The Third Woe

[Trekson]

When the Satan is cast to the earth with his fallen angels, it is referred to as woe to the inhabitants of the earth, however, that is NOT the 3rd woe. You see there is still 3 1/2 years to go of persecution. (Rev. 12: 14)

The great earthquake is the second woe which is at the end of the trib. (Rev. 11: 13, 16: 17 & 18)

The 3rd woe is when Jesus returns.

Heavy sigh, I know what I was shown. Read Rev. 8:13 which announces the three woes, read how it is addressed, "Woe to the inhabiters of the earth" They open w/ that line and close w/ that line in Rev. 12:12, "woe to the inhabiters of the earth...for the devil has come down...". If you can't see that connection then I'd ask the HS for guidance and understanding. Armageddon is 'not" the third woe. When Christ returns after Armageddon, it will be a time of intense joy and praise as the Feast of Tabernacles is finally fulfilled which portrayed the time that Christ comes to "tabernacle" (live) among men.

 

[Button]

The Three Woes.

Rev. 8:13 - " And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth by reason of the other voices of the trumpet of the three angels, which are yet to sound!"

The first woe is completed by the 5th trump as found in Rev.9:12 - "One woe is past; and, behold, there come two woes more hereafter."
The second woe is completed by the 6th trump and after the Jerusalem earthquake that destroys a tenth of the city and kills 7000 Rev.11:13-14. - "The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly."

The third woe sounds at the 7th trump ( the last time a “woe” is mentioned in Revelation in the KJ ) and is found in Rev. 11:15 - Just after the 7th trump sounds there is a short interlude in the narrative. The 7th trump completes the wrath of the Lamb and the angels are speaking forward in faith about what will come when the wrath of God is completed. Rev. 12:12 tells us what the third woe is" Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time."

This third and final time a woe is mentioned is connected to the originating verse, Rev. 8:13 by the phrase, “woe to the inhabiters of the earth” (This is also the last time that phrase is used in the KJ). Since this is the case, shortly after this verse we find in Rev. 12:14 - "And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent."

We also see in Rev. 13:5 that the Beast out of the Sea (the a/c) is given the equivalent time of 42 months.

As we all know the underlined times given means 3 1/2 yrs. So, here is the inescapable conclusion. At least the first six trumpet judgments must be concluded before the middle of the 70th week.

I've come up with another question and a possible, tentative alternative for my fellow futurists.
Who said that all the seals must be within the context of the 70th week? I've always believed they were but is there any scriptural "proof"?

Here's my tentative alternative. Could WW3 as shown in the 2nd seal begin the 70th week and could the a/c make a covenant based on that war that begins the week? The 1st seal doesn't imply that is when the covenant is signed. The a/c will need some time to earn his rep, so to speak and he comes conquering by deception, not war. Some event has to put him in the limelight for the folks in Rev. 13:4 to say what they do!
What do you guys think?

I think it would be naive to imagine someone would be given insight into events that would occur more than nineteen hundred years into a future 1st century primitive minds could never conceive.

If John was exiled to Patmos to stop him from spreading the Gospel,how is it he obtained materials to record prophecies from the same God who gave him the Gospel?

Revelation tells you what God is going to do to us. After thousands of years of giving him worship so that he doesn't send us to hell for expressing the very nature he imbued us with first? Because the first of our kind ate from a tree he planted in Edens garden. And could only imbue Adam and Eve with understanding of good or evil because God made it so.

And as such, the battle between good and evil ensued.

God does all that he pleases.

He created people for mercy. And others to be destroyed.

God is sovereign and has dominion over his creation. He predestined the world.

He tells us this in his word.

And ever since it appeared in printed,published,versions, we, the clay,have tried to reason the why, of our journey and the future that the potter has in mind.

Love Jesus and the Life He gives you. If you trust him you can take every step,unafraid.

