The relationship between faith and works.

[Behold]

Yes; and this righteousness is practical in nature

This Righteousness, is God's.
Its not of you.
You dont earn it, you dont keep it, you receive it.
Its "the GIFT of Righteousness".
Its God as Christ, redeeming your sin, and imputing you with God's righteousness.
You have NO part in this, except to receive it as God's "Gift of Salvation".
You dont walk it out, you dont perfect it, you dont endure to the end, to receive it.
Its God gained, God given, and God finished.

Its This : Philippians 1:6

 

[justbyfaith]

This Righteousness, is God's.
Its not of you.
You dont earn it, you dont keep it, you receive it.
Its "the GIFT of Righteousness".

No doubt.

Its God as Christ, redeeming your sin, and imputing you with God's righteousness.
You have NO part in this, except to receive it as God's "Gift of Salvation".
You dont walk it out, you dont perfect it, you dont endure to the end, to receive it.
Its God gained, God given, and God finished.

Its This : Philippians 1:6

It is to be received; and, once received, it is to be lived out.

Of course you don't walk it out to receive it; you receive it to be able to walk it out.

It's like someone who receives a gift (let's say, a car) on Christmas and then never uses the present given to them. I suppose that they retain the gift; but if they don't use it it is of no real value to them.

 

[Enoch111]

...You dont walk it out..

If by this you mean that God does not command Christians to live soberly, righteously, and godly in this present world, then you do have a very serious problem.

IMPUTED RIGHTEOUSNESS IS A GIFT

PRACTICAL RIGHTEOUSNESS IS A NECESSITY

 

[DPMartin]

That has no relevance here. You asked where the Bible says that we are declared righteous, and when you were shown that justification means exactly that, you should have been glad. Instead you are trying to find an excuse to disbelieve God.

BTW James Strong was a man of integrity and that is why his monumental work continues to serve Christians. Thayer's Greek Lexicon goes into more detail, but they are in complete agreement.

you are the one who brought up "precise". and I disagree with the Strong's as more accurate then the language that the bible was translated to itself.

did you know in the English version of English saw has nothing to do with you had seen something. in the very first chapter of scripture the word "saw" is used, and God saw that it was good. in the 1600's saw was a saw blade or something shaped as a saw blade or as Shakespeare used it saw is to declare. and in the OED brit version saw is still only defined as those two prevailing definitions.

 

[Behold]

If by this you mean that God does not command Christians to live soberly, righteously, and godly in this present world, then you do have a very serious problem.

IMPUTED RIGHTEOUSNESS IS A GIFT

PRACTICAL RIGHTEOUSNESS IS A NECESSITY

You are indeed supposed to present your body to God, every second you are alive, as a living sacrifice.
But you are never to do this, thinking that its because you are doing this, that God accepts you, and if you dont, He does not accept you.
So, as long as you present yourself to God, always knowing that He accepts you only because of The CROSS, then you are believing Right.
But to believe that God will not accept you, if you don't live right, is to deny the Grace of God.

 

[Behold]

No doubt.

It is to be received; and, once received, it is to be lived out.

Your are teaching that "living it out" is how you stay saved.
This denies the Cross.

Did the dying Thief on the Cross "live it out"?

You are not saved by "living it out " later.
You live it out, because you are already Saved., but not to try to stay saved.

 

[justbyfaith]

Your are teaching that "living it out" is how you stay saved.

That is not what I am teaching.

To know what I am teaching, you would have to read everything that I have written on these boards over the last two years or so since I started posting on these boards.

You live it out, because you are already Saved., but not to try to stay saved.

I agree.

 

[Enoch111]

But you are never to do this, thinking that its because you are doing this, that God accepts you, and if you dont, He does not accept you.

What makes you think Christians believe this nonsense? Just because you are deficient in Gospel truth does not mean that others are in the same boat.

 

[Enoch111]

...and I disagree with the Strong's as more accurate then the language that the bible was translated to itself.

So now you are pretending that you are a better scholar of Hebrew and Greek than Strong, Thayer, etc. who all agree on what δικαιόω means. Or are you suggesting that no one can properly translate Hebrew and Greek unless you put your hand to it?

 

[justbyfaith]

What makes you think Christians believe this nonsense? Just because you are deficient in Gospel truth does not mean that others are in the same boat.

What he said there, is actually not deficient in gospel truth.

We are redeemed solely through the blood of the Cross, our performance has nothing to do with it.

A good "performance" has everything to do with the work of the Holy Spirit that comes as the result of being truly saved, however.

