The Order of Salvation

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Robert Pate

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Everyone that was saved in the New Testament was saved by faith in Christ and his Gospel. Not by baptism, not by repenting, not by anything that we do other than faith in Christ and his Gospel.

On the day of Pentecost 8,000 Jews heard Peter's Gospel, believed, and were saved, Acts 2:41 also Acts 4:4.

Paul wrote, "So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God (Which is the Gospel) Romans 10:17.

Catholics and others teach that salvation is the results of repenting. The Bible teaches no such thing. Repentants is a work. We are not saved or justified by works, "This only would I learn of you, did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law (Because you did something) or by the hearing of faith (Hearing and believing the Gospel) Galatians 3:2.

The Holy Spirit is in the world calling all to come to Christ and be saved. When the Gospel is preached the Holy Spirit is present to convict people of their need to come to Christ and be saved. Many hear the Gospel, but instead of coming to Christ they turn to religion. To reject Christ and his Gospel is to reject Christ and become lost.

Religion is a diversion away from Christ and his Gospel. If you have chosen to go that way, you are under the judgment of God. God does not accept the works or the obedience of anyone's religion. God only accepts the works and the obedience of Jesus Christ. We are accepted only in him and because of him.
 

Taken

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Everyone that was saved in the New Testament was saved by faith in Christ and his Gospel. Not by baptism, not by repenting, not by anything that we do other than faith in Christ and his Gospel.

On the day of Pentecost 8,000 Jews heard Peter's Gospel, believed, and were saved, Acts 2:41 also Acts 4:4.

Paul wrote, "So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God (Which is the Gospel) Romans 10:17.

Catholics and others teach that salvation is the results of repenting. The Bible teaches no such thing. Repentants is a work. We are not saved or justified by works, "This only would I learn of you, did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law (Because you did something) or by the hearing of faith (Hearing and believing the Gospel) Galatians 3:2.

The Holy Spirit is in the world calling all to come to Christ and be saved. When the Gospel is preached the Holy Spirit is present to convict people of their need to come to Christ and be saved. Many hear the Gospel, but instead of coming to Christ they turn to religion. To reject Christ and his Gospel is to reject Christ and become lost.

Religion is a diversion away from Christ and his Gospel. If you have chosen to go that way, you are under the judgment of God. God does not accept the works or the obedience of anyone's religion. God only accepts the works and the obedience of Jesus Christ. We are accepted only in him and because of him.
 

Taken

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Everyone that was saved in the New Testament was saved by faith in Christ and his Gospel. Not by baptism, not by repenting, not by anything that we do other than faith in Christ and his Gospel.

On the day of Pentecost 8,000 Jews heard Peter's Gospel, believed, and were saved, Acts 2:41 also Acts 4:4.

Paul wrote, "So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God (Which is the Gospel) Romans 10:17.

Catholics and others teach that salvation is the results of repenting. The Bible teaches no such thing. Repentants is a work. We are not saved or justified by works, "This only would I learn of you, did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law (Because you did something) or by the hearing of faith (Hearing and believing the Gospel) Galatians 3:2.

The Holy Spirit is in the world calling all to come to Christ and be saved. When the Gospel is preached the Holy Spirit is present to convict people of their need to come to Christ and be saved. Many hear the Gospel, but instead of coming to Christ they turn to religion. To reject Christ and his Gospel is to reject Christ and become lost.

Religion is a diversion away from Christ and his Gospel. If you have chosen to go that way, you are under the judgment of God. God does not accept the works or the obedience of anyone's religion. God only accepts the works and the obedience of Jesus Christ. We are accepted only in him and because of him.

Repentance to God effects Forgiveness From God, Comes From God For a natural mans having standing against God, Having NOT believed, ie SIN against God.
 
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Chadrho

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Repentants is a work.

Repentance is not a "work." Repentance is a reorientation of our mind and heart. It is a turning away from the world and a turning toward God (think of baptismal vows to turn away from sin and evil and turn to Christ). Faith is impossible unless one turns their mind and heart toward Christ. It doesn't take much, but one must turn. I would argue that the very act of turning toward God is an act of divine grace (if not as an efficient cause, then certainly as a final cause since divinity is the object of faith).

The way you're arguing can be used against faith, as well, so that faith is also a "work." I think the solution is to recognize that we are saved by grace, first and foremost. Divine grace preceeds faith, encourages faith, sustains faith, and fulfills faith. Without grace, there is neither repentance nor faith.
 