Proverbs 16:9

 

[TribulationSigns]

Heavy sigh, I know what I was shown. Read Rev. 8:13 which announces the three woes, read how it is addressed, "Woe to the inhabiters of the earth" They open w/ that line and close w/ that line in Rev. 12:12, "woe to the inhabiters of the earth...for the devil has come down...". If you can't see that connection then I'd ask the HS for guidance and understanding. Armageddon is 'not" the third woe. When Christ returns after Armageddon, it will be a time of intense joy and praise as the Feast of Tabernacles is finally fulfilled which portrayed the time that Christ comes to "tabernacle" (live) among men.

Take a breath and read slowly:

Rev 8:13
(13) And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth by reason of the other voices of the trumpet of the three angels, which are yet to sound!

God is talking about the last three trumpets. The fifth, sixth and seventh! Are you in denial that the three upcoming woes are explicitly ties to the three remaining trumpets? Or are you spiritual deaf and blind that you do not like to hear what God clearly says.

 

[Trekson]

day 220 is when the daily sacrifices begin again. Not taken away. day 220 is around 7 months into the start of the seven years.


day 220 is the start up day of the daily sacrifices again. So you have a wrong basis for your calculations.

You are approaching when the AoD is set up from the wrong direction. Instead, subtract 1335 days from the day Jesus returns, day 2520. 2520-1335 = day 1185 of the 7 year that the AoD will be set up.

The great tribulation will last 1335 days and end when Jesus returns.

Sorry but they only last a short time. They begin as part of the covenant on day 1. Jesus does "not" return on day 2520. The week ends when Israel fulfills the last three goals of Dan. 9:24 which they can't do until after Armageddon. After Armageddon there will still be 45-75 days left of the 70th week left for them to perform those acts. The millennium doesn't start the same day he returns either. There are other prophecies that need to be fulfilled between Armageddon and the start of the millennium.

 

[Trekson]

I think it would be naive to imagine someone would be given insight into events that would occur more than nineteen hundred years into a future 1st century primitive minds could never conceive.

If John was exiled to Patmos to stop him from spreading the Gospel,how is it he obtained materials to record prophecies from the same God who gave him the Gospel?

Revelation tells you what God is going to do to us. After thousands of years of giving him worship so that he doesn't send us to hell for expressing the very nature he imbued us with first? Because the first of our kind ate from a tree he planted in Edens garden. And could only imbue Adam and Eve with understanding of good or evil because God made it so.

And as such, the battle between good and evil ensued.

God does all that he pleases.

He created people for mercy. And others to be destroyed.

God is sovereign and has dominion over his creation. He predestined the world.

He tells us this in his word.

And ever since it appeared in printed,published,versions, we, the clay,have tried to reason the why, of our journey and the future that the potter has in mind.

Love Jesus and the Life He gives you. If you trust him you can take every step,unafraid.

Proverbs 16:9

Dan. 12 tells us that in the latter days, knowledge will increase. I believe that includes both secular and prophetic knowledge as well. A few of the prophecies given in Rev. couldn't even begin to be understood until we reached a level of technology that reveals them.

 

[TribulationSigns]

Dan. 12 tells us that in the latter days, knowledge will increase. I believe that includes both secular and prophetic knowledge as well. A few of the prophecies given in Rev. couldn't even begin to be understood until we reached a level of technology that reveals them.

Dan 12:4
(4) But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.

You believe the knowledge of Daniel 12 has to do with the technology we develop today? That is typically premillennial belief.
No, clearly, you do not understand what is the time of the end and what knowledge the Lord was really talking about.

 

[Marilyn C]

Heavy sigh, I know what I was shown. Read Rev. 8:13 which announces the three woes, read how it is addressed, "Woe to the inhabiters of the earth" They open w/ that line and close w/ that line in Rev. 12:12, "woe to the inhabiters of the earth...for the devil has come down...". If you can't see that connection then I'd ask the HS for guidance and understanding. Armageddon is 'not" the third woe. When Christ returns after Armageddon, it will be a time of intense joy and praise as the Feast of Tabernacles is finally fulfilled which portrayed the time that Christ comes to "tabernacle" (live) among men.

