- Dec 31, 2010
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The Pope and Kenneth Copeland
- Thread starter rockytopva
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Choir Loft
Copeland and Pope.......two excellent examples of apostate christendom.rockytopva said:
The sooner it falls into the dust, the better.
and that's just me, hollering from the choir loft......
PS
What's the difference between the church Jesus founded and Christendom?
hint: not the same thing
PPS
The church was founded by Jesus Christ.
Christendom was founded by Emperor Constantine....official...bureaucratic...political....of the world...
We, as Christians, are all going to be very wrong on certain points in Scripture. And there will always be pretenders in Christ.
I will let God decide if these two are pretenders.
We can disagree and yet love each other as Jesus wants. We can declare with each other, in prayer, putting aside our egos, that Jesus Christ is Lord. That I believe is the true unity.
I will let God decide if these two are pretenders.
We can disagree and yet love each other as Jesus wants. We can declare with each other, in prayer, putting aside our egos, that Jesus Christ is Lord. That I believe is the true unity.
We are not called to unite with those who apostatize, but to reject them.Doxiemom said:
Titus 3:10-11 A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject; 11 Knowing that he that is such is subverted, and sinneth, being condemned of himself.
Doctrine is very important. Sure, we all won't agree on everything. That's just not going to happen. But, the following things were not written for us to take lightly...
Revelation 2:14-15 But I have a few things against thee, because thou hast there them that hold the doctrine of Balaam, who taught Balac to cast a stumblingblock before the children of Israel, to eat things sacrificed unto idols, and to commit fornication. 15 So hast thou also them that hold the doctrine of the Nicolaitans, which thing I hate.
2 John 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist. ... 10 If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed:
Titus 1:9 Holding fast the faithful word as he hath been taught, that he may be able by sound doctrine both to exhort and to convince the gainsayers.
Titus 2:1 But speak thou the things which become sound doctrine:
Hebrews 13:9 Be not carried about with divers and strange doctrines. For it is a good thing that the heart be established with grace; not with meats, which have not profited them that have been occupied therein.
Ephesians 4:14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;
1 Timothy 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
I guess you missed the point that I was saying not to unite for the adaptations of bad doctrines.
I was saying that in a singular unit, we can declare the Jesus is Lord.
But, not all folks are willing to call some people who attend certain churches "Christians" because they abhor some of their doctrines.
For sure, some of us are very arrogant and prideful of the church we go to. Not sure if that will sit well come Judgement.
You can reject to "apostasy"= bad doctrines= but do we have to reject the Christian as an individual?
Do we have to refuse to pray together ?
As an example, another bunch of little kindergardeners are shot by a madman. A time for mourning and all the Christians come together to pray for healing peace. to come to those grieving parents. This is not the time to stand on doctrines, but to sing a prayer in unity of the Lord's Prayer, together, as one group of Christians.
Then comes the season of helping people come out of "her" that apostate church.
Maybe it is just me, but I will gladly hold hands with a priest and Baptist minister. And let the Holy Spirit be the Comforter. If for a little season.
I was saying that in a singular unit, we can declare the Jesus is Lord.
But, not all folks are willing to call some people who attend certain churches "Christians" because they abhor some of their doctrines.
For sure, some of us are very arrogant and prideful of the church we go to. Not sure if that will sit well come Judgement.
You can reject to "apostasy"= bad doctrines= but do we have to reject the Christian as an individual?
Do we have to refuse to pray together ?
As an example, another bunch of little kindergardeners are shot by a madman. A time for mourning and all the Christians come together to pray for healing peace. to come to those grieving parents. This is not the time to stand on doctrines, but to sing a prayer in unity of the Lord's Prayer, together, as one group of Christians.
Then comes the season of helping people come out of "her" that apostate church.
Maybe it is just me, but I will gladly hold hands with a priest and Baptist minister. And let the Holy Spirit be the Comforter. If for a little season.