 

[Grailhunter]

Your are teaching that "living it out" is how you stay saved.
This denies the Cross.

Did the dying Thief on the Cross "live it out"?

You are not saved by "living it out " later.
You live it out, because you are already Saved., but not to try to stay saved.

Wait a minute.
You are not saved by "living it out " later.
You live it out, because you are already Saved., but not to try to stay saved. Your are teaching that "living it out" is how you stay saved. This denies the Cross.

Yes living it out, our walk with Christ. After you are saved you can become something between Hitler and Nancy Pelosi and the cross is not going do you any good. Or you can be a good Christian and sit like a bump on the log and do nothing for fear of sinning, only being concerned about yourself going to heaven and in the end Christ will throw you in to utter darkness. Read the story of the Talents.
Did the dying Thief on the Cross "live it out"?

What about the thief? All we know is Christ took care of him. The Bible says nothing about the thief being baptized, nothing about the thief going to heaven. Nothing about Christ going from the Cross to heaven to the tomb and resurrection and back to heaven. Bottomline we do not know exactly what happened to the thief, other than Christ took him to a good place. You have to be careful about a single unexplained scripture setting the rest of the Gospel on it ear.

 

[Enoch111]

What he said there, is actually not deficient in gospel truth.

It is a false accusation. No one believes that kind of nonsense.

 

[justbyfaith]

It is a false accusation. No one believes that kind of nonsense.

I'm not sure I'm following you...what did he say that was an accusation?

 

[LC627]

Good works are the fruit of salvation - not the root

 

[justbyfaith]

You are indeed supposed to present your body to God, every second you are alive, as a living sacrifice.
But you are never to do this, thinking that its because you are doing this, that God accepts you, and if you dont, He does not accept you.
So, as long as you present yourself to God, always knowing that He accepts you only because of The CROSS, then you are believing Right.
But to believe that God will not accept you, if you don't live right, is to deny the Grace of God.

You present yourself to God so that He might accept you...think of what this means at every level.

 

[Behold]

You present yourself to God so that He might accept you..

Wrong again, legalist.

Jesus presents us to God, as blood bought, and God accepts us as washed in the blood.

If you try to present yourself so that God will accept you, you'll die and burn in the lake of fire, as God will not accept you or your filthy rags of self righteousness.
God will never accept YOU based on you "presenting you".
Not ever, Legalist.
Not EVER.

 

[Truther]

Wrong again, legalist.

Jesus presents us to God, as blood bought, and God accepts us as washed in the blood.

If you try to present yourself so that God will accept you, you'll die and burn in the lake of fire, as God will not accept you or your filthy rags of self righteousness.
God will never accept YOU based on you "presenting you".
Not ever, Legalist.
Not EVER.

That works....as long as we don't say we "accept Jesus as our personal savior".

Who do we think we are saying "accept Jesus"?

 

[Behold]

That works....as long as we don't say we "accept Jesus as our personal savior".

Who do we think we are saying "accept Jesus"?

There are a lot of phrases that are used to qualify heart trust in Christ.

"believe on"
"believe in"
"receive by faith"
"accept the Lord into your life"
"accept the Lord into your heart"
"let Jesus into your life"

So, these are all really the same idea.
A person hears the Gospel, understands they are lost, and they are lead by the Holy Spirit to the Cross where they place their Faith in Christ.
God sees this faith.
He SEES IT because God knows our thoughts and our intent and our motive.
God sees our Faith in Christ, this "heart trust", and He accepts it to then give you His Righteousness, which you become as "the righteousness of God in Christ" = Born again.

 

[Truther]

There are a lot of phrases that are used to qualify heart trust in Christ.

"believe on"
"believe in"
"receive by faith"
"accept the Lord into your life"
"accept the Lord into your heart"
"let Jesus into your life"

So, these are all really the same idea.
A person hears the Gospel, understands they are lost, and they are lead by the Holy Spirit to the Cross where they place their Faith in Christ.
God sees this faith.
He SEES IT because God knows our thoughts and our intent and our motive.
God sees our Faith in Christ, this "heart trust", and He accepts it to then give you His Righteousness, which you become as "the righteousness of God in Christ" = Born again.

I can see God accepting mankind(Grace).

But man accepting God?

That means God is on the same level as man....like God groveling on our level hoping that wicked men would accept Him.

 

[Behold]

I can see God accepting mankind(Grace).

But man accepting God?

That means God is on the same level as man....like God groveling on our level hoping that wicked men would accept Him.

God became one of us.
So, that is God on our level, as unless God became a man, and completed our salvation as a human, there would be no salvation available.