I do read the word `woe,` and can understand that people would read it as the 3rd woe. However, that is a superficial reading of God`s word. You see God`s word says -

`Woe, woe, woe to the remaining blasts of the trumpet of the three angels who are about to sound.` (Rev. 8: 13)

The 5th trumpet/1st owe - demons out of the pit. (Rev. 9: 1 - 12)

The 6th trumpet/2nd woe - great army - great earthquake. (Rev. 9: 13 - 21 to Rev. 11: 13 & 14)

The 7th trumpet/ 3rd woe - Lord returns and the kingdoms of the world become His kingdoms. (Rev. 11: 15) Notice the temple of God is opened, that is the same as heaven opened and the Lord comes forth. (Rev. 11: 19 & Rev. 19: 11)


You need to know that the Revelation of the Lord as He is known in the heavenly realms is in 4 parts.

1. Jesus Head of His Body. (Rev. 1 - 3) The time span of the building and maturing of the Body of Christ.

2. Jesus enthroned on His own throne with the Body of Christ. He is given the judgment scroll. We are shown like a video what will be judged. (Rev. 4 - 7) This starts at the beginning of the trib till he comes in power and glory, end of trib. It is an overview.

3. Jesus the Mediator of the New Covenant for Israel. (Rev. 8 - 13) Jesus is the mighty victor over Satan. This is the actual beginning of the trib, and continues till the Lord comes at the end of the trib. (rev. 11: 19) There are also extra descriptions of the scriptural identity of the Lord, (the promised Child) and Satan, the dragon.

4. Jesus is the Judge and Maker of all things new. (Rev. 14 - 22) This section starts halfway through the trib. (Rev. 14: 1) and continues till the Lord returns. (Rev. 19: 11) There are also extra parts revealing Babylon (religious, economic and political), all being judged.

All things new - Rev. 21 & 22)

 

[Douggg]

Sorry but they only last a short time. They begin as part of the covenant on day 1.

The daily sacrifices cannot be started until a temple has been built.

The daily sacrifices beginning again will be on day 220, at the start of the 2300 days of Daniel 8:13-14.

 

[ewq1938]

The bible tells us when the third woe is and that is found in Rev. 12:12. Satan coming down to earth, that's it, that ends the third woe, but that doesn't end the a/c's rule of terror upon the church and the remnant.

The third woe trump is Christ coming to Earth, not satan. Satan was cast to Earth long before the 3rd woe trump. IMO he is cast here in the 3rd trump

 

[Trekson]

Take a breath and read slowly:

Rev 8:13
(13) And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth by reason of the other voices of the trumpet of the three angels, which are yet to sound!

God is talking about the last three trumpets. The fifth, sixth and seventh! Are you in denial that the three upcoming woes are explicitly ties to the three remaining trumpets? Or are you spiritual deaf and blind that you do not like to hear what God clearly says.

Of course not, you're just not dividing them correctly. The trumpet sounds (which is the announcement that the following events will be the woe spoken of. I thought I made that pretty clear!

Dan 12:4
(4) But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.

You believe the knowledge of Daniel 12 has to do with the technology we develop today? That is typically premillennial belief.
No, clearly, you do not understand what is the time of the end and what knowledge the Lord was really talking about.

Or perhaps it's you don't know. If one isn't premill they have no hope of truly understanding prophetic scripture. They have to make up fulfillments that really have nothing to w/ the prophecies at all.

