The Torah Has Not Been Abolished

[cgneustar]

The Lord Rebuke you! You come here with your religious propaganda that does not bring Glory to God but spews it's rage against those who defile your ignorance of the Truth and you want to speak a curse against them? There is no love of Jesus in you...your fruits have exposed your heart.

We will see who the Lord rebukes, those who uphold the Torah, or those who discard it, for it is written, "I never knew you, depart from me you workers of torahlessness".

 

[Earburner]

IOWS, if YOU HAVE made the Blood of Christ YOUR justification BY FAITH, why are you seeking to be justified by keeping the Law verbatim?
Is not the shed Blood of Christ, being the Passover Lamb of God, more capable for the forgiveness and removal of sin, than countless animals, by their blood, which cannot and could not remove sin!
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Why do you prefer to confound yourself with Law keeping, knowing that doing so causes the blood of His Sacrifice, to not be applied to you?

Surely you do have a dilemma, for even now, there are not even Animal sacrifices in Jerusalem to run to for your sin! How will you be clean, if not by the shed Blood of Christ?
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Forsake the Law, or else YOU will be forsaken, when Christ returns in flaming fire!

 

[cgneustar]

IOWS, if YOU HAVE made the Blood of Christ YOUR justification BY FAITH, why are you seeking to be justified by keeping the Law verbatim?
Is not the shed Blood of Christ, being the Passover Lamb of God, more capable for the forgiveness and removal of sin, than countless animals, by their blood, which cannot and could not remove sin!
.
Why do you prefer to confound yourself with Law keeping, knowing that doing so causes the blood of His Sacrifice, to not be applied to you?

Surely you do have a dilemma, for even now, there are not even Animal sacrifices in Jerusalem to run to for your sin! How will you be clean, if not by the shed Blood of Christ?
.
Forsake the Law, or else YOU will be forsaken, when Christ returns in flaming fire!

"I never knew you, depart from me you workers of torahlessness".

 

[Earburner]

We will see who the Lord rebukes, those who uphold the Torah, or those who discard it, for it is written, "I never knew you, depart from me you workers of torahlessness".

Unknowingly to you, every person who is NOT "born again" of God's Holy Spirit", THEY ARE LAWLESS, being "none of His". John 3:3-8; Rom. 8:9
Therefore, if you are "none of His", you definitely will be DEPARTING from His presence forever!!
Do you understand?

 

[justbyfaith]

Tzitzit and Tallit, the Command to Wear a Four Cornered Garment with Fringes

This is what the word of God says:

Rom 6:14, For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

Rom 7:4, Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

Rom 7:6, But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.

Gal 2:19, For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God.

Eph 2:15, Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
Eph 2:16, And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:

Col 2:14, Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

Heb 7:18, For there is verily a disannulling of the commandment going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof.

More comprehensively:

Rom 7:1, Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth?
Rom 7:2, For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.
Rom 7:3, So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man.
Rom 7:4, Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.
Rom 7:5, For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death.
Rom 7:6, But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.

It is not that the law has been abolished per se; but it is that the equivalent of this has taken place, in that we are forgiven of our sins and therefore there is no more condemnation because of the law for those of us who are born again. We have died and therefore the jurisdiction that our old husband (the law) had over us is no longer valid, we are free to be married to a new husband, Christ; who gives us victory over sin at its core rather than in the outward ritualistic situation that the law demands of us.
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If I am not preaching from the word of God then by all means do what @cgneustar says and reject my teaching. But if, in your sound discernment, you can see that I am attempting to bring to you the whole counsel of God and to protect you as an undershepherd of our Lord Jesus Christ, respond accordingly. I suggest that you also be be Bereans concerning everything that you hear (see Acts 17:10-11).

 

[justbyfaith]

Paul did not lie in Galatians 5:4, for "works of Torah" are not the commands of "you shall not murder" and "you shall not steal" and "you shall wear fringes on the four corners of your garments", which are plain commands that are still required to be obeyed under the new covenant, "works of Torah" are resting on the Shabbath, new moons, food, drink, and other such commands that Paul in other epistles identifies as "shadows of the Torah", which are fulfilled differently under the new covenant of the Messiah, and also circumcision falls under "works of the Torah", because it was the sign of the old covenant that was replaced by the new covenant. The apostles are very specific on which commands of the Torah are no longer required to be kept under the new covenant, whereas all other commands are still binding, hence "I did not come to abolish the Torah". Yet rather than understand this, you people go off into complete lawlessness, discarding the entire Torah.

See Romans 5:5, Romans 13:8-10, Galatians 5:14, Matthew 22:36-40, and Romans 8:4.

Love is the fulfilling of Torah; and we receive the love of God through faith in Jesus Christ; see also Galatians 3:14 coupled w/ Romans 5:5.

As believers, we desire to obey the spirit of the law and in our minds we are subject to the law of the Lord. However, according to Romans 7:6, 2 Corinthians 3:6, we are not bound to the letter but seek to be obedient to the spirit of the law; which is love.

