The theological fallacy of a spiritual 'resurrection'

[ewq1938]

You disregard the fact Jesus returns in fire and final judgment (The End) you aren't going to remove the scripture seen below

Now you are just sidestepping the issue with copy and paste text. Typical Amillennial avoidance. I have proven the rod of iron rule does not begin until Christ returns. That proves Premillennialism is correct and avoiding that fact is a typical Amillennial response.

 

[Truth7t7]

Now you are just sidestepping the issue with copy and paste text. Typical Amillennial avoidance. I have proven the rod of iron rule does not begin until Christ returns. That proves Premillennialism is correct and avoiding that fact is a typical Amillennial response.

You avoid the fact it's fire time when Jesus returns, and the earth is going to be dissolved by fire "Gone"

There isn't a Millennial Kingdom on this earth after the return of Jesus Christ, you don't want to face this truth, as you avoid the fire in return as if it doesn't exist

 

[Truth7t7]

Now you are just sidestepping the issue with copy and paste text. Typical Amillennial avoidance. I have proven the rod of iron rule does not begin until Christ returns. That proves Premillennialism is correct and avoiding that fact is a typical Amillennial response.

When Jesus Christ Returns It Will Be (The End) Not The Start Of A Millennial Kingdom On Earth

As scripture clearly teaches below in 1 Corinthinas 15:23-24 , when Jesus Christ returns then comes (The End)

Many disregard (Then Cometh The End) as they desire to see a mortal Millennial Kingdom on earth, after the coming of Jesus Christ

Afterward they that are Christ's at his coming. Then cometh the end, not a Millennial Kingdom on this earth as many falsely claim

(Then Cometh The End)

(Death Is Swallowed Up In Victory)

1 Corinthians 15:21-26 & 51-54KJV
21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.
22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

 

[Davy]

Are you only a Christian certain months of the year?

I like watermelon from the U.S. state of Georgia. Like their vidalia onions, very sweet.

 

[The Light]

Roger dodger.

Jolly Roger Dodger

 

[ewq1938]

More dodging the issue. Typical Amillennialism.

When Jesus Christ Returns It Will Be (The End) Not The Start Of A Millennial Kingdom On Earth

As scripture clearly teaches below in 1 Corinthinas 15:23-24 , when Jesus Christ returns then comes (The End)

Many disregard (Then Cometh The End) as they desire to see a mortal Millennial Kingdom on earth, after the coming of Jesus Christ

Afterward they that are Christ's at his coming. Then cometh the end, not a Millennial Kingdom on this earth as many falsely claim

(Then Cometh The End)

(Death Is Swallowed Up In Victory)

1 Corinthians 15:21-26 & 51-54KJV
21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.
22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

 

[ewq1938]

You avoid the fact it's fire time when Jesus returns, and the earth is going to be dissolved by fire "Gone"

That is unscriptural. The second coming is in Revelation 19 and no fire destroys the world and heaven at that time.

There isn't a Millennial Kingdom on this earth after the return of Jesus Christ

That denies many scriptures such as Revelation 2, 19 and 20.

 

[GEN2REV]

I have proven the rod of iron rule does not begin until Christ returns. That proves Premillennialism is correct and avoiding that fact is a typical Amillennial response.

How have you proven that?

 

[Behold]

​

All humans born into this world ("born of the flesh") are not "born spiritually dead". Rather, we are born without eternal spiritual life, .

What you wrote is not true.

Listen,

When an unbeliever dies, they are sent to Hell.
Not their body.
They, later will be Judged for the unpardonable sin of "Christ rejection".
Their spirit will then encounter the "2nd Death"....and that is not death, that is their spiritual life, continued, as the Spirit never dies....but the un-born again spirit exists after JUDGEMENT..... IN The Lake of Fire, that never ends.......as that is the eternity that finds the SPIRIT of every Christ Rejector who dies.

Unbelievers are not damned after they die......they are damned NOW, and are JUGDED after they die..

John 3:36

Reader, you are NOT a Body.
You are a Spirit Being, that lives in a body.
The body dies, but the real you, the spirit, never dies.
Where will it end up...the real you?
You decide that end result destination on earth, before you die........by being born again, or not.

 

[GEN2REV]

What you wrote is not true.

Listen,

When an unbeliever dies, they are sent to Hell.
Not their body.
They, later will be Judged for the unpardonable sin of "Christ rejection".
Their spirit will then encounter the "2nd Death"....and that is not death, that is their spiritual life, continued, as the Spirit never dies....but the un-born again spirit exists after JUDGEMENT..... IN The Lake of Fire, that never ends.......as that is the eternity that finds the SPIRIT of every Christ Rejector who dies.

Unbelievers are not damned after they die......they are damned NOW, and are JUGDED after they die..