 

[Trekson]

I do read the word `woe,` and can understand that people would read it as the 3rd woe. However, that is a superficial reading of God`s word. You see God`s word says -

`Woe, woe, woe to the remaining blasts of the trumpet of the three angels who are about to sound.` (Rev. 8: 13)

The 5th trumpet/1st owe - demons out of the pit. (Rev. 9: 1 - 12)

The 6th trumpet/2nd woe - great army - great earthquake. (Rev. 9: 13 - 21 to Rev. 11: 13 & 14)

The 7th trumpet/ 3rd woe - Lord returns and the kingdoms of the world become His kingdoms. (Rev. 11: 15) Notice the temple of God is opened, that is the same as heaven opened and the Lord comes forth. (Rev. 11: 19 & Rev. 19: 11)


You need to know that the Revelation of the Lord as He is known in the heavenly realms is in 4 parts.

1. Jesus Head of His Body. (Rev. 1 - 3) The time span of the building and maturing of the Body of Christ.

2. Jesus enthroned on His own throne with the Body of Christ. He is given the judgment scroll. We are shown like a video what will be judged. (Rev. 4 - 7) This starts at the beginning of the trib till he comes in power and glory, end of trib. It is an overview.

3. Jesus the Mediator of the New Covenant for Israel. (Rev. 8 - 13) Jesus is the mighty victor over Satan. This is the actual beginning of the trib, and continues till the Lord comes at the end of the trib. (rev. 11: 19) There are also extra descriptions of the scriptural identity of the Lord, (the promised Child) and Satan, the dragon.

4. Jesus is the Judge and Maker of all things new. (Rev. 14 - 22) This section starts halfway through the trib. (Rev. 14: 1) and continues till the Lord returns. (Rev. 19: 11) There are also extra parts revealing Babylon (religious, economic and political), all being judged.

All things new - Rev. 21 & 22)

There are a whole lot of events happening at the 7th trump and most of them have nothing to do w/ the 3rd woe. Thankfully, scripture tells us exactly what part the 3rd woe is, so there should be no confusion. The body of Christ doesn't meet Christ until sometime after the mid-point of the 70th week. The "woe" part isn't the identifier, the "inhabiters of the earth" is.

 

[Trekson]

The daily sacrifices cannot be started until a temple has been built.

The daily sacrifices beginning again will be on day 220, at the start of the 2300 days of Daniel 8:13-14.

View attachment 80761

There is no reason to assume that the temple won't be completed before the 70th week begins. A portable tabernacle like they had in the OT would suffice as a fulfillment to the related prophecies.

 

[Trekson]

The third woe trump is Christ coming to Earth, not satan. Satan was cast to Earth long before the 3rd woe trump. IMO he is cast here in the 3rd trump

Scripture says differently. The word "woe" isn't mentioned again after Rev. 12:12. If that doesn't clarify it for you, nothing will.

 

[soberxp]

For a time, and times, and half a time,
Three times correspond to three Woe.
The Third Woe correspond to half a time.
I don't think it correspond to 42 months.

And what makes you think of the Third World War?
@Trekson

 

[Douggg]

There is no reason to assume that the temple won't be completed before the 70th week begins. A portable tabernacle like they had in the OT would suffice as a fulfillment to the related prophecies.

I don't think so because of the Muslim control of the temple mount.

 

[TribulationSigns]

Of course not, you're just not dividing them correctly. The trumpet sounds (which is the announcement that the following events will be the woe spoken of. I thought I made that pretty clear!

No, you didn’t. You’re not standing on Scripture — you’re standing on your own imagination. When someone refuses to read correctly and won’t compare Scripture with Scripture, that’s not conviction — that’s self-deception.

If you’re not willing to be teachable, then there’s nothing more to discuss. Enjoy your trip to the ignore list.

 

[ScottA]

The Three Woes.

Rev. 8:13 - " And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth by reason of the other voices of the trumpet of the three angels, which are yet to sound!"

The first woe is completed by the 5th trump as found in Rev.9:12 - "One woe is past; and, behold, there come two woes more hereafter."
The second woe is completed by the 6th trump and after the Jerusalem earthquake that destroys a tenth of the city and kills 7000 Rev.11:13-14. - "The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly."