Robert Pate

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Repentance is not a "work." Repentance is a reorientation of our mind and heart. It is a turning away from the world and a turning toward God (think of baptismal vows to turn away from sin and evil and turn to Christ). Faith is impossible unless one turns their mind and heart toward Christ. It doesn't take much, but one must turn. I would argue that the very act of turning toward God is an act of divine grace (if not as an efficient cause, then certainly as a final cause since divinity is the object of faith).

The way you're arguing can be used against faith, as well, so that faith is also a "work." I think the solution is to recognize that we are saved by grace, first and foremost. Divine grace preceeds faith, encourages faith, sustains faith, and fulfills faith. Without grace, there is neither repentance nor faith.
Anything that we do is a work. Faith is not what saves us. What saves us is the doing and the dying of Jesus. Faith is what makes the Gospel ours. Your doctrine is not according to the Bible. It appears that you are a Catholic or you have Catholic beliefs. In the Bible the word "Grace" always means God's grace. God was gracious in that he sent his Son into the world to atone for the sins of humanity, John 3:17. I don't think that you see it that way. Nothing proceeds faith. Faith is the results of hearing and believing the Gospel. "So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God" (which is the Gospel) Romans 10:17.

On The day of Pentecost 8,000 Jews heard Peter's Gospel and were convicted by the Holy Spirit of their need for Christ, Acts 2:41 also Acts 4:4. There is no mention of divine grace in the scriptures. This is something that you have made up. There is no scripture that says, "Divine grace proceeds faith, encourages faith, sustains faith, and fulfills faith". Again, you have made that up.
 

Robert Pate

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Repentance to God effects Forgiveness From God, Comes From God For a natural mans having standing against God, Having NOT believed, ie SIN against God.
Repentance is a work of the Holy Spirit. It has nothing to do with forgiveness. Our forgiveness is based upon the doing and the dying of Jesus. "Without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness of sins" Hebrews 9:22.
 
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Chadrho

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Anything that we do is a work. Faith is not what saves us. What saves us is the doing and the dying of Jesus. Faith is what makes the Gospel ours. Your doctrine is not according to the Bible. It appears that you are a Catholic or you have Catholic beliefs. In the Bible the word "Grace" always means God's grace. God was gracious in that he sent his Son into the world to atone for the sins of humanity, John 3:17. I don't think that you see it that way. Nothing proceeds faith. Faith is the results of hearing and believing the Gospel. "So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God" (which is the Gospel) Romans 10:17.

On The day of Pentecost 8,000 Jews heard Peter's Gospel and were convicted by the Holy Spirit of their need for Christ, Acts 2:41 also Acts 4:4. There is no mention of divine grace in the scriptures. This is something that you have made up. There is no scripture that says, "Divine grace proceeds faith, encourages faith, sustains faith, and fulfills faith". Again, you have made that up.

Well, I'm not Catholic. You seem to have it figured out, though. Good for you.
 

Taken

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Repentance is a work of the Holy Spirit. It has nothing to do with forgiveness. Our forgiveness is based upon the doing and the dying of Jesus. "Without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness of sins" Hebrews 9:22.

Forgiveness IS an act, of ONE to ANOTHER, when the Other has exacted an OFFENSE against the One.

Without a natural birth…there is no SIN of a manKIND of thing.

A manKIND of thing IS naturally BORN IN SIN.
He neither, knows, loves, believes in the Lord God…aka. HIS SIN.
He grows…maybe a year, 5 years, 10 years, 40 years, 50 years……BEFORE he hears, decides to hear more, or Reject, or continues hearing, until he freely chooses to REPENT…

What is he Repenting FOR?
From Birth to whatever day of his life….EVERY DAY, moment of his Life HE WAS AGAINST the Lord God IN DISBELIEF.

God has OFFERED Forgiveness to any man…
Who is sorry, Who wants to Notify God of His regret FOR (how ever long of his own life), he was AGAINST God.

IF you submitted your life unto God….
Were you NOT sorry, regretful for the Years, you did not know Him, Love Him, Believe in Him?

Matt 4:
1-16 Is some things that affected Jesus you can read for yourself….

Listen clearly to what Jesus says TO MEN, in verse Matt 4:

[17] From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.

That is a mans first step when calling on the Lord…
Announce your sorrow and regret for having HAD been Against God.
 

Robert Pate

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Forgiveness IS an act, of ONE to ANOTHER, when the Other has exacted an OFFENSE against the One.

Without a natural birth…there is no SIN of a manKIND of thing.