 

[justbyfaith]

IOWS, if YOU HAVE made the Blood of Christ YOUR justification BY FAITH, why are you seeking to be justified by keeping the Law verbatim?
Is not the shed Blood of Christ, being the Passover Lamb of God, more capable for the forgiveness and removal of sin, than countless animals, by their blood, which cannot and could not remove sin!
.
Why do you prefer to confound yourself with Law keeping, knowing that doing so causes the blood of His Sacrifice, to not be applied to you?

Surely you do have a dilemma, for even now, there are not even Animal sacrifices in Jerusalem to run to for your sin! How will you be clean, if not by the shed Blood of Christ?
.
Forsake the Law, or else YOU will be forsaken, when Christ returns in flaming fire!

Isa 8:20, To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

 

[justbyfaith]

Justification by obedience to the Torah alone is useless if you have no belief in Yeshuah, both are required, yet unlike the Pharisees, who were obedient to the Torah, yet lacked belief in Yeshuah, you people are the other extreme, you have belief in Yeshuah, yet you refuse to obey the Torah, which is lawlessness, and because of this is why your condemnation will be worse than that of the Jews who believe as the Pharisees did, because they will merely be cast out of Jerusalem and trampled, whereas you people will endure the rage of God with seven plagues after they are trampled, and then be thrown into hot lava after you suffer through the full cup of the wrath of God, because of your lawlessness that masquerades under the belief you claim to have.

Heb 12:15, Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you, and thereby many be defiled;

Were the apostles not persecuted and matyred because of what they taught, including the Messiah himself? So why should it come as a shock that I would not also be rejected by you people for telling you the truth that you do not want to hear? As such, I am not on here to become popular among you people, otherwise I would be teaching sweet things like your pastors do. I am here to teach the truth knowing full well that most of you will reject it, in hopes that perhaps one or two of you will listen, and make my time on here worth it for the sake of the one or two.

If one or two people were to listen to you, it would be to their condemnation: Galatians 5:4 is clear on that.

 

[justbyfaith]

The purpose of the law is that it is a schoolmaster to lead men to Christ. By the law is the knowledge of sin.

The law shows people that they are sinners in need of a Saviour.

Once faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

Believers in Christ begin to bear the fruit of the Holy Spirit; against which there is no law.

 

[Enoch111]

The purpose of the law is that it is a schoolmaster to lead men to Christ. By the law is the knowledge of sin.

True. At the same time "the Law" (meaning the Ten Commandments) is God's righteous and holy moral and spiritual standard for Christians under the Law of Christ. So we need to maintain this balance.

 

[Earburner]

Paul did not lie in Galatians 5:4, for "works of Torah" are not the commands of "you shall not murder" and "you shall not steal" and "you shall wear fringes on the four corners of your garments", which are plain commands that are still required to be obeyed under the new covenant, "works of Torah" are resting on the Shabbath, new moons, food, drink, and other such commands that Paul in other epistles identifies as "shadows of the Torah", which are fulfilled differently under the new covenant of the Messiah, and also circumcision falls under "works of the Torah", because it was the sign of the old covenant that was replaced by the new covenant. The apostles are very specific on which commands of the Torah are no longer required to be kept under the new covenant, whereas all other commands are still binding, hence "I did not come to abolish the Torah". Yet rather than understand this, you people go off into complete lawlessness, discarding the entire Torah.

Since you are disecting which part of the Law should be kept, and which are not necessary under the New Covenant, might I remind you, that the Holy Spirit through James said this:
KJV-James 2[10] For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
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If you ARE NOT keeping the WHOLE Law (Torah), are you not guilty of all, and therefore you keep NONE of the Law at all, making you to be "a breaker of the Law".
Please go see KJV- Mat. 5:19-20, and then explain how it is, that both the least and the great
ARE IN the KoG together.

Clue: the answer is found in verse 20.

 

[Earburner]

True. At the same time "the Law" (meaning the Ten Commandments) is God's righteous and holy moral and spiritual standard for Christians under the Law of Christ. So we need to maintain this balance.

The Law is there and shall remain, in order to lead men/women to Christ!!
However, Law keeping verbatim, produces ONLY that righteousness which is of/by The Law!
That form of righteousness falls very far short of The Righteousness of Christ, of which is GIFTED to every believer through faith. Mat. 5:20.
Without His Righteousness, no one shall enter into the KoG. Hence Rom. 8:9

 

[cgneustar]

Since you are disecting which part of the Law should be kept, and which are not necessary under the New Covenant, might I remind you, that the Holy Spirit through James said this:
KJV-James 2[10] For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
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If you ARE NOT keeping the WHOLE Law (Torah), are you not guilty of all, and therefore you keep NONE of the Law at all, making you to be "a breaker of the Law".
Please go see KJV- Mat. 5:19-20, and then explain how it is, that both the least and the great
ARE IN the KoG together.