Agreed ... where is there anything wrong with praying for someone ?Doxiemom said:
Besides, let people say what they want about Kenneth Copeland, I know what he teaches and believes, and as a KCM partner I stand with him
because I know he loves God, believes the word and is a man of integrity.
The fact that the Pope has reached out to him and that he responded with love instead of judgement is merely a sign of his spiritual maturity.
A lot less can be said of ..........................
It would still be wrong to unite in worship with them, but we all held different doctrines. There is truth, which is light, and then there is error, which is darkness.Doxiemom said:
Ephesians 5:11 And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.
Indeed, some are arrogant and prideful of the church they attend. Even when their church is in apostasy, and have a whore's forehead, they refuse to be ashamed, and ignore the warning to "come out of her my people" as stated in Revelation 18.
Jeremiah 3:3 Therefore the showers have been withholden, and there hath been no latter rain; and thou hadst a whore's forehead, thou refusedst to be ashamed.
I do not encourage us to be hateful, harsh, unloving, and unhelpful to others, even if they have different beliefs than we do. We are to love one another as we love ourselves. Pray for your enemies, if he is hungry feed him, if he is thirsty give him a drink. But there is a line to be drawn, which we cannot safely cross without endangering our salvation, and the salvation of others.
In this case, yes I have to refuse to pray together with the Pope and others. I encourage you to find the whole video and watch the entire thing. Statements like "Luther's protest is over" are not things we should take lightly -- which thing you may be unaware that was said in the video.
I would do not encourage ecumenical types of prayers - no, not at all. All churches coming together, and praying, even for peace, is not something we should be a part of.
Daniel 8:25 And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand.
Nothing wrong with praying for people. But praying for unity across denominations is something that we should not be found doing. Especially when the doctrines and teachings can be so vastly different. We are called to have no fellowship with the works of devils, Eph 5:11. And a church which is the habitation of devils is still, when all is said and done, a habitation of devils. When doctrines of devils are the teachings thereof, there can be no unity.Enquirer said:
Revelation 18:1-4 And after these things I saw another angel come down from heaven, having great power; and the earth was lightened with his glory. 2 And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird. 3 For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies. 4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.
So be it, then.
Without ill will towards you, I must say, from personal experience, I find it difficult to sit in a church next to someone in a different denominational church wondering if they ever doubted my Christianity. I am and always was a Christian, even though through the years I found that what was taught to me as truth I have had to leave behind.
I am not calling it a sin for someone to come to conclusions about my former church( whatever it may have been), but , for me, there is a taint of something that un-nerves me.
I think we must , in love, at the proper time and in the proper place, try to draw one out of an apostate situation, by all means. You can be a soldier for Christ while bearing His Peace.
Ah, but we may never agree.
And I was fully aware of the larger part of the video.
Without ill will towards you, I must say, from personal experience, I find it difficult to sit in a church next to someone in a different denominational church wondering if they ever doubted my Christianity. I am and always was a Christian, even though through the years I found that what was taught to me as truth I have had to leave behind.
I am not calling it a sin for someone to come to conclusions about my former church( whatever it may have been), but , for me, there is a taint of something that un-nerves me.
I think we must , in love, at the proper time and in the proper place, try to draw one out of an apostate situation, by all means. You can be a soldier for Christ while bearing His Peace.
Ah, but we may never agree.
And I was fully aware of the larger part of the video.
@ Raeneske ... I must admit initially I was shocked at the whole scenario ... but I breathed a sigh of relief when KC limited his words
and said nothing that in anyway endorsed Catholic doctrine or the RCC in any way.
Had he done this, I would not hesitate to send KCM an email and cancel my partnership with them with immediate effect.
I wholeheartedly agree that we should not under any circumstances whatsoever join hands across the massive divide between these
two denominations.
However, there is nothing wrong with being civil, polite or respectful as KC was.
We do not cast off, cut off or refuse to deal with the RCC people that we know, what if some are family members ?
No, we love them and pray for them, exactly what KC did.
and said nothing that in anyway endorsed Catholic doctrine or the RCC in any way.