John 3:36

Reader, you are NOT a Body.
You are a Spirit Being, that lives in a body.
The body dies, but the real you, the spirit, never dies.
Where will it end up...the real you?
You decide that end result destination on earth, before you die........by being born again, or not.

I actually agree with Fullness on this one point, but I commented to him about it and he won't respond.

I think maybe he didn't realize that it negates Pre-Mil and now he doesn't want to address it at all.

This concept is taught over and over throughout Scripture, though.

Why would an unbeliever, who never knew God and was never given any faith to begin with, be punished in hell? That makes no sense.

Yet, those who are given the gift of faith Ephesians 2:8 are expected to do certain things with it.

The unfaithful servant who did nothing with the money he was given, etc. It makes so much more logical sense that God would punish those who He has given a gift of faith for doing nothing with it and for not following His ways.

Matthew 7:21-23 is another example of that concept with the 'Many who say Lord, Lord' and are rejected because they lived in sin and never got to know Jesus.

But, it's ok. I get it. You will never, ever, ever even consider this possibility, no matter how much it is backed by Scripture.

It is what it is.

 

[Behold]

Why would an unbeliever, who never knew God and was never given any faith to begin with, be punished in hell? .

People are not "given faith".....they are given the option to believe in JESUS.

Its Calvinism, the worst type, "hyper" "tulip".... that teaches that God saves some and decides others will burn in the lake of Fire..
This is accusing God of being a Psychopath. Its poison Hell sent Theology that the nutbar Calvin seeped into the body of Christ, like a Viper tossed into a Child's Crib.
It BITES the truth right out of the Gospel of Grace.
It poisons FAITH in Christ.
The Devil loves it.

Listen..
God does not choose some to burn, and chooses others to go to heaven.
He OFFERS Salvation, to "ALL who will come"...>"to as many as will believe'.

God does not Pick you for Hell, or Pick you for Heaven, before you are born and have not even heard about JESUS YET. !!
He OFFERS Heaven, to everyone, .... by one condition.

= "the work of God is that you believe on Jesus, whom God sent".

Look...

If God is LOVE< the how is it God's love to pick a mother to go to heaven, and her daughter to burn in the lake of fire?
That is not LOVE, that is CRAZY...and that is CALVINISM...."Hyper". "TULIP".

God would not send His Son Jesus The Lord to suffer the Cross for SOME, but not all.....
John 3:16 is not a LIE !!

Yet nutbar Calvinism, this theological insanity, teaches exactly that...that God will choose YOU< but not your kids. Or He'll choose you Mother but not your Father, to go to heaven., because he chose your KIDS and ONE PARENT to burn in the lake of fire.

Reader........See that? That is "crazy Calvinism".
Do not listen to people who teach this sick deception.
Do not belong to a "church" that teaches this Satanic Doctrine.

 

[GEN2REV]

People are not "given faith".....

Ephesians 2:8
"... faith ... it is the gift of God."
Ephesians 2:8

Are people given faith, Behold?

 

[GEN2REV]

@Behold

Who can come to Jesus on their own, Behold?
"Nobody can come to Me except the Father ... draw him to Me ..."
John 6:44

Can anybody come to Jesus of their own accord, Behold?
"Nobody can come to Me except the Father ... draw him to Me ..."
John 6:44

Who can come to Jesus, Behold?

 

[Timtofly]

If you read that carefully, you should see that "our Lord" refers to God the Father. So, that is talking about when Jesus delivers the kingdom to the Father at His second coming, as Paul taught in 1 Corinthians 15:22-24.

So Jesus is not Christ?

 

[Timtofly]

Jesus doesn't rule in the future as a King with a rod of iron, as a scepter sitting on a throne as you suggest

The rod of iron is a tool of destruction, as a Potter destroys his clay vessels with a rod of iron

Revelation 2:27KJV
27 And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father.

Revelation 19:15KJV
15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

I am pretty sure no one will be able to disobey Jesus the Prince more than one time, after being literally killed by that iron rod rule. You said it, total destruction of pottery, no rehabilitation necessary.

 

[Davy]

That is unscriptural. The second coming is in Revelation 19 and no fire destroys the world and heaven at that time.

That denies many scriptures such as Revelation 2, 19 and 20.

@Truth7t7 is an Amillennialist. They believe on the day of Jesus' 2nd coming all the wicked are destroyed and we immediately go into God's future new heavens and a new earth. That's an old doctrine that began to creep into the early Church in the 2nd century A.D. It was not... a doctrine of the 1st century Christian Church. The Gnostics began to creep in starting around the 2nd century, so it likely came from them.

But speaking about God's consuming fire... Apostle Peter actually gave us a detail of that on the last day of this world in 2 Peter 3. But, Peter was covering 2 previous destructions God had done upon this earth, and those did not literally turn this earth into nothing like it never existed...