Clue: the answer is found in verse 20.

This is a lie, for Paul taught,
Therefore let no one pass judgment on you in questions of food and drink, or with regard to feast or a new moon or a Shabbath. These are a shadow of the things to come, but the substance belongs to Christ.
Colossians 2:16-17

While the Messiah taught,
Do not think that I have come to abolish the Torah or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.
Matthew 5:17

And it is also written,
For when there is a change in the priesthood, there is necessarily a change in the Torah as well.
Hebrews 7:12

Meaning that although the Torah is still binding, the commands related to food, drink, feast, new moon, and Shabbath are fulfilled differently under the new covenant, which is why rather than sacrifice a lamb every year on the Passover, the Messiah, our Passover lamb has been sacrificed, in fulfillment of the command of the Passover of the Torah. Why is this so difficult for you people to understand? I know why, because you do not want to understand, because you want to remain in your lawlessness.

 

[cgneustar]

Unknowingly to you, every person who is NOT "born again" of God's Holy Spirit", THEY ARE LAWLESS, being "none of His". John 3:3-8; Rom. 8:9
Therefore, if you are "none of His", you definitely will be DEPARTING from His presence forever!!
Do you understand?

Lawless means discarding the Torah of God, which is the Law of God, which is what you people do, and are subsequently also not born again, because of your torahlessness.

 

[101G]

1 Timothy 1:9 "Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,
1 Timothy 1:10 "For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine.

The Law is not removed, WHY, not for us who are in CHRIST, but for those who are not in CHRIST. scripture, Romans 2:10 "But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:
Romans 2:11 "For there is no respect of persons with God.
Romans 2:12 "For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law; BINGO, if you sinned without the Law you will perish without law. but, but, one more but, but as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law,. guess what the LAW do not make one perfect, only point out the sin. so the LAW cannot save you. and on top of that the promise was made to abraham before the Law was given, and have none effect on those in Christ by Faith. scripture, Galatians 3:10 "For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.
Galatians 3:11 "But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.

for, Galatians 3:17 "And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.
Galatians 3:18 "For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise".

PICJAG.

 

[justbyfaith]

True. At the same time "the Law" (meaning the Ten Commandments) is God's righteous and holy moral and spiritual standard for Christians under the Law of Christ. So we need to maintain this balance.

In bearing the fruit of the Spirit, we will exhibit no behaviour that is in violation of any law that the Lord has truly set forth to be obeyed.

Therefore the law is written on our hearts and in our minds; and also, the righteousness of the law is fulfilled in us who walk not after the flesh but after the Spirit. In bearing the fruit of love, joy, peace, longsuffering, etc. we fulfill the law, there is no law that condemns such behaviour as comes from those who truly bear the fruit of the Spirit.

Thus our "obedience to the law", its root is not in seeking to obey a set of do's and don'ts; rather it is rooted in our faith in Christ by whom we have received the Holy Spirit so that we can bear His fruit.

By simply believing and abiding in the vine, we in a more effortless manner bear the fruit of the Spirit which amounts to being a law-abiding citizen of the kingdom.

 

[Earburner]

This is a lie, for Paul taught,
Therefore let no one pass judgment on you in questions of food and drink, or with regard to feast or a new moon or a Shabbath. These are a shadow of the things to come, but the substance belongs to Christ.
Colossians 2:16-17

You side stepped what I asked of you in Mat. 5:19-20. Please go back to it (today at 4:26 pm), and be direct in your answer.
How is it, according to Jesus, that BOTH the "Law Breakers"-least, and the "Law Keepers"-great, ARE IN the KoG together?
See Mat. 5:20 for your answer.

 

[justbyfaith]

You side stepped what I asked of you in Mat. 5:19-20. Please go back to it (today at 4:26 pm), and be direct in your answer.
How is it, according to Jesus, that BOTH the "Law Breakers"-least, and the "Law Keepers"-great, ARE IN the KoG together?
See Mat. 5:20 for your answer.

Matthew 5:20 is to be compared to Galatians 2:21 and Philippians 3:9.

 

[Earburner]

Lawless means discarding the Torah of God, which is the Law of God, which is what you people do, and are subsequently also not born again, because of your torahlessness.

Absolutely not! Its far greater than that!!
Even The righteousness of the Law FALLS SHORT of The Righteousness of Christ!!
Why?
Ans. ONLY He has fulfilled the Law.
You have not, and you shall not!!

For in order for YOU (or I) to do so, we must keep the WHOLE LAW....without error!!
Please tell me, and all here, who it is that has kept the whole Law, verbatim!!
Except naming Jesus, YOU CAN'T!!

 

[Earburner]

Matthew 5:20 is to be compared to Galatians 2:21 and Philippians 3:9.

Thank you JBF! Unfortunately "CG" has not answered yet!
I hope that he can