A manKIND of thing IS naturally BORN IN SIN.
He neither, knows, loves, believes in the Lord God…aka. HIS SIN.
He grows…maybe a year, 5 years, 10 years, 40 years, 50 years……BEFORE he hears, decides to hear more, or Reject, or continues hearing, until he freely chooses to REPENT…

What is he Repenting FOR?
From Birth to whatever day of his life….EVERY DAY, moment of his Life HE WAS AGAINST the Lord God IN DISBELIEF.

God has OFFERED Forgiveness to any man…
Who is sorry, Who wants to Notify God of His regret FOR (how ever long of his own life), he was AGAINST God.

IF you submitted your life unto God….
Were you NOT sorry, regretful for the Years, you did not know Him, Love Him, Believe in Him?

Matt 4:
1-16 Is some things that affected Jesus you can read for yourself….

Listen clearly to what Jesus says TO MEN, in verse Matt 4:

[17] From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.

That is a mans first step when calling on the Lord…
Announce your sorrow and regret for having HAD been Against God.
Right. There must be sorrow and remorse for sin. Repentance plays a big part in the repentance of sins. You cannot continue in sin and believe that you will be forgiven.

The forgiveness of sin is based upon the shed blood of Jesus. Without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness of sins.
 

rockytopva

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Order of Salvation...

The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach; That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. - Romans 10:8-10

1. Confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus Christ
2. Believe in your heart that he is risen from the dead

How easy is that!
 
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Rella

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Everyone that was saved in the New Testament was saved by faith in Christ and his Gospel. Not by baptism, not by repenting, not by anything that we do other than faith in Christ and his Gospel.

On the day of Pentecost 8,000 Jews heard Peter's Gospel, believed, and were saved, Acts 2:41 also Acts 4:4.

Paul wrote, "So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God (Which is the Gospel) Romans 10:17.

Catholics and others teach that salvation is the results of repenting. The Bible teaches no such thing. Repentants is a work. We are not saved or justified by works, "This only would I learn of you, did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law (Because you did something) or by the hearing of faith (Hearing and believing the Gospel) Galatians 3:2.

The Holy Spirit is in the world calling all to come to Christ and be saved. When the Gospel is preached the Holy Spirit is present to convict people of their need to come to Christ and be saved. Many hear the Gospel, but instead of coming to Christ they turn to religion. To reject Christ and his Gospel is to reject Christ and become lost.

Religion is a diversion away from Christ and his Gospel. If you have chosen to go that way, you are under the judgment of God. God does not accept the works or the obedience of anyone's religion. God only accepts the works and the obedience of Jesus Christ. We are accepted only in him and because of him.
Robert, this is a serious question.

You say this...
Everyone that was saved in the New Testament was saved by faith in Christ and his Gospel. Not by baptism, not by repenting, not by anything that we do other than faith in Christ and his Gospel.

On the day of Pentecost 8,000 Jews heard Peter's Gospel, believed, and were saved, Acts 2:41 also Acts 4:4.

Paul wrote, "So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God (Which is the Gospel) Romans 10:17.

Catholics and others teach that salvation is the results of repenting. The Bible teaches no such thing. Repentants is a work.

Now if repenting is wrong and not needed for salvation... are you certain those Friday night hook ups are still ok? As long as they have a solid faith in the blood that Christ Jesus shed
for us?
 
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Robert Pate

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Robert, this is a serious question.

You say this...
Everyone that was saved in the New Testament was saved by faith in Christ and his Gospel. Not by baptism, not by repenting, not by anything that we do other than faith in Christ and his Gospel.

On the day of Pentecost 8,000 Jews heard Peter's Gospel, believed, and were saved, Acts 2:41 also Acts 4:4.

Paul wrote, "So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God (Which is the Gospel) Romans 10:17.

Catholics and others teach that salvation is the results of repenting. The Bible teaches no such thing. Repentants is a work.

Now if repenting is wrong and not needed for salvation... are you certain those Friday night hook ups are still ok? As long as they have a solid faith in the blood that Christ Jesus shed
for us?
The Gospel calls for holy living. All that are indwelt with the Holy Spirit will not deliberately sin. If they do, they should examine themselves to see if they are of the faith.
 

BlessedPeace

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Repentance is a work of the Holy Spirit. It has nothing to do with forgiveness. Our forgiveness is based upon the doing and the dying of Jesus. "Without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness of sins" Hebrews 9:22.
Yours is easy believism,aka/sloth believism.

When you counter Jesus teachings,you are not upholding his good news.
 
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Rella

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The Gospel calls for holy living. All that are indwelt with the Holy Spirit will not deliberately sin. If they do, they should examine themselves to see if they are of the faith.
And if they do, and find they are.... snd turn (repent) from the offense you say that is the work of repentance... no?