The third woe sounds at the 7th trump ( the last time a “woe” is mentioned in Revelation in the KJ ) and is found in Rev. 11:15 - Just after the 7th trump sounds there is a short interlude in the narrative. The 7th trump completes the wrath of the Lamb and the angels are speaking forward in faith about what will come when the wrath of God is completed. Rev. 12:12 tells us what the third woe is" Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time."

This third and final time a woe is mentioned is connected to the originating verse, Rev. 8:13 by the phrase, “woe to the inhabiters of the earth” (This is also the last time that phrase is used in the KJ). Since this is the case, shortly after this verse we find in Rev. 12:14 - "And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent."

We also see in Rev. 13:5 that the Beast out of the Sea (the a/c) is given the equivalent time of 42 months.

As we all know the underlined times given means 3 1/2 yrs. So, here is the inescapable conclusion. At least the first six trumpet judgments must be concluded before the middle of the 70th week.

I've come up with another question and a possible, tentative alternative for my fellow futurists.
Who said that all the seals must be within the context of the 70th week? I've always believed they were but is there any scriptural "proof"?

Here's my tentative alternative. Could WW3 as shown in the 2nd seal begin the 70th week and could the a/c make a covenant based on that war that begins the week? The 1st seal doesn't imply that is when the covenant is signed. The a/c will need some time to earn his rep, so to speak and he comes conquering by deception, not war. Some event has to put him in the limelight for the folks in Rev. 13:4 to say what they do!
What do you guys think?

Aaah, you were doing so good...until your "As we all know..." paragraph!

That common "70th week" doctrine--that many do indeed believe, but do not "know"-- is unfortunately part of the "destructive heresies" originally taught by the "false teachers" spoken of by Peter, resulting in the "lie" and "strong delusion" ("as we all know") crowd foretold by Paul. All of which is also prophecy and the word of God, not to be continually kicked down the road ahead as if it did not include the many members and many generations of the Church that followed--which most still do even to this day.

But I am not going to argue, I am just going to state the actual truth--which God has not left never to be revealed, but has in fact also included in prophecy, as it is written of these times in particular. Here is what is actually true:

Daniel equated the seventy weeks or seven years--or whatever so many have imagined--as also being three times, in the phrase: "a time, times, and half a time"...which are the three times of Christ which Jesus stated, saying, "Behold, I cast out demons and perform cures today and tomorrow, and the third I shall be perfected." Which are not three advents, but three acts occurring in this world over all of "time" from the beginning unto the end--"time" which is divided in "half." Which is also that "half" an hour of "silence in heaven."​

Very concisely then, the third woe, is a reference to what happens to evil and darkness and to the tares, when Jesus is perfected.​

 

[Trekson]

I don't think so because of the Muslim control of the temple mount.

Nothing scripturally says it has to be in the exact same location.

 

[Trekson]

No, you didn’t. You’re not standing on Scripture — you’re standing on your own imagination. When someone refuses to read correctly and won’t compare Scripture with Scripture, that’s not conviction — that’s self-deception.

If you’re not willing to be teachable, then there’s nothing more to discuss. Enjoy your trip to the ignore list.

I am very much standing on what scripture actually says, no offense. but you don't seem to understand the difference between the object that is holding something and item that is being held. When you figure that out you'll get closer to the truth. Let's try this. Say I'm holding a bucket of water and I drench you with the water that was inside the bucket? No, they are not the same. The only way they could be the same is if I had thrown both the bucket w/ the water in it at you. The seals, trumpets and vials aren't part of the events following, they were just containers of the events and none of the seals, trumpets and vials are ever thrown upon those who are suffering from their contents.

 

[Douggg]

Nothing scripturally says it has to be in the exact same location.

The Jews are the ones who will build the next temple. So they are going to build it where the previous temple stood.