They got attacked.

Stephen was specifically attacked because he "spoke words against this holy place and the law." (Acts of the Apostles 6:13).

The original poster was attacking no one here on these boards; but rather was exposing the past of an organization that has had questionable practices in times past.

 

[quietthinker]

Yes they can. But you don't bring justified charges.
You bring lies and deceptions.

Look at your OP. A total falsehood based on a 16th century forger, a lying man who claimed to be an ex-Jesuit when he wasn't and a Congressional Record that wasn't about what was claimed.

The whole thing was lies and deceptions. I was hoping that you would apologise but it appears your are unrepentant.
May God have mercy on your soul.

It appears Mungo you are not familiar with history.

 

[Jane_Doe22]

I know: but he was implying that he was going to get it for not being Catholic.



Read the book of Acts. The apostles were the reason for great tumults from those they preached to on not a few occasions.



But you are a Mormon and have a vested interest in this because you are in the same boat with Catholics in that both of your religions claim that the exposers of their deeper secrets are actually lying.



And I am not one of them. I care about Catholics; while I am against Catholocism.

Because in teaching that Mary is a co-redeemer with Christ, they diminish the work of Christ on the Cross so that it may not be trusted in to the fullest extent. And this is in fact a salvation issue.

This post is... *eye roll*
justbyfaith, if you care about Catholics or anyone else, ditch the assumption that a Catholic person is an uneducated/deceived idiot, that you know more about their beliefs than them, and that this "anti-cult" stuff is remotely loving. None of that's reality, it's all horribly offensive, and just makes people flee from the things you espouse.

A much better approach is to be a humble servant, to serve, to love, and let Christ's goodness shine through your actions.

Like I don't agree with Catholic-specific Marian doctrines. But I spent weeks listening to Catholics, attending Catholic events, and studying Catholic sources to better understand what those Marian doctrines are. At the end of it, I still don't remotely believe these doctrines (even more so than when I started). But I have a better understanding of what they are, and a better love/understanding of the individuals whom believe them.