Well, Holy Living is expected... for sure.... but it does not come naturally in all things. Some people need to work at it... turn from their sin... just like Jesus told the Prostitute.. "go and sin no more".. IF she was sucessful that would have been a work on her part to obey.

Turn that around and say that Jesus said that to her philanderer brother... ( this is just an example I KNOW not biblical) (But you are a man who at one time was single.... so try to remeber when... and Jesus told him " go and sin no more"

Just how long do you think that would have lasted....

One has to repent no matter the cost or discomfort and for many, if not most there will be things in their lives that will take every bit of effort to avoid that they can muster....

YOU are wrong

The Holy Spirit is responsible for one's repentance??? Then why leave the wanting for certain things in people? Fo even Paul understood that when he said it is better to marry then to burn with passion... he never suggested that once born again the Holy Spirit will see you never want that which is wrong.
 
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Robert Pate

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And if they do, and find they are.... snd turn (repent) from the offense you say that is the work of repentance... no?

Well, Holy Living is expected... for sure.... but it does not come naturally in all things. Some people need to work at it... turn from their sin... just like Jesus told the Prostitute.. "go and sin no more".. IF she was sucessful that would have been a work on her part to obey.

Turn that around and say that Jesus said that to her philanderer brother... ( this is just an example I KNOW not biblical) (But you are a man who at one time was single.... so try to remeber when... and Jesus told him " go and sin no more"

Just how long do you think that would have lasted....

One has to repent no matter the cost or discomfort and for many, if not most there will be things in their lives that will take every bit of effort to avoid that they can muster....

YOU are wrong

The Holy Spirit is responsible for one's repentance??? Then why leave the wanting for certain things in people? Fo even Paul understood that when he said it is better to marry then to burn with passion... he never suggested that once born again the Holy Spirit will see you never want that which is wrong.
The Holy Spirit is the Christians keeper and teacher and leads us into all truth, John 16:13. We receive the Holy Spirit when we first trust in Christ. We do not receive the Spirit by works or obedience to the law, Galatians 3:2. Repentance is a work of the Holy Spirit because the Holy Spirit convicts of sin. Have you ever heard that small quiet voice say, don't do that?
 

Rella

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The Holy Spirit is the Christians keeper and teacher and leads us into all truth, John 16:13. We receive the Holy Spirit when we first trust in Christ. We do not receive the Spirit by works or obedience to the law, Galatians 3:2. Repentance is a work of the Holy Spirit because the Holy Spirit convicts of sin. Have you ever heard that small quiet voice say, don't do that?
Not when it comes to anything that I know that God disproves of.

Now before you tell me I do not have the Holy Spirit living in me, I will tell you if I don't I still speak in tongues.
 

Robert Pate

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Not when it comes to anything that I know that God disproves of.

Now before you tell me I do not have the Holy Spirit living in me, I will tell you if I don't I still speak in tongues.
There are many cults that speak in tongues. Evidence that you have the Holy Spirit is that you will magnify Christ and his Gospel.
 

Robert Pate

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Yours is easy believism,aka/sloth believism.

When you counter Jesus teachings,you are not upholding his good news.
Believing in Jesus is the only thing that is going to save you, John 3:16. Under the New Covenant the law and the commandments have been abolished, Ephesians 2:15. Jesus nailed the law to his cross, Colossians 2:14. This is why the just shall live by faith, Romans 1:17.
 

BlessedPeace

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Believing in Jesus is the only thing that is going to save you, John 3:16. Under the New Covenant the law and the commandments have been abolished, Ephesians 2:15. Jesus nailed the law to his cross, Colossians 2:14. This is why the just shall live by faith, Romans 1:17.
Your denial of Baptism and its importance is your teaching.


You forget, Jesus was Baptized.
Luke 3


John 3:22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized.

John 3:23 And John also was baptizing in Aenon near to Salim, because there was much water there: and they came, and were baptized.

John 3:24 For John was not yet cast into prison.

John 3:25 Then there arose a question between some of John’s disciples and the Jews about purifying.

John 3:26 And they came unto John, and said unto him, Rabbi, he that was with thee beyond Jordan, to whom thou barest witness, behold, the same baptizeth, and all men come to him.



“teaching them whatsoever I have commanded” (Matthew 28:20).
 
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Rella

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There are many cults that speak in tongues. Evidence that you have the Holy Spirit is that you will magnify Christ and his Gospel.
Well, I gave up any life of my own for Christ Jesus and His Father..... Does that count