3 World Ages:
1. "the world that then was" -- time when God ended Satan's original rebellion of old.
2. "the heavens and the earth, which are now" -- today's world earth age, preserved unto God's consuming fire.
3. "new heavens and a new earth" -- God's future Eternity.

The first destruction upon the earth was by waters of a flood, to end Satan's rebellion. Like the flood of Noah's day, it simply 'cleansed' the SURFACE of this earth of those works, not literal destroy all of the earth (otherwise we wouldn't be here today).

The future destruction on the day of Christ's coming, on the "day of the Lord", will melt man's works off the SURFACE of this earth, not literally destroy the whole earth like Truth7t7 and many others think.

So even the future destruction upon the earth by God's consuming fire on the day of Christ's future return, that still to be compared to the previous destructions upon the surface of this earth that God did of old.

 

[Behold]

Ephesians 2:8
"... faith ... it is the gift of God."
Ephesians 2:8Are people given faith, Behold?

Salvation is Christ on the Cross.
This is the "Gift" of God.......= "The Gift of Salvation"
People are not given faith, they are given FREE WILL, that allows them to BELIEVE, or not.

 

[Truth7t7]

[B][COLOR=#b30000]The future destruction on the day of Christ's coming, on the "day of the Lord", will melt man's works off the SURFACE of this earth, not literally destroy the whole earth like Truth7t7 and many others think.[/COLOR][/B]

So even the future destruction upon the earth by God's consuming fire on the day of Christ's future return, that still to be compared to the previous destructions upon the surface of this earth that God did of old.

Scripture clearly teaches the heavens and earth will be "Dissolved" by fire to the very "Elements"

Davy you aren't going to change the very clear words of God below, simple, clear, easy to understand

The believer is clearly instructed to look for new heavens and earth, the new creation Revelation 21:1-5

2 Peter 3:10-13KJV
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

 

[GEN2REV]

Salvation is Christ on the Cross.
This is the "Gift" of God.......= "The Gift of Salvation"
People are not given faith, they are given FREE WILL, that allows them to BELIEVE, or not.

I won't name any names, but somebody is living in deep denial.

 

[Desire Of All Nations]

People are not "given faith".....they are given the option to believe in JESUS.

You cannot possibly support this belief with scripture, primarily because it contradicts Jesus' statement in Jhn 6:44 where He plainly states that the Father has to initiate the conversion process by drawing the desired person to Himself. No true follower of God in the Bible woke up one day and decided on their own volition that they were going to follow Him. Jesus told His followers at the time that He chose them and not the other way around(Jhn 15:16).

**Amillennial Strawman fallacy ALERT!**


No one died refusing to worship the image of the beast and refusing to take the mark of the beast. Those things can happen only in the 42 month Great Tribulation of Revelation 13. It's the second beast the False Prophet that makes people worship the image and take the mark. The saints of Revelation 20 refused to do that but had the testimony of Christ. That cannot be applied to just any people or era.

This 1 quote alone shows why you are absolutely wrong:

"Some [Sabbatarians] were rent and torn to pieces, some burned to ashes with powder, some roasted on pillars; others were hanged on trees, killed by the sword, or drowned; many were executed with a gag in their mouth to prevent them from talking.”
“Like sheep and lambs, they were led to slaughter by the score. Bibles were strictly prohibited in many places; in others, even burned. Many were stared, and many were tormented in various ways before they died; others, too young for execution, were lashed; many had to suffer for years in dungeons and towers; others, after having holes burned through their cheeks were dismissed. And those who escaped all this torture, often had to hide in caves and rocks, in the woods, and under the ground, searched by dogs and sergeants.”
“They sang praises to their God while being led to execution; virgins adorned themselves for this occasion as for a feast.”
“ Others have smiled at the water destined to be their grave, displaying manly bravery, because they had on the armor of God, or they exhorted the people to repentance, before firmly marching up to the stake.” - "History of the Martyrs of Christ", approx. A.D. 1610

And that was just a description of the kind of persecution people who rejected the mark faced from Catholics and Protestants around the time of the Reformation.The mark has existed for as long as the Roman religion existed. It is clearly not something that will be invented in the future because Rev. 13 establishes the fact that the political and religious figure will enforce a pre-existing mark:

"He was granted power to give breath to the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak and cause as many as would not worship the image of the beast to be killed." - Rev. 13:17

The fact that Catholics and Protestants haven't murdered anyone for rejecting the mark in recent memory doesn't mean that the mark doesn't already exist.

It makes 0 sense to claim that no one was ever killed for refusing the mark before the Tribulation when Rev. 2:10 shows Christ telling His saints in the Smyrna era to "be faithful unto death". Dan. 7 and Rev. 13 even talks about how the great false church would be given power to persecute God's saints. Those passages apply to the entire Church period, not just the Tribulation.