Had he done this, I would not hesitate to send KCM an email and cancel my partnership with them with immediate effect.
I wholeheartedly agree that we should not under any circumstances whatsoever join hands across the massive divide between these
two denominations.
However, there is nothing wrong with being civil, polite or respectful as KC was.
We do not cast off, cut off or refuse to deal with the RCC people that we know, what if some are family members ?
No, we love them and pray for them, exactly what KC did.
The pope and KC and all the other preachers, follow Rome and they do not even realize they are doing it..the Roman church because of it's pagan roots based on ancient Babylon, follow the sun god, whence the assembly and "worship" day of sunday...the protestant churches split and got rid of statues, praying to Mary etc, but did not get rid of the sunday abomination...they all still blindly follow it...The seventh day sabbath which God introduced in Genesis 2, and He blessed and sanctified this day, as a Holy day..it's the seventh day of the week...not the first day of the week sun day....This is God's Holy day each week..directly from the Creator Himself! He commanded it in Ex 20 as the fourth commandment...and in many places in the Bible Isaiah for example says keeping this day proves as God says "then I am their God and they are my people"...if you want to be a true follower of Jesus, follow His commandments, of which the seventh day Sabbath is the fourth...Jesus said in John 14.15 "ifyou love me keep my Commandments"...
Rev 17 describes the harlot church, and sure sounds like the Roman church, and the daughters of the harlot are obviously the protestant offshoots...all of which are an abomination to God, and will be severely dealt with..In the meantime they continue to spread their perverted interpetation of the word of God, and ignore the teachings of Jesus in the New Covenant/testament...
Rev 17 describes the harlot church, and sure sounds like the Roman church, and the daughters of the harlot are obviously the protestant offshoots...all of which are an abomination to God, and will be severely dealt with..In the meantime they continue to spread their perverted interpetation of the word of God, and ignore the teachings of Jesus in the New Covenant/testament...
@ heretoeternity ... "the sunday abomination" ? ... sounds to me like you're still under the Law, Rom 14:5 - 6 says,
One person regards one day above another, another regards every day alike. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind.
He who observes the day, observes it for the Lord, and he who eats, does so for the Lord, for he gives thanks to God; and he who eats
not, for the Lord he does not eat, and gives thanks to God.
Whatever day you choose to observe is acceptable to God, because you observe it for God.
One person regards one day above another, another regards every day alike. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind.
He who observes the day, observes it for the Lord, and he who eats, does so for the Lord, for he gives thanks to God; and he who eats
not, for the Lord he does not eat, and gives thanks to God.
Whatever day you choose to observe is acceptable to God, because you observe it for God.
We are all under God's law, Enquirer don't you know that? Obviously you do not...as Paul said do we make void the law through faith? No we establish the law..Romans 3..that is God's law...
Your quotes above are pertaining to the Law of Moses, or Mosaic laws..the food, feast days, festivals, sacrificial, cleanliness etc laws..there are 613 such laws....are you not able to distinguish between God's law and Mosaic law? Obviously not!..you need a Bible study to get this straight..don't forget God's law, the ten commandments were written by God Himself on the stone tablets, and will be with us until "Heaven and earth pass away and all is fulfilled" Jesus Matthew 5...
Remember Enquirer, to follow the Son of God, His days, and commandments, and NOT the sun god/satan and his days of sunday, dec 25th and easter, all of which are pagan based and have NO Biblical authority!
Your quotes above are pertaining to the Law of Moses, or Mosaic laws..the food, feast days, festivals, sacrificial, cleanliness etc laws..there are 613 such laws....are you not able to distinguish between God's law and Mosaic law? Obviously not!..you need a Bible study to get this straight..don't forget God's law, the ten commandments were written by God Himself on the stone tablets, and will be with us until "Heaven and earth pass away and all is fulfilled" Jesus Matthew 5...
Remember Enquirer, to follow the Son of God, His days, and commandments, and NOT the sun god/satan and his days of sunday, dec 25th and easter, all of which are pagan based and have NO Biblical authority!
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